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N'Gai Croal - RE5 Trailer Imagery is Racist

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Zzoram said:
And while Newsweek’s popular video game writer N’Gai Croal
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stopped reading here.

I remember in RE 2 when brave policeman Marvin turned into a zombie and I blew his head off. I was left alone with an accusing little voice in my head that said "racist".

but seriously. we run around a mall and expect to see stereotypical white zombies, why would we not expect to run around in Haiti and see stereotypical black zombies? I think perhaps the crux of the issue lies elsewhere. maybe some people just aren't comfortable seeing how poor Haitians really are rendered in 1080p. it should make people think a little bit about the distribution of wealth in the world.
 
Ptaaty said:
People definately need to understand that there is a difference between racially insensitive and racism.

Racially insensitive usually comes from a someone with lack of education/context compared to someone with more experience or education on racial issues. In a truly color blind society, the racially insensitive comment, aspect, etc, goes unnoticed...it is the closest thing we can be to the "right way" and completely equal.

The problem is, things have happened in this world which create a context...some are aware of them (those in the USA are painfully aware) some are completely clueless (Capcom).

Personally, I just wish society would move on already...creating a big deal out of anything that can possibly be contrued as insensitive, have any type of bias and calling it racist just perpetuates our differences.

Capcom is not racist, not at all. Capcom is, in the eyes of the PC schooled (IMO division creating education) US citizen, racially insenstive.

I can't wait to play RE5. I am a while male in my early 30s with a few black friends, some hispanic, I guess I just could care less about race or race issues....I just want everyone to actually be treated equally. But because I understand that due to our country's past, my friends (and my own) knowledge of this past...I choose to limit my racially insensitive comments and behavior whenever I know they exist.

RE5 is going to be an awesome game....I think Capcom made a (unintential) mistake going to the Africa locale, at least in the form presented in trailers. The biggest reason is that there is a thread on this at all. I want to be excited to play a game, not even think about race.
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Both of those can be the same thing sometimes in many instances. I think (as pointed out by the Villareal? guy) innocent ignorance and calculated agenda are more accurate. Though none of us can say for sure if Capcoms intentions are racist or not I think a lot of that boils down to perception.
 
Xater said:
I am technically a film student.
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Now, with which does it "dovetail" more? Horror (I will even go so far as to start with the classic silent horror films coming out of Europe) or racist history (Birth Of A Nation, among others) and why? I say horror, especially since it's, you know, a horror game.
 
Warrior300 said:
Although, it still amazes me why the government still hasn't done this.

what could be the reason?
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Um, because burying your history of evil is something scary fucking countries do?

I came in to point out that N'Gai is ridiculous, but wow, you just topped him.
 
Deadly Monk said:
Obviously not intentional, which is why N'Gai sounds like an idiot. That's the point. There is something going on with the characters in the game that is not right. It's called good lighiting and angle, not "darkened area where man is sitting is evil. Oh my god, black people are bad!". The point is, the fact that he even finds the IMAGES in a trailer racist that have nothing to do with racism but everything to do with MOOD makes him sound like every other person out there trying to find something to complain about.

This is a cultural issue, not racial and I can't believe he's not smart enough to back away for a moment and see the trailer for what it is. Sigh, no other Country, especially not Africa, will give a shit about this. Why is that we care so much about the trailer being thought of as racist and the actual Country it's set in doesn't?

I guess something as silly as videogames still need contreversy every so often or these guys would have nothing to say other than "hey, this game is good!" and "hey, it's bad!". Enthusiast Press at it's finest...
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THIS.

/thread
 
This thread reminds me of this:

fic-spk1.gif


fic-spk2.gif



http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/103452/
 
iby.h said:
Good point, take Zack and Wiki for example that whole "Allahu Akbar"—meaning God is great, thing. Capcom wasnt trying to say That Arabs are savages, they just didn't know any better.

Offtopic: I wish they would of kept the "Allahu Akbar" in the stage , it was kinda cool.
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The Allahu Akbar thing was not cool at all, and for this very reason - It was like hearing "Praise Jesus" in a cartoonish unrelated game experience. It was out of place, if you know what I mean. I thought it cheapened the games invented authenticity by introducing worldly inaccuracy.
 
Nash said:
I think the way people react to the trailer says more about their own perceptions and views. Just as many people see nothing wrong with it. But by drawing attention to the perceived offense, people are just reinforcing the outdated views which they claim it represents. I don't think it's very productive. It's being over-senstive and reading too much into things.
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Exactly.
 
chicken_ramen said:
What sickens me about this entire thread is that, even without reading the article, all the information you need is right there in the headline.

