Zoe
Member
It's enough to introduce reasonable doubt.
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Rape charge dropped against USC student after evidence of consent presented
- Thread starter norm9
- Start date
It's enough to introduce reasonable doubt.
Up to 30% of women are sexually assaulted before graduating from college.
The burden should always be on the men. As I say in all of these threads, there is a real problem with rape in this country that doesn't get nearly enough exposure or attention.
DOWN
Banned
Thats why I asked earlier what she claimed. Im guessing some part of the video directly contradicted her claim, because she would not have been in trouble for being interested in one point but later no longer giving him consent as things progressed.
Puck Beaverton
Banned
yeah casual sex in this day and age seems like a slippery slope
benicillin
Banned
Wow this topic went to garbage really quickly. Whole lot of people here don't seem to understand the difference between not enough evidence to prosecute (a sadly common problem) and her falsifying rape claims (something that did not happen.)
Or you know, consent.
Or you know, consent.
illusionspark
Member
You can still rape someone who wants to have sex with you... So.
Where is this line drawn also?
So it can happen just before, during and after?
Can a woman after sex say it was rape if she felt like shit after?
Rape is so hard to prove.
I agree that even wanting to have sex with somebody doesn't mean consent can't revoked, a mind can be changed quickly "I don't want to do this".
That said, the court has to go with evidence, we can't lock people away because of a he said she said especially when there is at least some evidence for reasonable doubt.
Rape is so fucked up. It's worse because it's a crime that often times cannot be proven.
That said, the court has to go with evidence, we can't lock people away because of a he said she said especially when there is at least some evidence for reasonable doubt.
Rape is so fucked up. It's worse because it's a crime that often times cannot be proven.
Anton Sugar
Member
Sunster
Member
I understand. but false claims are exceedingly rare. don't lose the perspective that women have a lot more to fear from casual sex than men.
Lionel Richie
Member
Do you honestly think that during the time they were going down that at no point she said anything like FUCK ME?
Mohonky
Member
The fuck?
So if someone accuses you of rape, its on you to prove you didnt, not that it actually occurred?
How do you know that?
I don't think there's enough evidence to prosecute her in any form, but it definitely makes it a possibility that it was a false claim
Ok, but is there evidence of her saying it was ok to use a foreign object? Maybe I missed it in the article, but it sounds like the video just shows the instigation. Not the act in question. Just because she doesn't say no at the start, doesn't mean she couldn't have said no later.
Psychoward
Banned
For real holy shit
Sarcastic Poster
Member
Be protected, get your partner to sign shit. (I'm only half joking because these false rape accusations are absolutely awful and a terrifying prospect and a terrible thing to lie about).
If I was a professional athlete, I would 100% do that. You have a target on your back.
Where did you get this from?
Puck Beaverton
Banned
celebs have women sign NDA's. I know Bieber does/did that.
Shadowhelper
Banned
I doubt the claim is she revoked consent at the last second and she was raped.
I mean, if you look at the video, its unlikely anyone was revoking consent. He even says he did not ever think she was too drunk to give consent. So I think this is an issue of her claiming she was too intoxicated to have had sex with him, therefore she was taken advantage of.
Perhaps the dude took advantage, perhaps he didn't. But its not a case of a dude spots a drunken girl who is comatose, and then takes her to a room. That video shows enough for the judge to believe the defendant might be telling the truth.
I mean, if you look at the video, its unlikely anyone was revoking consent. He even says he did not ever think she was too drunk to give consent. So I think this is an issue of her claiming she was too intoxicated to have had sex with him, therefore she was taken advantage of.
Perhaps the dude took advantage, perhaps he didn't. But its not a case of a dude spots a drunken girl who is comatose, and then takes her to a room. That video shows enough for the judge to believe the defendant might be telling the truth.
No. Consent can be revoked before and during. Come on, it's not that hard.
Well the odds seem to be on the (alleged) victim's side. And you don't want to be that guy that ignores a rape victim because you wanted to be fair to both sides.
what a romantic
So much this.
Really glad this lad's life didn't get ruined, even though his internet footprint is forever, any prospective employers or clients he works with just have to google him and might think he still did it...
and of course the girl isn't able to be identified for 'legal reasons' I'm assuming
Psychoward
Banned
Or maybe they have a target on their backs because there's a giant fucking problem with student athlete organizations and college sexual assault?
