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Puppeteer out Nintendo's Nintendo.

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TheRealTalker said:
This... As much as I love the DK series if the game is not one of these two people decide not to buy them at retail since they believe it's either inferior or a copy of one of these things... Then they later complain or accuse people/companies for their lack of retail platformers when it was there bad mouthings fault in the first place

This is also relevant with other genres as well... It's not everyone but a majority of people either dismiss it since its not a popular franchise in pop culture hence not "cool" or they insult it our put harsh criticism on it due to it being a new I.P and having a lack of history... A history in which you ignorantly decide is not worthy of having... Then a few months later you nag again for more of diversity but eventually just gobble up the old
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There's more than 2 people in this market...the same people buying platforming games are not always the same that bitch about gamers not buying enough new games or the same that gobble up COD...
And LBP was a very bad platforming game, the editor may have been nice but the platforming is to the level of some flash games out there!
 
I think this topic is trash but I have a semi on-topic thought:

It seems that most non-Nintendo devs of platformers increasingly rely on graphical gimmickry to sell their products. It typically manifests in hyper stylization or for 3D rendered ones overdramatic lighting. Even Nintendo falls into this with games like Kirby's Epic Yarn/Yarn Yoshi which are for them 2nd/3rd tier platformers. It's increasingly uncommon to find a "clean" looking 2D platformer, about the only one I can think of outside Nintendo is Sonic.

This all leads me to believe that many these are born in artistic concept rather than gameplay and it often shows. NSMB is mechanically a beautiful game and it was always very apparently that everything has clear mechanical value (including mundane things like flower and clouds to the music) which is probably why it is such a strong franchise.

I never really got that sense from what I've seen of Puppeteer or impressions of it but I also have not played it to make a clear judgement.
 
I never really got that sense from what I've seen of Puppeteer or impressions of it but I also have not played it to make a clear judgement.
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Puppeteer feels like something SCEJ may have produced during the PSX or PS2 era.

That said, I wish there were more clean looking platformers out there as well, but not to the point of looking clinical ala New Super Mario Bros. In that game, the visual design and (more importantly) the terrible soundtrack actually detract from an otherwise solid game.

I'd love for more platformers to nail both the presentation AND gameplay aspects. The best platformers of the past managed to deliver both things.
 
After having watched the video (now that I'm not in a place where video sites are blocked), I must disagree.

It looks really good, and I like the aesthetic... but looking purely at how it seems to play and control, it doesn't honestly stand out against some of the current Nintendo games that I see that are on their way.

So, nope. No they have not.
 
Lordwindowlicker said:
After having watched the video (now that I'm not in a place where video sites are blocked), I must disagree.

It looks really good, and I like the aesthetic... but looking purely at how it seems to play and control, it doesn't honestly stand out against some of the current Nintendo games that I see that are on their way.

So, nope. No they have not.
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You should try playing it first. The thread starter was an idiot for bringing Nintendo into this as it seems to be pushing people to take a negative stance against the game.

It's not a Nintendo game and it doesn't feel like one *BUT* it plays wonderfully and seems to have a lot of creativity behind it. Try the demo and you'll see that it plays great. It doesn't even show off the head mechanic (where changing heads switches abilities). It's almost akin to Megaman boss powers applied to a pure platformer.

It's a great addition alongside the other platformers Nintendo has been releasing.
 
dark10x said:
You should try playing it first. The thread starter was an idiot for bringing Nintendo into this as it seems to be pushing people to take a negative stance against the game.

It's not a Nintendo game and it doesn't feel like one *BUT* it plays wonderfully and seems to have a lot of creativity behind it. Try the demo and you'll see that it plays great.

