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[Forceatowulf]

I'm a little confused why this effort wouldn't be targeting Microsoft to change their mind, or at least go after both - not try and sway just Sony.

Well, we recently found out from a reliable source that Sony is still sitting on the idea while MS has clearly made plans to go ahead with it.

I think it's a bit more tactical to try and sway the opinion of a company that is still undetermined than a company that has already given the go ahead. After all the months of gamers out-crying about the prospect of DRM and blocking used games... MS still went ahead with it giving no fucks about it. That makes me think they're already all in on this shit.

 

[dream431ca]

That's the thing I have a problem with. It's been what, a week since the unveil? It's been three months since Sony unveiled the PS4 and we don't know what they're doing. There's the same 'we might, we might not' speculation on both, which is why I just don't get why Microsoft is the only one on the end of the pitchforks here. I just don't get why it's so incredibly one sided, when they're both being secretive as fuck about what they might be doing.

The problem is that Phil Harrison slipped out something that he should not have, that caused a shit storm.

 

[ZombiePlatypus]

Don't have a twitter, but I'm glad this is gaining momentum. Is there a facebook-page aimed at Sony regarding the issue?

 

[Boke1879]

That's the thing I have a problem with. It's been what, a week since the unveil? It's been three months since Sony unveiled the PS4 and we don't know what they're doing. There's the same 'we might, we might not' speculation on both, which is why I just don't get why Microsoft is the only one on the end of the pitchforks here. I just don't get why it's so incredibly one sided, when they're both being secretive as fuck about what they might be doing.

It's not speculating though. Microsoft out of their own mouths have said there will basically be DRM with used games. A friend won't be able to play it unless they are signed into your account. Or if you want to buy that used game you'll have to pay the fee of a full priced game.

This came from the Head of MS themselves! Now they are trying to damage control.

 

[Deleted member 8095]

Did someone already make a joke about starting an online petition if the tweeting fails?

 

[OfWhiteSkinOnRedLeather]

Don't have a twitter, but I'm glad this is gaining momentum. Is there a facebook-page aimed at Sony regarding the issue?

Not sure, but the thing about Twitter is you have high ranking people within Sony on it, specifically Shuhei Yoshida, pres. of Sony Worldwide Studios, so he's seeing this all himself, not some PR person managing the Facebook account.

EDIT: Or rather, not some Facebook account made by fans that Sony might not even see.

 

[nailbombxx]

I will probably skip the PS4 if it makes any effort to punish people who like to trade amongst themselves.

 

[Pistolero]

That's the thing I have a problem with. It's been what, a week since the unveil? It's been three months since Sony unveiled the PS4 and we don't know what they're doing. There's the same 'we might, we might not' speculation on both, which is why I just don't get why Microsoft is the only one on the end of the pitchforks here. I just don't get why it's so incredibly one sided, when they're both being secretive as fuck about what they might be doing.

What is incredible is that you seem to be oblivious to all the things that had happened. Sony hasn't talked about it as far as I know. MS, via its PR people, did, and boy was it lame! Were you aware of the interviews that were conducted shortly after the XBone reveal?

 

[famousmortimer]

Not sure, but the thing about Twitter is you have high ranking people within Sony on it, specifically Shuhei Yoshida, pres. of Sony Worldwide Studios, so he's seeing this all himself, not some PR person managing the Facebook account.

That's why I haven't bothered with posting facebook info. It will go to the social media team who will likely pass it on... but with twitter you can go straight to the source.


Obviously posting on facebook wouldn't hurt if people are interested in doing so.

 

[Forceatowulf]

Yeah, I don't get this whole "MS is still undetermined too!" nonsense. The god damn people who work at the top of that sector already said they were making plans for it... Sony still hasn't. The closest thing they've said on the matter of DRM is that they will leave that up to publications, which is fine with me because I can always just avoid their bullshit games. Free market baby. But if the DRM is implemented by Sony like MS is doing.. then I don't have a choice anymore, which is bullshit.

 

[Orca]

Well, we recently found out from a reliable source that Sony is still sitting on the idea while MS has clearly made plans to go ahead with it.

The problem is that Phil Harrison slipped out something that he should not have, that caused a shit storm.

What is incredible is that you seem to be oblivious to all the things that had happened. Sony hasn't talked about it as far as I know. MS, via its PR people, did, and boy was it lame! Were you aware of the interviews that were conducted shortly after the XBone reveal?

