Dice
Pokémon Parentage Conspiracy Theorist
go get educated about how important freedoms are in a market kthxbye
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Nintendo takes down videos of TAS, rom-hacked games on Nicovideo
- Thread starter xk0sm0sx
- Start date
Isn't Kazio Mario World just a rom hack played on a reproduction cart?
TheSlySoul
Member
jediyoshi
Member
Err, TAS videos aren't inherently on non "real games".
There are TAS demonstrations there, so it'd be affected all the same.
I'm always surprised when people are surprised that Nintendo does this. I mean, they have two pages existing on IP policy and one in particular that specifically talks about how the are against things such as emulation. Now, whether you actually agree with this or not, it's still there for everyone to see so it's not like its hidden information
http://www.nintendo.com/corp/ippolicy.jsp
http://www.nintendo.com/corp/legal.jsp
I mean, agree or disagree, they are pretty clear on this matter.
http://www.nintendo.com/corp/ippolicy.jsp
http://www.nintendo.com/corp/legal.jsp
Nintendo said:
I mean, agree or disagree, they are pretty clear on this matter.
NeoGAF will be closed by Nintendo? I remember a challenge using Lunar Magic that lead to many clones of SMW ^_^
Especially now that there's USB SNES carts readers that allow to play real carts (and patch them on the go if needed)
They're probably not done totally legally most of the time, but it's perfectly possible.
Especially now that there's USB SNES carts readers that allow to play real carts (and patch them on the go if needed)
Vampirolol
Member
This is stupid on so many levels.
Sir Ilpalazzo
Member
It doesn't really matter if they've explained themselves. It's still embarrassing and makes them look like a dinosaur - especially because no one else does nonsense like this.
the TAS demos are on real hardware since the bot is just feeding the game the button presses to replicate the TAS in real hardware.
i dunno but seems that a lot of people forgot what was the real goal of TASes. it was to make sequences that are beyond a human's reflexes and can be reproduced on real hardware all along but the tech wasn't there initially. nowadays, we have things like TASbot that makes this goal a reality. emulators are just a part of the process in creating the TAS but the final product can work without any emulation involved.
i'm pretty sure Nintendo doesn't even know this so they'll take down a video done in real hardware and that will start a shitstorm regardless.
People aren't criticizing a lack of clarity of their policies, they're criticizing the policies themselves.
Old men are the future!
Are you trying to say that they have no right to protect their IP and copyright?
gigantor21
Member
It worked wonders for competitive Smash, LOL.
Seriously, though, this is dumb--and entirely expected, in Nintendo's case. At this point I'm surprised it didn't happen sooner.
KratosEnergyDrink
Member
Very strange.
Other companies with meaningful IPs, like Disney, have no problems when people copy their old movies and publish them somewhere on the internet. Or...?
Sir Ilpalazzo
Member
You say that as though hacks or tool-assisted runs damage their brands.
Doesn't mean they have to follow what other companies are doing.
That's not my call to make as it's not that my IP is being manipulated, but I can definitely see how they are against it. They have explicitly said that no one is to emulate their games whatsoever, no matter what the reason. It's written on their site in black and white.
Brawly Likes to Brawl
Member
You'd think a game dev would be savvy enough to know where their priorities lie. Someone making TAS videos of some super old ass games is not a legitimate threat to your IP. You're just ruining some fan's day for no reason other than formality.
What I find really weird is that other TAS videos are still available.
For example this here - all sorts of Majora's Mask TAS videos:
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm25189727
It seems at least the GBA Mario Kart video was uploaded by user cstrakm, who still has a few videos up and those remaining videos have ads enabled. So it seems actually the ads were the problem, not the TAS videos themselves.
EDIT: user ISMin, that uploaded Kirby, has ads enabled for other videos too.
People are surprised because Nintendo's never taken legal action against emulator makers, even commercial ones. They go after ROM hosts/uploaders, and joint action against companies who make/sell game copiers, but that's pretty much it before.
I don't really think this is an "emulation" issue.
For now it's all speculation, since there's no official word on what happened yet.
Anyway in the blog you can see a few charts. It shows that videos tagged under "TAS" and "Kaizo Mario" have dropped severely the past few days, (about a hundred were removed).
Hmm, as a premium user I can skip the ads, so I'm wondering if the ads were actually turned on for video monetization, or rather to support Nicovideo.
I have also not heard of any ad monetization program for Nicovideo other than Nico's own Creator's Program which Nintendo have joined in.
Kelli Lemondrop
Banned
if in the united states, making backups is illegal *IF* you have to circumvent ANY form of copy protection (which could be interpreted to include having to use a custom interface to acccess the chip).
it may be perfectly legal in other countries, such as japan, but here in the states if you have to bypass any form of protection at all, its a dmca violation to make a copy.
Vipershark
Member
Nintendo's responses as to why they don't support emulators (as posted earlier) are more or less irrelevant as far as TASes and other videos go.
What their responses fail to take into account (conveniently, for them) is that emulators and personal backups aren't illegal at all. They instead speak around the issue and only talk about the fact that emulators can be used to play games which have been distributed illegally (which is a fair point on their end) and frame it as though emulators can only be used to play said illegal copies.
