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[Erethian]

One thing is for sure if shareholders are angry enough and do get Iwata fired GAF will have one of its biggest meltdowns ever. Regardless if the implication has anythig to do with iOS or not.

Shareholders don't appoint the CEO, they appoint the board. So you'd need to have a situation where a new board is appointed with the intention that they'll then turn around and fire Iwata.

Edit: This is also a ridiculously unlikely scenario because the situations where institutional investors, who own the majority of shares for most companies around the world, have ever gone against the wishes of the current board and CEO are so stupidly rare that it's an incredibly noteworthy event when it happens.

 

[DCharlie]

a Wii U price tag of $350/35,000 yen won't stop me getting one but i think that price tag will be, um, "problematic"

 

[Ulairi]

a Wii U price tag of $350/35,000 yen won't stop me getting one but i think that price tag will be, um, "problematic"

It's not going to be $350 and they don't know how much it's going to cost.

 

[DCharlie]

It's not going to be $350 and they don't know how much it's going to cost.

I personally don't think it will be but i've started to hear that figure being brought up by a few people now.

I can't see it personally - $299 is an upper limit i'd have thought.

 

[Ulairi]

I think you're right and it will be $299 with a pack-in game which is a fair price for a new console.

 

[Christine]

Well if Nintendo's investors want them to go iOS in masse then Nintendo has to convince them like hell otherwise. The shareholders could very well demand for the high ups at Nintendo such as Iwata and co. be fired and be replaced by far more pro-smartphone/tablet types.

Even if it would be wrong it is still a strong possibility. Shareholders have made terrible choices in the past. Many many many many times.

I really don't think a lot here comprehend just how real the possibility is the shareholders could demand Iwata's head if they are as angry with the poor numbers as they could be, especially if it happens for multiple fiscal reports in a row.

It may not be the "right" choice, but thats not how the corporate world works always. Iwata could possibly be a few fiscal reports from being the next Howard Stringer. Things happen fast and shareholders tend to lack patience.

A minimum of 38% of the outstanding and voting shares in Nintendo are held by investors that have sat on them for decades. As far as the controlling interest is concerned, the return on their investment is provided nearly exclusively through dividends. This is the first fiscal year in which the company has neither positive operating income nor net income, meaning that no dividend obligation exists. However, as of last October, they established a 100 yen per share minimum dividend. This is a far cry from what they've paid in their best recent years, but they've established this exception to their profit distribution policy quite specifically opposite stated expectations of "revitalized" profit in the fiscal year ending March 31, 2013. This is taking from capital to pay against next year's increase in same. They wouldn't do it at all unless they had complete confidence that this year's loss is an isolated event, nor would they do it so cheaply ($160 million in total, give or take) if there were actually any serious worries from the long-term investors. This is just so that everybody keeps getting an annual return without interruption.

 

[Medalion]

I personally don't think it will be but i've started to hear that figure being brought up by a few people now.

I can't see it personally - $299 is an upper limit i'd have thought.

Upper? Rumor that would be the lower

 

[shinra-bansho]

$350 would be palatable - if it has some sort of Wii Sports like killer app that catches on - or provides a noticeable generational transition from what's presently on the market at $250, and will probably be ASPing at ~$200 come Holiday season.

If it doesn't have either $299 is essentially the upper limit to not being stillborn.

 

[Tiktaalik]

It's pretty disturbing when the analysts that are supposed to be the experts don't understand the company's business model at all.

 

[jman2050]

It's pretty disturbing when the analysts that are supposed to be the experts don't understand the company's business model at all.

Who said any of them are experts?

it's just a bunch of general-interest analyst firms trying to speak about an industry that they have absolutely no working knowledge of.

 

[thestopsign]

Exactly how long until the shareholders meeting goes public with news?

 

[charlequin]

once again I agree with analysts and not with neogaf, what a surprise. If anything I would say nintendo need not hurry, cash in the bank, current sales and all that.

