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[TGO]

I think it's in IO own interest to not be owned by any of the hardware makers, if MS was to buy IO the next Hitman may be the last.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

I've always been a little bit of a Sony Fanboy, never owned an Xbox, was very biased. I was able to get a One X cheap and wanted Game Pass and to play a couple exclusives, the X has sold me with it's superior performance for 4K gaming and features such as Game Pass which I think is amazing. I stopped buying and playing Multiplat titles on my Pro now. My view of Xbox has now changed. In the past it didn't matter what Xbox had, I would just buy the next PlayStation but now I wouldn't hesitate to invest in the next gen Xbox if it's worth it. I'm interested to see how Microsoft is going to shape up next gen, buying up these studios could be what they need in order to bring a range of new exclusives to their console. I hate the god awful OS on the Xbox though, change that shit! It was crap before and it's crap now!

I've flip flopped console brands over the decades, but lately I've bought Xbox. But for next gen, if PS is better than Xbox Scarlett and similarly priced, I might get back into PS.

Just get the system you feel is priced right and has the games you want to play and sit back and laugh at the fanboys bickering over $300-400 systems...... all while always ignoring that godly PC gamer who chimes in with his ultra settings at 120 fps and has graphics and settings leagues beyond any mortal console. lol

Most games are multiplat anyway, so it really comes down to the handful of exclusives, your friends list, which controller do you like etc..... Other things like PSVR or Xbox's 4k disc drives are other things too if they are that important to you.

For my gaming tastes, almost all of my fav games are third party. The only first party or exclusive games I might be interested in is Forza games for Xbox and gritty games like Bloodborne on PS. And maybe get back into The Show like I had in 06 or 07. All the other stuff like Halo, Gears, Gran Turismo, Uncharted I don't care for.

 

[Deuterion]

The problem I have with Microsoft just buying up developers is that they can easily make the same mistakes that caused them to run Lionhead, FASA, Bizarre, and Bungie into the ground or out of the building. I’d rather they develop teams in house and learn how to manage the creation and release of successful IP. I feel like buying studios is putting a bandaid on the issue when the real problem is that a lot of Microsoft divisions are ran by complete idiots.

 

[YayNJ]

Why is it that when Sony buy devs its a genius move, great for gaming etc.. And nobody bat's an eye lid when they destroy and pull the plug on entire teams, But when Microsoft does its 'gaming heading to a dark place'?

I don't like console wars, they are pathetic - but the salt from the Sony side of the room has been very much real and petty recently.

 

[pr0cs]

A self-inflicted screwing is still a screwing

Uh wow

So you blame the company for their customers buying their products.. Wait... What?

 

[12Dannu123]

The problem I have with Microsoft just buying up developers is that they can easily make the same mistakes that caused them to run Lionhead, FASA, Bizarre, and Bungie into the ground or out of the building. I’d rather they develop teams in house and learn how to manage the creation and release of successful IP. I feel like buying studios is putting a bandaid on the issue when the real problem is that a lot of Microsoft divisions are ran by complete idiots.

Do you have proof of this? If you're talking about past management then your point is absolutely not relevant to current times.

 

[Justin9mm]

I've flip flopped console brands over the decades, but lately I've bought Xbox. But for next gen, if PS is better than Xbox Scarlett and similarly priced, I might get back into PS.

Just get the system you feel is priced right and has the games you want to play and sit back and laugh at the fanboys bickering over $300-400 systems...... all while always ignoring that godly PC gamer who chimes in with his ultra settings at 120 fps and has graphics and settings leagues beyond any mortal console. lol

Most games are multiplat anyway, so it really comes down to the handful of exclusives, your friends list, which controller do you like etc..... Other things like PSVR or Xbox's 4k disc drives are other things too if they are that important to you.

For my gaming tastes, almost all of my fav games are third party. The only first party or exclusive games I might be interested in is Forza games for Xbox and gritty games like Bloodborne on PS. And maybe get back into The Show like I had in 06 or 07. All the other stuff like Halo, Gears, Gran Turismo, Uncharted I don't care for.

