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Official Football Thread 2006/2007 (Soccer)
- Thread starter hadareud
- Start date
- Status
psycho_snake
I went to WAGs boutique and all I got was a sniff
I just saw the robinson goal. Its ****ing incredible how he can hit the ball that far.
MrSardonic
The nerdiest nerd of all the nerds in nerdland
psycho_snake said:
Decades ago, some keeper scored a similar goal from his own penalty box - basically kicked it the entire length of the field.
Mama Smurf
My penis is still intact.
Mama Smurf said:
First game of the lot, West Brom v Birmingham, ends 1-1 thanks to and 85th minute Birmingham goal and ends that!
Gerrard can't even play in the middle when Alonso isn't in the team.
Mama Smurf
My penis is still intact.
That was such an obvious penalty to Villa, do refs need to watch the game from low res internet streams instead? We seem to be able to see more this way.
The Championship is extremely close and exciting (but but we need penalties to make it interesting boohoo waah waah!) this year, but it'd be an absolute disaster for Birmingham if they didn't grab automatic promotion.
I'm looking forward to the play-offs, whoever's in them, I can't remember when it's been tighter.
The Championship is extremely close and exciting (but but we need penalties to make it interesting boohoo waah waah!) this year, but it'd be an absolute disaster for Birmingham if they didn't grab automatic promotion.
I'm looking forward to the play-offs, whoever's in them, I can't remember when it's been tighter.
Mama Smurf
My penis is still intact.
Wembley had the first of its safety checks yesterday, with 30,000 people in there watching various things. It's funny, you can pack some grounds to the rafters with 30,000 people and it seems like a great crowd and loads of people, but this pic in the newspaper makes 30,000 look like 3000. Puts into perspective just how big 90,000 is.
Mark Bright scored the first goal at Wembley btw, remember that for pub quizzes for the rest of your life.
Some facts I'm copying down from the paper, you may already know them:
- Wembley has the most toilets of any stadium in the world, 2618. Old Wembley had 361
- The royal box, where the FA Cup trophy is presented, is 107 steps up from the pitch. That's a long climb, the old one was 39
- The pitch is 4m lower than it was (and apparently the whole stadium has been designed to keep the pitch perfect)
- There are no pillars to obstruct views, the arch isn't just decoration, it's actually holding the stadium up
- Each seat has more leg room than the old royal box
- Spectators are much closer to the pitch
- Largest stadium in the world to have every seat undercover
- 688 catering outlets, 152 at old Wembley. Apparently one bar sells fish and chips for £7....****ing hell
- The Wembley Arch is 133m tall, the Twin Towers were 35m
This isn't from the paper, but apparently we're close to lining up the first official England first team match at the stadium. It'll be a friendly against big opposition, likely from South America. Brazil or Argentina then. I'd guess Brazil.
I'm glad, it should be big. We risk losing our first match there, but we can't pussy out of it and play some team we're likely to beat. Where's the fun in that?
Mark Bright scored the first goal at Wembley btw, remember that for pub quizzes for the rest of your life.
Some facts I'm copying down from the paper, you may already know them:
- Wembley has the most toilets of any stadium in the world, 2618. Old Wembley had 361
- The royal box, where the FA Cup trophy is presented, is 107 steps up from the pitch. That's a long climb, the old one was 39
- The pitch is 4m lower than it was (and apparently the whole stadium has been designed to keep the pitch perfect)
- There are no pillars to obstruct views, the arch isn't just decoration, it's actually holding the stadium up
- Each seat has more leg room than the old royal box
- Spectators are much closer to the pitch
- Largest stadium in the world to have every seat undercover
- 688 catering outlets, 152 at old Wembley. Apparently one bar sells fish and chips for £7....****ing hell
- The Wembley Arch is 133m tall, the Twin Towers were 35m
This isn't from the paper, but apparently we're close to lining up the first official England first team match at the stadium. It'll be a friendly against big opposition, likely from South America. Brazil or Argentina then. I'd guess Brazil.
I'm glad, it should be big. We risk losing our first match there, but we can't pussy out of it and play some team we're likely to beat. Where's the fun in that?
I'm not even surprised at the Foster thing, its not freaky at all to me now.
Howard had a keeper score on him from the opposite penalty box - and there was no defensive mix up to confuse him, he just totally misjudged the bounce.
Also happened to the other Utd reserve keeper I believe.
What is it with Utd reserve keepers letting other GKs score on them from the opposite penalty box!?!?!
Foster had a horrible game....clearly not ready for Utd's no.1, but hope he develops well in the next couple of years.
also Hargreaves un an exclusive interview said ManUtd is the only club he wants to join. He knows they see him as a vital piece of the puzzle and will try in the summer.
munich seem ready to let him go if the price can be agreed, sadly it looks to be in the region of £20m
. hehopes the fans can understand why he wants to leave but he doesnt think they will.
sounds like a formality really
Howard had a keeper score on him from the opposite penalty box - and there was no defensive mix up to confuse him, he just totally misjudged the bounce.
Also happened to the other Utd reserve keeper I believe.
What is it with Utd reserve keepers letting other GKs score on them from the opposite penalty box!?!?!
Foster had a horrible game....clearly not ready for Utd's no.1, but hope he develops well in the next couple of years.
also Hargreaves un an exclusive interview said ManUtd is the only club he wants to join. He knows they see him as a vital piece of the puzzle and will try in the summer.
munich seem ready to let him go if the price can be agreed, sadly it looks to be in the region of £20m
. hehopes the fans can understand why he wants to leave but he doesnt think they will.sounds like a formality really
Mama Smurf
My penis is still intact.
Every goalkeeper has bad games, even Van der Sar. Every other game I've seen Foster play in this season he's been excellent.
Now if that game starts playing on his mind, and he makes further mistakes in games, it might well be best to keep loaning him out for a while. I doubt it will, he seems quite a strong character, had the balls to do a Match of the Day interview about the incident.
I find it quite strange that you sold Howard to Everton, who'd been superb since he was loaned out there. I know you have Kuzszack and Foster, but I don't think that's even a competition for United's future, Foster's a mile ahead. Now Foster and Howard...that would be impressive.