It's a great addition alongside the other platformers Nintendo has been releasing.
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Has it been said that the OP and the thread titles are horrendous.
Seriously I don't even know the platform it's on (and the OP only gave a Utube link...) and the OP made sure I never wanted to learn anything about it, never mind try it.
 
dark10x said:
You should try playing it first.
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You seem to be under the assumption that I'm not just stating my impressions based on what has been shown. I never said that any of that was ironclad.

dark10x said:
It's not a Nintendo game and it doesn't feel like one *BUT* it plays wonderfully and seems to have a lot of creativity behind it.
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I never said anything to the contrary. As I've said previously, it looks great. But the topic wasn't asking if it was a good game or not, the OP stated that they beat Nintendo where they lived and based purely on the trailer I don't see it. Perhaps I could be proved wrong, but as of now I don't think he's correct.

It looks like something that I'll really enjoy. but yeah..
 
dark10x said:
Puppeteer feels like something SCEJ may have produced during the PSX or PS2 era.

That said, I wish there were more clean looking platformers out there as well, but not to the point of looking clinical ala New Super Mario Bros. In that game, the visual design and (more importantly) the terrible soundtrack actually detract from an otherwise solid game.

I'd love for more platformers to nail both the presentation AND gameplay aspects. The best platformers of the past managed to deliver both things.
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Would you count things like N+, Super Meat Boy, Thomas Was Alone etc as "clean"?
 
Mael said:
Has it been said that the OP and the thread titles are horrendous.
Seriously I don't even know the platform it's on (and the OP only gave a Utube link...) and the OP made sure I never wanted to learn anything about it, never mind try it.
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Yeah, it's horse shit and unfair to the smaller team working on this game.

I don't think they are trying to do anything even remotely similar to a Nintendo-style game. The comparison is so invalid. Don't cast the game aside simply due to a misguided OP.

Would you count things like N+, Super Meat Boy, Thomas Was Alone etc as "clean"?
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They're not really platformers in the same sense (though all are awesome). They feel more like Flash games to me visually.
 
dark10x said:
Yeah, it's horse shit and unfair to the smaller team working on this game.

I don't think they are trying to do anything even remotely similar to a Nintendo-style game. The comparison is so invalid. Don't cast the game aside simply due to a misguided OP.
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Well I still don't know where I could even try this so...
If it ends up as another La Mulana you won't see me complain.

And N+ is not exactly in the same league as the Mario/Castlevania/Metroid/Megaman of the worlds
 
This doesn't look anything like the platformers of old. I'll reserve judgement till I can try it out. Many scenes in the video look like they take you away from the core gameplay/controls, which can end up in awful.

The visuals are dope as fuck.
 
zoukka said:
This doesn't look anything like the platformers of old. I'll reserve judgement till I can try it out. Many scenes in the video look like they take you away from the core gameplay/controls, which can end up in awful.

The visuals are dope as fuck.
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Well, in the demo, you had the scissors power up which allowed you to freely cut along pieces of cloth. If you were watching you might even think it was scripted but you really have full control and need to perform well or you will fall.

I agree that it doesn't look like an old school game, rather, something more in line with Klonoa.
 
plagiarize said:
I... you think Blinx didn't have obnoxious art? Who could...

image.php


See what you made me do? You made me stoop to an avatar quote.
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I don't see anything wrong with Blinx. It looks like a platformer from the 90's but with more graphical horsepower. o_O
 
dark10x said:
Well, in the demo, you had the scissors power up which allowed you to freely cut along pieces of cloth. If you were watching you might even think it was scripted but you really have full control and need to perform well or you will fall.

I agree that it doesn't look like an old school game, rather, something more in line with Klonoa.
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Reminds me that Klonoa is far from some super tight control+level design but it still is one of my favourite platformers. There is way more to a platformer than just those.
 
Napalm_Frank said:
Reminds me that Klonoa is far from some super tight control+level design but it still is one of my favourite platformers. There is way more to a platformer than just those.
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I dunno, the Klonoa games have really tight control and require some real precision. The level design (especially in Klonoa 2) is also excellent.

Still, you're right, tight controls are important but those alone don't mean much if they're used in an otherwise dull package (ala New Super Mario Bros).
 
zoukka said:
This doesn't look anything like the platformers of old. I'll reserve judgement till I can try it out. Many scenes in the video look like they take you away from the core gameplay/controls, which can end up in awful.

