It's not that they don't create new IPs, which they have, but the new IPs failed to eclipse their predecessors. IP like Splatoon feels like a side project compared to Mario, when it should be the main event, the thing that gets a whole new generation excited about Nintendo.
-
Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!
Nintendos Sad Struggle for Survival (The Atlantic)
- Thread starter entremet
- Start date
It's not that they don't create new IPs, which they have, but the new IPs failed to eclipse their predecessors. IP like Splatoon feels like a side project compared to Mario, when it should be the main event, the thing that gets a whole new generation excited about Nintendo.
That's his point. The same brilliant minds that so expertly calculated the Wii success came up with and released the Wii U. If that isn't evidence that the Wii phenomenon was a wonderful accident I don't know what is.
I think it about did that in Japan. They saturated the kids market there.
Lionel Richie
Member
That is an unfair standard because no video game IP is as relevant to mainstream audiences like Pokemon and Mario/Donkey Kong. Both Splatoon and Animal Crossing sold and sell very well.
But if you insist, then Wii Sports.
Still your and the other posters arguments still boils down to the Wii don't count. Sony's plan with the PS3 wasn't sustainable...
chillybright
Banned
Does Nintendo have other major departments to diversify their risks?
NinjaCoachZ
Member
Considering that New Leaf is the best-selling non-Mario, non-Pokemon 3DS game, and Splatoon has a similar stat on Wii U on top of driving a ton of console growth in Japan, yes. Wild World also sold extremely well on the DS.
Animal Crossing is a big franchise for Nintendo. I really feel GAF tends to underestimate just how popular it is. Aside from Twilight Princess on Wii beating City Folk, every Zelda game since AC's inception has been outsold by an AC game.
Likewise with Splatoon. A Japanese tweet by the official account showing off its presence in the Switch reveal trailer has as many retweets as the actual English Switch reveal does.
KojiKnight
Member
Besides going into theme parks, movies, mobile, etc?
joecanada
Member
Yes and I didn't say the article was good simply that what you just wrote is infinitely more insightful than " oh it's another Nintendoomd article everyone look at me nothing to see here !"
I'm all for adaptation in business model, even doing a mobile game at all is probably an important move for Nintendo. The Pokemon go game probably exposed more people in a month than the entire existence of wiiiu .
No one does. No one thinks Nintendo is doomed and going to go bankrupt, sell off their assets, and leave the industry entirely. Literally no one seriously thinks that's going to occur in the near future, or even at all. Nintendoomed is a 100% strawman, thread-derailing argument that should be fired into the sun. Even the most critical Nintendo commenters generally acknowledge how tight a ship they run and how strong their franchises are. The article is definitely poorly titled, but every topic about Nintendo doesn't need to include the Nintendoomed thread-shitting. It's up there with the first 5 pages of every Pachter thread being all garbage-ass "oh, the opposite will happen then durr durr" posts.
Suburban Thug
Member
Yes, let's take Nintendo's word at face value. They definitely aren't biased or anything. Tell me how many of your Pokémon Go gaming friends rushed out to buy a 3DS? Exactly 0 of mine did. After the fad died out they went back to candy crush.
How would they even be able to reliably measure how many people purchased their dedicated hardware because of the launch of Go? This just seems like posturing.
Edit: wording
Edit 2: "Nintendo was forced to release a statement explaining that the direct impact from Pokémon Go on its business would be limited. That said, the increased awareness around Pokémon is definitely good news for Nintendo especially considering that Pokémon Sun and Moon are on their way to the 3DS in November."
Seems to me like the existing user base started buying more Pokémon related stuff rather than new consumers jumping on board. I have a very hard time believing your average iOS user would drop $200+ on a dedicated handheld just because Go was fun for a month. I can only provide anecdotal evidence but all of my friends played Go (because it was free) and exactly 0 of them got a 3ds or any other Nintendo hardware because of it.
Clickbait.
I mean, the article makes a lot of good points, but its really just a rundown of basic events as they have transpired, and no real conclusion made of these points, or anything of an actual message to send to the reader, which generally means that the article itself is made of fluffy nothing made for clicks, telling us once again of Nintendo's decline without saying anything else about it.
I mean, the article makes a lot of good points, but its really just a rundown of basic events as they have transpired, and no real conclusion made of these points, or anything of an actual message to send to the reader, which generally means that the article itself is made of fluffy nothing made for clicks, telling us once again of Nintendo's decline without saying anything else about it.
What is fair and what is relevant to growing their business are two different things? Nintendo survives on appealing to new generations of children.
I do believe the article is doing Nintendo a disservice by ignoring both the Switch and their other recent diversification, such as theme parks. But beyond that, it's very on the mark. 2017 will be a pivotal year for Nintendo, one way or the other. Likely, it will be the year that we find out whether Nintendo can viably continue as a video game hardware manufacturer.
If the Switch is a failure, I can't believe that their investors simply roll over and say "no problem, just try again in a few years." I think the more likely results would consist of low-risk, virtually-guaranteed wins, like Virtual Console for phones/tablets, SNES Classic Mini, and Super Mario 3D World for PlayStation 4.
