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[Bulletbrain]

It really depends... How much code.. Like did it have to be totally re-written or just a little?

Let's say you try and find me a real world example of that scenario.

Because no studio in their right mind would do it? and if they would make a total upgrade for an old game in the same engine, it would simply be a remaster.

See my edit pls: If you really need a example, here it is. The original half life was made using GoldSrc. Valve then ported Half-life to their new Source engine and launched Half-life:Souce. This is what sensible people call a remaster. Then a team of modders made Black Mesa, a complete remake of Half-life, using the same Source engine.

 

[Jack Uzi]

"A remaster is always done in the same engine. Most devs doesn't want to use the time to convert to a new engine, so remastering what have already been done, is the preffered route for most devs"

Resident Evil, RE0 and Code Veronica were ported to a new engine MT Framework to run on the HD consoles.

 

[8BiTw0LF]

You've described basically any new iteration of an engine ever lol. Engines are even cross compatible now and you can port assets from one to another eg. models, level meshes, shaders etc. Games even occasionally change engine mid-development. Do they just burn all the work they did already? No.

Which engines are cross-compatible? I know UE5 is backwards compatible with UE4. UE3 to UE4 is a no-go.

No, I absolutely don't need to provide a real world example of this scenario. Definitions are important. I'm giving you a hypothetical example where you definition cannot work. That means your definition is bad. That's my entire point. You are absolutely wrong in your definition because it won't hold up in this very possible (however unlikely) scenario that I described. Your definition cannot work for all scenarios, therefore it is a bad definition.

Of course you can do a remake of a game in the same engine - it just never happens, so it's not something to make a debate about. If every debate was about making extreme unlikely scenarios, we would'nt get far.

A remaster doesn't necessary reuse the original engine. See the recent quake remaster, it's a new engine built on-top of Vulkan.

So it's a remake..

See my edit pls: If you really need a example, here it is. The original half life was made using GoldSrc. Valve then ported Half-life to their new Source engine and launched Half-life:Souce. This is what sensible people call a remaster. Then a team of modders made Black Mesa, a complete remake of Half-life, using the same Source engine.

Definitely a remaster.. "Porting a Goldsource model to the Source engine is a short process. For best results, have all original source content ready for the model: original 3d package file, textures, and .QC file. SMD files may also be useful if the original 3d package file is unavailable.
For the most part, porting models is straightforward: Set the VPROJECT properly, convert old textures to VTF format, tweak .QC file to include new Source syntax, and then compile the new content into a new Source model file." - Porting Goldsource content to Source - Valve Developer Community (valvesoftware.com)

Resident Evil, RE0 and Code Veronica were ported to a new engine MT Framework to run on the HD consoles.

Guess it was backwards compatible?

 

[Bulletbrain]

Which engines are cross-compatible? I know UE5 is backwards compatible with UE4. UE3 to UE4 is a no-go.

Of course you can do a remake of a game in the same engine - it just never happens, so it's not something to make a debate about. If every debate was about making extreme unlikely scenarios, we would'nt get far.

So it's a remake..

Definitely a remaster.. "Porting a Goldsource model to the Source engine is a short process. For best results, have all original source content ready for the model: original 3d package file, textures, and .QC file. SMD files may also be useful if the original 3d package file is unavailable.
For the most part, porting models is straightforward: Set the VPROJECT properly, convert old textures to VTF format, tweak .QC file to include new Source syntax, and then compile the new content into a new Source model file." - Porting Goldsource content to Source - Valve Developer Community (valvesoftware.com)

Guess it was backwards compatible?

But this goes against your rule? It's a remaster despite being a new engine. On the other hand, Black Mesa is a complete remake of Half-Life source, despite being on the same engine. New engine, old engine doesn't make a difference. What makes a remake...is in the name. You have to actually remake stuff. Hope you understand at least now.

 

[8BiTw0LF]

But this goes against your rule? It's a remaster despite being a new engine.

If the engine is backwards compatible and no additional code has to be written to make it work - yes, it's a remaster.

On the other hand, Black Mesa is a complete remake of Half-Life source, despite being on the same engine. New engine, old engine doesn't make a difference. What makes a remake...is in the name. You have to actually remake stuff. Hope you understand at least now.

You're right. I should have added "if any other studio would remake a game within the same engine - it's a remake" - just thought that was self-explanatory.

 

[IFireflyl]

Of course you can do a remake of a game in the same engine - it just never happens, so it's not something to make a debate about. If every debate was about making extreme unlikely scenarios, we would'nt get far.

If you're now admitting that a remake can be done in the same engine then you are admitting that your original definition (new engine = remake; no new engine = remaster) is wrong. That means that there is something else (not the game engine) that determines what is a remake and what is a remaster. Thank you for confirming that I was right, and that you were wrong.