RE5 TRAILER
IMAGERY
is racist.

And, essentially, this is what N'Gai says. He doesn't say that the game is racist. He doesn't say that you can't have black zombies. He actually goes to great lengths to show he's not saying that, and yet, everywhere this article is posted people just love to make up their own straw men to argue against. He even states several times the sage advice that people in this thread seem to be doling out: that final judgement will, of course, be left till the game is out.

Here it is in a nutshell:

The trailer, without any context, portrays the not yet zombified Africans as a group of dark, dangerous others. This imagery draws on, either intentionally or otherwise, classical racist imagery that dates back to colonial times.

Why put out a trailer like this? Do they think everyone who sees it will understand the context it exists in? Thats a very silly assumption. RE4 was big, but not that big.
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I can agree with that.

Although it's pretty clear to me that the racial imagery/undertones people can pick out were done unintentionally by Capcom. They wanted to create a menacing, broody mood. Enemies in this game just happen to be African, because it's well... set in Africa.
 
saelz8 said:
The Allahu Akbar thing was not cool at all, and for this very reason - It was like hearing "Praise Jesus" in a cartoonish unrelated game experience. It was out of place, if you know what I mean. I thought it cheapened the games invented authenticity by introducing worldly inaccuracy.
Click to expand...

what game was that?
 
saelz8 said:
The Allahu Akbar thing was not cool at all, and for this very reason - It was like hearing "Praise Jesus" in a cartoonish unrelated game experience. It was out of place, if you know what I mean. I thought it cheapened the games invented authenticity by introducing worldly inaccuracy.
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yeah I get you, I should of made it more clear. I am Palestinian so me hearing it in a game just felt kinda cool, but what you are saying it true.
 
Nash said:
And some people see penises in random ink blots.

I think the way people react to the trailer says more about their own perceptions and views. Just as many people see nothing wrong with it. But by drawing attention to the perceived offense, people are just reinforcing the outdated views which they claim it represents. I don't think it's very productive. It's being over-senstive and reading too much into things.
Click to expand...

media imagery that portrays people of color in a negative light isn't really an "outdated" concept though
sup reverend wright
. It's usually a lot more subtle these days.

Doesn't necessarily mean it's intentional, doesn't mean that it's some active conspiracy by the KKK, and it doesn't mean that N'Gai is trying to censor the game or anything. But it is still very much a (sometimes unconscious) part of American society. I just took it as him saying that Capcom probably wants to be more aware of these types of things, considering it wants to market the game here in America, where a lot of people still notice these things.

And considering how games are becoming more popular on a worldwide basis, it doesn't hurt to be aware of cultural differences, and how a message can potentially be viewed. Assuming, they want all people to buy the game.
 
The way the imagery is interpreted depends on the viewer. Personally, I see the setting being portraited as dark and scary because it's a FUCKING HORROR GAME, but I guess others try to see other things to write stupid articles.
 
This is seriously out of control. Yeah, they're perpetuating some really precarious images of a historically victimized ethnicity in their game, but this is a video game company from Japan. They've been doing this shit for years. Since their demographics are far removed and way more homogeneous than ours, they obviously won't have the same sensitivities we do. If they did, how could you explain a game like Tom Sawyer, a character like Barret from Final Fantasy 7, or almost every black anime character ever? Yeah, it probably offends some people more than others. So don't buy it, the same way you don't buy books or movies or music by people who offend you.
 
Ninja Scooter said:
its a shame this thread is simply degenerating into "OMG SHOOTING WHITE PEOPLE IS OKAY BUT NOT BLACKS NGAI YOU IDIOT!" when in reality all Ngai (to me) is trying to do is point out how people's history and perspective can cause them to view things differently. He's not saying capcom is racist. There is no right or wrong answer to this. Stop acting like morons.
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QFT. The ignorance in this thread is really telling, but I guess what else would you expect when the logic of console wars is mixed with issues that are actually relevant
 
While I don't agree with N'Gai (a growing trend with me), its really no use arguing now since the thread is so covered with stupid.

I don't know what's sadder, people completely missing N'gai's point and bashing him for whining that "shooting black people=racist" or the people that also miss the point and defend the notion that "shooting black people=racist".
 
