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Next generation leap

JordanN said:
The problem isn't the tech, the artstyles just look the same across the board.

That's what kills it for me. They all just try to be "realistic" and nothing more.

Previous console cycles showed the leap while actually producing completely unique styles.

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All 4 games were a step up from the NES, yet they also look different compared to one another.
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You have to be kidding.

The one thing that really stood out at the PS5 event was how FEW games pursued a realistic style. I'd say that was one of the things that made it less impressive to people, because the easiest way to show off any increase in power is to just show how much closer to real life we're getting. That was why the Unreal 5 demo was so impressive.

The only games I can think of that pursued photorealism were Pragmata and Resident Evil 8, out of 27 (!) games shown.
 
Mid and late gen is where we'll see the real goods. Next gen is going to be a vast improvement over current, trust me and the leap is going to be bigger than ps3->ps4. The hardware differential is just much higher.

And don't pay attention to the 'diminishing returns' crowd. Graphics has a looooong way to go before we hit any sort of limit.
 
hyperbertha said:
Mid and late gen is where we'll see the real goods. Next gen is going to be a vast improvement over current, trust me and the leap is going to be bigger than ps3->ps4. The hardware differential is just much higher.

And don't pay attention to the 'diminishing returns' crowd. Graphics has a looooong way to go before we hit any sort of limit.
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Diminishing returns doesn't mean we hit a limit. The point is that the impact is smaller and if you look at Horizon 1 and 2, it's impossible to deny that.
 
Hunnybun said:
You have to be kidding.

The one thing that really stood out at the PS5 event was how FEW games pursued a realistic style. I'd say that was one of the things that made it less impressive to people, because the easiest way to show off any increase in power is to just show how much closer to real life we're getting. That was why the Unreal 5 demo was so impressive.

The only games I can think of that pursued photorealism were Pragmata and Resident Evil 8, out of 27 (!) games shown.
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I don't even get this idea that general leaps only occur when games strive for photo-realism.
 
Coolwhhip said:
Diminishing returns doesn't mean we hit a limit. The point is that the impact is smaller and if you look at Horizon 1 and 2, it's impossible to deny that.
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People said the same thing about late gen ps3 games and early ps4 games. I know Horizon 2 isn't too much of an improvement but late gen games are going to be a different story. If you look at movie CG and epic demo they are still much higher of a leap than ps3-ps4, and it didn't even have ray tracing. There are still bigger leaps to be had when you take into account ray tracing and vast memory advantages due to the SSD.
 
hyperbertha said:
People said the same thing about late gen ps3 games and early ps4 games. I know Horizon 2 isn't too much of an improvement but late gen games are going to be a different story. If you look at movie CG and epic demo they are still much higher of a leap than ps3-ps4, and it didn't even have ray tracing. There are still bigger leaps to be had when you take into account ray tracing and vast memory advantages due to the SSD.
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If you look at Quake 2 RTX, full path tracing is a generational leap all by itself.

Fingers crossed we'll get that in next generation machines, 6 or 7 years down the line.

It's only really after that that diminishing returns will arrive with any force.
 
I think expectations need some adjusting for next gen

1) Faces are near to as good as they are going to be. The faces in TLOU2 are simply remarkable. How much better can we get? My bet is most devs by the end of next gen wont surpass TLOU2 because some of that detail is so granular it is more artistry than technical ability

2) Devs have done a remarkable job over this gen in visual improvement. I went back to Witcher 3 after TLOU2 and just visually, and animation wise it felt like I stepped back a generation. Models look bad, lighting is flat, foliage and shadows look undetailed.

3) The main sore point I see in visuals still is the detail of environments. Case in point FFVII Remake, it looks incredible at times but the amount of undetailed textures and ugly assets compared to the character models was a real eye sore at times. And so much of everything is static

So when it comes to next gen I dont think its the close up face images that will show it, its going to be the lighting, environments, animation and hopefully interactivity
 
That's kind of a bad comparison. The Horizon Zero Dawn PS5 shot is blurry and compressed. As is the Spiderman PS4 shot.
 