EDIT: On Hargreaves, the main sticking point has always been whether or not Bayern will let him go, and we're no closer to knowing that. Everything else is okay, I even think they'd be willing to spend that much. If anything, chances have gone down slightly since Hitzfeld took over as coach, as he was always the one adamant that they wouldn't sell.
Now if that game starts playing on his mind, and he makes further mistakes in games, it might well be best to keep loaning him out for a while. I doubt it will, he seems quite a strong character, had the balls to do a Match of the Day interview about the incident.
I find it quite strange that you sold Howard to Everton, who'd been superb since he was loaned out there. I know you have Kuzszack and Foster, but I don't think that's even a competition for United's future, Foster's a mile ahead. Now Foster and Howard...that would be impressive.
EDIT: On Hargreaves, the main sticking point has always been whether or not Bayern will let him go, and we're no closer to knowing that. Everything else is okay, I even think they'd be willing to spend that much. If anything, chances have gone down slightly since Hitzfeld took over as coach, as he was always the one adamant that they wouldn't sell.
looks like I'm getting every single game wrong, not a great start to the betting plan.
Such is life.
edit: 2:0 Charlton. Could the relegation battle not be over after all? Even West Ham are not totally out of it if they win two of their next 3 games (Middlesbrough home, Arsenal away, Sheffield Utd away - that will probably the deciding game for the relegation battle)
Such is life.
edit: 2:0 Charlton. Could the relegation battle not be over after all? Even West Ham are not totally out of it if they win two of their next 3 games (Middlesbrough home, Arsenal away, Sheffield Utd away - that will probably the deciding game for the relegation battle)
Mama Smurf said:
Howard had his chance and did well for one season but mentally he's not up to it. His fumble got us knocked out of Europe (why do our keepers keepdoing that?). He even looked out of his depth at reserve level.
playing for Utd can be mentally destroying apparently, he looked like genuine contender best GK in England at one point but he had some kind of mental breakdown. Same happened with Barthez who came as a world class keeper and then made some of the craziest gaffs ever.
Mama Smurf
My penis is still intact.
Well that was incredibly dull.
All goalkeepers have poor patches, it just depends whether teams keep faith in them or not. United tend not to. Lehman had an entire season of mistakes a few years back, but Wenger stood by him and he was probably the best keepr in the league last year and one of the best this time. Friedel had a bad year last season...not that anyone but Blackburn fans noticed, because...why would they? Now though, back to his best.
It's a dangerous position to let a player regain their form of course, as mistakes by goalkeepers tend to lead to goals. That's why loaning Howard out was good, so he could go and get over those mistakes elsewhere and not cost United points. Then, if he can get back on form, you take him back. If not, sell him.
Doesn't really matter, you're still in a really strong position when it comes to goalkeepers. Arsenal would kill for it with Lehman possibly leaving this year.
All goalkeepers have poor patches, it just depends whether teams keep faith in them or not. United tend not to. Lehman had an entire season of mistakes a few years back, but Wenger stood by him and he was probably the best keepr in the league last year and one of the best this time. Friedel had a bad year last season...not that anyone but Blackburn fans noticed, because...why would they? Now though, back to his best.
It's a dangerous position to let a player regain their form of course, as mistakes by goalkeepers tend to lead to goals. That's why loaning Howard out was good, so he could go and get over those mistakes elsewhere and not cost United points. Then, if he can get back on form, you take him back. If not, sell him.
Doesn't really matter, you're still in a really strong position when it comes to goalkeepers. Arsenal would kill for it with Lehman possibly leaving this year.
Mama Smurf
My penis is still intact.
Lakitu said:
While any team can play badly, that was particularly disappointing because of the lack of effort. I swear Gerrard was just strolling round the pitch for half the game, not that most of the other players were much better. I thought it was a mistake to have such a lack of creativity in the centre of midfield though, what are Mascherano and Sissoko going to do going forward?
Mama Smurf
My penis is still intact.
I didn't realise Goodison Park was built in a rainforest.
2nd place is probably out of reach now.
2nd place is probably out of reach now.
Cornballer
Member
Well that was balls. Andy Johnson is a pain in the ass, but he gets the job done. I can't believe that guy's workrate. Diaby looked good, but Fabregas looked a little tired in the midfield. Arsenal have a tough time creating chances with Baptista and Aliadiere up top.
On to International week...
On to International week...
Mama Smurf
My penis is still intact.
We can't lose this week guys. Either England lose and McClaren is fired, or we win and...we've won. A draw would at least push McClaren towards the door, if not out of it.
FA Cup replays tomorrow first.
FA Cup replays tomorrow first.
Cornballer
Member
Do the England fans here rate McClaren, or do you want someone else?Mama Smurf said:
Who's playing tomorrow?
Mama Smurf
My penis is still intact.
Tottenham v Chelsea
Man Utd v Middlesbrough
Both start about 8pm, UK time.
Almost no one wanted McClaren. The dumbass media and some dumbass fans decided Sven represented all foreign coaches and we needed an Englishman to show the passion. That led to people as unbelievably unqualified as Stuart Pearce being put forward. Even amongst those who did want an Englishman McClaren didn't have the most support, Allardyce was right up there.
The rest of us with a fucking brain in our nut looked at the Premiership and realised there aren't any English coaches worthy of the job. Martin O'Neill was the fan favourite, the pundits' choice, definitely the man for the job and he wanted it, according to his comments during the WC after he'd been overlooked.
I don't know who'd be available now, we'd probably just put Venables in charge rather than assistant until we could find a long term replacement.
Man Utd v Middlesbrough
Both start about 8pm, UK time.
Almost no one wanted McClaren. The dumbass media and some dumbass fans decided Sven represented all foreign coaches and we needed an Englishman to show the passion. That led to people as unbelievably unqualified as Stuart Pearce being put forward. Even amongst those who did want an Englishman McClaren didn't have the most support, Allardyce was right up there.
The rest of us with a fucking brain in our nut looked at the Premiership and realised there aren't any English coaches worthy of the job. Martin O'Neill was the fan favourite, the pundits' choice, definitely the man for the job and he wanted it, according to his comments during the WC after he'd been overlooked.
