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[Wedzi]

Still not seeing why you can't have a single player game and it be a game as a service. Tell Tale and Hitman do it. No reason why they can't do the same with games like ReCore or Quantum Break #SaveBeth. SP games don't have to be one and done and I'll repeat, putting the exclusive SP games on GamePass will be a smart move and have those games have seasons and such so the story can evolve over time. Imo, Zelda can do service type of stuff in that world cuz it's so big and it would be awesome. Even story type of stuff.

But honestly, a GAAS doesn't have to mean a Destiny, Overwatch, or multiplayer type of game. Developers just need to rethink single player to also have the service type of stuff in there like Tell Tale but on a "core audience" type of thing. Funny enough, that's what I was planning with my Indy game but I need time to work on it.

I dont think that there is a "death" of single player 1P Xbox games... just that the model of them may not be the same. That's basically what Phil is stating but of course doom and gloom.

I'm gonna leave my post about how a Killer Instinct modeled Fable game could work. Granted, I don't know how many people would be interested.

So it's possible they could just be helping out on Sea of Thieves but I'm going out on a limb and saying it might be Fable related. MS had the option of selling Lionhead and the Fable IP before shutting down the studio but kept the IP so they must think it's still valuable.

Open world, AAA, free to play, MMO like Fable could be a success. It could follow a Killer Instinct like model. The world is free, but you pay for different expansions. Could also have cosmetics for sale, loot boxes that contain armor, different farting animations, etc.

Crossplay/Play anywhere with Windows 10 and Xbox. It would be a totally different model for a AAA WRPG that fits the bill with the current market of gamers.

 

[sirap]

Cool. I have no interest in this direction, and even if I did time + location makes these types of games a nightmare for me to play.

Still, I hope this strategy works for Microsoft.

 

[LKSmash]

That would be unfortunate because I do feel they could craft a Horizon.

I think they have that ability as well but I'm not convinced the people in charge have the patience to find out. Knack is getting a sequel but Ryse and Sunset are not. I think Ryse could've been a franchise that didn't need to be limited to an era. It could've jumped around like AC but, alas, it appears dead.

 

[cakely]

I read the article and I can't say that I'm really encouraged.

I'm certain that he's thinking of Sea of Thieves while he's saying this. I played quite bit of Destiny, and The Division, so I'm thinking I'll like Sea of Thieves, but I'm also a big fan of AAA story-driven single-player experience. It sounds like Microsoft has moved away from that type of game.

 

[Head.spawn]

I wonder if their attempt to chase for the GaaS gold-rush is going to be anything like their chase for the "big console MMO!".

 

[DriftingSpirit]

I think they have that ability as well but I'm not convinced the people in charge have the patience to find out. Knack is getting a sequel but Ryse and Sunset are not. I think Ryse could've been a franchise that didn't need to be limited to an era. It could've jumped around like AC but, alas, it appears dead.

Agreed. It seems they want a game with revenue potential in order to consider giving it a sequel. Which I can't entirely fault them for from a business perspective but it is disappointing from a consumer perspective.

 

[Fisty]

Cool. I have no interest in this direction, and even if I did time + location makes these types of games a nightmare for me to play.

Still, I hope this strategy works for Microsoft.

Tier 2 lives on

 

[sphinx]

”The audience for those big story-driven games... I won't say it isn't as large, but they're not as consistent. You'll have things like Zelda or Horizon Zero Dawn that'll come out, and they'll do really well, but they don't have the same impact that they used to have, because the big service-based games are capturing such a large amount of the audience. Sony's first-party studios do a lot of these games, and they're good at them, but outside of that, it's difficult – they're become more rare; it's a difficult business decision for those teams, you're fighting into more headwind."

Phil.... Sony and Nintendo destroyed your xbox business last month precisely because of Zelda and Horizon, and people are buying Switches and PS4 in droves BECAUSE of those games.

when you want to sell gaming hardware that's the kind of guns you bring to the fight.

step up your game already, quit fucking around, bring in your exclusives and show you mean it.

 

[AAMARMO]

I miss Don Mattrick .

 

[Liliana Eileen]

I miss Don Mattrick .

Joke post? Phil is infinitely better.

 

[De_Legend]

Epic sp games incoming!