MGrant said:
This is seriously out of control. Yeah, they're perpetuating some really precarious images of a historically victimized ethnicity in their game, but this is a video game company from Japan. They've been doing this shit for years. Since their demographics are far removed and way more homogeneous than ours, they obviously won't have the same sensitivities we do. If they did, how could you explain a game like Tom Sawyer, a character like Barret from Final Fantasy 7, or almost every black anime character ever? Yeah, it probably offends some people more than others. So don't buy it, the same way you don't buy books or movies or music by people who offend you.
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Period.
 
Street Fighter 2 is 10x more rascist than RE5. I can't believe the type of stereotyping they put on that Dhalsim character, complete with the eleghants and Yoga bullshit. Same for E.Honda, lol @ his level backdrop that of a bathroom.

I fear we will never see the end of this RE5 debate but at least it's mostly the concern of the press and not the gamers themselves (judging from the posts in this thread, people who actually believe this to be blatantly rascist seem to be in the minority).

I do however agree with the whole "Black Hawk Down music" point. The music used in RE5 is not actually indicative of Haitian music but it's far more African in origin. N'Gai noted that and I give him props because it's true. I still don't see this as being overtly rascist (cradling the line at best), certainly not much more than previous RE games particularly RE4.
 
Warrior300 said:
One more thing, do they still teach the history of slavery in America?

I know it was messed up, but the only way to get rid of it is to erase it from history. Non of the racist things going on now would be here if the whole idea of slavery was just made to be a myth.

In many ways, its holding back the african american citizens of the USA, they still think that they have to act like a threat to never let that happen again. The truth though is that only going forward and coming together is a way to solve all the issues now.

Erase black slavery in the USA from the books( simply stop teaching it), and then you've got yourselves a generation unaware of the dark history of the country.

Although, it still amazes me why the government still hasn't done this.

what could be the reason?
Click to expand...

I love how your solution is for the history of black people in America to be buried, yet the very society that benefitted from that history gets to keep right on trucking :lol
 
soul creator said:
media imagery that portrays people of color in a negative light isn't really an "outdated" concept though
sup reverend wright
. It's usually a lot more subtle these days.

Doesn't necessarily mean it's intentional, doesn't mean that it's some active conspiracy by the KKK, and it doesn't mean that N'Gai is trying to censor the game or anything. But it is still very much a (sometimes unconscious) part of American society. I just took it as him saying that Capcom probably wants to be more aware of these types of things, considering it wants to market the game here in America, where a lot of people still notice these things.

And considering how games are becoming more popular on a worldwide basis, it doesn't hurt to be aware of cultural differences, and how a message can potentially be viewed. Assuming, they want all people to buy the game.
Click to expand...

Make Americans aware of what? Good cinematography in a computer game? Trust me, there's many people who look and try so hard everyday to find anything terrible about our Country.

This thread is so horrible. I can't wait until the game comes out and everyone moves on to another game. I hope Dead Rising 2 doesn't take place in a mall, oh boy that would be bad.

End this, please!

And it's true, Street Fighter 2 is really the most racist game i've ever played.
 
Quick related question. Was creating this character racist?

oilman4ab.png


EDIT: Sheesh, you should at least wait until the final product is out before you start discussing this. For all we know, they could be pulling a Raiden.
 
TheGreatDave said:
Shame about the racism :(
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The only shame I can see is that if somehow this game gets altered to some shittier less amazing version because a bunch of ignorant assholes bitched about racism.....I don't even know what I'll do, but I won't be happy.
 
PhoenixDark said:
QFT. The ignorance in this thread is really telling, but I guess what else would you expect when the logic of console wars is mixed with issues that are actually relevant
Click to expand...
Careful, you might be advised not to be close minded for saying this obvious fact. I swear, a whole lot of people made my ignore list in thread. Including those I once thought weren't "bad" people.
 
Occasionally I get that rant of: " Man some of those FKin Japanese are so racist!"
While I'm watching DBZ
popo.gif


BUT I STILL LIKE IT.

Forget racism..

and
...

Pretty soon, the whole world will.
 
soul creator said:
I love how your solution is for the history of black people in America to be buried, yet the very society that benefitted from that history gets to keep right on trucking :lol
Click to expand...
Every country is guilty of racism at some point in history, I'm sure America isn't the last country to do this either.
 
Synless said:
The only shame I can see is that if somehow this game gets altered to some shittier less amazing version because a bunch of ignorant assholes bitched about racism.....I don't even know what I'll do, but I won't be happy.
Click to expand...
True.

The vision that I observed in RE5 was superb. Who gives a crap if its semi-derivative of Black Hawk Down? It was awesome visually and intense in atmosphere. I want more of it and I want it inside me. I am not going to let some rascist undertones get in the way of me enjoying an obviously rich survival action gaming experience.
 
