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Rottenwatch: THE DARK KNIGHT

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It was literally full. On a Sunday night at a 10PM showing, it had so many goddamn people. Otherwise, I would have rubbed a few out.
 
reilo said:
It was literally full. On a Sunday night at a 10PM showing, it had so many goddamn people. Otherwise, I would have rubbed a few out.
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:lol shows are already starting to sell out here for shows during the week, was going to see it tommorow but imax is sold out... this is madness....
 
Totakeke said:
Beyond simplistic? Reactionary? Huh?
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[the subject matter being crime]
Treating criminals as sociopath masterminds who commit crime for kicks or revenge.
Totakeke said:
Elaborate?
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For example, the whole
who do I save
part was silly, if you want to present a
greater good vs personal interest
dilemma you can do without resorting to ridiculously elaborate and unlikely madmen schemes.

Totakeke said:
Why bother? Why bother with what? Writing a script and putting an established character from the batman universe in? The director did help to write the screenplay with his brother.
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Why bother trying to take a silly character, established as it may be, and try very hard to write it into a realistic 3d character.
But seriously, that's a very minor point, I have problem with the Aaron Eckhart character, the "why bother" is just random musing.

Scullibundo said:
:lol :lol :lol

I can't believe you people are taking his criticisms seriously, it honestly reminds me of the latest xkcd:

http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/impostor.png

If you can't write clearly, you're not a good writer. If you're not a good writer then you shouldn't hold yourself as an authority on criticising the writings of others.
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Is this directed at me?
I never claimed to be an authority on anything, I'm just stating my opinion on a movie I just saw.
You on the other hand responds with emoticons and webcomics, way to elevate the conversation.
 
i saw this movie for the first time tonight and absolutely loved it. i didnt enjoy the first one though, i thought the last half was awesome but the first half bored me to tears. this easily surpassed the batman begins and any other superhero movie ive ever seen. heath ledger did an amazing job.
 
just got back from seeing it. action was leagues better than the first, but there are a few things that i didn't like about the movie which made it evening out to being about as good as the first in my mind.

but it is a pretty fantastic movie.

anyone speculate on who's going to be the villain for the 3rd movie?
 
Chichikov said:
[the subject matter being crime]
For example, the whole
who do I save
part was silly, if you want to present a
greater good vs personal interest
dilemma you can do without resorting to ridiculously elaborate and unlikely madmen schemes.
Click to expand...


You could... but it wouldn't nearly be quite as fun. Which is the point.
 
Chichikov,

so yeah you're basically criticizing nolan for blending a superhero's universe into reality.... not even the quality of it, but just the premise itself. whatever. such an opinion is marginal to the point of being non-existent. not to suggest that popularity rules, but it does demonstrate in my mind how unimportant such a perspective is; how you manifested such criticisms in your mind in order to subvert a fantastic film and challenge its very essence. but for what? did these supposed problems actually appear to you on their own, or did you look for them? be honest. your complaints are, in my mind, utterly ridiculous.
 
Socreges said:
Chichikov,

so yeah you're basically criticizing nolan for blending a superhero's universe into reality.... not even the quality of it, but just the premise itself. whatever. such an opinion is marginal to the point of being non-existent. not to suggest that popularity rules, but it does demonstrate in my mind how unimportant such a perspective is; how you manifested such criticisms in your mind in order to subvert a fantastic film and challenge its very essence. but for what? did these supposed problems actually appear to you on their own, or did you look for them? be honest. your complaints are, in my mind, utterly ridiculous.
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Yes, I am questioning the wisdom of such attempt, and exactly because it's the most successful attempt ever made in my mind (and really, I don't hate this film, read what I wrote again).
When contrasted against a successfully realized almost realistic world, the comic silliness stick out much more than in lesser movies, and yeah, transcending your genre means you open yourself to getting judged by harsher standards.
Socreges said:
how you manifested such criticisms in your mind in order to subvert a fantastic film and challenge its very essence. but for what? did these supposed problems actually appear to you on their own, or did you look for them? be honest.
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I went to see a movie, I came back and wrote some impressions, I don't even think they were very negative.
I promise you, I have not hidden agenda here.
 