Not 😞

 

[nycgamer4ever]

Spoiler alert: they won't. Zelda might crack the top 10. No chance for Horizon or Persona. Spencer might be underselling SP games but he's not wrong in stating they don't move the needle as much as they used to.

And you think MS will be able to make a game that can move the needle and compete with Bungie, Blizzard, and Rockstar? Most of the gamers who play GAAS type games are content with one or two games that they and their friends are playing for years. You think that chasing a market already dominated by industry juggernauts and in the process neglect a large portion of your fan base or potential fan base is the right move? You need all types of games on your platform to be successful.

I interpret what he saying as MS hasn't been able to make sp gamex that move the needle so they are not willing to make the commitment it takes and will instead focus on GAAS strategy to tap into that market.They are looking for home runs and forget that singles, doubles, and walks are just as important.

 

[TsuWave]

Because their install base is twice that on Xbox. Sonys core business is PlayStation.

I'm pretty sure insurance is sony's core business

 

[nycgamer4ever]

I'm pretty sure insurance is sony's core business

And their imaging division. Although the gaming division is quickly becoming a larger portion of the overall business structure.

 

[leeh]

I'm pretty sure insurance is sony's core business

https://venturebeat.com/2016/07/28/...sion-accounted-for-78-of-its-q1-2016-profits/

Only takes a Google.

 

[The Hamburglar]

At E3 MS will announce every xbox sold from that date forward will come with a signed T-shirt of phil spencer that has the caption "been here before" and a bluray copy of groundhog day.

 

[Kevin]

His comments on single player gaming has made me less excited for the future of the Xbox platform. Personally I am not into online gaming at all and always have preferred story-driven gaming experiences. Disappointing that it sounds like Microsoft is going to put most of their effort into online gaming and very little effort in good core single player experiences.

I was excited to see what Microsoft had in store for the Xbox One Scorpio but now I'm just going to have to go in with rather modest expectations.

 

[chaosmaster(1)]

Agreed. It seems they want a game with revenue potential in order to consider giving it a sequel. Which I can't entirely fault them for from a business perspective but it is disappointing from a consumer perspective.

The thing is from that business perspective an rpg has the capability to have dlc/expansion support that would work better than other traditional story driven games. I'm baffled they won't try to fund a WRPG when they had success with Bioware in both the 360 and OG Xbox era.

 

[2blackcats]

Cool. I have no interest in this direction, and even if I did time + location makes these types of games a nightmare for me to play.

Still, I hope this strategy works for Microsoft.

Yeah. When the original xbox came out and for the first few years of 360 i either had practically useless Internet or none. Still had a great time with MS published games. That wouldn't fly now though.

 

[rakkadakka]

I certainly hope that people who tout Horizon as an example realize the history of the studio behind the game.

The real question isn't if he just wants good games but if MS can commit to fostering new talent and being patient with their releases.

MS almost certainly would have cut the studio behind Horizon well before they ever got to make it.

 

[DriftingSpirit]

And you think MS will be able to make a game that can move the needle and compete with Bungie, Blizzard, and Rockstar? Most of the gamers who play GAAS type games are content with one or two games that they and their friends are playing for years. You think that chasing a market already dominated by industry juggernauts and in the process neglect a large portion of your fan base or potential fan base is the right move? You need all types of games on your platform to be successful.

I interpret what he saying as MS hasn't been able to make sp gamex that move the needle so they are not willing to make the commitment it takes and will instead focus on GAAS strategy to tap into that market.They are looking for home runs and forget that singles, doubles, and walks are just as important.

Right, some comments here make it seems like the GaaS model is a wide pasture just ripe for growth and success. It is more like they'll have a difficult time (if not, even more) with that just as they would with the SP stuff.

MS just doesn't have an answer for the SP segment and they are trying to find another route to go. It isn't that the GaaS model is just so much better in general. You can succeed, flop, do okay, etc... just like with anything else.

 

[Kaako]

And you think MS will be able to make a game that can move the needle and compete with Bungie, Blizzard, and Rockstar? Most of the gamers who play GAAS type games are content with one or two games that they and their friends are playing for years. You think that chasing a market already dominated by industry juggernauts and in the process neglect a large portion of your fan base or potential fan base is the right move? You need all types of games on your platform to be successful.