The problem with that is that unless Nintendo can prove that the roms being used are illegal, there's nothing they can do about people posting videos of them.
I think that's why they're removing them for monetary reasons. They know that there's no way they can realistically prove that the roms being used aren't legal so instead they're opting to just pull videos with any roms down since they can't control them.
Only problem is, this also hurts people who are playing (and making videos) completely legally, which in no way helps Nintendo at all. This whole thing comes off like Nintendo throwing a tantrum about the fact that they can't control the ecosystem.
What their responses fail to take into account (conveniently, for them) is that emulators and personal backups aren't illegal at all. They instead speak around the issue and only talk about the fact that emulators can be used to play games which have been distributed illegally (which is a fair point on their end) and frame it as though emulators can only be used to play said illegal copies.
The problem with that is that unless Nintendo can prove that the roms being used are illegal, there's nothing they can do about people posting videos of them.
I think that's why they're removing them for monetary reasons. They know that there's no way they can realistically prove that the roms being used aren't legal so instead they're opting to just pull videos with any roms down since they can't control them.
Only problem is, this also hurts people who are playing (and making videos) completely legally, which in no way helps Nintendo at all. This whole thing comes off like Nintendo throwing a tantrum about the fact that they can't control the ecosystem.
charlequin
Banned
Even under our absurdly corporate-friendly copyright laws that isn't a thing Nintendo actually has the legal power to demand.
No, it couldn't. No cartridge-based system uses any technology that qualifies under the DMCA anti-circumvention rules.
WrenchNinja
Member
It's Nintendo, whatever they do will be correct according to him.
JSoup
Banned
While Nintendo and other companies will tell you this and try to sue over it, it's been upheld in court several times that your right to create a personal backup supersedes their right to prevent you. If they don't want you making backups, the only recourse they have so to either A. Make it difficult for you to do that or B. Scare you into not wanting to do it.
levyjl1988
Banned
They'll probably mirror the videos somewhere else on the internet, other than that.
Nintendo likes to get negative press. First comes lack of stock followed by lack of amiibo's to this. Nintendo the new Ubisoft?
Nintendo likes to get negative press. First comes lack of stock followed by lack of amiibo's to this. Nintendo the new Ubisoft?
Yeah, there's plenty of creative TAS videos.
There's a Made In Wario speedrun, and there's also a Dr Mario one which shows two TAS fighting against each other, one at level 0, one at level 20.
At first due to the wording I though this was a fan article, but I'm actually surprised how clearly they even outlined things related to internet rumors (24 hour rule, second copy). Illegal emulation seems to be a big issue to Nintendo, which makes me sad since those people are also hurting the good number of people (at least here on GAF) that use emulators only for personal backups.
UNATCO?
Great post, and you took the words right out of my mouth. They fail to mention that having rom backups of your own games is perfectly legal, and so emulators are not ilegal whatsoever. Nintendo being Nintendo.
The Spoony Hou
Member
Nintendo makes no sense. I can only guess they consider those to be "not proper representations of the gameplay" or something. I think that's why Nintendo doesn't condone emulator use, though of course they most probably take roms offline for economic purposes.
encephalon
Member
For the record, unless I'm mistaken, the great purge of playthroughs youtube experienced never happened on nico nico. You'll have no problem finding Shining Force III playthroughs, etc. Videogame playthroughs probably make up a much larger percentage of nico nico's content than youtube, if not the majority of content on the site (the section including games and anime features several times more recent uploads than the other sections). Essentially, if you're posting a gameplay video and you're Japanese, you're most likely posting it on this website. So this might piss off a considerable portion of the playthrough community, but it's probably hard to say what real consequences if any there will be for Nintendo for doing so.
YianGaruga
Banned
This isn't "just speed-run cheating". TAS and rom-hacks are big projects which can require months of work and are made by very dedicated and talented people. Nintendo has no reason to intervene here in any way. (Unless it's really just about monetization)
Please explain how this TAS can be described as "speed-run cheating"?
TASs allow people to demonstrate things possible in a game that are almost impossible to do in real time. As such they are not really representative of what the game is usually like for the average person so you can't even use the same argument of being able to experience the game without playing it yourself like you can with a Let's Play.
TheChillyAcademic
Member
OMG please don't tell me Asshole Mario has been removed!!!!!!
crazyrabbits
Banned
Nope.
As said above, there are certain consumer laws that have been in place for decades, and allow users to have specific things they can and can't do with software. You can make a one-off backup copy, as long as you're not using it for personal profit or illegal copying, you can augment or modify the files on your disc as you see fit, and you can sell it once provided that (once again) it is not for personal profit.
Contrary to what Nintendo (or even Steam) claims, you have rights when it comes to the software you purchase.
SerTapTap
Member
There's always a TAS block in recent GDQs, usually they'll bring a bot that inputs TAS inputs on live hardware but they've played romhacks and crap before (Kazio, a straight romhack and I Wanna Be The Boshy which uses a great deal of unlicensed assets from Nintendo and more)
I agree that Nintendo probably isn't quite that stupid though.
Does Nicovideo even have any sort of monetization program like Youtube?
Factually wrong on both accounts.