I don't know who'd be available now, we'd probably just put Venables in charge rather than assistant until we could find a long term replacement.
Wes said:We should play Germany in the first match at new Wembley in my opinion
Not just in your opinion.
Mama Smurf
My penis is still intact.
Good choice, the FA said it was likely to be South African opposition but this is about as good as it gets.
If we lose, we'll never live it down.
EDIT: Might try and get to that match. London isn't too far away now and it'd be nice to say I was there.
Don't have much money though, so if Blackburn get into the cup final against the odds, it'll be that game I'm trying to get tickets for instead.
If we lose, we'll never live it down.
EDIT: Might try and get to that match. London isn't too far away now and it'd be nice to say I was there.
Don't have much money though, so if Blackburn get into the cup final against the odds, it'll be that game I'm trying to get tickets for instead.
yeah, we definitely have a problem upfront without Henry and Van Persie. On the bright side, Adebayor will be back next game. The bad news is that he is not exactly known for his clinical finishing either.phfresno said:
Another problem is that there's no goals coming from midfield at the moment, Fabregas doesn't have any confidence or luck in front of goal, Rosicky still hasn't proofed my right on the scoring front, Hleb is Hleb and so on.
Mama Smurf
My penis is still intact.
Just watched the Charlton v Newcastle highlights. Newcastle were awful, just awful. It could have been 4-0 easily. They were playing Solano and Duff as full backs by choice. That's how bad their actual defenders are.
It's still going to be really difficult for Charlton to stay up. They're putting up a good fight, 7 points from the last 9, and they'll be happier seeing Sheff Utd above them than Man City or Wigan, but they're still 4 points behind. The goal difference is negligible and, if they were to catch Sheff Utd on points, would likely have swung in their favour anyway.
Fixtures:
Charlton
H Wigan
A Man City
H Reading
A Everton
H Sheff Utd
A Blackburn
H Tottenham
A Liverpool
Sheff Utd
A Bolton
H Newcastle
A Man Utd
H West Ham
A Charlton
H Watford
A Aston Villa
H Wigan
Based on league position (and obviously not counting the game between the two of them) Charlton's games are considerably more difficult. And things don't look much better for them on stats.
There are two things they can hope for. They do have to play each other still and they're at home (though I did include this in Charlton's favour in the stats and overall their fixtures were still harder), and Sheff Utd's main striker, Hulse, is out for the rest of the season. He's scored 8 goals for them in the league, none of which were penalties, which is impressive given their position. No other player has scored more than 3...could swing things.
It's still going to be really difficult for Charlton to stay up. They're putting up a good fight, 7 points from the last 9, and they'll be happier seeing Sheff Utd above them than Man City or Wigan, but they're still 4 points behind. The goal difference is negligible and, if they were to catch Sheff Utd on points, would likely have swung in their favour anyway.
Fixtures:
Charlton
H Wigan
A Man City
H Reading
A Everton
H Sheff Utd
A Blackburn
H Tottenham
A Liverpool
Sheff Utd
A Bolton
H Newcastle
A Man Utd
H West Ham
A Charlton
H Watford
A Aston Villa
H Wigan
Based on league position (and obviously not counting the game between the two of them) Charlton's games are considerably more difficult. And things don't look much better for them on stats.
There are two things they can hope for. They do have to play each other still and they're at home (though I did include this in Charlton's favour in the stats and overall their fixtures were still harder), and Sheff Utd's main striker, Hulse, is out for the rest of the season. He's scored 8 goals for them in the league, none of which were penalties, which is impressive given their position. No other player has scored more than 3...could swing things.
I hope Charlton go down, thats what happens when you boo your greatest ever manager you stupid ingrates!
I feel for Tevez, wtf is he doing at West Ham, he's making a real go of it though and seems to be really bonding with the fans - which means he may well be plying his supposed world class trade in the championship next season while his greedy owners watch their walking cash cow plummet down the ranks.
I feel for Tevez, wtf is he doing at West Ham, he's making a real go of it though and seems to be really bonding with the fans - which means he may well be plying his supposed world class trade in the championship next season while his greedy owners watch their walking cash cow plummet down the ranks.
PSV - Ajax 1-5 
unfortunately i still think PSV will be champion.
And what about the celebration by the referee after Ajax fifth goal:
his explanation was that he celebrated because his use of the advantage rule worked out haha.
And last but not least check out this really funny bit, Davids shot came back from the post and hit Gomes in the face, who then fell down: http://youtube.com/watch?v=cCN_-H0MTPs
unfortunately i still think PSV will be champion.
And what about the celebration by the referee after Ajax fifth goal:
his explanation was that he celebrated because his use of the advantage rule worked out haha.
And last but not least check out this really funny bit, Davids shot came back from the post and hit Gomes in the face, who then fell down: http://youtube.com/watch?v=cCN_-H0MTPs
Mama Smurf
My penis is still intact.
:lol He's happier than the Ajax player
Cornballer
Member
Wow - lots of laughs in the PSV-Ajax game. Gomes took a pretty hard hit there. :lol
DCharlie
And even i am moderately surprised
i hate Sheff Utd , i'd love to see them drop!
And as we get Charlton EVERY SINGLE WEEK here , i'm starting to get attached to their plight - especially with a few ex-Ipswich boys there - plus Carlson is from my home town.
Unfortunately :
Charlton
H Wigan W 2-1
A Man City L 3-1
H Reading W 1-0
A Everton L 2-0
H Sheff Utd W 3-0
A Blackburn D 2-2
H Tottenham L 1-3
A Liverpool L 5-1
Sheff Utd
A Bolton L 2-0
H Newcastle D 1-1
A Man Utd L 1-3
H West Ham W 3-2
A Charlton L 0-3
H Watford W 4-2
A Aston Villa D 1-1
H Wigan W 2-0
I think Sheff Utd have too much of a lead to be caught
And as we get Charlton EVERY SINGLE WEEK here , i'm starting to get attached to their plight - especially with a few ex-Ipswich boys there - plus Carlson is from my home town.