Next gen will be a giant leap, especially in terms of world density, geometry, texture quality, physics, AI and interactivity. But it might take a while before it shows.
 
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I want to see games that look so amazing you know that they cant be done on current gen hardware. That is a generational leap. Spiderman and Horizon look good but that aint it. :messenger_smirking:
 
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Vasto said:
Horizon 1 does.

Horizon 2 looks better but it does not look like a game that cant be done on current gen hardware.
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Wrong, it looks like a generation leap. You are just confused with the diminishing returns.
If it can run to current-gen hardware be sure that it will run as a cross-gen. They will not lose 100 plus potential buyers for a game that it's not based on PS5.
 
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Vasto said:
Horizon 1 does.

Horizon 2 looks better but it does not look like a game that cant be done on current gen hardware.
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It absolutely does. No current gen game looks close to it.

In fact if what you are after is games that couldn't be done on current gen, then the majority of PS5 games qualified, but without question:

Ratchet & Clank
Pragmata
Resident Evil 8 (the better parts, was a bit uneven)
Kena
Stray
Project Athia
Demon's Souls
 
Yoboman said:
Show me where Horizon or any current gen game looks like this, because I want to play it


Horizon-Forbidden-West-Announcement-Trailer-PS5.gif

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You still not getting it. I said Horizon 2 looks better than Horizon 1. You can show all the cinematic gifs in the world and it still does not change what I said. Horizon 2 does not look like a game that cant be done on current gen hardware.
 
Vasto said:
You still not getting it. I said Horizon 2 looks better than Horizon 1. You can show all the cinematic gifs in the world and it still does not change what I said. Horizon 2 does not look like a game that cant be done on current gen hardware.
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Yes it does!

What current gen game compares to those gifs?
 
So...ummm, where is it then?

For the record, I don't expect anything from MS to beat that...aside from maybe Forza Horizon, but that ain't happening.
 
Graphics look better, but I'm happy with current-gen graphics, so the jump in graphics isn't that interesting to me. I'm also disinterested in all the focus on technical aspects of the consoles. I know that's common with next gen comparisons, it just seems boring to me to focus so narrowly on tech.

As always, I'm interested in games. If the next generation games are better -- not just prettier or faster-loading, but better -- then I'll get excited. Until then, I'm in "wait and see" mode.
 
biggest leap in games ever was leaving tv behind and stepping into the game world in VR. stop fooling yourselves with same remasters with slightly more pixels in the same small flat screen...
 
Another thread...

The PS5 is showing launch window games that could all be run on the PS4 if they were scaled down on the grfx and res. Nothing more. The games that are for the PS5 are being built and won't be ready for another 18mths at the earliest. Same with the XsX.

What exactly are people trying to prove in these threads?
 
Vasto said:
You need to learn the difference between looking as good and cant be done.
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I don't know what you mean.

Apparently you've conceded that no current gen games look as good as Horizon 2.

The current gen is nearly 7 years old, all the best developers have attempted to squeeze as much power out of the machines as possible.

To me, the fact that so far no current gen game looks as good as Horizon 2 is, in effect, the same as saying that Horizon 2 can't be done on current gen, because if could be it would have been by now.

But apparently you've got your own particular definition of 'can't be done' which you're refusing to share with us.
 
I love your enthusiasm, OP, but I'm still waiting for the games to actually release before I get excited.

Things can change. Graphics can get downgraded between the announcement trailer and the actual release, and even trailer footage running on "real hardware" are susceptible to being doctored behind the scenes to make it look better than the eventual retail release.

That said, I've seen the opposite happen before where the release looks better than the reveal trailers. This is why it's important to wait for the game to release before we start comparing the generation leap of fidelity.

Side note: it's usually hard to see the generation leap within the first few years of a console's release. 3-4 years in, however, that's when you really notice what developers are capable of pulling off on the hardware.
 
hyperbertha said:
Mid and late gen is where we'll see the real goods. Next gen is going to be a vast improvement over current, trust me and the leap is going to be bigger than ps3->ps4. The hardware differential is just much higher.