A film's main goal is to entertain audiences. Just as the Joker's main goal was really to have fun. To criticize TDK for conveying a ridiculous story realistically and to then question the realism of its main villain, is almost as absurd as imagining the Joker giving a detailed lecture at Harvard Law.
 
Chichikov said:
When contrasted against a successfully realized almost realistic world, the comic silliness stick out much more than in lesser movies, and yeah, transcending your genre means you open yourself to getting judged by harsher standards.
Click to expand...

So what you are saying is that the film suffers because the source material is silly? I think its the other way around. The comic aspect of the film is what grabs the audiences attention, and its not until the film has finally reached its peak does the audience realize the deeper more realistic tones to the story.

Just like comic books, the visuals is what grabs you, but its the layered themes and messages that keep the reader hooked.

The only way your argument holds up is if you went into this film under the impression it wasn't a comic book movie.
 
Chichikov said:
Yes, I am questioning the wisdom of such attempt, and exactly because it's the most successful attempt ever made in my mind (and really, I don't hate this film, read what I wrote again).
When contrasted against a successfully realized almost realistic world, the comic silliness stick out much more than in lesser movies, and yeah, transcending your genre means you open yourself to getting judged by harsher standards.

I went to see a movie, I came back and wrote some impressions, I don't even think they were very negative.
I promise you, I have not hidden agenda here.
Click to expand...
I actually kind of agree with you but my conclusion is bit different from yours. Yes, with such a realistic world, they seem out of place...but thats the point of this movie. The director is trying to show you that the Joker and the Batman aren't very different...they are both crazy and they both inhabit a world that would turn to/against them if it suited them.

What I found personally odd was how Batman seemed more out of place in that world than the Joker did...or maybe I just wished we saw more of Ledger.
 
When contrasted against a successfully realized almost realistic world, the comic silliness stick out much more than in lesser movies
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That´s a very good point, but in contrast, I think that was precisely one of the movie´s strenghts. The original material (the comic) is, in essence, a history about "freaks", as joker self defined himself. And that is one of the main reasons why it is so attracting: you are reading stories about extremely disturbing, twisted individuals.

And Noland had the genious idea of putting them into an extremely realistic scenario, thus making the contrast way more shocking and meaningful. The scene where the Joker interacts with the regular "real life villains" (the mob bosses) is all kinds of awesome, precisely because of that.
 
msdstc said:
Same here man! I make short films of my own. It started small with my first (terrible) short film, which was just really us messing around with angles/continuity. I would see a small problem here and there. As time went on I started noticing EVERYTHING, whether it was if an object moved, reaction shots, consistency, etc. It actually hurts the viewing of those B movies you were talking about.
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Well, I'll take you to task about the final fall issues you had, then. You actually see Batman fall, and it's quite a bit after Harvey has already fallen.
 
The music really lacked that punch, that one memorable tune that made the original Batman movie so great. It was just noise to me, I kind of wished it would stop during some of the scenes.

If you say otherwise, you're lying. It was the same in Batman Begins. It was standard fare all the way through, just made that much more noticeable compared to Elfman's work. I think Metal Gear Solid 4 had more dramatic music than this.
 
Pojo said:
The music really lacked that punch, that one memorable tune that made the original Batman movie so great. It was just noise to me, I kind of wished it would stop during some of the scenes.

If you say otherwise, you're lying. It was the same in Batman Begins. It was standard fare all the way through, just made that much more noticeable compared to Elfman's work. I think Metal Gear Solid 4 had more dramatic music than this.
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wat

give the soundtrack another listen, seriously
 
TheHeretic said:
I think if that line stuck out to you, you have serious mental problems.
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Dude, you had to compare her to a toothless 7-11 clerk to make her sound attractive.

I think if that line stuck out to you, you have serious mental problems.
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Everyone in our row chuckled at that line. Perhaps we were sitting in the Mental Problems seats.

She's a sad-faced lady with strange facial features and the blank, listless mien of Dear Card Crusher. Her face looks, in short, like a poorly-chewed toffee. But it's OK, I checked on the internet and people are into all sorts of shit that's way weirder than Maggie Gyllenhal.
 
Pojo said:
The music really lacked that punch, that one memorable tune that made the original Batman movie so great. It was just noise to me, I kind of wished it would stop during some of the scenes.