Sony recently announced smartphone apps based on their popular exclusive franchises, right? I basically take that as them saying "we're done with Vita."
There's no argument that Sony's handheld division is doomed, because everyone's pretty much already accepted this as fact. I love my Vita, and yet, I don't ask if there will be a successor, because I already know the answer. If anything, that's the Switch.
Sad but true: Call of Duty.
If the Switch is a failure, I can't believe that their investors simply roll over and say "no problem, just try again in a few years." I think the more likely results would consist of low-risk, virtually-guaranteed wins, like Virtual Console for phones/tablets, SNES Classic Mini, and Super Mario 3D World for PlayStation 4.
Sony recently announced smartphone apps based on their popular exclusive franchises, right? I basically take that as them saying "we're done with Vita."
There's no argument that Sony's handheld division is doomed, because everyone's pretty much already accepted this as fact. I love my Vita, and yet, I don't ask if there will be a successor, because I already know the answer. If anything, that's the Switch.
Sad but true: Call of Duty.
Exactly 1 of my friends did just that. Now what?
The Wii was a very well thought out system. By no means an accident. Same goed with the NES, Gameboy, DS. Nintendo has a history of making these accidents happen. I dont think we should call them that.
I want to see the demographics breakdown for Pokemon and Mario and Zelda. Because I feel there's a lot of 20+ year olds playing those series and kids aren't the majority.
Tutomos
Member
I think what the author of the article is trying to say is don't fight the war on two fronts. Nintendo has to pick one if they want to be really successful financially. I wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo's best teams will work on iOS/Andorid platforms exclusively in the future.
So far I haven't seem anything from Switch that indicates the two of the most sought after demographics for them (kids and female) will buy the system in droves. I don't see Switch selling more than the 3DS, not from what they've shown. But their mobile offerings like Pokemon Go and Miitomo are steps in the right direction. Those games can be picked up by almost anybody really easily. They just need to put their best teams on it and figure out how to monetize it better.
So far I haven't seem anything from Switch that indicates the two of the most sought after demographics for them (kids and female) will buy the system in droves. I don't see Switch selling more than the 3DS, not from what they've shown. But their mobile offerings like Pokemon Go and Miitomo are steps in the right direction. Those games can be picked up by almost anybody really easily. They just need to put their best teams on it and figure out how to monetize it better.
You do realise that 3DS sales have been the highest they have been in a while and Pokémon Sun & Moon had the best launch of any Nintendo software in the US and in Europe in Nintendo's history, right?
And 3DS sales have been up YoY in the US and Europe since the launch of Pokémon Go.
foxuzamaki
Doesn't read OPs, especially not his own
You do know that splatoon has sold well over 4 million, right?
GiantBreadbug
Member
See it's frustrating because there's plenty to call Nintendo out on and lots of criticisms to make (Mario Run DRM being one I'm pretty upset about), but usually people attach some personal feelings to it or have a COMPLETELY shallow understanding of the situation and wind up making themselves look like fools. The title is just so fucking stupid and self-congratulatory of an observation that was made in error.
I mean the article is wrong right there in the title. The scenario described is a delusion. They're pretty clearly thriving and it's because they don't give a shit about the sensibilities of people like this author.
This has a similar attitude as the "oh boy I wish Nintendo would make a 4K Specsbox because that's the only way for them to remain relevant." Like, what?
I have bad news for people who think the bleeding edge console market is some huge well of market share: it isn't. It's already proving itself to be a lot more irrelevant to the mass market than Nintendo is. I usually know when people do or don't know what they're talking about when they start going on about the current state of "relevance."
The westernized AAA specs-chasing pissing-contest console gaming echo chamber is not a market with very much room to grow, or even much visibility to a pretty huge chunk of potential customers. Gaming as a hobby is pretty niche still, and lying to yourself about the relevance of AAA console gaming when it's basically dead in Japan and struggling to expand in a meaningful way in the west (mostly because of the stupid arms race).
Nintendo will continue to focus on making great games and that's why they'll be fine. As if I needed to assure myself of Nintendo in particular's fineness over that of other gaming entities.
I mean the article is wrong right there in the title. The scenario described is a delusion. They're pretty clearly thriving and it's because they don't give a shit about the sensibilities of people like this author.
This has a similar attitude as the "oh boy I wish Nintendo would make a 4K Specsbox because that's the only way for them to remain relevant." Like, what?
I have bad news for people who think the bleeding edge console market is some huge well of market share: it isn't. It's already proving itself to be a lot more irrelevant to the mass market than Nintendo is. I usually know when people do or don't know what they're talking about when they start going on about the current state of "relevance."
The westernized AAA specs-chasing pissing-contest console gaming echo chamber is not a market with very much room to grow, or even much visibility to a pretty huge chunk of potential customers. Gaming as a hobby is pretty niche still, and lying to yourself about the relevance of AAA console gaming when it's basically dead in Japan and struggling to expand in a meaningful way in the west (mostly because of the stupid arms race).