And don't pay attention to the 'diminishing returns' crowd. Graphics has a looooong way to go before we hit any sort of limit.
Click to expand...
Yeah, those same people shout diminishing returns every generation but we always get a big leap and next generation will be the same way
 
Hunnybun said:
It absolutely does. No current gen game looks close to it.

In fact if what you are after is games that couldn't be done on current gen, then the majority of PS5 games qualified, but without question:

Ratchet & Clank
Pragmata
Resident Evil 8 (the better parts, was a bit uneven)
Kena
Stray
Project Athia
Demon's Souls
Click to expand...
Thank you!
 
Vasto said:
Horizon 1 does.

Horizon 2 looks better but it does not look like a game that cant be done on current gen hardware.
Click to expand...
Wrong, it looks like a generation leap. You are just confused with the diminishing returns.
If it can run to current-gen hardware be sure that it will run as a cross-gen. They will not lose 100 plus potential buyers for a game that it's not based on PS5.
 
Hunnybun said:
I don't know what you mean.

Apparently you've conceded that no current gen games look as good as Horizon 2.

The current gen is nearly 7 years old, all the best developers have attempted to squeeze as much power out of the machines as possible.

To me, the fact that so far no current gen game looks as good as Horizon 2 is, in effect, the same as saying that Horizon 2 can't be done on current gen, because if could be it would have been by now.

But apparently you've got your own particular definition of 'can't be done' which you're refusing to share with us.
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Horizon 2 aint it bro. :messenger_tears_of_joy:

This is a game that looks like it cant be done on current gen hardware.

 
Vasto said:
Horizon 2 aint it bro. :messenger_tears_of_joy:

This is a game that looks like it cant be done on current gen hardware.
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Υοu are joking of course

or you don't know how development works with AI(NPCs for example) or without AI.
A game without AI can look like ''in engine'' trailers. If you know what an in-engine trailer means.
Your example/comparison is bad at best.

but both of them are for next-gen hardware I believe.
 
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When I see a.i peeping round corners in games , seeing facial changes when they see you , or indeed a gamer controlled character, 8k or more to pick up such fine details , high FPS with fluid animation akin to real life ,... I mean , things to me have regressed, in gaming , half life 2? In-game physics, Mind blowing , how old? Then , another example , battling a.i characters on pc quake back in the day , and them waiting at top of stairs ready to rocket you.... Gob smacked me and scared me lol back then ...Next gen??
 
From what i've seen so far, this leap looks like the smallest ever. If you told me these are game footage from PS4 pro or XBOX one X i would believe it.
 
nkarafo said:
From what i've seen so far, this leap looks like the smallest ever. If you told me these are game footage from PS4 pro or XBOX one X i would believe it.
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You are right. Diminishing returns, unfortunately.

In fact probably it will be one of the biggest leaps in the console history.
 
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Horizon and Ratchet specially look very impressive.

RAM is a smaller leap than i would have liked but everything else is huge, and i mean HUGE in terms of CPU and reading data.

Some gamers are not impressed only because PS4 /ONE X games look pretty good already, but its a giant leap everyone should be excited
 
Birdo said:
I made this chart to show where, I feel, that games "visually" plateaued:


TKJqGIy.jpg
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I think nothing beats the 16bit to 32bit gen leap. We went from 2D pixels to fully 3D textured worlds. Now some will say 16bit were beautiful, matured 2D and 32bit was low res, low frame rate, low Polly early 3D. But it still made the games look like something completely different, not to mention allow games that could never be done on 16bit consoles, even at lower quality.

The Atari 2600/Intellivision to NES/Master System was probably the second best leap. You went from huge pixels that you had to use your imagination to see what they are suppose to represent, to proper 2D graphics that could clearly represent what they are supposed to be.
 
Vasto said:
Exactly what I have been saying.
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Ok, you need to differentiate the terms ''looks'' and ''is''.

The most accurate argument is this:

Next-generation for now it doesn't look like a huge leap, but we know it is. In fact one of the biggest ever.

btw when you see the next ND game I am pretty sure you will change your mind.
 
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