No local split screen for Halo 5 at all? Campaign or MP...

Madness

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I was debating whether to make this thread since, in the past, many often are used to just unjustly criticize the game, but I was looking at the twitters of various Halo/Halo dev accounts and this conversation caught my eye. Someone tweeted a picture of Halo 5 showing only 1 player/Xbox Live and he asked whether split screen was removed, Josh Holmes, internal studio head for Halo 5, responded by saying that full screen is needed for all MP modes that use dedicated servers etc. (Warzone, Arena, Campaign).

Now we had already known that split screen campaign was cut because it wouldn't have been able to maintain 60fps which is what the game is built around, visual fidelity much higher in campaign, but many assumed local split screen MP was still in. 4 player split screen was most likely going to be out but it seems like 2 player split screen is out as well, effectively meaning that only 1 player per console can play Halo 5 campaign or multi-player.

The way it's worded is interesting because it also mentions using dedicated servers, maybe offline customs play would allow split screen? Thoughts? I mean at the end of the day, me personally, I'm no longer in school or go over to play, and so I'd still like 60fps over having split screen, but I know a lot of people who bring friends over, who have significant others or siblings who like to play. Thoughts? We were discussing it earlier in the community thread.

Edit:


Pre-order only shows 1 player for local, 2-24 for Xbox Live as well.

Edit #2: Confirmed split screen not in final release, nor any native LAN support.

A Microsoft spokesperson confirmed to Ars Technica that Halo 5: Guardians will not support any form of split-screen multiplayer, nor will the game natively support LAN play. "The decision [to remove all split-screen modes] was an extremely difficult one for the team, but one that was necessary to deliver the biggest Halo game to date," the representative wrote in a statement. "343’s focus is to ensure that fans get the best Halo experience yet, and the team felt a split-screen experience would compromise the gameplay design and the visual bar they’ve set."

The representative pointed out that Halo: MCC was not built with LAN support, as well, but we have found that LAN connectivity can be used in that game so long as all connected Xbox One consoles are also connected to Xbox Live via Wi-Fi.

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2015/06/halo-5-listing-dev-statement-point-to-end-of-series-local-multiplayer/
 

SND

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Is couch co-op really a thing anymore? I understand that some people still like/want it, but isn't that a minority at this point?

I wouldn't want a dev to waste time including a feature for a small number of people, instead I'd hope they'd put those resources elsewhere,
 

jem0208

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It has been stated a few times that the game is reliant on 60fps.



While that doesn't change the fact that it sucks, it doesn't sound like 343 left it out just because they're "lazy devs".
 

Madness

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Before this thread gets out of hand.

It has been stated a few times that the game is reliant on 60fps.

Yeah, but assumption was from the past threads and game informer article that it was coop campaign that wasn't going to be split screen. Now it seems as if split screen gone altogether, effectively making Halo 5, a one player per console game only.
 

YuriLowell

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Is couch co-op really a thing anymore? I understand that some people still like/want it, but isn't that a minority at this point?

I wouldn't want a dev to waste time including a feature for a small number of people, instead I'd hope they'd put those resources elsewhere,
Couch co-op is a halo tradition.
 

wesleyshark

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Is couch co-op really a thing anymore? I understand that some people still like/want it, but isn't that a minority at this point?

I wouldn't want a dev to waste time including a feature for a small number of people, instead I'd hope they'd put those resources elsewhere,
It's not a majority. It's a very vocal minority. I'd much rather have a fluid and consistent experience overall, in both campaign and multiplayer, then for things to get cut so that the screen can be divided into two or four for cramped gameplay at lower framerates.
 

PeterVenkman

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Is couch co-op really a thing anymore? I understand that some people still like/want it, but isn't that a minority at this point?

I wouldn't want a dev to waste time including a feature for a small number of people, instead I'd hope they'd put those resources elsewhere,
Yes, it is a thing.

Split screen mp is a go to with friends over. Always used to have a copy of halo around simply because it was one of the easiest ways to get a group of people playing games.

This is a shame, but it means I really don't need to buy An Xbox one for halo.
 

jem0208

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Yeah, but assumption was from the past threads and game informer article that it was coop campaign that wasn't going to be split screen. Now it seems as if split screen gone altogether, effectively making Halo 5, a one player per console game only.
I know, I'm just throwing that out there before the lazy dev comments come flying in.