The visuals are dope as fuck.
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The boss fights have more QTEs than I'd like to see but in that trailer, most of that was gameplay from a boss battle (which includes a mine cart section, same with the Kotaku boss fight demo).

I'd think the Wrestler's Head and Pirate's Head videos should give a decent idea how the game plays outside of boss battles

zoukka said:
Demo up in EU?
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Japan only but a different one is going up for the West.
 
dark10x said:
I dunno, the Klonoa games have really tight control and require some real precision. The level design (especially in Klonoa 2) is also excellent.

Still, you're right, tight controls are important but those alone don't mean much if they're used in an otherwise dull package (ala New Super Mario Bros).
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For what I remember Klonoa has pretty much zero physics to it when compared to Mario for example.
 
whatsinaname said:
Any rumours/news of this being ported to the Vita?
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There was some speculation that a Vita version's in the works, but it's not something that's actively happening right now. That's not to say it won't ever happen, though. "I'd want to do something with those controls," says Moore. "It wouldn't be the same game - I'd like to change the levels, because I don't think some of them would work. That's down to my management, if they decide they want to fund a Vita version. It's definitely something people have been asking for."
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http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-07-12-the-story-behind-japan-studios-most-personal-project
 
Boss Doggie said:
Naw if you're gonna use a platformer, at least use something like Super Meat Boy.
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Why would I use a game that's inferior to Nintendo's own efforts like that one?

DKCR is a good one though, at least it would be if that terrible waggle mechanic didn't cripple it. I can deal with some slightly loose controls fine. Hell, I prefer playing as Luigi in the old Mario games and Galaxy despite him being slippery and floaty. But I can't ignore a crappy control mechanic like that. Haven't been keeping up with Tropical Freeze that much (or any game these days to be honest), but I really hope they fixed that.
 
SykoTech said:
Why would I use a game that's inferior to Nintendo's own efforts like that one?

DKCR is a good one though, at least it would be if that terrible waggle mechanic didn't cripple it. I can deal with some slightly loose controls fine. Hell, I prefer playing as Luigi in the old Mario games and Galaxy despite him being slippery and floaty. But I can't ignore a crappy control mechanic like that. Haven't been keeping up with Tropical Freeze that much (or any game these days to be honest), but I really hope they fixed that.
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It was removed from the 3DS version, mercifully, but the lower framerate really hurts (an unsteady 30 fps).
 
dark10x said:
The problem with your comment is that many of us have played Puppeteer and can confirm that it has tight controls while feeling nothing like Little Big Planet. They play completely differently.

The controls in Puppeteer feel wonderful.
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And I heard the gameplay is really basic, the attempt of story-telling gets way too often in the way of the gameplay and the story-teller is getting annoying.
 
Game looks alright but nowhere near the quality of top-tier Nintendo platformers. Which makes sense since Nintendo's been doing it forever and knows exactly what to do.

If you want Nintendo quality platformers you have to get a Nintendo system. There's no point deluding yourself into thinking your going to get anything as good control wise and level design wise anywhere else in this day & age.
 
Obviously the title of this thread has caused this kind of junk....

But there are OTHER great platformers other than Nintendo's. If they don't play EXACTLY like Mario or DKC, it doesn't mean it isn't good...great even.

As for NSMB...they are competent, but lack the creativity and spark of the first 3 and the first 2 Mario Worlds. They're trying too hard to hit all the right notes, but there isn't enough experimenting with it. I haven't played the Wii U one though. I hear it's a step up.

But when I hear "Nintendo's platformers are the best"..I'm thinking Super Nintendo days. Those are cream of the crop.
 
dark10x said:
It was removed from the 3DS version, mercifully, but the lower framerate really hurts (an unsteady 30 fps).
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Well that's disappointing. Guess I shouldn't bothered with that one either.

Here's hoping that Tropical Freeze has both those issues under control.

evil_ash_xero said:
Obviously the title of this thread has caused this kind of junk....