I interpret what he saying as MS hasn't been able to make sp gamex that move the needle so they are not willing to make the commitment it takes and will instead focus on GAAS strategy to tap into that market.They are looking for home runs and forget that singles, doubles, and walks are just as important.

Well put. It seems they are still chasing that white whale. The next big thing, if you will. Wish they would take more risks and believe in their creative talent more. Seems too much of a numbers game and not enough creative belief/support.

 

[nycgamer4ever]

https://venturebeat.com/2016/07/28/...sion-accounted-for-78-of-its-q1-2016-profits/

Only takes a Google.

That only shows that Games division is the most profitable. Although they have been steadily growing the games division over the years to be a larger part of the overall company it's just a piece of the overall pie, albeit a large piece.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/297533/sony-sales-worldwide-by-business-segment/

 

[LKSmash]

And you think MS will be able to make a game that can move the needle and compete with Bungie, Blizzard, and Rockstar? Most of the gamers who play GAAS type games are content with one or two games that they and their friends are playing for years. You think that chasing a market already dominated by industry juggernauts and in the process neglect a large portion of your fan base or potential fan base is the right move? You need all types of games on your platform to be successful.

I interpret what he saying as MS hasn't been able to make sp gamex that move the needle so they are not willing to make the commitment it takes and will instead focus on GAAS strategy to tap into that market.They are looking for home runs and forget that singles, doubles, and walks are just as important.

I agree with your second paragraph and stated as much in other comments. I think they've given up on taking risks that provide a singular point of sale. If they're getting you to buy a game, they're looking to get you to also buy DLC/microtransactions.

 

[Papacheeks]

Yeah. When the original xbox came out and for the first few years of 360 i either had practically useless Internet or none. Still had a great time with MS published games. That wouldn't fly now though.

Doesn't seem to hold Nintendo back currently? Zelda isn't online and the switch doesn;t have a lot of online functinoality outside of multiplayer for specific games that have it like MARIO KART, SPLATOON.

And yet it's selling like crazy and that's because of software.

I would take a xbox with ok functinonality but great single player games any day of the week.

PS3's online for it's first couple years was awful yet people still bought all the games they were putting out.

 

[nycgamer4ever]

Well put. It seems they are still chasing that white whale. The next big thing, if you will. Wish they would take more risks and believe in their creative talent more. Seems too much of a numbers game and not enough creative belief/support.

This has gotten me a little down. I have an xbox also but it's really just my UHD player. Looking forward to more games since I have two new babies I just don't have the time to be play for hours on end online with friends. Hopefully they will surprise us at E3 but if not Scorpio is a no go for me.

 

[sirap]

Tier 2 lives on

I wish Malaysia was Tier 2. We don't exist to Microsoft and EA

 

[nycgamer4ever]

I agree with your second paragraph and stated as much in other comments. I think they've given up on taking risks that provide a singular point of sale. If they're getting you to buy a game, they're looking to get you to also buy DLC/microtransactions.

The thing is you can make a really good single player game and people will be more than happy to spend more on DLC and micro transaction providing they are worth it.

 

[Toe-Knee]

So what was the point of taking out the DRM if all the games are Online only?

That's the trick! Change one kind of DRM for another and say you've removed it.

Technically you haven't lied.

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

The article very much reminds me of how they are going to emphasis more on PC than they have. Yet they finally did... sort of. W10 Store, and while you can get Xbox Exclusives on it, it doesn't help the fact that it's in a walled garden still (and one that doesn't even use EXEs). I think people should take this with a grain of salt, especially considering how many first party games have been treated as of late that aren't the big guns (mainly cancellations or push backs).

 

[nycgamer4ever]

Right, some comments here make it seems like the GaaS model is a wide pasture just ripe for growth and success. It is more like they'll have a difficult time (if not, even more) with that just as they would with the SP stuff.

MS just doesn't have an answer for the SP segment and they are trying to find another route to go. It isn't that the GaaS model is just so much better in general. You can succeed, flop, do okay, etc... just like with anything else.

The whole industry is just so damn competitive now, in any market. Time to put the big boy pants on and earn it. Put up or shut up.

 

[kc44135]

Well, if they have little to no interest in making/investing in the kinds of games that I enjoy playing, then I have little to no interest in buying their consoles. This is why I still don't own an X1 or have any interest in Scorpio. That's just all there is to it.