Nintendo will continue to focus on making great games and that's why they'll be fine. As if I needed to assure myself of Nintendo in particular's fineness over that of other gaming entities.
Lionel Richie
Member
If the only way you can grow your business is with something as huge as Mario or Pokémon then 98% of the businesses of the world are going bankrupt for sure.
Not even close. If 10 not hardcore random people walked in on someone playing Call of Duty, on a good day you're going to get 2-3 people guessing correctly. Mario or Pokémon it's going to be damn closer to 10.
They quite literally made Splatoon the main event of their Switch reveal trailer.
While the article feels mostly like the old nintendo is doomed mantra, even though their future is a bit uncertain although they still are fine money-wise, I do agree that the price model for mario run might be a bad choice.
After all, the vast majority probably don't know more about the game than that mario is now on mobile. And thus they download, and are faced with only 3 free stages + some additional content, which means you either don't bother with the app anymore, enjoy the mostly same content again and again or check out the full game purchase.
And $9.99 is already quite a lot for mobile games, but facing that prize after downloading what looks like a free game might make it even more outrageous for a lot of people than if it cost 9.99 from the start.
It would be interesting to see numbers on how many people actually plays the game regularly in comparison to how many who downloaded it.
After all, the vast majority probably don't know more about the game than that mario is now on mobile. And thus they download, and are faced with only 3 free stages + some additional content, which means you either don't bother with the app anymore, enjoy the mostly same content again and again or check out the full game purchase.
And $9.99 is already quite a lot for mobile games, but facing that prize after downloading what looks like a free game might make it even more outrageous for a lot of people than if it cost 9.99 from the start.
It would be interesting to see numbers on how many people actually plays the game regularly in comparison to how many who downloaded it.
CrispyBoar
Banned
If I could "like" a post on NeoGAF like on Facebook, it would be this one.
But of course, people will ignore logic like this & demand for Nintendo to be like Microsoft & Sony in terms of graphics & power.
cartman414
Member
What, because people want more microtransactions?
Laughing Banana
Weeping Pickle
Such a Sesquipedalian Loquaciousness article, sheeesh.
LordRaptor
Member
Funny, because most people entirely dismissing the handheld market as having any sales capability do so because the Vita failed.
deadscreensky
Member
Great article, thanks for the link. I was sort of surprised it didn't get into the Switch, but I guess there's nothing really to talk about there yet. Will be interesting to see if this article is prophetic -- Nintendo is incredibly conservative, but (as the author points out) they do occasionally release a Wii Sports. I'm leaning towards them having to spend another console generation in the wilderness, but will be happy if I'm wrong.
(I'm not sure why so many people on GAF seem to think you have to agree with 100% of an essay to find it valuable or interesting, but apparently they do! No different perspectives allowed, just mindless doomed meme defense.
Obviously some people disagree with it on more comprehensive grounds and that's cool.)
(I'm not sure why so many people on GAF seem to think you have to agree with 100% of an essay to find it valuable or interesting, but apparently they do! No different perspectives allowed, just mindless doomed meme defense.
Obviously some people disagree with it on more comprehensive grounds and that's cool.)
Yes there is but we get articles like that every months since more than a decade, everything worth argumenting was already said again and again in the past, and we're now stuck in a loop where people just don't care anymore because there is simply nothing more to say.
Last I checked Nintendo's business was more than just the mobile games many here didnt want to see them produce int he first place. Now all of a sudden the wii u and 3ds declines dont even matter anymore. And amiibo, remember how that shook up the toys to life landscape and didnt falter less than a year in?
A key aspiration of their mobile venture was to be a tool to bring that audience back to their traditional wares. Outside of a small bump for Pokemon, one they largely werent responsible for, that goal has not been realized. Pokemon Go was able to bump old pokemon games on the charts. What old Mario games have seen the same results thanks to SMR? How is that even going to happen when Nintendo is pulling Wii Us out of stores and shipping more Classics to smaller markets? Are we guaranteed to see 3D Land and NSMB2 charting in japan next week?
They are still pulling themselves out of the ashes of the 8th generation. Merely laying the foundation for them to rise again is not success. Until then they are still in the middle of a struggle. Especially while they're making mistakes along the way.
New Super Mario Bros Wii (2009) jumped back up to around number 79 on the US Amazon game charts.
Remember the Wii sold over a 100 million units. Seems like quite a few people dusted it off and went and ordered a copy of NSMB for it.
Empyrean Heaven
Member
Lionel Richie
Member
Must be fun living in this batshit insane parallel universe.
Confused Cheeseburger
Member
Did anyone even read this article? It is well written and raises some very valid points.
clevbrowns94
Member
It is weird that some people on here seem to think that the Wii and DS have been Nintendo's only successes. Maybe they are 15 years old or so, and weren't old enough to remember how big the NES, SNES, Gameboy, etc. were back in the day.