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Pakistani governor who opposed anti-blasphemy laws killed by own bodyguard

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Nemo

Will Eat Your Children
The Karachi news makes me sad. Pakistan is a beautiful country and I always imagined I would retire over there, the land over there is so pure. But seeing how the community keeps setting it back makes me mad as hell

kobashi100 said:
One thing people in the west should realise is that the love for the Prophet (saw) is non-negotiable for any Muslim. We are not gonna accept insults against him ever!
That's an ignorant view bro, don't do that
 

Jeels

Member
Siding with Teetris, I am a proud Pakistani, but we do not have an obligation to hurt others in any circumstance. It's worse because in this circumstance, there were no attacks on the Prophet (pbuh). Pakistan is an amazing country with a very proud, and culturally beautiful people, but stuff like this is unacceptable and hurting it.
 
My driving instructor back in the day who was a Muslim immigrant from Pakistan told me that Muslims in Pakistan and India do have castes too. I told him I thought it was only for Hindus but he said no.
 

Zapages

Member
SmokyDave said:
Messy as fuck. I doubt their chosen deity figure will be impressed at them celebrating the death of a man they didn't agree with.


For some reason I was convinced you were born in Scotland and raised in the US.

I am... But my grandparents/relatives/etc and whenever I visit Pakistan, I go stay at Lahore.
 

kittoo

Cretinously credulous
crimzonflame said:
My driving instructor back in the day who was a Muslim immigrant from Pakistan told me that Muslims in Pakistan and India do have castes too. I told him I thought it was only for Hindus but he said no.

Its not exclusive to Hindus in South Asia. Almost all the Muslims of Pakistan and India are decendents of converted Hindus, who carried over their caste identities even when they converted (even more so cause most of the time people were forcefully converted, so keeping the castes was a consolation many a times). There are many Rajput Muslims (those who put Rathore, Chauhan etc as surname) , Gujjar Muslims, Chowdhari Muslims and so on and so forth. I've personally seen this in Indian Muslims and have read about this being similar in Pakistan too. But a Pakistani might be better at telling about that.
 

Zapages

Member
RustyNails said:
Which is tragic, by the way. Pakistan's founder Mohammed Ali Jinnah envisioned a fully secular state, much like Turkey's Ataturk. Look at how far Turkey has come and how Pakistan has been struggling behind.

That's debatable... I don't think Jinnah wanted secularism like Turkey, where secularism/kemalism hampers religious freedom, instead a country where religious freedom for all religious minorities and people of Pakistan is available with no discrimination against each other no matter what creed or ethnicity that they might belong to.

Good article: http://dawnnews.tv/wps/wcm/connect/...zine/encounter/jinnahs-vision-of-pakistan-689
 
Jeels said:
Siding with Teetris, I am a proud Pakistani, but we do not have an obligation to hurt others in any circumstance. It's worse because in this circumstance, there were no attacks on the Prophet (pbuh). Pakistan is an amazing country with a very proud, and culturally beautiful people, but stuff like this is unacceptable and hurting it.

Baffles me that these people exist.
 

Alucrid

Banned
SmokyDave said:
Absolutely not, that's despicably narrow minded.

I'd have my secret police round the members of the group up and take them to a re-education camp, obviously.

A re-education camp...to make you like bacon?


Uh...I hate bacon with a passion. And...I never want to see or eat it again.

So...looks like you'll have to take me to that bacon paradi-err education camp. Right?
 

Zapages

Member
Azih said:
Agreed. Though it's not a matter of having a strong secular education system it's a matter of having a strong public school system with halfway decent teachers of any sort that is completely missing. That's been true since Pakistan's inception, but hey Pakistan isn't unique in this and even India has huge areas that have no good schools. The difference is that after the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan the West and Pakistan collaborated in turning to extremist religious sentiment imported into Afghanistan from the Middle East mostly to combat the communists which (surprise) didn't dissipate after the Soviets left. Middle Eastern oil shiek money started flowing in to set up the shit hole madrassas in Afghanistan and Pakistan. Parents and kids had no other schools to even go to in rural areas so hey here comes a new radcial generation!

So freakin true... :|

Also the idea in Pakistan of being modern/western is being able to speak english, not wearing traditional clothes*although they are very comfy lol* or wearing clothes that are very skanky/taboo like, being rude and disrespectful to your elders, money is everything in the end of it all, and breaking as many laws as possible.

While true idea of being modern/western is getting a good education, helping the poor/needy, and being good citizen/following the laws.
 