I assume they couldn't hit the 60fps target in MP either.
 

tootsi666

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It has been stated a few times that the game is reliant on 60fps.



While that doesn't change the fact that it sucks, it doesn't sound like 343 left it out just because they're "lazy devs".
There are many engines which work just fine in both 60 and 30fps. They fucked up early in design.
 

Chezzymann

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Is couch co-op really a thing anymore? I understand that some people still like/want it, but isn't that a minority at this point?

I wouldn't want a dev to waste time including a feature for a small number of people, instead I'd hope they'd put those resources elsewhere,
I hope not, couch co op is far superior to online multiplayer in my opinion. It's just not the same talking to your friends via a microphone versus playing the game together in the same house. In my opinion it's a huge part of what makes halo halo, its how I grew up playing the game.

Since I don't know anyone with an Xbox one and rely on people coming over for playing games usually, I might not get halo 5 because of this.
 
Mar 30, 2007
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It has been stated a few times that the game is reliant on 60fps.

While that doesn't change the fact that it sucks, it doesn't sound like 343 left it out just because they're "lazy devs".
You can always decrease other aspects of the graphics to hit a better framerate. I'm not saying they're lazy, but it's not impossible just because 'the game is reliant on 60fps'.
 

Kalliban

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Is couch co-op really a thing anymore? I understand that some people still like/want it, but isn't that a minority at this point?

I wouldn't want a dev to waste time including a feature for a small number of people, instead I'd hope they'd put those resources elsewhere,
I'd rather they included split-screen ("couch co-op" if that's the term now) than online multiplayer for most games tbh.
 

Stone Ocean

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It's not a majority. It's a very vocal minority. I'd much rather have a fluid and consistent experience overall, in both campaign and multiplayer, then for things to get cut so that the screen can be divided into two or four for cramped gameplay at lower framerates.
How does the performance of splitscreen affect your experience in any way?
 

TDLink

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Is couch co-op really a thing anymore? I understand that some people still like/want it, but isn't that a minority at this point?

I wouldn't want a dev to waste time including a feature for a small number of people, instead I'd hope they'd put those resources elsewhere,
Yes it absolutely is. As you've gotten older and grown apart from your friends maybe you rarely or never experience it anymore but kids all the way up through people in university still enjoy playing games with others in the same room, not just online. That's never going to change.
 

PnCIa

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To be social in reality is not a thing thats desire able anymore people. I would rather have a local splitscreen that runs at 40 FPS than non at all.
Sure...my GF can get herself an XBone, right? That sounds like a good idea.

How about locking splitscreen to 30 Fps? That should work. Except when your physics are tied to framerate like in days of Quake.
 

Rosur

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Split screen mp is a go to with friends over.
Yep split screen mp with mates is great. Its a shame companies don't want to have it in anymore :( (We never do online gaming as people have different platforms/ too busy to organise for online but when we meet up we normal play a few round of smash/ mario kart, halo and the older CODs).

I don't care if you drop the graphics for it so it runs well but using graphics as an excuse not to include it sucks.
 

jem0208

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There are many engines which work just fine in both 60 and 30fps. They fucked up early in design.
I'm not gunna disagree with that.
You can always decrease other aspects of the graphics to hit a better framerate. I'm not saying they're lazy, but it's not impossible just because 'the game is reliant on 60fps'.
Perhaps, it's possible they would have had to decrease it to a level below the minimum standards they wanted though.
 

chidrock

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Splitscreen is huge for me and my friends. I've played through all of the Halo games with my friends in the past and most recently my son.

I thought I was a diehard Halo fan and I got all of the special editions in the past, but I'm actually considering skipping this one because the splitscreen was the thing I liked most about Halo.

Not sure it'll be worth buying a second XB1 just so I can sit in separate rooms to play through it with my son. (My wife wouldn't be happy about having two tvs set up in one room lol)
 

Xer0

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I'm positive they know what they're doing, but, considering the compromises they're making, Halo 5 better be, like, super locked at 60.
 

ramparter

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Is couch co-op really a thing anymore? I understand that some people still like/want it, but isn't that a minority at this point?

I wouldn't want a dev to waste time including a feature for a small number of people, instead I'd hope they'd put those resources elsewhere,
Couch co-op is still great. Perhaps you meant split screen fps multiplayer? That I'd understand. No point playing an fps game when your enemies know your location.
 