This gen I've ended up with a Pro and an X. I can see myself buying both anyway so I can play both exclusives. I know Sony will continue with some good exclusives and this is a focus for MS so there are going to be some I want to play next gen I'm sure! I'll just probably buy both haha

 

[joe_zazen]

I think it's in IO own interest to not be owned by any of the hardware makers, if MS was to buy IO the next Hitman may be the last.

Money always comes with strings. And it seems most big american companies would rather kill a studio if it under performs then release it like Square did with io.

So yeah, getting bought by nice guy phil probably isnt their number one choice.

 

[Shpeshal Nick]

Buying financially troubled development houses to aid your own struggling console business is probably not the best plan ever presented in a boardroom. I'm just fascinated that Microsoft keeps doing it.

EDIT: Having owned their products now in this space for a decade and a half, my observation has been that Microsoft is very into checking boxes, even when it doesn't benefit them. They did it with Kinect when the Wii craze was dying out. "See guys! We've got waggle too!" They did it with the X this generation after Sony brought out the Pro. "See guys! We have the most powerful system!" And now they seem to be doing it in response to their lack of studios. "See guys! We own all these development houses!"

It's all very formulaic to them, as if they can just tick off boxes and magically reverse what Mattrick did to them. It's going to be a long uphill slog, and it's going to require brilliant moves rather than just a fat wallet. Ask George Steinbrenner.

Firstly, Microsoft had publicly floated the idea of a mid-gen upgraded console before the Pro was even rumoured to exist. The Pro camer out earlier because it was a PS4 with a second GPU strapped onto it. Mucriosoft went with an actual upgrade.

Second, what the hell do you want them to do?

People complain about their lack of first party output, so they're bolstering their first party studios.

You realise it's not a coincidence that all thsi spending is coming not very long after Phil was promoted right under Nadella right? It's no real secret Myerson didn't take Gaming seriously and basically had a tight leash on Xbox spending.

Microsoft has spent more on gamign in the last year and a half than they had the entire first half or more of this generation.

 

[dirthead]

I'm so sick of walled garden platform companies like Microsoft, Nintendo, Sony, Apple, Valve, and Google. The only reason computers were ever cool was because they used to be somewhat open and indies like id Software could actually make cool stuff that wasn't soul-less corporate bullshit.

Microsoft slowly chipped away at that until we arrived where we're at now: no one makes real PC games anymore and anything with a budget is soul-less corporate bullshit.

The problem with all walled garden platform companies is that there's an inherent conflict of interest. They're so greedy they can't just be content with owning a platform. Nope. They have to compete with their own customers for software sales, too. People shouldn't accept conflict of interest scenarios like that. Microsoft should have NEVER got into game development. All they did was buyout and ruin most PC studios and eat away at the awesome early 90s shareware indies until there was nothing left.

People always tell me "well just go play [insert shitty indie game with programmer art] then!" No dude. I want HIGH QUALITY indie games. In 1993, Doom was a state of the art AAA game released completely outside of the locked down, corporate, and crappy Nintendo video game business model. There is no 2018 equivalent of it. Your choices are to play low budget independent trash or play a boring AAA game that feels like it was made by a robot and every decision passed through the offensive filters of suits maximizing profits with microtransactions and overly political nutjobs trying to sap all the fun out of everything because it's not politically correct enough.

Honestly, fuck contemporary gaming. It sucks. If it wasn't for emulation, I wouldn't even play games anymore.

 

[Strife In a Teacup]

Awesome for IO and Microsoft. I always preferred Thief, but Looking Glass is long gone, so I'd be more than happy for MS to do this.

 

[kungfuian]

Having all these studios under one umbrella is nice until a corporate direction change puts them all under the gun in one fell-swoop. Not saying that's going to happen, but lets be honest consistency has never been MS' strong suit when running the gaming side of their business.

It also sets a precedent where everyone else is encouraged to buy up studios of their own in order to protect their business, widening the potential for trouble.

I 100% agree that a priority shift in Microsoft could leave these studios out in the cold, and overall I see the trend of consolidating the industry in this way as a negative.

The big question in the room, and something none of us can really answer, has to be what Microsoft actually does with these studios both short and long term and how they go about doing it.