Unfortunately :
Charlton
H Wigan W 2-1
A Man City L 3-1
H Reading W 1-0
A Everton L 2-0
H Sheff Utd W 3-0
A Blackburn D 2-2
H Tottenham L 1-3
A Liverpool L 5-1
Sheff Utd
A Bolton L 2-0
H Newcastle D 1-1
A Man Utd L 1-3
H West Ham W 3-2
A Charlton L 0-3
H Watford W 4-2
A Aston Villa D 1-1
H Wigan W 2-0
I think Sheff Utd have too much of a lead to be caught
:lol @ the ref, I love it.
Apparently Lily Allen doesn't like Ashley Cole
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egoCehcWM2k
:lol
Apparently Lily Allen doesn't like Ashley Cole
if this is really her
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egoCehcWM2k
:lol
:lol Would be funny as **** if that was Lily Allen. I think she's in town here in a couple weeks for a sold out show at a small venue.
:lol Simply no finishing whatsoever. We're missing our top three scorers, haven't had scoring from our midfield all year, and the forwards that are available are widely inconsistent. Take away the fluke goal against Villa, and the own goal against PSV, and our last REAL goal was scored three weeks ago by a 17 year old kid in the first half of a cup final who's about to go under the knife (and not soon enough...it didn't take much at all to make Theo's shoulder slip out again. Poor kid).
I would've been happy with a point, even more so considering Bolton and Liverpool both dropped points of their own. As it is we're still in third with that game in hand. But unless Adebayor really takes charge up front, I don't know where are scoring is gonna come from. Hope it doesn't neccessitate bringing RVP back early.
Andy Johnson was absolutely terrific BTW...which might mean something for England.
I'm not even gonna get into the England managerial fiasco again. Just realize that we could've had Scolari, but the FA ****ed that up because they insisted that he be announced as manager before the World Cup started, which he of course had no interest in doing since he was still managing Portugal. The FA needs to get what Wembley just received...a long, clinical restructuring from the top down. Preferably without the delays.
:lol :lol :lol Holy crap...
hadareud said:
:lol Simply no finishing whatsoever. We're missing our top three scorers, haven't had scoring from our midfield all year, and the forwards that are available are widely inconsistent. Take away the fluke goal against Villa, and the own goal against PSV, and our last REAL goal was scored three weeks ago by a 17 year old kid in the first half of a cup final who's about to go under the knife (and not soon enough...it didn't take much at all to make Theo's shoulder slip out again. Poor kid).
I would've been happy with a point, even more so considering Bolton and Liverpool both dropped points of their own. As it is we're still in third with that game in hand. But unless Adebayor really takes charge up front, I don't know where are scoring is gonna come from. Hope it doesn't neccessitate bringing RVP back early.
Andy Johnson was absolutely terrific BTW...which might mean something for England.
I'm not even gonna get into the England managerial fiasco again. Just realize that we could've had Scolari, but the FA ****ed that up because they insisted that he be announced as manager before the World Cup started, which he of course had no interest in doing since he was still managing Portugal. The FA needs to get what Wembley just received...a long, clinical restructuring from the top down. Preferably without the delays.
Prince said:And what about the celebration by the referee after Ajax fifth goal:
his explanation was that he celebrated because his use of the advantage rule worked out haha.
:lol :lol :lol Holy crap...
psycho_snake
I went to WAGs boutique and all I got was a sniff
I think he's a good manager for an average premiership club, he he's a shit manager for a team like england.Cornballer said:
A very big reason why england keep failing to do well is because of the press and the weakness of the FA. If england win with a very good performance, the press will make the manager and the players sound like gods. All this does is create pressure because the players know that if they dont perform then the press wil criticise them. There is no ****ing middle ground with the press. Its either the team are heroes or the team is shit.
I never liked sven because of the way he manages. I do agree that at times its good to be relaxed and not scream at your players all the time, but sven was way too relaxed. When england looked like they were ****ed sven didnt have the character to dig them out of a hole. Now despite svens problems, why the **** did news of the world feel the need to get a reporter pretend he's a fake sheikh and reveal what sven said in that meeting? It did nothing at all. It was pointless, its only purpose was to humiliate sven and make him look bad. Sven was wrong to say the stuff about owen being uphappy etc because the players expect it to be confiedntial, but did news of the world really need to make those things known to the public. All it did was cause more problems for the team, it didnt help anyone at all.
What makes things worse is that the FA have got no personality themselves. At times it feels like they are being run by the media. When we first appointed sven it was considered a great move. After a while the presss made it sound like he didnt care about iengland winning because he's not an english manager, so the fa listen to the press and sack him so that they can appoint an english manager, even though the best english manager is fat sam and he isnt the class of manager we need. Now that mclaren is appointed, the press will continue to criticise him and will eventually say that a foreign manager is better.
To be fair to the FA, Allardyce is the only contender they considered to have had a good season, and he counter balanced that by being wrapped up in the whole agent bribing scandal. So I think Maclaren was the best pick from a bad bunch.
It's worth remembering too that outside of 4 or 5 players, the squad is pretty shit. Central midfield is the only area where you can say we should be world beaters (maybe central defence too), we have 5 or 6 world class players but most of them dont fit in the same team. You cant blame Maclaren for Peter Crouch being Englands only fit target man, or how substandard every wide player in the squad is.
And Mamas wrong, he wont get sacked if we lose to Israel because he has the perfect excuse in the shape of FA cup replays, we'll go to ET & Penalies in the first game instead.
It's worth remembering too that outside of 4 or 5 players, the squad is pretty shit. Central midfield is the only area where you can say we should be world beaters (maybe central defence too), we have 5 or 6 world class players but most of them dont fit in the same team. You cant blame Maclaren for Peter Crouch being Englands only fit target man, or how substandard every wide player in the squad is.
And Mamas wrong, he wont get sacked if we lose to Israel because he has the perfect excuse in the shape of FA cup replays, we'll go to ET & Penalies in the first game instead.
The FA is such a joke, are they STILL paying Sven a stupid su of money while he "tries to find work"? WTF you stupid imbeciles!!