GhaleonQ said:
Now, with which does it "dovetail" more? Horror (I will even go so far as to start with the classic silent horror films coming out of Europe) or racist history (Birth Of A Nation, among others) and why? I say horror, especially since it's, you know, a horror game.
Click to expand...

I agree with the horror theme. The thing is he might have a point if you take it out of context but you just can't. In film and of course games there are genre signs that are in some way classic and you can find those in this trailer. Clearly Ngai has totally connotations for those signs then most other people.

On top of that I just watched the trailer again and actually there is just ONE short shot of a suspicious guy in the dark. Every other person is just minding their own business.
 
Synless said:
The only shame I can see is that if somehow this game gets altered to some shittier less amazing version because a bunch of ignorant assholes bitched about racism.....I don't even know what I'll do, but I won't be happy.
Click to expand...


That might be bad, but in that case we whould have to deal with..........
 
Synless said:
Every country is guilty of racism at some point in history, I'm sure America isn't the last country to do this either.
Click to expand...

America has an, um, special history with it though. Especially considering a lot of its effects are still in place today.

That said, I hope you're not agreeing with his point :(
 
Aggelos said:
I cannot wait 'til the next trailer!
I want to see more about this game so badly! The whole concept/setting makes me horny!
Click to expand...

You may want to make sure you move away from any areas with black people in then, you may go crazy in a sexy murderous rage.
 
You know... maybe the title of this thread should have literally quoted N'Gai instead of poorly summarizing his argument. I think that would have been nice.
 
They just need to create a racist on/off option in the menu. Shutting it off would make everyone white and in that way it would eliminate any bitching from anyone.
 
chicken_ramen said:
What sickens me about this entire thread is that, even without reading the article, all the information you need is right there in the headline.

RE5 TRAILER
IMAGERY
is racist.

And, essentially, this is what N'Gai says. He doesn't say that the game is racist. He doesn't say that you can't have black zombies. He actually goes to great lengths to show he's not saying that, and yet, everywhere this article is posted people just love to make up their own straw men to argue against. He even states several times the sage advice that people in this thread seem to be doling out: that final judgement will, of course, be left till the game is out.

Here it is in a nutshell:

The trailer, without any context, portrays the not yet zombified Africans as a group of dark, dangerous others. This imagery draws on, either intentionally or otherwise, classical racist imagery that dates back to colonial times.

Why put out a trailer like this? Do they think everyone who sees it will understand the context it exists in? Thats a very silly assumption. RE4 was big, but not that big.
Click to expand...

And here's the problem. People will get upset without learning the context. Because people are dumb. I'm not totally sure what N'gai's point is. Is he saying that the trailer is racist, or that some people will perceive it as racist? N'gai knows the background and context, and if he thinks it was racist then that's too bad. Especially if he's regarded as one of the smartest video game journalists.

I think it boils down to this. People who put more emphasis on the history and background of RESIDENT EVIL in a RESIDENT EVIL game won't find anything wrong at all. People who put more emphasis on AFRICA'S HISTORY OF OPPRESSION in a RESIDENT EVIL game might have a problem.

I read the sentence I quoted as this:

"The trailer, without any context, portrays the not yet zombified Resident evil enemies as a group of dark, dangerous others. This imagery draws on, either intentionally or otherwise, classical Resident Evil themes that dates back to RE1"
 
This does not clean the suffering and pain inflicted on every person persecuted, but racism will never die if a person's race is a more (or even equally) differentiating factor from other human beings than that person's name.
 
soul creator said:
America has an, um, special history with it though. Especially considering a lot of its effects are still in place today.

That said, I hope you're not agreeing with his point :(
Click to expand...
America's history was far less horrifying then almost every other countries history of slavery. I don't think it should ever be erased from history, that's how we learn from it. But Being in many history classes I can assure you America wasn't anything special. Open up a history book, start with Mesopotamians and work your way up, you will then see something special.

You also say that it's still in effect today, but you don't realize slavery in the U.S. was a very short lived event compared to many countries that had slavery for hundreds and even up to thousands of years.
 
TheGreatDave said:
You may want to make sure you move away from any areas with black people in then, you may go crazy in a sexy murderous rage.
Click to expand...

No, I didnt mean that. I think that the setting has a mysterious awesomeness (dry climate, isolated african setting, emphasis on the lighting, etc..) I haven't felt like this before for a Biohazard game. Bio 5 looked so awesome since the first teaser in 2005. I find the setting/concept more horny than the Raccoon City events
 
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