There was a lot of speculation based on small bits of info. Here's the clearest thing they said - Hank Henshaw, the program manager for Xbox Incubation - which I had to Google to find out what it actually was - said this the day after the unveiling:

Henshaw: Let me clear that up unequivocally. Xbox One will support the reselling and used game market for Xbox One games. We have not announced details about exactly how it's going to work, or how licenses are going to be exchanged. That's all coming up later in the year. What we have announced is that a used game ecosystem will be supported, so people can breathe easy. They will be able to get used games.

That's as clear as either side have been on the issue so far. I think we're going to see some kind of DRM from both that affects used games, resale, and authenticating installs, but there's no way either one would be stupid enough to do something that makes them a pariah while the other doesn't.

 

[BlastProcessing]

stop crying about used games support the developers by actually buying the video games you play.

 

[Hoho for breakfast]

Assuming this hasn't all already been 100% decided by Sony, I couldn't imagine a more important decision possibly in the recent history of the industry.

Their choices right now have the potential to drastically alter the gaming landscape for years to come. No pressure or anything...

 

[paradise_circus]

Seriously, it's not like allowing used games is going to hurt their gaming experience in any way.

There are always those uncalled-for devil's advocates.

drm prohibits someone from "maximizing" the entertainment with his acquired product. the drm shitstorm in itunes lasted years and now the music is drm free.

 

[sn00zer]

Steam is not comparable. I'm not spending over 50$ on a game that forces restrictions. You pay about 5-10$ and Steam usually has fantastic pricing and deals.

Steam is completely comparable, all major releases can be anywhere from $50-$60...$40 for games released months after console release. $5 to $10 only happens during sales.

If Sony and MS want to be like Steam, then go digital only. Don't release a single game in physical form. If they do that then very few will complain. But if I go out and buy a physical game, then that's mine. I should be able to resell it without any issues. I should be able to let my friends borrow it without them having to jump through hoops to get it to run.

Many many PC games are steamworks or origin based even physical copies require you to enter a Steam key.

I dunno this whole thing seems a little blown out of proportion, but whatever. Im a minority when it comes to this. I think given Sony's track record with Greatest Hits titles, mega collections, and PS+ prices, steam level sales could be a very real thing. Why buy a used game when PSN sale has it for cheaper?

EDIT: Im fairly certain XB1 and Sony are just trying to copy Steam.... prerelease piracy drops, devs get a cut of every sale without middlemen, games are cheaper for consumers... everyone is happy

 

[Kaako]

Getting more and more traction slowly. Hopefully IGN/Gamespot/Kotaku/etc pick up on this twitter thing as well. Well done to those that already did their part. Keep that shit up.

 

[Man]

Steam lets you gift games at least which is essentially the digital version of selling a used game (assuming you want money for the 'gift').

 

[Casanova]

drm prohibits someone from "maximizing" the entertainment with his acquired product. the drm shitstorm in itunes lasted years and now the music is drm free.

I'm afraid you misunderstood my post. I am, in now way, defending DRM policies.

 

[nelsonroyale]

This is good news. I don't have twitter though, anywhere else I can make myself known?

 

[Suirrad]

Assuming this hasn't all already been 100% decided by Sony, I couldn't imagine a more important decision possibly in the recent history of the industry.

Their choices right now have the potential to drastically alter the gaming landscape for years to come. No pressure or anything...

Agreed. Lets hope they choose wisely.

 

[SolidSnakex]

I dunno this whole thing seems a little blown out of proportion, but whatever. Im a minority when it comes to this. I think given Sony's track record with Greatest Hits titles, mega collections, and PS+ prices, steam level sales could be a very real thing. Why buy a used game when PSN sale has it for cheaper?

I really can't think of the last time I bought a used game. I try to avoid buying anything used that's gaming related since I don't trust the previous owner to have taken care of the product too well. That comes from all the rentals during the PSone era that made it seem like someone just slid the disc around their floor. But I do resell quite a few games that i've bought. And that always goes back toward buying a new game. Gamestop actually pointed out that 70% of their customers do the same thing, and that results in 1.8b being put back into the game industry. Too many at these companies only want to look at those buying used games and not all of the people that use that resell money to purchase new games or new consoles. I also rent quite a few games as well, which obviously would be kneecapped as a result of this nonsense.

But if either of them try to really release a console with that DRM, then I think that they're going to be in for a nasty rude awakening. Sony in particular because they're banking on the hardcore gamer to support their console. MS can at least hope that casuals will pick it up and not really care about that DRM. But Sony? If they piss those gamers off then they're screwed. They've already got a failing handheld on their hands, so do they really want to risk their next console meeting the same fate? Because that's what's on the line right now.