It makes me so mad to think how much money FA paid Sven. Absolutely sick, he didnt do a damn thing to earn that money. You could tell he didnt care about the football, he was just there on some kind of holiday. it was probably preferable for him to get fired as he gets a huge pay off.
The England set up has no guts, they need to mix things up, stop playing the obvious players and for example drop Lampard ffs. No wonder Scholes left, he got sick of the whole thing too.
Its hilarious that Liverpool's donkey striker is always England player, first heskey, when people realised he wasnt good enough he was replaced with Crouch. ffs.
England have the best defence in the world on paper. Their midfield and forward line is beset by players who select themselves apparantly and a lack of ambition or courage just finishes it all off. thankfully i dont even support england, i despise those fa imbeciles and merely hope for the best for utd players.
/rant
It makes me so mad to think how much money FA paid Sven. Absolutely sick, he didnt do a damn thing to earn that money. You could tell he didnt care about the football, he was just there on some kind of holiday. it was probably preferable for him to get fired as he gets a huge pay off.
The England set up has no guts, they need to mix things up, stop playing the obvious players and for example drop Lampard ffs. No wonder Scholes left, he got sick of the whole thing too.
Its hilarious that Liverpool's donkey striker is always England player, first heskey, when people realised he wasnt good enough he was replaced with Crouch. ffs.
England have the best defence in the world on paper. Their midfield and forward line is beset by players who select themselves apparantly and a lack of ambition or courage just finishes it all off. thankfully i dont even support england, i despise those fa imbeciles and merely hope for the best for utd players.
/rant
MrSardonic
The nerdiest nerd of all the nerds in nerdland
The situation at arsenal has revealed the lack of quality some players have - rosicky, hleb, baptista, et al...they just aren't the kind of quality, consistency, and killer players that arsenal need if they want to be up there in England and Europe. Yesterday was awful
MrSardonic said:
They don't have any good strikers at the moment. Aliadiere and Baptitsta played meh. Oh and what about diaby...the guy just can't hold on to a ball for more than 5seconds.
Everton deserved to win based on the chances they got (the bar got in the way 2/3 times). Arsenal did have more ballposession but they, like always, didn't really do anything with it.
don't you slag my boi Diaby off. He will soon be a massive player for this club for many years to come.
Rosicky and Hleb both have the required quality I think, you also have to consider that both of them were out some time prior to this game. Of course they will have to prove themselves next year, quality alone is not enough at a club like Arsenal.
Aliadiere will be gone in the summer, even though Wenger loves him (I think he's his son in reality). Baptista, I don't know what to say. I really want to like him, but in the last few games he was extremely disappointing (being polite), although yesterday was not as bad as the Villa game. Some of his decisions are shocking, he also constantly runs into people and loses the ball.
The problem is that I can't judge if it's just a bad stretch of form for Baptista, or worse, the quality is just not there. Luckily, that's for Wenger to judge, and I very much trust he will make the right decision.
The one thing that really disappointed me yesterday was our attitude in the last 15 minutes - Everton just wanted it more.
One thing is for certain however, with our top 3 strikers this is a different team. Hell, even with one of the 3 it would look different.
Rosicky and Hleb both have the required quality I think, you also have to consider that both of them were out some time prior to this game. Of course they will have to prove themselves next year, quality alone is not enough at a club like Arsenal.
Aliadiere will be gone in the summer, even though Wenger loves him (I think he's his son in reality). Baptista, I don't know what to say. I really want to like him, but in the last few games he was extremely disappointing (being polite), although yesterday was not as bad as the Villa game. Some of his decisions are shocking, he also constantly runs into people and loses the ball.
The problem is that I can't judge if it's just a bad stretch of form for Baptista, or worse, the quality is just not there. Luckily, that's for Wenger to judge, and I very much trust he will make the right decision.
The one thing that really disappointed me yesterday was our attitude in the last 15 minutes - Everton just wanted it more.
One thing is for certain however, with our top 3 strikers this is a different team. Hell, even with one of the 3 it would look different.
Ghost said:
Bottom line right here. I think the defense is fine when everyone is healthy, but beyond that there are question marks all over the park. Robinson barely cracks the top ten for goalies in his own ****ing league, and that's just not good enough. Up front it's a bit like Arsenal at the moment...a severe lack of clinical finishing. But the real problem for me is the midfield, which has got to be the most overrated part of any team in the footballing world. Today's game is all about pace, getting into space, keeping possession and making the right decisions. The only players who fit that bill for me is Aaron Lennon and Joe Cole. Everybody else is either slow as molasses, or too inconsistent with their decision making (SWP, though since he hardly plays it's hard to blame him). It pisses me off even more when people were calling this midfield the best in the world just a year ago (and it wasn't just the English saying this either, which astounded me even more), and that Beckham somehow became one of the two fall guys for the World Cup failiure when he directly contributed to three goals.
I think all that's missing is two or three players, but I do agree that the main problem is midfield. As discussed earlier either Lampard or Gerrard needs to be dropped to the bench, that's step one. The vital thing missing is a playmaker, but there's none around.
The wing is obviously a big problem too. Joe Cole is overrated in my eyes, Lennon can be great, but is too inexperienced and has one good game in 3, SWP has completely lost his way, although he seems to be improving lately.
You're absolutely right when you say that the midfield is too slow, passing and general movement leave a lot to be desired as well.
Mclaren just has to try out more players - Bentley, for instance. Walcott would have been another option on the wing (same as Lennon though), now he's injured of course. Barton instead of fat Frank. Richards instead of Neville when he's fit. There's quite a few options to give the team some pace.
The wing is obviously a big problem too. Joe Cole is overrated in my eyes, Lennon can be great, but is too inexperienced and has one good game in 3, SWP has completely lost his way, although he seems to be improving lately.
You're absolutely right when you say that the midfield is too slow, passing and general movement leave a lot to be desired as well.
Mclaren just has to try out more players - Bentley, for instance. Walcott would have been another option on the wing (same as Lennon though), now he's injured of course. Barton instead of fat Frank. Richards instead of Neville when he's fit. There's quite a few options to give the team some pace.