If you say otherwise, you're lying. It was the same in Batman Begins. It was standard fare all the way through, just made that much more noticeable compared to Elfman's work. I think Metal Gear Solid 4 had more dramatic music than this.
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Music was fucking amazing. So good I bought the damn OST!
 
Today will be my first non-TDK day after seeing it all 3 days over the weekend. I wonder if I will suffer withdrawel? :lol
 
Chichikov said:
Both archetypes has nothing to do with reality.
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Archetypes are REFLECTIONS of reality. Shit what you're doing is like complaining that the Birth of Venus isn't a photograph.
 
Solo said:
Today will be my first non-TDK day after seeing it all 3 days over the weekend. I wonder if I will suffer withdrawel? :lol
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This is why TDK will surpass 400 mil (or get damn close), unlike Spidey 3 which had roughly the same opening weekend. Repeat viewings. No one went to Spidey 3 multiple times, TDK seems to be the first big blockbuster in quite a while for it to be worthy of that, and nearly everyone in this thread has seen or plans so to see it a second or even a third time. All the more impressive because Batman really doesn't have a rabid fanbase like Star Wars or Star Trek who will be doing multiple viewings by default.
 
It really didn't demonstrate shit, humanity passed Joker's challenge because Batman yelled really loudly or something
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No humanity passed Joker's challenge because they didn't "eat each other' like he expected them to. The Joker's philosophy isn't as universal as he thinks; it fails here, and it fails when he tries to get Batman to break his rules.
 
dankir said:
Music was fucking amazing. So good I bought the damn OST!
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Indeed, it's FUCKING GREAT, and we finally got the "full theme" Hans Zimmer has been hinting at since Begins, it's in "Like a Dog Chasing Cars"...so awesome.

It's the best soundtrack I've listened to in years.
 
Karma Kramer said:
So what you are saying is that the film suffers because the source material is silly? I think its the other way around. The comic aspect of the film is what grabs the audiences attention, and its not until the film has finally reached its peak does the audience realize the deeper more realistic tones to the story.

Just like comic books, the visuals is what grabs you, but its the layered themes and messages that keep the reader hooked.

The only way your argument holds up is if you went into this film under the impression it wasn't a comic book movie.
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Well, I think it suffer from trying to make its silly source material serious.
As stated, I think it could have been a great action movie, but its ambitions hold it down in the end.
Unlike you, I don't think the deeper pondering parts amounted to anything meaningful.

I made this flowchart a while back for future superheroes directors (I think it was for the last Superman) -
10s7scl.png


Of course, it could be that I just completely missed the point of the movie, what do you consider to be the movie message or underlying meaning?

3rdman said:
I actually kind of agree with you but my conclusion is bit different from yours. Yes, with such a realistic world, they seem out of place...but thats the point of this movie. The director is trying to show you that the Joker and the Batman aren't very different...they are both crazy and they both inhabit a world that would turn to/against them if it suited them.

What I found personally odd was how Batman seemed more out of place in that world than the Joker did...or maybe I just wished we saw more of Ledger.
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I'm not sure I follow, you're saying the point of the movie is to show that superheroes character do not fit in the real world?
And as for the Batman and the Joker being one and the same, well, it is said in the movie, but it's not really demonstrated. In what way are they the same? they're not even polar opposites.

I would agree with you that The Joker was very well executed character, Ledger will get most of the credit, but I think a lot of it also had to go to the writers. Pulling a flamboyant, entertaining and yet genuinely menacing villain is tough tight-rope act, and pulling it on a character with the history and the inherent ridiculousness of The Joker is small cinematic miracle.

Azih said:
Archetypes are REFLECTIONS of reality. Shit what you're doing is like complaining that the Birth of Venus isn't a photograph.
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How so?
Take the most basic element of movie character, motivation; none of the main characters demonstrate motives that resembles anything that exists in the realm of reality.
 
Cheebs said:
This is why TDK will surpass 400 mil (or get damn close), unlike Spidey 3 which had roughly the same opening weekend. Repeat viewings. No one went to Spidey 3 multiple times, TDK seems to be the first big blockbuster in quite a while for it to be worthy of that, and nearly everyone in this thread has seen or plans so to see it a second or even a third time. All the more impressive because Batman really doesn't have a rabid fanbase like Star Wars or Star Trek who will be doing multiple viewings by default.
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No doubt. Im taking a break for a week or so now, but Im sure Ill see it at least once more.
 