Is this something to be proud of now? "I agree with a group of perennially inaccurate people with no subject-matter expertise over a gathering of broadly knowledgeable people who can use debate to test one anothers' points and who have a strong model of how the industry actually works"?

Why is Nintendos total revenue being compared to app store revenue? App Store is just software revenue. The vast majority of Nintendo's revenue comes from hardware.

Which is what's endangered by a move away from exclusive hardware support and into the world of trend-surfing multiplatform releases.

All your corrections here are kind of irrelevant to what's actually being discussed. Okay, app store revenue is $8b this year instead of $4b. Is Nintendo, all by themselves, going to double that? Are they going to make a quarter of that? No. The point of citing the number is to demonstrate that even a wildly ambitious result for Nintendo in moving into that space is a fairly tiny result in comparison to their actual, established line of business. It doesn't make sense to pursue a relatively small payday with a huge risk attached when one's core business is still quite successful overall.

 

[shinra-bansho]

Exactly how long until the shareholders meeting goes public with news?

It's currently 1:30 AM in Japan; IR info should be out some time in the next 16 hours.

Not sure what time Nintendo traditionally posts its info.

 

[jman2050]

Which is what's endangered by a move away from exclusive hardware support and into the world of trend-surfing multiplatform releases.

All your corrections here are kind of irrelevant to what's actually being discussed. Okay, app store revenue is $8b this year instead of $4b. Is Nintendo, all by themselves, going to double that? Are they going to make a quarter of that? No. The point of citing the number is to demonstrate that even a wildly ambitious result for Nintendo in moving into that space is a fairly tiny result in comparison to their actual, established line of business. It doesn't make sense to pursue a relatively small payday with a huge risk attached when one's core business is still quite successful overall.

There's just no money in mobile gaming for big companies except as a supplement to their primary business model. Nintendo is just in the unique case where they can't use it as a supplement because any attempt to do so directly contradicts their core business. There's absolutely no upside to even considering going into the mobile space for them.

 

[Tylahedras]

Shareholders don't appoint the CEO, they appoint the board. So you'd need to have a situation where a new board is appointed with the intention that they'll then turn around and fire Iwata.

Edit: This is also a ridiculously unlikely scenario because the situations where institutional investors, who own the majority of shares for most companies around the world, have ever gone against the wishes of the current board and CEO are so stupidly rare that it's an incredibly noteworthy event when it happens.

The exception that proves the rule?

http://mycrains.crainsnewyork.com/b...lders-rise-up-and-reject-citis-pay-practices/

He's right though, Nintendo would have to choose to change direction internally, which doesn't seem likely at this point.

Is this something to be proud of now? "I agree with a group of perennially inaccurate people with no subject-matter expertise over a gathering of broadly knowledgeable people who can use debate to test one anothers' points and who have a strong model of how the industry actually works"?

I've been wrong before and I've been right before I guess we'll see.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

It's currently 1:30 AM in Japan; IR info should be out some time in the next 16 hours.

Not sure what time Nintendo traditionally posts its info.

You mean 1:30 PM.

It's 1:56 PM as of this posting.

 

[shinra-bansho]

You mean 1:30 PM.

It's 1:56 PM as of this posting.

Oh, lol, yup - poor timezone math. Should be some time in the next 3 hours then I imagine.

 

[HK-47]

The exception that proves the rule?

http://mycrains.crainsnewyork.com/b...lders-rise-up-and-reject-citis-pay-practices/

He's right though, Nintendo would have to choose to change direction internally, which doesn't seem likely at this point.



I've been wrong before and I've been right before I guess we'll see.

You know who usually isnt right? Average shmuck analysts about specialized industries they dont understand.