Sven picking Walcott for the WC was so damn hilarious btw :lol what the hell was he thinking??
they should just go back to playing as many man utd players as reasonable
Foster
Gary Neville - Rio - Terry- Cole
gerrard - Carrick- Hargreaves - lennon
rooney - alan smith
they should just go back to playing as many man utd players as reasonable
Foster
Gary Neville - Rio - Terry- Cole
gerrard - Carrick- Hargreaves - lennon
rooney - alan smith
Mama Smurf
My penis is still intact.
McClaren was appointed in April, Allardyce's bung allegations didn't come up until September.
And McClaren was the only choice of a bad bunch because The FA restricted it to a bad bunch by going with Englishmen after Scolari dropped out. O'Neill should have been chosen.
I realise McClaren has never had a fully fit squad, or even team, but it's not like we were playing Brazil. We couldn't beat Macedonia at home...we could play our 5th choice players in every position and should be able to manage that. I mean I defended England after the Spain match, Spain were playing an almost full strength side and we had a large number of first teamers missing, I think we did well to even match them on the pitch (which I felt we did), but I still think we'd be stronger with a better manager.
I feel England's first team (or at least, the first team I'd pick) is as good as any in the world and in some positions we have fantastic depth...but in others we have poor strength in depth. My first team would be:
-------------------------Foster---------------------
G Neville----Ferdinand-------Terry-------A Cole
Lennon-------Lampard----Hargreaves----J Cole
----------------Rooney--------Owen--------------
As long as they're on form, and any team in the world can have players out of form, I feel that team can match anyone. My only really question mark would be set piece takers...Lampard and Hargreaves can do a decent job, but there's no Beckham, Ronaldo, Pedersen or anyone in there who's really dangerous.
In terms of strength of depth:
GK
Carson
Kirkland
James
Green
Robinson
Luckily, as long as your first choice goalkeeper is fit, you don't really need too much strength in depth here. You're never going to bring on a goalkeeper to change a game...not unless it's going to penalties and you have a specialist anyway...but I think we have enough talent there to back up Foster well. No one truly awesome, but good. The problem with the current England set up is the order they seem to be in.
RB
Richards
Brown
Young
Johnson
P Neville
Carragher
Hargreaves
I'm really hopeful over Richards. I think he has a bright future, I just hope he leaves Man City for a bigger club this summer. You may question why City are doing so crap if he's so good, and obviously he's only one man, but in reality it's City's attack which is dreadful, 19th best in the league. Their defence is actually really good, 7th best in the league.
Below Richards it gets a bit more average, but there are a number of able deputies who could do a job. I put Carragher and Hargreaves at the bottom not because I think they're worse there, but because I'd prefer not to have to move players out of position if we're talkign strength in depth.
LB
Bridge
Barry
P Neville
Baines
Warnock
Carragher
Remember when this was a huge problem for England? And we had to play ****ing Chris Powell back there? Thank god that's over.
Not exactly a super strong position for us in terms of reserves, but a bit like the right backs after Richards, there are players who can do a decent job. Left bakc isn;t exactly a position you need a world beater in, so long as the rest of your first team is fit.
CB
Woodgate
Carragher
King
Campbell
Dawson
Lescott
Davies
Brown
Honestly, I wouldn't trade the players in this position with any other team in the world. Fantastic stuff.
RM
Dyer
Bentley
Beckham
Young
Wright-Phillips
Beckham was world class once, but not now. Certainly not on the right hand side of midfield anyway. The rest are just really good players, and I wish Bentley would be given his chance. Some of the balls he puts in are well above the standard of the rest (not Beckham), even if he doesn't quite have the pace of Dyer, Young and Wright-Phillips.
LM
Downing
Walcott
Richardson
Lennon
Oh dear. I really don't like any of the top 3. Well...no, I like Walcott, I just don't think he's shown enough quality yet to get into the England squad regularly. I really don't want to play Lennon on the left rather than the right, but frankly some other right sided choice with Lennon on the left is going to make a stronger team than Lennon on the right with one of these.
Damn you Giggs for choosing Wales!
DCM
Carrick
Huddlestone
Parker
P Neville
Carragher
King
It'd be hard to argue we don't look weaker without Hargreaves. I really think Huddlestone is awesome, but perhaps needs a couple more years before he can dominate in this role. Parker and Carrick are able deputants, nothing more.
ACM
Gerrard
Beckham
Jenas
Barton
Nolan
Dyer
J Cole
Pretty great I think, there are real possibilities for players who can come on and change a game.
FW
Johnson
Bent
Ashton
Crouch
Defoe
Lita
Smith
Nugent
Young
Walcott
The problem here is that, after the main two strikers, the quality drops sharply. Rooney and Owen could be the frontline for any side in the world, domestic or international. These guys struggle to make it to the top sides in the Premiership. You really can't look at them and say "Yeah, those are the other two strikers we should have in our squad". There's certainly absolutely no competition to the main two, unlike say, France who have to choose between the likes of Trezeguet and Saha to partner Henry.
There are possibilities. We haven't really seen Ashton at a top side for very long, hard to know if he'll live up to his billing. Nugent hasn't played in the Premiership yet, Young, Walcott and Lita are too young to know how they'll turn out.
So many good - average strikers, so few stars, I really don't know who I'd pick. I know a few I wouldn't pick...I'd probably have to go with 2 of Johnson, Bent and Ashton. I actually think Bent, at a top side like Liverpool, could be an incredibly prolific striker. I'm just not sure if he'd be as successful at international level. Some players just aren't as good when they make the step up for some reason no matter how good in the league...Ian Wright for example.
------------
I would say in most positions we have good or excellent strength in depth. A couple of positions are just tragic, so we have to rely on luck to keep our main guys for them.
Thing is, any team in the world is going to suffer if enough of their first team is out. As long as you have a few back ups who can come on and change a game, the others are only really there to cover positions one one or two of the first team are out. Once it gets beyond that, when 4 or 5 key players are out, every side would be weakened.