But there are OTHER great platformers other than Nintendo's. If they don't play EXACTLY like Mario or DKC, it doesn't mean it isn't good...great even.

As for NSMB...they are competent, but lack the creativity and spark of the first 3 and the first 2 Mario Worlds. They're trying too hard to hit all the right notes, but there isn't enough experimenting with it. I haven't played the Wii U one though. I hear it's a step up.

But when I hear "Nintendo's platformers are the best"..I'm thinking Super Nintendo days. Those are cream of the crop.
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Very well said on every aspect.
 
Clownboat said:
Looks nice but the gameplay doesn't appear to be cohesive at all. Looks like a weird cross between slow, floaty platforming (Trine) and QTE/on-rails bullshit (recent 3D Sonic games). Hopefully the trailer is not representative.

(But isn't that the point of a trailer?)
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What Sonic Games are you talking about? The only one on rails are the Wii Games Excluding Colors. Plus they're not even QTE heavy, unless you're discussing the Werehog in Unleashed.
 
There are a lot more valid examples of people out-Nintendo-ing Nintendo than this OP. Nintendo isn't magic. Lame OP.

This game does look sweet as fuck, though. Seems like they really are putting a lot of passion behind this.

Edit: Also can someone please shake Sony awake and tell them what in God's name are they doing releasing this a week before GTA? Thanks :P
 
Game looks alright but nowhere near the quality of top-tier Nintendo platformers. Which makes sense since Nintendo's been doing it forever and knows exactly what to do.

If you want Nintendo quality platformers you have to get a Nintendo system. There's no point deluding yourself into thinking your going to get anything as good control wise and level design wise anywhere else in this day & age.
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It looks nowhere near the top-tier Nintendo platformers? From which generation? They certainly haven't been at the top of their game for a while. The last truly inspired Nintendo platform game released dates back to 2007 with Super Mario Galaxy. They've released plenty of excellent games since then but nothing as exciting and fresh since Galaxy.

Worse still, they've been consistently dropping the ball on the musical front. The fact of the matter is, when it comes to classic platformers, the quality of the music is almost as important as the game itself. It can elevate otherwise good stages into something truly memorable. Why else has the original theme to Super Mario Bros stuck with people for so many decades? New Super Mario Bros sabotages itself with boring music, safe visual design, and simply "good" level design. As far as I'm concerned, even the core mechanics aren't as refined or rewarding as some of their past games.

They are still the best of the best when it comes to making a great platformer but they are not infallible anymore.

That said, my solution is simply to play them all rather than picking sides. I'll enjoy Puppeteer just as I've enjoyed Nintendo's works. We should be celebrating the fact that another interesting platformer is being released as a full retail product rather than spitting on it simply because it isn't Mario.

Endo Punk said:
There are far better ways to hype such a niche game then to attack Nintendo who pretty much are kings of that genre.
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Pretty much.
 
SykoTech said:
Why would I use a game that's inferior to Nintendo's own efforts like that one?

DKCR is a good one though, at least it would be if that terrible waggle mechanic didn't cripple it. I can deal with some slightly loose controls fine. Hell, I prefer playing as Luigi in the old Mario games and Galaxy despite him being slippery and floaty. But I can't ignore a crappy control mechanic like that. Haven't been keeping up with Tropical Freeze that much (or any game these days to be honest), but I really hope they fixed that.
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If they follow 3DS layout then it will have no waggle. Considering how you can't waggle with the gamepad I expect it to be like that.

And I was focusing solely on mechanics in platforming.

JustRiffled said:
dude Blinx is one of the best designed furries ever

images


better than most art from indies
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Definitely. Blinx is pleasing to the eyes compared to most "look at my art against mainstream" atypical indie game usually do.
 