DOWN
Banned
? All Im saying is that a person being interested at one point doesnt prove they said yes all night long and that one of those involved could not have taken actions that the other felt were too far or had changed their mind about during the interaction.
Im not saying that intoxicated males can consent but only women cant. Im saying just because you start out interested in an encounter doesnt mean you are stuck there and cant back out of the interaction all along just because you thought it was ok at the beginning. You have a right to stop the consent you gave and get out of the interaction and your partner has to facilitate that, male or female.
Fulminator
Member
Consent can surely be revoked, but what happens if consent is revoked during intercourse? (I mean obviously you stop having sex, but is it rape because he/she withdrew during the act?) Can you revoke consent after intercourse? How do you navigate those situations?
Sunster
Member
I do not know what happened. I do know getting consent is the right thing to do regardless of perceived risks. very. small. risks.
Various studies and statistics.
I have seen the number as low as 20% and as high as 30%.
I wish there was some way to verify my outrageous claims but there probably isn't so just trust me.
Anton Sugar
Member
Yes, a woman can lie, if that's what you're implying. Just like any human being can lie about any private interaction behind closed doors.
Rape kits help establish a set of physical criteria for assessing it, but yes, it can be hard to prove in some cases.
Consent can be revoked at *any* time before or during. No one has ownership over your body. Saying "yes" 15 minutes ago doesn't invalidate a "no" right now. That's not the same as changing your mind after. Being drugged/too intoxicated to provide consent, and realizing it after, is somewhat different.
If someone tells you to stop having sex with them during the act and you don't stop, yes, you are raping them.
Psychoward
Banned
If she says no during sex and you keep going it's rape. If she said yes before but no during and you stop it isn't rape. This isn't rocket science guys.
hydrophilic attack
Member
consent can be withdrawn
Lonewulfeus
Member
Ding ding ding. Unless you were in the room it's impossible to know what happened.
Its he said/she said. She likely gave a run down of events that painted him as the aggressor/initiator and these tapes damaged her credibility. The accused could have also given a description of events that matched what the tapes showed.
If there is no evidence in her favor at that point you have to just drop the charges.
How is this hard to understand at all? Consent can be revoked at any time before or during. If someone says to stop, then fucking stop. It's very easy.
And yeah rape is hard to prove. That's probably why so many women get raped and why so many men get away with it, unfortunately.
People that don't seem to understand this probably should just chop off their penis. We'd be better off.
Huge Succeeded
Banned
wait, what?
...seems to me like there's literally nobody in the former category, and at least a few in the latter?
Fulminator
Member
I understand that, that's why I said you stop having sex with them
I'm asking , if you withdraw consent during sex, can someone say everything that occurred up to that point is also rape
I mean surely the obvious answer is no (provided there was original consent), but surely there are some people that would claim so
But this is actually not really a relevant thing to discuss, and is probably not a big real world issue so I'm not gonna continue talking about it
Messofanego
Banned
Is there a statistic for the percentage of rape cases that involve intoxication, both false and true?
Rktk
Member
There is at least one in the former with another in agreement, on this page.
this sounds like a case where she just regretted doing something when she was drunk. I have done some dumb shit when I've been drunk too, but I take responsibility. Doesn't mean that consent wasn't revoked at some point during the act, but without any evidence of that it's a hard sell in court.
this is the hottest take.
this is the hottest take.
JoJoShabadoo
Member
I mean, you should link to some sources rather than ask a gaffer to trust you.
Anton Sugar
Member
I keep getting extremely frustrated at this thread. Yes, the murky he-said/she-said is difficult to navigate, legally and morally, but god damn, if someone says no during a (previously) consensual sexual encounter and the other person does not stop, it is rape.
I take for granted that it's apparently not common sense?
...? That's not how our justice system works.
I agree that rape is a huge problem in this country but it's an inherently problematic crime. Barring any damning physical evidence too often it boils down to a "he said she said", and it's very tough to convict someone in that scenario.
DOWN
Banned
It can be rape if one party doesnt stop immediately or if that party took actions that were not agreed to, like using foreign objects when their partner did not give consent for that kind of interaction. You have every right to have boundaries against that kind of interaction while allowing another, every right to say you no longer want to do any of this, etc. During the act, your partner needs to make sure you are able to say no to anything they are going to try on you, male or female
It is shitty how vulnerable women can be in this situation, but don't you think it's also a problem that men aren't allowed to be sexually assaulted while drunk by cultural standards?