 

[blakep267]

The thing is you can make a really good single player game and people will be more than happy to spend more on DLC and micro transaction providing they are worth it.

Eh, you can get more money and faster easier money with cosmetic loot boxes and map updates for a service game vs crafting meaningful story dlc that you have to sell at $20+ a pop that comes out 6 months later. Your gambling that a large enough segment of buyers for your game still cares enough to wanto to jump back in months later

 

[LKSmash]

The thing is you can make a really good single player game and people will be more than happy to spend more on DLC and micro transaction providing they are worth it.

And you're completely correct but I don't think it worked very well for Sunset (not the best example, but really the only one). And as I said elsewhere, they seem to lack patience in finding out if some games have legs or not. Knack is getting a sequel but nothing for Ryse, Sunset, QB, etc.

 

[Dabanton]

Still not seeing why you can't have a single player game and it be a game as a service. Tell Tale and Hitman do it. No reason why they can't do the same with games like ReCore or Quantum Break #SaveBeth. SP games don't have to be one and done and I'll repeat, putting the exclusive SP games on GamePass will be a smart move and have those games have seasons and such so the story can evolve over time. Imo, Zelda can do service type of stuff in that world cuz it's so big and it would be awesome. Even story type of stuff.

But honestly, a GAAS doesn't have to mean a Destiny, Overwatch, or multiplayer type of game. Developers just need to rethink single player to also have the service type of stuff in there like Tell Tale but on a "core audience" type of thing. Funny enough, that's what I was planning with my Indy game but I need time to work on it.

I dont think that there is a "death" of single player 1P Xbox games... just that the model of them may not be the same. That's basically what Phil is stating but of course doom and gloom.

Yeah what I got from his comments is 'pure' SP games are a harder sell to his bosses. But lets say something like Gears 4, which has a strong SP/Co-op element and MP is more sellable and also offers the opportunity for longer term engagement.

Tbh MS does better at those sort of games.

 

[nycgamer4ever]

Eh, you can get more money and faster easier money with cosmetic loot boxes and map updates vs crafting meaningful story dlc that you have to sell at $20+ a pop that comes out 6 months later

Definitely it's the path of least resistance but you still have to make a good game to pry people away from Overwatch, Destiny, GTA 5 Online, FF14, and all those countless mobile games that makes tons of money.

 

[MilkyJoe]

And you're completely correct but I don't think it worked very well for Sunset (not the best example, but really the only one). And as I said elsewhere, they seem to lack patience in finding out if some games have legs or not. Knack is getting a sequel but nothing for Ryse, Sunset, QB, etc.

Correct, they appear to think unless it's a 10 million seller then just bin it. Very depressing.

 

[nycgamer4ever]

And you're completely correct but I don't think it worked very well for Sunset (not the best example, but really the only one). And as I said elsewhere, they seem to lack patience in finding out if some games have legs or not. Knack is getting a sequel but nothing for Ryse, Sunset, QB, etc.

See that is what I don't understand. Does a game really have to sell 5 million plus to get a sequel. I feel like expectations are out of wack. Could be pressure from shareholders spurring these decisions. Knack, which I actually enjoyed, and the but of a lot of jokes, is getting a sequel. Nier got a sequel which I am sure people were surprised when it was announced. Did Sunset do THAT bad?

 

[blakep267]

Definitely it's the path of least resistance but you still have to make a good game to pry people away from Overwatch, Destiny, GTA 5 Online, FF14, and all those countless mobile games that makes tons of money.

True but they aren't putting out bombs like battborn( well Halo wars but nobody should've expected that to set the world on fire.). Even underperforming gears still has good engagement and steady content drops.

 

[leeh]

That only shows that Games division is the most profitable. Although they have been steadily growing the games division over the years to be a larger part of the overall company it's just a piece of the overall pie, albeit a large piece.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/297533/sony-sales-worldwide-by-business-segment/

What you sent me also shows that it's the largest division based on revenue?

 

[Ushay]

The bigger single player experiences can have a tail of high quality DLC, which can be hugely successful if you get the game right in the first place.

Service based and narrative games can coincide if they want them too. I'm hoping his latter comments about GaaS not making sense in many scenarios rings true at E3. There are audiences for both types of games, big ones.