I know they say they are offering support and creative freedom yada yada, and from the outside it looks like they are bailing out studios that might otherwise be in trouble, but it's too early to tell. Do these studios get real freedom or does Microsoft 'provide' oversight on projects and in what form? Do they get crazy deadlines and low budgets? Will Microsoft impose Gamepass and sales performance/use goals or will studios and their games be treated as contributing to the greater good of the platform regardless of individual performance? Will gamepass metrics determine if these studios stay open?

I would say Microsoft's track record isn't so good but you never know. They have the potential to create a vibrant community of creators and content under their umbrella. Hopefully they take this opportunity to create something similar to the PlayStation ecosystem of 1st party content creation vs. say a company like E.A. (we all know their track record).

 

[FF:Enhanced_Reality]

So??? This happens to every industry, the gaming industry isn't any different. Consolidation of the gaming industry was always going to happen in the future, it's a matter of when not if. Lets be honest here, Microsoft has become the gaming industries safety net. We will likely see studios who are struggling sell themselves to MS.

I don't think that's necessarily true though. They aren't snapping up every struggling developer and honestly we've lost a lot who could have continued making great games over years but none of the console manufacturers saved them. Microsoft are just on an aggressive expansion at the moment and I think it may force the competition to do something drastic.

 

[Doug Heffernan]

I hope it happens. They would be an excellent team to add to the Microsoft portfolio. They are perfect for Game Pass... they proved with Hitman 1 that they can excel at episodic games.

It's puzzling why they chose not to go episodic with Hitman 2... and maybe that's a big reason why the game is not doing good sales-wise and they are in this position potentially looking for a buyer.

 

[The Alien]

Microsoft clearly needs games. To get their own games they need more studios. They are now acquiring a lot of more studios (some really good ones too - playground, obsidian, ninja theory)(and building initiative whose talent roster so far is impressive).

Yet somehow in this thread this is being spun as a bad thing. (smfh)

The goalposts just never seem to stop moving for Microsoft.

 

[SlashBringingHasher]

i had hoped sony does get that since they need a studio like that. better than them closing. good luck and good news.

 

[Virex]

 

[Louis Cyphre]

I think it's in IO own interest to not be owned by any of the hardware makers, if MS was to buy IO the next Hitman may be the last.

If they never got bought this latest Hitman may be their last. Deals like this take two sides, so if they want to be bought then maybe it's good for both sides. Stop acting like you know what's best for them.

 

[TGO]

If they never got bought this latest Hitman may be their last. Deals like this take two sides, so if they want to be bought then maybe it's good for both sides. Stop acting like you know what's best for them.

Lol, "Stop acting like you know what's best for them"
You're a funny one, no one is "acting" like they know what's best.
It can go both ways, but I'd be wary.
It's just an opinion, they can date whoever they like

 

[Panajev2001a]

Firstly, Microsoft had publicly floated the idea of a mid-gen upgraded console before the Pro was even rumoured to exist. The Pro camer out earlier because it was a PS4 with a second GPU strapped onto it. Mucriosoft went with an actual upgrade.

I think you got them swapped and are mixing highest performance with the system being an upgrade or not. One system went with more of a brute force approach than architectural improvements (more than, does not mean the architecture was not improved too) and got the performance crown albeit launching later and at s higher price while the other one was meant to come out earlier and at the same price of the launch system so it relied more of architectural enhancements mixed with process enhancements.

PS4 Pro has the newest architectural features actually, it is more based on Polaris and with Vega features added to save bandwidth and improve performance in general math and VR code (like Rapid Packed Math or FP16 at double rate... 4.2 TFLOPS with FP32 and when processing FP16 data the theoretical peak doubles at 8.2 TFLOPS, but it is not like a switch you can flick).

Out of the two Xbox One X wins the performance crown (it was certainly challenging from HW and SW points of view and I quite like the triple OS structure they have developed and how it influenced the HW architecture too [fully virtualised and fast stack]), good job . From an engineering point of view nobody working on the Pro has anything to regret really: delivering that performance target (with the technology they brought to the table) without breaking the $399 barrier and doing it a year earlier than the competition is something to be proud of.

 

[Whitecrow]

Microsoft clearly needs games. To get their own games they need more studios. They are now acquiring a lot of more studios (some really good ones too - playground, obsidian, ninja theory)(and building initiative whose talent roster so far is impressive).