I've just seen a bunch of videos of this game and I still fail to see what's supposed to be so exciting about it. And I love platformers. I don't understand why the Sony crowd here are so focused on hyping this. I hope they release a demo or something so I can try the game for myself, but judging from videos alone I vastly prefer what I've seen from the new DK for WiiU. Or Rayman Legends (graphics and animation on this one are absolutely bonkers, almost unbelievable), which as I said before is multiplatform.

dark10x said:
It looks nowhere near the top-tier Nintendo platformers? From which generation? They certainly haven't been at the top of their game for a while. The last truly inspired Nintendo platform game released dates back to 2007 with Super Mario Galaxy. They've released plenty of excellent games since then but nothing as exciting and fresh since Galaxy.

Worse still, they've been consistently dropping the ball on the musical front. The fact of the matter is, when it comes to classic platformers, the quality of the music is almost as important as the game itself. It can elevate otherwise good stages into something truly memorable. Why else has the original theme to Super Mario Bros stuck with people for so many decades? New Super Mario Bros sabotages itself with boring music, safe visual design, and simply "good" level design. As far as I'm concerned, even the core mechanics aren't as refined or rewarding as some of their past games.

They are still the best of the best when it comes to making a great platformer but they are not infallible anymore.

That said, my solution is simply to play them all rather than picking sides. I'll enjoy Puppeteer just as I've enjoyed Nintendo's works. We should be celebrating the fact that another interesting platformer is being released as a full retail product rather than spitting on it simply because it isn't Mario.
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Galaxy's OST is better than 99% of any other OST out there. Wonderful. And it's from Nintendo. Not a platformer, but Xenoblade's is also fenomenal. They produce magnificient scores on their games. Of all the things one might have against their games, the soundtracks?. Seriously?. WTH.

I also want to somehow stand up for the NSMB series of games. The graphics are safe and simple, no way to deny that, but the gameplay design is fantastic. The Wii game was great on that department, but the WiiU one is truly amazing IMO. Controls are top notch. Every stage has its own gameplay theme on it that's fully developed from beginning to end. It's fun playing solo, and even more so with friends and family. I fail to see what's to hate there.

Now, back to Puppeteer. I am not liking it much, personal opinion based on what I've seen. I'll try the demo if/when they release one. I hope to be wrong on it, as some say gameplay's good.
 
Galaxy's OST is better than 99% of any other OST out there. Wonderful. And it's from Nintendo. Not a platformer, but Xenoblade's is also fenomenal. They produce magnificient scores on their games. Of all the things one might have against their games, the soundtracks?. Seriously?. WTH.
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There's Galaxy again.

Soundtracks are one of my biggest complaints with Nintendo games but we shouldn't get into that here.
 
dark10x said:
There's Galaxy again.

Soundtracks are one of my biggest complaints with Nintendo games but we shouldn't get into that here.
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You're the first person I know who have problems with Nintendo's OST. Even those who question their content praise the soundtrack of the games. o_O
 
So yeah...after playing Puppeteer today I now agree with the OP. What a real gem of a game!

The game is absolutely filled to the brim with charm. It makes me feel so happy when I play it!
 
Puppeteer looks great and all, but I don't know why you automatically equate platformers with Nintendo. It just seems like you're trying to troll.
 
Tricky I Shadow said:
So yeah...after playing Puppeteer today I now agree with the OP. What a real gem of a game!

The game is absolutely filled to the brim with charm. It makes me feel so happy when I play it!
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Yep, I agree. Played a bit last night and it's already been proving more enjoyable than any Mario platformer I've played since Galaxy. Plays great and has charm coming out it's ears. Looking forward to really getting stuck in over the weekend.

(Sorry if that hurts your feelings Nintendo fans, but I'm sure there are plenty more second hand opinions out there that'll tell you what you want to hear.)
 
Zen_Arcade said:
Puppeteer looks great and all, but I don't know why you automatically equate platformers with Nintendo. It just seems like you're trying to troll.
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I think it's a completely valid point. Here we have Sony funding unique and creative games that remind people of the kind of work Nintendo used to be capable of. Nintendo of today hasn't created an amazing new IP that reminds people of those days in a very long time. Now it's just milking Mario and a handful of other franchises into eternity, with many of the iterations being remakes and partial remakes of old games. I genuinely feel a little sad thinking about what they've become.
 
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