 

[Krusenstern]

Maybe we should try and tweet it to CD Projekt Red. They're pretty anti-DRM.

 

[kogasu]

Done. Not sure how well this'll work but it doesn't hurt to try.

Doing great GAF!

 

[Beren]

Maybe we should try and tweet it to CD Projekt Red. They're pretty anti-DRM.

I did and GoG too , but more tweets won't hurt

 

[farisr]

but there's no way either one would be stupid enough to do something that makes them a pariah while the other doesn't.

That's the whole point of this. It is very likely that MS got wind of Sony considering the DRM stuff as well and that's why they went "okay let's go through with this." After the backlash though, according to sources, Sony has changed their mind.

What we're doing now is letting Sony know that we absolutely don't want drm, keeping this issue raised and in the spotlight, so it doesn't get forgotten or die down before e3, to prevent Sony from changing their mind back again (if this dies down too quickly, they will take it as "see it's just a kneejerk reaction, people will eventually not care and deal with it").

If Sony follows through with not implementing this stuff, there is a good chance that MS will be forced to not go through with their plans in order to remain competitive. This could either be done before the console even releases, could be done sometime after (depending on if there are 3rd party exclusive deals hinging on this feature, and whether microsoft wants to compensate them for not fully living up to the deal).

Of course, this isn't guaranteed to work, but we're giving it an effort. Sources have already said that MS even relaxed some of their policies in regards to the online requirement due to the reaction to the Adam Orth incident. Now the MS backlash after the event + this initiative could very well convince sony that going the route of no DRM for physical copies of games could be beneficial or an important differing feature.

If MS wants to prevent Sony from getting ahead though (which they have an opportunity to since their conference is first), they can announce that there is no DRM stuff, and that will take away the negative press, but it will also pretty much guarantee that Sony will announce the same thing.

Also the reason why it's directed at sony and not microsoft. MS in general has demonstrated a disconnect from the gaming crowd in the past few months. Sony's on the other hand don't. Sony is the first one to show any signs of changing their minds on this thing, whereas no news from the MS side.

So, most people are focusing on the company that's actually showing some sort of reaction to this issue and want to make sure that they keep on having that reaction. If some insider source info came out saying that MS is not considering DRM stuff anymore due to backlash, then people would be directing their tweets at MS as well.

 

[dream431ca]

Maybe we should try and tweet it to CD Projekt Red. They're pretty anti-DRM.

People have been doing that for a while. More always helps though.

 

[famousmortimer]

Maybe we should try and tweet it to CD Projekt Red. They're pretty anti-DRM.

Yeah, someone mentioned that earlier. Definitely worth a shot. Though aren't they in eastern europe? They may still be asleep.

 

[Shaheed79]

I should be surprised by the number of "Agent Smith's" that posted in this topic, but sadly I'm not. Anyone who believes that a fight, where a victory is not guaranteed, is not worth fighting, needs to reevaluate history and themselves.

Sometimes you just have to fight for what you believe in, no matter what the risks or how minute you believe your chances are. If it's that important to you, then it's worth the time, dedication and sacrifice. Self defeating attitudes, of any kind, are like a contagious illness. Don't let it infect you and diminish your resolve.

 

[OfWhiteSkinOnRedLeather]

Maybe we should try and tweet it to CD Projekt Red. They're pretty anti-DRM.

Some of us already have, but the more the merrier.

 

[Rich!]

I do not understand why some people assume that used games are bad for the industry. It's totally mind boggling.

I am not made of money. I buy a game. I finish it. I trade it in to go towards the purchase of a new game. Publishers get a purchase. If I couldnt trade mine in, I wouldn't spend the full £40 for it and would buy much less as a result. I'm obviously not alone in this.

imagine if car manufacturers blocked used sales. Their new unit sales would plummet like a fucking rock. People rely on the fact you can part exchange your old goods towards the new product.

how is that hard to understand?

 

[Boke1879]

This is good news. I don't have twitter though, anywhere else I can make myself known?

Making a twitter account doesn't take long. You could just make a dummy account for this purpose. It wouldn't hurt.

 

[Minions]

Still trucking. Keep it up guys.

 

[Krusenstern]

Yeah, someone mentioned that earlier. Definitely worth a shot. Though aren't they in eastern europe? They may still be asleep.

Well, it's 8:30 in the morning here (CET).

Ok, I'll make myself a twitter account.

 

[robertsan21]

come on Sony, dont take the same road as MS, you have kind of been given the win over next gen by just doing 3 simple things, allow used games to be sold and dealt with as we the consumer wants, allow 100% offline singleplayer mode, dont use stupid as activation codes.