Seth Enosh

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i could swear i read multiplayer DOES have 2 player splitscreen
In december Josh Holmes said there would be splitscreen. He also confirmed 2-player local campaign Co-Op which we know is cut from the game informer article. It seems like they planned to have Splitscreen but have changed their mind.

Sources:

https://twitter.com/JoshingtonState/status/545000766969114625
"@ambr8978 @quinndelhoyo @Brav @Halo we’ll have local split screen for 2 players in final."

https://twitter.com/joshingtonstate/status/546126391201128448
"@ArtooFeva Halo 5: Guardians will feature four player co-op via LIVE or 2-player local co-op via split screen. More later..."
 

Madness

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i could swear i read multiplayer DOES have 2 player splitscreen

edit:
https://mobile.twitter.com/JoshingtonState/status/545000766969114625

"@ambr8978 @quinndelhoyo @Brav @Halo we’ll have local split screen for 2 players in final."
Yeah that's why I was curious because Josh says all MP modes use full screen implying no split screen, plus this is the picture that was tweeted before it.



Apparently the pre-order only shows 1-1 for Xbox one and then 2-24 players over Xbox Live.
 

Percy

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Is couch co-op really a thing anymore? I understand that some people still like/want it, but isn't that a minority at this point?

I wouldn't want a dev to waste time including a feature for a small number of people, instead I'd hope they'd put those resources elsewhere,
So features that will only be utilised by a minority of users should not be implemented at all?

Hoo boy... better remove the multiplayer altogether in that case.
 

The Jackdog

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In december Josh Holmes said there would be splitscreen. He also confirmed 2-player local campaign Co-Op which we know is cut from the game informer article. It seems like they planned to have Splitscreen but have changed their mind.

Sources:

https://twitter.com/JoshingtonState/status/545000766969114625
"@ambr8978 @quinndelhoyo @Brav @Halo we’ll have local split screen for 2 players in final."

https://twitter.com/joshingtonstate/status/546126391201128448
"@ArtooFeva Halo 5: Guardians will feature four player co-op via LIVE or 2-player local co-op via split screen. More later..."
so they are changing their minds?

goddamnit.
 

Welfare

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It's not a majority. It's a very vocal minority. I'd much rather have a fluid and consistent experience overall, in both campaign and multiplayer, then for things to get cut so that the screen can be divided into two or four for cramped gameplay at lower framerates.
Backwards compatibility was only used by 5% of players, which is why it was not present at the Xbox One's launch, and yet look, BC is back.

Fuck this whole "vocal minority" nonsense as if not for vocal minorities, Halo 5 would be more like Halo 4, we would've never gotten Legendary Slayer in Halo 4, and there would probably not be a HCS.
 

PnCIa

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So features that will only be utilised by a minority of users should not be implemented at all?

Hoo boy... better remove the multiplayer altogether in that case.
They should remove gamemodes that are rarely played. Because, you know, nobody cares.
 

Seth Enosh

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Or, as they continued to develop the game, realized they couldn't meet the 60fps target if they kept splitscreen in, so splitscreen got cut.
Yep. It's weird to me because 343 shipped halo 4 with absolutely terrible FPS in splitscreen multiplayer (I'm not one to care about FPS that often but even I could notice how badly Halo 4's Dominion mode played in 2 player splitscreen online, it had to be dropping to 20 fps or something like that), and also shipped H2A with terrible FPS in splitscreen (again, around 20 FPS even on small built-in maps with only 2 players).

But now they didn't plan for halo 5 to have splitscreen with a lower performance...
 

Jito

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Keep up the good work 343, removing those expected features of a Halo game is just what the fans were asking for! Played so many hours of Halo splitscreen online and local co-op was the only way I ever played the campaign with my mates. It's lame that splitscreen is being tossed for 60 fps, just make it 30 fps in split screen or some other compromise.

This has thrown Halo 5 back to the bottom of my list of reasons to get a XB1 after the great showing at E3.
 

Kalliban

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Or, as they continued to develop the game, realized they couldn't meet the 60fps target if they kept splitscreen in, so splitscreen got cut.
If that was the case then they could've reduced the framerate to 30 when in splitscreen or something. No need to remove it completely. My guess is that it's much bigger than that, probably some limitation in the engine meaning a lot of time to rebuild it, meaning a delay of the game. Maybe it'll come as a DLC later?
 