Zapages

Member
Pakistan's 2nd PM: Liaquat Ali Khan was assignation as he was supposedly trying to disassemble the feudal lord system in Pakistan.
 
Teetris said:
The Karachi news makes me sad. Pakistan is a beautiful country and I always imagined I would retire over there, the land over there is so pure. But seeing how the community keeps setting it back makes me mad as hell

That's an ignorant view bro, don't do that

How is it an ignorant view? So because the west feel it is okay to throw insults at the Prophet Jesus (AS) we should now accept insults against the Prophet muhammad (saw).

That is pure madness and is what secular regimes in the muslim and non muslim world think is okay.

There is some things as muslims we cannot accept and this is one of them.

Zapages said:
That's debatable... I don't think Jinnah wanted secularism like Turkey, where secularism/kemalism hampers religious freedom, instead a country where religious freedom for all religious minorities and people of Pakistan is available with no discrimination against each other no matter what creed or ethnicity that they might belong to.

Good article: http://dawnnews.tv/wps/wcm/connect/...zine/encounter/jinnahs-vision-of-pakistan-689

I think you already know this brother. An Islamic State would have given all the above! I could argue that all the ethinic and sectarianism problems/violence that we have seen in Pakistan is due to the lack of an Islam.
 

Prine

Banned
kobashi100 said:
How is it an ignorant view? So because the west feel it is okay to throw insults at the Prophet Jesus (AS) we should now accept insults against the Prophet muhammad (saw).

That is pure madness and is what secular regimes in the muslim and non muslim world think is okay.

There is some things as muslims we cannot accept and this is one of them.

Bro - Many challenged our Prophet (saw) and said many things when he was alive, how did he handle insults? What lesson did he leave for muslims? It hurts me when people insult him as its a gross misunderstanding but you cant force people to believe what you believe. Through example and tolerance can you at least explain your reasoning but thats all it should ever conclude with.
 
Prine said:
Bro - Many challenged out Prophet (saw) and said many things when he was alive, how did he handle insults? What lesson did he leave for muslims? It hurts me when people insult him as its a gross misunderstanding but you cant force people to believe what you believe. Through example and tolerance can you at least explain your reasoning but thats all it should ever conclude with.

When did I say that people should be forced to believe? Debate and intellectual discourse has always been encouraged in Islam.

Blatant insults like we have seen with the cartoons etc is stepping well over the line.
 
kobashi100 said:
How is it an ignorant view? So because the west feel it is okay to throw insults at the Prophet Jesus (AS) we should now accept insults against the Prophet muhammad (saw).

That is pure madness and is what secular regimes in the muslim and non muslim world think is okay.

There is some things as muslims we cannot accept and this is one of them.

I understand why you feel the way you do as a Muslim.

The thing that you will have to accept is that Islam is the religion of only a fraction of the world. The laws of your religion only apply to those who follow that religion. If you can understand that, then you can understand why these laws cannot be allowed to restrict the freedoms of people outside of that religion. Hindu beliefs cannot restrict you from eating beef, and Islamic laws cannot restrict my freedom of speech.

You don't have to accept insults against Muhammad, if by "accept" you mean "condone". You do have to accept it in the sense that you cannot (and should not) control it.
 

Stridone

Banned
kobashi100 said:
How is it an ignorant view? So because the west feel it is okay to throw insults at the Prophet Jesus (AS) we should now accept insults against the Prophet muhammad (saw).

That is pure madness and is what secular regimes in the muslim and non muslim world think is okay.

There is some things as muslims we cannot accept and this is one of them.



I think you already know this brother. An Islamic State would have given all the above! I could argue that all the ethinic and sectarianism problems/violence that we have seen in Pakistan is due to the lack of an Islam.

Maybe you should stop talking for all muslims cause I'm sure alot of them, especially here on GAF, won't appreciate being represented by a fucking nutcase.
 
saw.jpg
 

Witchfinder General

punched Wheelchair Mike
While not directly related to the recent killing, I thought this article in Foreign Policy magazine was a rather interesting take on Pakistan's current nadir:

How cricket explains Pakistan:

Pakistani cricket has become intimately bound up with the country's broader implosion. No international team, naturally, has toured Pakistan since the attack on its soil in 2009. Next year, it will be the only one of four subcontinental cricket nations not hosting any part of the big World Cup gala. Its "home" games, few and far between, are staged in the United Arab Emirates or England. The distance places a further strain on the resources of a maladministered cricket board, which, at a conservative estimate, has incurred losses of $250 million over the past three years from tour cancellations. Meanwhile, the militancy in the heartland of Pakistan is growing gradually worse, with more frequent terrorist attacks and an inept governmental response. What price a couple of manipulated no-balls in this environment?