 

[argon]

Anyone else notice that the analyst said Nintendo has 8,000 yen per share in cash? The stock is currently at 11,400. Nintendo has no debt, so that cash hoard is built into the stock price. Subtract it from the stock and that means investors currently believe the entirety of Nintendo's IP catalog, non-cash assets and business operations is worth 3,400 yen per share (~$6 billion total). Incredibly mispriced, but it shows how much the investor mindshare has shifted toward Apple and iOS/Android gaming being the next big thing Nintendo is missing out on. Investors are pricing doom and gloom for years to come.

 

[Night_Trekker]

If BMW released the new M3 at $60,000~ and it sold like shit, then cut the price by 33%~ would it be any surprise that it was selling well?

I'm not really trying to get into the whole anti/pro-Nintendo thing with this comment, I just don't get why the 3DS's "success" should be lauded when it required dire action to achieve those numbers. Sure it's selling now after its price point was completely reworked, but it was a failure at $250.

I don't think it can really be used by either side as any sort of realistic argument for Nintendo's current well-being or lack thereof.

Because Nintendo always plans conservatively so they can afford to make such drastic cuts if necessary. If Sony or MS did something as drastic, I would be shocked since they always sell hardware at a loss. Nintendo? They plan for such contingencies because they don't have other divisions to fall back on. It was a drastic and necessary move, but they could afford to make it.

That, and it worked, and the 3DS is undeniably looking like a success.

Also, your analogy is ridiculous.

This argument holds no water.

Why is this a sticking point? Microsoft and Sony can keep re-using "Xbox" and "PS3" and no one bats an eyelash at that. Calling your next console The Xbox 360 is one of the dumbest names ever, because it means you wind up back where you started. And all "PS3" signifies is that Sony is unwillingly to try anything new, and is happy to simply ride off the success that that PS2 had.

Why is "Wii U" any different than those?

This is anecdotal so take it with a block of salt, but I have a pretty serious gamer friend (not serious enough to be a GAF lurker, obviously) who had no idea the 3DS was a totally new system. He assumed from the name that it was just another iteration of the DS hardware with 3D slapped on.

Now imagine the wide range of consumers who don't know much about gaming at all before they bought the Wii. You think they're going to know the Wii-U is a totally new console? Why? Even the name has "Wii" in it, and most of them have moved on to HD-compatible console experiences like the Kinect (if they're still gaming at all). The Wii is that older thing they used to play before they got something better or got tired of it.

Though it's true that my gamer friend is experienced enough to expect hardware iterations aplenty (especially from Nintendo handhelds) while the average "blue ocean" gamer who was attracted to the Wii wouldn't expect that... why risk confusing the consumer? I see the obvious value of keeping the Wii brand alive, but doing so while sending a clear message that this is a totally new piece of hardware will be difficult.

 

[legend166]

Haha oops, didn't realise that was a dodgy link. Anyway, my point still stands.

That latest link you posts with the $2 billion number seems to include all music, movie, book and app sales, so this isn't exactly a like for like comparison.

 

[Medalion]

Is it almost time for the reckoning?

 

[NihonTiger90]

You don't notice how everyone wants Apple to "win" in everything? They blatantly ignore facts to put a negative spin on a story to make it seem like everyone's doomed if they don't pump out games on ios.

Fixed that for you. But in all seriousness, chasing iOS and Android at the sacrifice of throwing your core business aside is a terrible, terrible idea. Not saying you can't successfully develop for both ... but iPhone/iPad/smartphone gaming is not where it needs to be to be viable for all but a handful of folks. And even casual heavy companies like Zynga are starting to run into issues.

 

[Exterminieren]

One thing is for sure if shareholders are angry enough and do get Iwata fired GAF will have one of its biggest meltdowns ever. Regardless if the implication has anythig to do with iOS or not.

This is not going to happen. If Yamauchi wants Iwata fired, he gets fired; not before.

 

[bigtroyjon]

Earnings are out and way better than expected due to the Yen moving in their favor over the last few months.

 

[GDGF]

Earnings are out and way better than expected due to the Yen moving in their favor over the last few months.

Great to hear!

Oh wait that means no need for WiiU megatons. Bad to hear!