Arc

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Wow. This is a huge bummer. Halo without split screen is just not really a Halo game I'm interested in.

Why do devs not prioritize this basic feature? It feels condescending like they are assuming their audience are anti social stereotypes of "gamers". It's another embarrassing failure of 343.
 

BokehKing

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It comes down to money, it forces people to buy a system and online service. It's not that people lost interest in couch co-op, it's that they stop offering it. I know plenty of gaming couples who despise the lack of couch co-op.

If the voice is a minority, it was not dwindled due to lack of interest, it was lack of options.

It's funny, everyone wanted halo to go back to its roots, but... Couch co-op is a huge chunk of root missing
 

Chezzymann

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Halo 5 has no LAN? lol rip competitive halo
What the hell? How would you be able to organize local tournaments without lan? Can you do custom games online? Even then every Xbox one used at the tournament would have to individually pay for Gold and go online.
 

Collateral22

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Someone above said the same. I should've asked for a source on it. Hasn't been confirmed. If so, that would be bullshit.

I mean, it HAS to have LAN support. I just has to. Right?
Considering MS seem to be pushing Halo 5 on all fronts it will have to, although AW has no LAN either on XB1.
 

Seth Enosh

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Someone above said the same. I should've asked for a source on it. Hasn't been confirmed. If so, that would be bullshit.

I mean, it HAS to have LAN support. I just has to. Right?
There definitely won't be system link, Master Chief Collection didn't have that either. Multiplayer is going to be Always Online.

I believe halo 5 is dedicated servers only, with no p2p fallback, so LAN wouldn't be possible.

Chezzymann said:
What the hell? How would you be able to organize local tournaments without lan? Can you do custom games online? Even then every Xbox one used at the tournament would have to individually pay for Gold and go online.
This is how the current Halo Championship Series tournament in Halo MCC is working as far as I know. No System Link or LAN support in that game either.
 

BokehKing

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What the hell? How would you be able to organize local tournaments without lan? Can you do custom games online? Even then every Xbox one used at the tournament would have to individually pay for Gold and go online.
Pretty sure it has LAN, they are trying to make Halo relevant again to the people who lost interest, they want it to be a major e-sport again for non halo fans.
 

Samurai G0SU

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Couch co-op is a halo tradition.
When it was 2005 maybe....
Things change, as everyone can see.

This sucks for me since my wife wont be-able to play with me. But previous games already set this standard this Gen not having couch co-op so we'll be fine. Don't see anyone making big #trending fusses about it.

What was the last couch co-op? Evolve?? lulz
 

Haruko

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Someone above said the same. I should've asked for a source on it. Hasn't been confirmed. If so, that would be bullshit.

I mean, it HAS to have LAN support. I just has to. Right?
All XBone games have the same restriction on LAN, as far as I can tell:

At least one of the XBones in the LAN setup needs a connection to Live.

The actual game is still played over LAN. Halo MCC works this way and it's been used for a number of tournaments so far. I would think Gears Ultimate will have the same restriction.

It's a requirement at the console level, not the game level.
 

BokehKing

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When it was 2005 maybe....
Things change, as everyone can see.

This sucks for me since my wife wont be-able to play with me. But previous games already set this standard this Gen not having couch co-op so we'll be fine. Don't see anyone making big #trending fusses about it.

What was the last couch co-op? Evolve?? lulz
Two of halo's competitors will have it though (COD & battlefront)
Times didn't change that much
 
Oct 25, 2013
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Is couch co-op really a thing anymore? I understand that some people still like/want it, but isn't that a minority at this point?

I wouldn't want a dev to waste time including a feature for a small number of people, instead I'd hope they'd put those resources elsewhere,
Yes it's a thing. I don't know how much use it sees, but my 9 year old son and I have played through Halo CE Anniversary, Halo 3, Halo 4, and Halo Reach through split-screen together, and were working on Halo 2 in MCC. Now if we want to play through it together, I'll have to buy another copy of the game and another console that I wasn't planning to buy, and I'm not sure I'm about to do that.

That also would have been my only reason for buying Halo 5 at this point, so unless I decide to purchase another console, they have lost my purchase.