In better times the two countries congregate around cricket. When in 2004 the Indian team did a full tour of Pakistan after a long freeze, it occasioned the largest people-to-people exchange since Partition. With visa rules relaxed, thousands of Indians and Pakistanis met somebody from across the border for the first time in their lives. There always was sound economic sense to cricket diplomacy. Through the years of governmental restrictions, the cricket boards found ways to make money from TV revenues while staging matches in neutral venues such as Sharjah and Toronto. But this spirit of cooperation between the boards has now dwindled, and international cricket's most marketable product -- the Indian Premier League -- has not featured Pakistani players in any edition since early 2008.

Read the whole article as it is fascinating. I personally can't stand cricket (despite being born and raised in Australia) but I understand how important it is to those who have little else to brighten their day.
 
Witchfinder General said:
While not directly related to the recent killing, I thought this article in Foreign Policy magazine was a rather interesting take on Pakistan's current nadir:

How cricket explains Pakistan:

Read the whole article as it is fascinating. I personally can't stand cricket (despite being born and raised in Australia) but I understand how important it is to those who have little else to brighten their day.


Ah yes, good ol' cricket diplomacy. Always a good barometer for Pak-India relations.

Back whan I was a teenager, I too used to give a shit about cricket. Many shits infact.

Then Pakistan threw away the 99 world cup final to you aussies, despite being (IMO) the better more talented team, and beating Aus in the league matches.

'Twas a slap in the face, and I just said fuck it.

I hope cricket dies in Pakistan and we concentrate on hockey and football or something.
 
Jeels said:
It's worse because in this circumstance, there were no attacks on the Prophet (pbuh).
You're Pakistani so I have some questions for you:


How would you feel if there was an attack on Muhammad?

How do you feel about having a death penalty for blasphemy?

How do you feel about non-Muslim Pakistanis being subject to the laws of someone else's religion?
 

Zapages

Member
Darth Kupi said:
Ah yes, good ol' cricket diplomacy. Always a good barometer for Pak-India relations.

Back whan I was a teenager, I too used to give a shit about cricket. Many shits infact.

Then Pakistan threw away the 99 world cup final to you aussies, despite being (IMO) the better more talented team, and beating Aus in the league matches.

'Twas a slap in the face, and I just said fuck it.

I hope cricket dies in Pakistan and we concentrate on hockey and football or something.

Funny hockey is Pakistan's national support. My Grandfather used to be on the olympic team or its reserves back in the day.

I saw that match live in the US, that was really bad. At least Pakistan won the 92 and the T20 world cups. :)
 
Zapages said:
Funny hockey is Pakistan's national support. My Grandfather used to be on the olympic team or its reserves back in the day.

I saw that match live in the US, that was really bad. At least Pakistan won the 92 and the T20 world cups. :)

Yes, it is the national sport, but its hardly the national pastime.

Its analagous to cricket in England.

Cricket is the brit's national sport, but all they care about is footy.

Hockey can have a resurgence, but unfortunately, all the money/interest is in "kirkat!"
 

Stinkles

Clothed, sober, cooperative
Jeels said:
Siding with Teetris, I am a proud Pakistani, but we do not have an obligation to hurt others in any circumstance. It's worse because in this circumstance, there were no attacks on the Prophet (pbuh). Pakistan is an amazing country with a very proud, and culturally beautiful people, but stuff like this is unacceptable and hurting it.


Hi-five!
 

Stinkles

Clothed, sober, cooperative
Zapages said:
I am... But my grandparents/relatives/etc and whenever I visit Pakistan, I go stay at Lahore.


Hey Zap, where in Scotland were you born? My best friends growing up were in the Edinburgh Paki(stani) community.
 
xbhaskarx said:
I just want to say that cricket is by far the worst of all the major team sports.


The slack jawed zombie corpse of baseball begs to differ...

As bad as cricket is, I can't belive how an entire nation tolerates baseball.
 
LaserBuddha said:
Hey, baseball used to be good...

How?

Even in the "good 'ol days" of the Red Sox being lovable losers, baseballs still had its asinine structure and boring gameplay.

It was never good.












They don't even hit the ball most of the time...

:/
 
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