 

[Medalion]

Earnings are out and way better than expected due to the Yen moving in their favor over the last few months.

Link? Not the Zelda guy

 

[Mpl90]

http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/sales/hard_soft/index.html

Oh, they changed things a bit!

http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/sales/software/3ds.html

 

[BorkBork]

In the challenging and competitive video game industry, which consistently requires new and innovative products, Nintendo will continue striving to expand its offerings of compelling products and services by capitalizing on being a platform holder with powerful in-house software development teams.

You here this, analysts? Get it through your thick skulls.

 

[BGBW]

In fact, I'd argue the 3DS is downright ugly, with its clamshell design very reminiscent of the bizarro "feature phones" which litter the Japanese market.

No no no no no no no. THe SP was a God send when it came out. Clamshells are God tier when it comes to handheld design. Also a 3DS without a hinge? HA HA HA. YOu want to carry a massive square in your pocket?

First line of the article and it's already stupid.

*Sigh*

It's funny because I've always had my systems out of my bedroom. My mother never let me have a television in my room. Just another case of an analyst thinking the world revolves around him.


In conclusion: Analysts, stop being so tsundere for Nintendo. 1. Shut up. 2. Buy a 3DS for Mario. 3. Enjoy it. "It's not like I want to play your games Nintendo or anything... baka". Jesus Christ on a stick how obvious can you get?

 

[Jokeropia]

Why is Nintendos total revenue being compared to app store revenue? App Store is just software revenue. The vast majority of Nintendo's revenue comes from hardware.

Oh and what the hell? That 2011 total link for the App Store is from July. No wonder it was so off. Know how much the app store made in just the last quarter alone (Jan through March 2011)? 2 billion.
http://www.appolicious.com/finance/...asses-600k-apps-1-9-billion-in-revenue-for-q2

The App store is now averaging about 8 billion a year in revenue currently. Posting out of date data to mask your point. What a surprise.

So the App stores revenue nearly matches Nintendos ENTIRE revenue on a per year basis, and Nintendos revenue is dominated by hardware! Comparing the app store revenue to nintendo revenue is a losing argument for Nintendo. If you know you use facts and actual up to date data.

How ironic. Did you actually read the article you linked to?

Apple also revealed that iTunes itself dragged in some $1.9 billion in revenue in just the second quarter of 2012. The store sells apps for iOS, as well as music, movies, podcasts and e-books, all of which contributed to the giant take.

Here's the kicker:

Apple also said developers have made more than $4 billion from the App Store since it was launched in 2008.

So that's all App Store developers combined lifetime revenue. 1/3 of what Nintendo did in a bad year.

 

[RedSwirl]

How ironic. Did you actually read the article you linked to?

Here's the kicker:

So that's all App Store developers combined lifetime revenue. 1/3 of what Nintendo did in a bad year.

Is that $4billion profit or revenue?

 

[jman2050]

Is that $4billion profit or revenue?

Revenue.

Why would Apple have profit information on thousands of unrelated companies.

 

[Medalion]

Sorry to bump this thread, but did the Investor Meeting already happen?

 

[Cipherr]

Sorry to bump this thread, but did the Investor Meeting already happen?

The Q&A? I dont think that is until tomorrow.

 

[AceBandage]

Sorry to bump this thread, but did the Investor Meeting already happen?

No that's later today/tonight/tomorrow in Japan. They'be only released their fiscal results so far.

 

[rezuth]

Revenue.

Why would Apple have profit information on thousands of unrelated companies.

Apple said it has paid developers an excess of $4 billion and that was back in January.

 

[jman2050]

Apple said it has paid developers an excess of $4 billion and that was back in January.

Yes, and?

EDIT - I guess you're saying that revenue is probably closer to 6 mil because of Apple's cut?

 

[Throwaway123456789]

Apple said it has paid developers an excess of $4 billion and that was back in January.

We don't know anything about the amount the developers paid to develop the apps. The revenue for the devs are $4 billion.