 

[Killer8]

So it's a remake..

Just lmao:



By any measurement this is like a textbook remaster of the original but because it's in a new engine it now fits into the category of remake..

I'm out.

 

[8BiTw0LF]

If you're now admitting that a remake can be done in the same engine then you are admitting that your original definition (new engine = remake; no new engine = remaster) is wrong. That means that there is something else (not the game engine) that determines what is a remake and what is a remaster. Thank you for confirming that I was right, and that you were wrong.

Yeah, I should have added that a 1 in a million times that would happen, totally contradicts my hypothesis...

 

[Haggard]

OP is too uneducated to differentiate between a port and a remake....

 

[IFireflyl]

Yeah, I should have added that a 1 in a million times that would happen, totally contradicts my hypothesis...

Be sarcastic all you want, but it absolutely does contradict your hypothesis. As I previously mentioned, definitions are important. Also, a hypothesis is merely a proposed explanation based on the evidence you have available. Hypotheses can be proven to be supported, or they can be proven to be not supported. I proved that your hypothesis is not supported based on an actual scenario that can occur. You're acting all edgy, but really you just need to admit that your definition wasn't the concrete answer that you thought it was, and then move on.

 

[rofif]

For me it is simple.

reMASTER - mastering out the original tape. That means higher res and polishing out the original assets. You might touch up here and there but no changes.
reMAKE - You scrap all there was and remake it all anew. Like Demons Souls. They made ALL new assets, models and engine on top. It is not a remaster just because levels and gameplay is the same.

Remake is a robocop in 4k HDR.
REmake is that terrible new robocop from few years ago

 

[Jack Uzi]

Which engines are cross-compatible? I know UE5 is backwards compatible with UE4. UE3 to UE4 is a no-go.

Of course you can do a remake of a game in the same engine - it just never happens, so it's not something to make a debate about. If every debate was about making extreme unlikely scenarios, we would'nt get far.

So it's a remake..

Definitely a remaster.. "Porting a Goldsource model to the Source engine is a short process. For best results, have all original source content ready for the model: original 3d package file, textures, and .QC file. SMD files may also be useful if the original 3d package file is unavailable.
For the most part, porting models is straightforward: Set the VPROJECT properly, convert old textures to VTF format, tweak .QC file to include new Source syntax, and then compile the new content into a new Source model file." - Porting Goldsource content to Source - Valve Developer Community (valvesoftware.com)

Guess it was backwards compatible?

No the engine was made for the PS/360 generation. They were ported to the engine to run on the new hardware.

 

[Keihart]

The engine talk is kinda bullshit.

The wording of "re-mastering" it comes simply from the idea of mastering something again, meaning, redoing the process in which you adapt the original content to a new platform, like a song mastered for cassette and then mastering it for CD or digital, it basically means in games jumping resolutions and framerates.

Lot's of remasters have required rebuilding or "porting" games over new engines since emulating them is often not enough for a proper re-master.

Re-make is a way looser term in comparison, there are no expectations of keeping the source material the same as intended but building it again. It can come in the form of new interpretations or simply updated techniques to achieve what the dev perceives was the original intent.

I don't think there is any confusion, we have seen both terms be used for years in other forms of media, a remaster of a movie or a music and a remake are pretty self explanatory by now and most people agree on the expectations of both brandings.

Edit: LMAO at OP defending his definition.

 

[Yoboman]

It should be

Remake = new engine, new gameplay, rethinking a lot of the fundamentals of the original. Eg Resident Evil 2

Remastered = new engine, same code gameplay

Port = original game and graphics maybe with minor tweaks

But devs and gamers have confused all the meanings so nobody knows what is what now

 

[ReBurn]

Is the distinction all that important?

 

[*Nightwing]

Thank you for that education. Words really do matter for effective communication.
With that in mind might I say: I have your remaster in my pants

it's remastered cause it's erect!

 

[Jack Uzi]

I wonder what engine Naughty Dog will use for the remake for The Last of Us

 

[Kokoloko85]

Simple exaple:

Nintendo Swtich:
Zelda Skyway Sword = Remaster
Zelda Links Awakening = Remake


Remaster: Updated graphics, FPS, maybe features
The Last of US remastered PS4
Final Fantasy X -X2 HD remaster
Halo Master Chief Collection
Uncharted Collection
Dark Souls PS4/ Xbox remaster
MGS Collection

Remake: Changed from the ground up
-Resident Evil 1 Remake
-Resident Evil 2 Remake
-Demon Souls
-Shadow of the Colossus PS4
-Final Fantasy 7 Remake
-Zelda Links Awakening

Trickier as they used different engines: But more of a remaster cause not any different apart from updated graphics and controls
Wind Waker HD - Wii U
Mass Effect Trilogy

 

[Neff]

OP is too uneducated to differentiate between a port and a remake....