 

[nelsonroyale]

Making a twitter account doesn't take long. You could just make a dummy account for this purpose. It wouldn't hurt.

Any place to make a noise on facebook? I could do the twitter thing, but I am not personally a fan of twitter and would rather not sign up. Worst comes to worst I make a dummy account though, as you said.

 

[Xbudz]

I support this movement.
If Sony comes up with a better way to handle DRM, awesome.

 

[Rich!]

Any place to make a noise on facebook? I could do the twitter thing, but I am not personally a fan of twitter and would rather not sign up. Worst comes to worst I make a dummy account though, as you said.

Sign up for a free hotmail/gmail account to use specifically for stuff like this. That way you don't get any crap forwarded to any accounts you actually use when you sign up for Twitter/etc.

 

[OfWhiteSkinOnRedLeather]

Any place to make a noise on facebook? I could do the twitter thing, but I am not personally a fan of twitter and would rather not sign up. Worst comes to worst I make a dummy account though, as you said.

As has been mentioned before, on Twitter you can tweet Shuhei Yoshida (@yosp), pres. of Sony Worldwide Studios, thus going straight to the source. Much more effective than Facebook.

 

[Anth0ny]

Worth a shot...

 

[SpaceBridge]

Did my part.

 

[Moxx19]

Well done everyone, let's keep this going!

 

[Anton668]

ok, tossed my tweet into the mix

 

[IrishNinja]

Reddit post was removed by mods, not showing up outside of the link

why?

stop crying about used games support the developers by actually buying the video games you play.

stop crying about consumers and their right to choose how they support things; you're one fo them

perfect

 

[Gori]

Hey guys, nice one. I've done a few ad campaigns focused on twitter and trending topics, and remember a few things: (that probably all of you know already)

It shouldn't be about letting Sony know - trust me, they know already - it should be about letting Sony know that everyone is talking about it. Don't just focus on the high ranking Sony execs. Focus on everyone that is into gaming. If we create a true trending topic here, we have won.

Always try to rewrite the tweets, don't just copy or retweet what other people say, that way they're ranked better by Twitters algorithms. To create a trending topic - it's all about conversation, rather than mentions. Also try to involve your followers on Twitter, or reply to what other people you are following are saying. Get in there.

Don't _only_ write tweets starting with an @ sign - as these will only be seen by your followers who also follow the people you are @'ing. But if you want to write to a lot of people, go ahead, it will make your followers feel less spammed by the whole issue. But if you do want to let your friends know who you're sending an @ message to - add a . before the @. This way everyone will see it.

 

[famousmortimer]

Hey guys, nice one. I've done a few ad campaigns focused on twitter and trending topics, and remember a few things: (that probably all of you know already)

It shouldn't be about letting Sony know - trust me, they know already - it should be about letting Sony know that everyone is talking about it. Don't just focus on the high ranking Sony execs. Focus on everyone that is into gaming. If we create a true trending topic here, we have won.

Always try to rewrite the tweets, don't just copy or retweet what other people say, that way they're ranked better by Twitters algorithms. To create a trending topic - it's all about conversation, rather than mentions. Also try to involve your followers on Twitter, or reply to what other people you are following are saying. Get in there.

Don't _only_ write tweets starting with an @ sign - as these will only be seen by your followers who also follow the people you are @'ing. But if you want to write to a lot of people, go ahead, it will make your followers feel less spammed by the whole issue. But if you do want to let your friends know who you're sending an @ message to - add a . before the @. This way everyone will see it.

Great info, adding to OP.

 

[dream431ca]

Alright. Just about 1 AM here. Going to bed. Your turn EU-GAF!

 

[Man]

Gofreak can be relied upon for a classy tweet:

Hi @Playstation, @yosp, @rohdescott, @jpkoller Don't interfere with physical discs! Loss aversion is powerful! #PS4NoDRM #PS4USEDGAMES

In economics and decision theory, loss aversion refers to people's tendency to strongly prefer avoiding losses to acquiring gains. Some studies suggest that losses are twice as powerful, psychologically, as gains. Loss aversion was first convincingly demonstrated by Amos Tversky and Daniel Kahneman.[1]

 

[farisr]

1200+ tweets now guys (just to yoshida)

 

[televator]

Sent a tweet @yosp's way literally 30 seconds before I saw this thread. YOU AND I ARE MENTALLY LINKED GAF.

WE ARE LEGION.

 

[Krusenstern]

Is this here their official twitter? https://twitter.com/CDProjektRED