Pojo said:
The music really lacked that punch, that one memorable tune that made the original Batman movie so great. It was just noise to me, I kind of wished it would stop during some of the scenes.

If you say otherwise, you're lying. It was the same in Batman Begins. It was standard fare all the way through, just made that much more noticeable compared to Elfman's work. I think Metal Gear Solid 4 had more dramatic music than this.
Click to expand...

I'd disagree, especially when talking about the Joker's theme. The way I've been relating it to people is it's similar to Jaws. Just when you can take a breath finally, the music cue of that electric string buzz starts up and you know "here we go again" and get all tensed up.
 
Anyone else had nightmares after watching this? I saw this yesterday on IMAX and I thought it was an amazing experience. I woke up 3 times this morning each from terrible nightmares, where I was scared for my life from the first one, and scared for the life of my famiy in the second and third. I'm sure it's no coincidence that this happened right after watching Dark Knight. :D
 
Solo said:
Today will be my first non-TDK day after seeing it all 3 days over the weekend. I wonder if I will suffer withdrawel? :lol
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same here, I was gonna go again tonight but imax is sold out, ill probly go this weekend when I see step brothers
 
Akira said:
Anyone else had nightmares after watching this? I saw this yesterday on IMAX and I thought it was an amazing experience. I woke up 3 times this morning each from terrible nightmares, where I was scared for my life from the first one, and scared for the life of my famiy in the second and third. I'm sure it's no coincidence that this happened right after watching Dark Knight. :D
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Oh moses smell the roses. :rollseyes:
 
God, the IMAX sequences were so incredible. I really wish the entire movie was shot that way. I know it's unrealistic, but after seeing that resolution it's hard to settle for 35mm.
 
I've watched it, and I must say that it's a very good movie. However, I was expecting more from Ledger's depiction of the Joker. To be more specific, I had hoped he would incorporate all the strengths from Nicholson's portrayal while adding the dark, malevolent qualities that made up the remaining portion of the classical character. This new Joker was without the punchlines, the dark wit that I assumed was the Joker staple. There were funny moments, but they were most unintentional, not purposefully delivered. In the end, I think the two Jokers complement each other well, but I can't say Ledger's version is the ultimate, all-in-one Joker that I was expecting to see.

Superb movie, nonetheless.
 
NintendosBooger said:
I've watched it, and I must say that it's a very good movie. However, I was expecting more from Ledger's depiction of the Joker. To be more specific, I had hoped he would incorporate all the strengths from Nicholson's portrayal while adding the dark, malevolent qualities that made up the remaining portion of the classical character. This new Joker was without the punchlines, the dark wit that I assumed was the Joker staple. There were funny moments, but they were most unintentional, not purposefully delivered. In the end, I think the two Jokers complement each other well, but I can't say Ledger's version is the ultimate, all-in-one Joker that I was expecting to see.
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Looks like the joke was on you!
 
NintendosBooger said:
I've watched it, and I must say that it's a very good movie. However, I was expecting more from Ledger's depiction of the Joker. To be more specific, I had hoped he would incorporate all the strengths from Nicholson's portrayal while adding the dark, malevolent qualities that made up the remaining portion of the classical character. This new Joker was without the punchlines, the dark wit that I assumed was the Joker staple. There were funny moments, but they were most unintentional, not purposefully delivered. In the end, I think the two Jokers complement each other well, but I can't say Ledger's version is the ultimate, all-in-one Joker that I was expecting to see.

Superb movie, nonetheless.
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Nurse Joker, nuff said.
 
NintendosBooger said:
I've watched it, and I must say that it's a very good movie. However, I was expecting more from Ledger's depiction of the Joker. To be more specific, I had hoped he would incorporate all the strengths from Nicholson's portrayal while adding the dark, malevolent qualities that made up the remaining portion of the classical character. This new Joker was without the punchlines, the dark wit that I assumed was the Joker staple. There were funny moments, but they were most unintentional, not purposefully delivered. In the end, I think the two Jokers complement each other well, but I can't say Ledger's version is the ultimate, all-in-one Joker that I was expecting to see.

Superb movie, nonetheless.
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Ledger's Joker shits all over Nicholson's.
 
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