Who needs education, logic, reason or facts when you've got gifs

 

[Keihart]

Simple exaple:

Nintendo Swtich:
Zelda Skyway Sword = Remaster
Zelda Links Awakening = Remake


Remaster: Updated graphics, FPS, maybe features
The Last of US remastered PS4
Final Fantasy X -X2 HD remaster
Halo Master Chief Collection
Uncharted Collection
Dark Souls PS4/ Xbox remaster
MGS Collection

Remake: Changed from the ground up
-Resident Evil 1 Remake
-Resident Evil 2 Remake
-Demon Souls
-Shadow of the Colossus PS4
-Final Fantasy 7 Remake
-Zelda Links Awakening

Trickier as they used different engines: But more of a remaster cause not any different apart from updated graphics and controls
Wind Waker HD - Wii U
Mass Effect Trilogy

It get's even weirder , Uncharted Collection was rebuilt in the same but updated engine.
Engine as part of the definition...

 

[Kev Kev]

Here I'll help clear things up…

FFVII Remake is neither a remaster or a remake

Any questions?

 

[MeatSafeMurderer]

Is it very obviously the same game just at a higher resolution, maybe with a few higher quality textures? (I.E. does it just look like the old version running in an emulator) Remaster.
Has the game obviously been rebuilt from the ground up with all new assets, a new engine, an all new code base etc? Remake.

It's not hard. Unfortunately you even have companies calling their obvious remakes remasters and vice versa.

 

[Sophist]

Here I'll help clear things up…

FFVII Remake is neither a remaster or a remake

Any questions?

is it a reboot?

 

[xellos2099alpha]

What would one cal Nier Replicant? Yoko himselfd say it is a version update.

 

[Kev Kev]

is it a reboot?

 

[Elbow Identity Shallow]

I'd edit the first post, not that it matters as its really of no consequence whet different people feel about the definitions.
-A remaster essentially uses something that is already there but mastering is done again.
-A remake of some is essentially that, they've remade it.
In gaming though, whatever things are labelled as it's more often a mix of both with some things being old and some things being new. Language is organic though and as well as evolving over time does change from person to person, town to town, country to country, etc. We really shouldn't rely on dictionary definitions to strictly for any word, they're merely reference books that can give us somewhere to start in terms of understanding something.
After all, there are literally thousands of recognised English language dictionaries with slightly different interpretations of the words within them and not one of those dictionaries is where the meaning of a word originated.
As I said, I'd edit the first post rather than calling it wrong. It's as right or as wrong as people feel it is.

 

[Edgelord79]

I never knew that it had to do with whether or not it uses a new engine. Learned something!

 

[Osaka_Boss]

But sometimes remasters aren't always in the same engine. Nightdive port old games like Doom 64 and Shadowman into their proprietary KEX Engine and add a ton of new visual effects, new textures, tweak maps etc. And yet, Nightdive themselves still call the games remastered.

There is similar confusion with Halo: MCC. Remake and remaster seem to be used for Halo: CE and Halo 2's anniversary editions, respectively, yet both have the same setup of 1:1 game and level design with a new graphical layer running on top in a new engine.

Yeah, people that played them back in the day will still have the same experience despite the improvements. I think this is the core idea. Still I don't think it is fair to call Crash trilogy a remaster when so much was done from scratch.

 

[WolfusFh]

OP is just straight up pretending his definition doesn't have issues, despite needing additional parameters in several real life situations, and then denying that these situations exist.

The definition being dependant on the engine used is nonsensical.

 

[Notabueno]

You're definition is inexact: many remasters are done by specifically changing the engine, usually not reworking or creating a new one but porting an older game to a newer game's engine.

Also there are many other aspects that describe a remaster vs reboot vs remake, and it has mostly to do with the conception of the game.

Remaster: A game of which the original content from code to structure is not significantly altered (thought might be fine-tuned or edited) and is ported to a newer engine, or directly refined in-engine.

Reboot: A game that is not a continuation of the main cannon line but starts with a new, and uses the core elements, tropes, concepts as the original while completely rewriting or reconceiving those for a completely new project, structure, plan and content.

Remake: A game of which only the original narrative, concepts, tropes, elements, structure, art direction are kept, but that is built anew from the ground up in a new engine, trying to follow and reflect the original but with modern standards in both graphics, gameplay, design etc...

 

[Ghost of Caelid]

Remasters are kind of arbitrary in an era of free 4k 60 updates. They are just double money dips at this point.

 

[Aressa]

I always choose remakes but obviously devs choose the easier path which remasters.