 

[Freshmaker]

GaaS could be as simply delivering new updates of content over time. That could be anything from Story DLC, cosmetic items, free maps, etc.

It doesn't necessarily mean multiplayer games and that is where the confusion is coming from.

It could mean that, but that's not what MS seems to be intent on focusing on. Deep Down's a prime example.

 

[nycgamer4ever]

True but they aren't putting out bombs like battborn( well Halo wars but nobody should've expected that to set the world on fire.). Even underperforming gears still has good engagement and steady content drops.

That reminds me I still have to play Gears 4 when i get a chance.

 

[Fisty]

Right, some comments here make it seems like the GaaS model is a wide pasture just ripe for growth and success. It is more like they'll have a difficult time (if not, even more) with that just as they would with the SP stuff.

MS just doesn't have an answer for the SP segment and they are trying to find another route to go. It isn't that the GaaS model is just so much better in general. You can succeed, flop, do okay, etc... just like with anything else.

Nailed It, they tried to buy into GaaS with Minecraft, but so far they haven't even been able to design a successful one of their own. Considering how locked down and insular that market seems to be, I really don't know if chasing that is worth it in the short term, especially when it doesnt look like they have much in the way of regular ass games coming either

Meanwhile, Sonys first party has carved out it's niche and they keep funding risky JPN games... you know, the stuff that the big third parties won't touch

 

[blakep267]

See that is what I don't understand. Does a game really have to sell 5 million plus to get a sequel. I feel like expectations are out of wack. Could be pressure from shareholders spurring these decisions. Knack, which I actually enjoyed, and the but of a lot of jokes, is getting a sequel. Nier got a sequel which I am sure people were surprised when it was announced. Did Sunset do THAT bad?

Games cost a lot of money. We have no idea what resources go into knack. For all we know it could be a side project for some devs in Japan studio where as Sunset was contracting a bigger third party dev

Nailed It, they tried to buy into GaaS with Minecraft, but so far they haven't even been able to design a successful one of their own. Considering how locked down and insular that market seems to be, I really don't know if chasing that is worth it in the short term, especially when it doesnt look like they have much in the way of regular ass games coming either

Meanwhile, Sonys first party has carved out it's niche and they keep funding risky JPN games... you know, the stuff that the big third parties won't touch

Id say halo 5 was very successful as was Forza Horizon 3. But that's a mix of car pack drops and the season pass approach

 

[MilkyJoe]

The bigger single player experiences can have a tail of high quality DLC, which can be hugely successful if you get the game right in the first place.

Service based and narrative games can coincide if they want them too. I'm hoping his latter comments about GaaS not making sense in many scenarios rings true at E3. There are audiences for both types of games, big ones.

FH3 is a good example.

 

[2blackcats]

Doesn't seem to hold Nintendo back currently? Zelda isn't online and the switch doesn;t have a lot of online functinoality outside of multiplayer for specific games that have it like MARIO KART, SPLATOON.

And yet it's selling like crazy and that's because of software.

I would take a xbox with ok functinonality but great single player games any day of the week.

PS3's online for it's first couple years was awful yet people still bought all the games they were putting out.

Maybe I phrased that poorly but I agree with you completely.

 

[SneakersSO]

I wonder if their attempt to chase for the GaaS gold-rush is going to be anything like their chase for the "big console MMO!".

Or the big Wii Sports-like 'motion-control game/experience' that they chased relentlessly from Kinect launch to Kinect Sports Rivals on X1.

 

[Fisty]

Id say halo 5 was very successful as was Forza Horizon 3. But that's a mix of car pack drops and the season pass approach

I am sure they made MS some money, but throwing microtransactions into IPs that are 10-15 years old isn't going to bring in new customers and it isn't pleasing a lot of the folks who have been with these IPs for awhile. Halo CE and Gears 1 didnt need tons of DLC and Run the Jewels skins to be mega hits.

 

[leeh]

I am sure they made MS some money, but throwing microtransactions into IPs that are 10-15 years old isn't going to bring in new customers and it isn't pleasing a lot of the folks who have been with these IPs for awhile. Halo CE and Gears 1 didnt need tons of DLC and Run the Jewels skins to be mega hits.

343 received a lot of praise how they implemented microtransactions, so I don't get your angle there.