I mean look at our side against Spain:
----------------------Foster----------------------
G Neville---Ferdinand---Woodgate---P Neville
Wright-P----Gerrard------Carrick----Lampard
----------------Dyer-------Crouch---------------
Quite aside from the ****ed up formation, we're 7 players down on what I think is our best side. 7! You bring in people like Crouch and Carrick to cover a couple of gaps in your first team, these back ups aren't supposed to make up 2/3 of your side. Even some of our top back ups are out. Take the equivalent quality of Rooney, Owen, J Cole, Hargreaves, A Cole, Terry and Lennon out of Brazil, Argentina, Italy, France...any side you like and they'll struggle. Spain almost had a first team, on play we matched them with that lot.
Strength in depth is certainly a problem in a few positions, but I don't think it's England's main problem overall. Nor the strength of a fully fit first team, which could match anyone. The problem is the manager's tactics, both in terms of formation and the way we play.
Oh, and who he picks of course.
And McClaren was the only choice of a bad bunch because The FA restricted it to a bad bunch by going with Englishmen after Scolari dropped out. O'Neill should have been chosen.
I realise McClaren has never had a fully fit squad, or even team, but it's not like we were playing Brazil. We couldn't beat Macedonia at home...we could play our 5th choice players in every position and should be able to manage that. I mean I defended England after the Spain match, Spain were playing an almost full strength side and we had a large number of first teamers missing, I think we did well to even match them on the pitch (which I felt we did), but I still think we'd be stronger with a better manager.
I feel England's first team (or at least, the first team I'd pick) is as good as any in the world and in some positions we have fantastic depth...but in others we have poor strength in depth. My first team would be:
-------------------------Foster---------------------
G Neville----Ferdinand-------Terry-------A Cole
Lennon-------Lampard----Hargreaves----J Cole
----------------Rooney--------Owen--------------
As long as they're on form, and any team in the world can have players out of form, I feel that team can match anyone. My only really question mark would be set piece takers...Lampard and Hargreaves can do a decent job, but there's no Beckham, Ronaldo, Pedersen or anyone in there who's really dangerous.
In terms of strength of depth:
GK
Carson
Kirkland
James
Green
Robinson
Luckily, as long as your first choice goalkeeper is fit, you don't really need too much strength in depth here. You're never going to bring on a goalkeeper to change a game...not unless it's going to penalties and you have a specialist anyway...but I think we have enough talent there to back up Foster well. No one truly awesome, but good. The problem with the current England set up is the order they seem to be in.
RB
Richards
Brown
Young
Johnson
P Neville
Carragher
Hargreaves
I'm really hopeful over Richards. I think he has a bright future, I just hope he leaves Man City for a bigger club this summer. You may question why City are doing so crap if he's so good, and obviously he's only one man, but in reality it's City's attack which is dreadful, 19th best in the league. Their defence is actually really good, 7th best in the league.
Below Richards it gets a bit more average, but there are a number of able deputies who could do a job. I put Carragher and Hargreaves at the bottom not because I think they're worse there, but because I'd prefer not to have to move players out of position if we're talkign strength in depth.
LB
Bridge
Barry
P Neville
Baines
Warnock
Carragher
Remember when this was a huge problem for England? And we had to play ****ing Chris Powell back there? Thank god that's over.
Not exactly a super strong position for us in terms of reserves, but a bit like the right backs after Richards, there are players who can do a decent job. Left bakc isn;t exactly a position you need a world beater in, so long as the rest of your first team is fit.
CB
Woodgate
Carragher
King
Campbell
Dawson
Lescott
Davies
Brown
Honestly, I wouldn't trade the players in this position with any other team in the world. Fantastic stuff.
RM
Dyer
Bentley
Beckham
Young
Wright-Phillips
Beckham was world class once, but not now. Certainly not on the right hand side of midfield anyway. The rest are just really good players, and I wish Bentley would be given his chance. Some of the balls he puts in are well above the standard of the rest (not Beckham), even if he doesn't quite have the pace of Dyer, Young and Wright-Phillips.
LM
Downing
Walcott
Richardson
Lennon
Oh dear. I really don't like any of the top 3. Well...no, I like Walcott, I just don't think he's shown enough quality yet to get into the England squad regularly. I really don't want to play Lennon on the left rather than the right, but frankly some other right sided choice with Lennon on the left is going to make a stronger team than Lennon on the right with one of these.
Damn you Giggs for choosing Wales!
DCM
Carrick
Huddlestone
Parker
P Neville
Carragher
King
It'd be hard to argue we don't look weaker without Hargreaves. I really think Huddlestone is awesome, but perhaps needs a couple more years before he can dominate in this role. Parker and Carrick are able deputants, nothing more.
ACM
Gerrard
Beckham
Jenas
Barton
Nolan
Dyer
J Cole
Pretty great I think, there are real possibilities for players who can come on and change a game.
FW
Johnson
Bent
Ashton
Crouch
Defoe
Lita
Smith
Nugent
Young
Walcott
The problem here is that, after the main two strikers, the quality drops sharply. Rooney and Owen could be the frontline for any side in the world, domestic or international. These guys struggle to make it to the top sides in the Premiership. You really can't look at them and say "Yeah, those are the other two strikers we should have in our squad". There's certainly absolutely no competition to the main two, unlike say, France who have to choose between the likes of Trezeguet and Saha to partner Henry.
There are possibilities. We haven't really seen Ashton at a top side for very long, hard to know if he'll live up to his billing. Nugent hasn't played in the Premiership yet, Young, Walcott and Lita are too young to know how they'll turn out.
So many good - average strikers, so few stars, I really don't know who I'd pick. I know a few I wouldn't pick...I'd probably have to go with 2 of Johnson, Bent and Ashton. I actually think Bent, at a top side like Liverpool, could be an incredibly prolific striker. I'm just not sure if he'd be as successful at international level. Some players just aren't as good when they make the step up for some reason no matter how good in the league...Ian Wright for example.
------------
I would say in most positions we have good or excellent strength in depth. A couple of positions are just tragic, so we have to rely on luck to keep our main guys for them.
Thing is, any team in the world is going to suffer if enough of their first team is out. As long as you have a few back ups who can come on and change a game, the others are only really there to cover positions one one or two of the first team are out. Once it gets beyond that, when 4 or 5 key players are out, every side would be weakened.
I mean look at our side against Spain:
----------------------Foster----------------------
G Neville---Ferdinand---Woodgate---P Neville
Wright-P----Gerrard------Carrick----Lampard
----------------Dyer-------Crouch---------------
Quite aside from the ****ed up formation, we're 7 players down on what I think is our best side. 7! You bring in people like Crouch and Carrick to cover a couple of gaps in your first team, these back ups aren't supposed to make up 2/3 of your side. Even some of our top back ups are out. Take the equivalent quality of Rooney, Owen, J Cole, Hargreaves, A Cole, Terry and Lennon out of Brazil, Argentina, Italy, France...any side you like and they'll struggle. Spain almost had a first team, on play we matched them with that lot.
Strength in depth is certainly a problem in a few positions, but I don't think it's England's main problem overall. Nor the strength of a fully fit first team, which could match anyone. The problem is the manager's tactics, both in terms of formation and the way we play.
Oh, and who he picks of course.
you prefer Lampard over Gerrard?
Lampard has shown time and time again that he is out of his depth as a central mid. He only plays well when he is more or les given a free role behind the striker(s) where he can run into the box and get goals. He isnt going to help control a midfield, his passing is bad etc.
England lack the ability to control games, its all huff and puff, brainless running back and forth with no gameplan thanks to the clueless duo of Gerrard and Lampard failing to dictate the midfield rhythm. England have looked better when guys like Hargreaves, Carrick step in and inject some calm passing and a bit of control to proceedings.
No point having someone who can cross if all you have to aim for are rooney and owen, priority is to play good football first and foremost and work your way through teams.
its kind of funny the quality england have available but the incompetence when it comes to using their talents. sadly out of the premier leagues top teams, england most resemble liverpool, some good players but kind of harmless going forward and very dull with a smattering of some bad players. none of the verve of arrogance of arsenal, utd chelsea etc.
Lampard has shown time and time again that he is out of his depth as a central mid. He only plays well when he is more or les given a free role behind the striker(s) where he can run into the box and get goals. He isnt going to help control a midfield, his passing is bad etc.
England lack the ability to control games, its all huff and puff, brainless running back and forth with no gameplan thanks to the clueless duo of Gerrard and Lampard failing to dictate the midfield rhythm. England have looked better when guys like Hargreaves, Carrick step in and inject some calm passing and a bit of control to proceedings.
No point having someone who can cross if all you have to aim for are rooney and owen, priority is to play good football first and foremost and work your way through teams.
its kind of funny the quality england have available but the incompetence when it comes to using their talents. sadly out of the premier leagues top teams, england most resemble liverpool, some good players but kind of harmless going forward and very dull with a smattering of some bad players. none of the verve of arrogance of arsenal, utd chelsea etc.
See this is my point, in your best 11 theres 5 that have never performed consistently at international level.
-------------------------Foster---------------------
G Neville----Ferdinand-------Terry-------A Cole
Lennon-------Lampard----Hargreaves----J Cole
----------------Rooney--------Owen--------------
*-*this close to adding Rooney.
At some point you have to stop blaming the coach and admit that they just aren't as good as their club sides make them look.
I wont even get into the balance of this 11 because we'd be here all day.
-------------------------Foster---------------------
G Neville----Ferdinand-------Terry-------A Cole
Lennon-------Lampard----Hargreaves----J Cole
----------------Rooney--------Owen--------------
*-*this close to adding Rooney.
At some point you have to stop blaming the coach and admit that they just aren't as good as their club sides make them look.
I wont even get into the balance of this 11 because we'd be here all day.
Mama Smurf
My penis is still intact.
Yeah, Lampard over Gerrard for me. I disagree that he's a poor passer, but I actually want him to play more foward for England. Hargreaves and our defence form one of the best defensive units in the world, Lampard can risk going forward a lot more than he does. I don't blame him, the England managers don't give him the same role that Chelsea do. He's gotten a lot of goals for England as it is, but I want even more. I know his finishing was bad during the world cup, but that's not standard and he was the one who got in those positions to have the chance to miss those chances. In his normal finishing form he could easily have gotten 4 or 5 goals in that tournament, he kept getting in there.
I've never been impressed by Carrick in an England shirt. Kind of like Ian Wright up front, I'm constantly impressed by him in the league, then he plays for England and I spend the game yelling at him and telling him he's no Hargreaves. Never pays any attention, guess he can't hear me.
For me, England need to play high tempo. It's the only way we know...well, we can play ultra defensively when put under the kosh too, but what we can't do is play a technical passing game. We don't play that in the Premiership and, aside from one player, everyone's from the Premiership so it's no surprise they can't do it. We need to play a high line, we need to press teams into mistakes, we need Lampard playing further forwards, we need to take more risks Ferdinand bringing the ball out of defence so our midfield can push up even higher or out full backs overlapping, particularly A Cole as he's the only left footer...we cannot slow down or drop back so our midfield is behind the halfway line.
Hard work and high tempo...it's the English way. We can try and play like Brazil or Italy or Spain, but we'll fail because we're not Brazil or Italy or Spain. Just as they'd fail trying to play the English way, not that they're stupid enough to try and be a nation they're not.
I've never been impressed by Carrick in an England shirt. Kind of like Ian Wright up front, I'm constantly impressed by him in the league, then he plays for England and I spend the game yelling at him and telling him he's no Hargreaves. Never pays any attention, guess he can't hear me.
For me, England need to play high tempo. It's the only way we know...well, we can play ultra defensively when put under the kosh too, but what we can't do is play a technical passing game. We don't play that in the Premiership and, aside from one player, everyone's from the Premiership so it's no surprise they can't do it. We need to play a high line, we need to press teams into mistakes, we need Lampard playing further forwards, we need to take more risks Ferdinand bringing the ball out of defence so our midfield can push up even higher or out full backs overlapping, particularly A Cole as he's the only left footer...we cannot slow down or drop back so our midfield is behind the halfway line.
Hard work and high tempo...it's the English way. We can try and play like Brazil or Italy or Spain, but we'll fail because we're not Brazil or Italy or Spain. Just as they'd fail trying to play the English way, not that they're stupid enough to try and be a nation they're not.
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