Yet somehow in this thread this is being spun as a bad thing. (smfh)

The goalposts just never seem to stop moving for Microsoft.

They are playing the dirty game.

What Sony did is first, letting a studio release a game for them, and if its quality and sales were great, then Sony acquires it, with an obvious benefit for both parties.

MS is in a trainwreck of buying studios just for cutting out third party games for Sony.
They dont even care about the quality of their titles, or how they did in sales.
The more studios they have, the less Sony have.

MS went full desperate in order to 'win' next gen.

It may be as legit as you want, but for me it's clearly crossing the line of sane competition, and for that, MS already lost even before starting the new gen.

Not trying to convince anyone of this, tho. It's just my stance on the matter.

 

[12Dannu123]

Why is it that when Sony buy devs its a genius move, great for gaming etc.. And nobody bat's an eye lid when they destroy and pull the plug on entire teams, But when Microsoft does its 'gaming heading to a dark place'?

I don't like console wars, they are pathetic - but the salt from the Sony side of the room has been very much real and petty recently.

It's likely because Sony fans are much more sensitive to things

They are playing the dirty game.

What Sony did is first, letting a studio release a game for them, and if its quality and sales were great, then Sony acquires it, with an obvious benefit for both parties.

MS is in a trainwreck of buying studios just for cutting out third party games for Sony.
They dont even care about the quality of their titles, or how they did in sales.
The more studios they have, the less Sony have.

MS went full desperate in order to 'win' next gen.

It may be as legit as you want, but for me it's clearly crossing the line of sane competition, and for that, MS already lost even before starting the new gen.

Not trying to convince anyone of this, tho. It's just my stance on the matter.

Lol.... Then you realise that Sony has closed more studios than Microsoft. Lets be honest here, Microsoft gives no shit about what we think, the thing they think about is finding a way to becoming the 'Netflix of Gaming'. If it involves buying lots of Studios and Publishers, then they will do it, consolidating the gaming industry that MS comes out on top is a bonus for them.. But right now Microsoft is buying all the studios they can at a cheap price.

 

[ArnoldSewerby]

Problem is none of the studios they have bought would make me get an xbox, they took a load of studios that made 'meh' games or company's that made exclusives anyway.

In this case all it would do is ensure I probably never got another hitman game, and I've had them all on ps so far.

 

[Virex]

They have all ready given IO an acquisition letter of intent

 

[TGO]

What are the sales ratio with Hitman.
I know people like to think if it's exclusive to one machine all sales go to that machine but it never actually works out that way.
Just curious.

 

[Whitecrow]

It's likely because Sony fans are much more sensitive to things


Lol.... Then you realise that Sony has closed more studios than Microsoft. Lets be honest here, Microsoft gives no shit about what we think, the thing they think about is finding a way to becoming the 'Netflix of Gaming'. If it involves buying lots of Studios and Publishers, then they will do it, consolidating the gaming industry that MS comes out on top is a bonus for them.. But right now Microsoft is buying all the studios they can at a cheap price.

Obviously, when a studio stops being profitable, their relationship ends.
I feel it for Studio Liverpool, and Evolution Studios...

But they are still logic business decisions, concerning only Sony and the studio.

I dont think that has nothing to do with what we are talking about : /

 

[GTR R35_Supra RZ]

Why is it that when Sony buy devs its a genius move, great for gaming etc.. And nobody bat's an eye lid when they destroy and pull the plug on entire teams, But when Microsoft does its 'gaming heading to a dark place'?

I don't like console wars, they are pathetic - but the salt from the Sony side of the room has been very much real and petty recently.

Right on target, well said..SonyGaf in the nutshell. Plus, they know the hurricane called Scarlet coming with all the studios in the pocket.

 

[Madonis]

Consolidation may be inevitable, but that doesn't mean it will be for the best or that we have to like it.

 

[TLZ]

That's good news I hope.

 

[TeamGhobad]

just buy sony and be done with it

 

[TBiddy]

" They did it with the X this generation after Sony brought out the Pro. "See guys! We have the most powerful system!"

Do you really think they made the X in response to the Pro? How long do you think it takes to develop a console? 6 months?

 

[phil_t98]

I think you got them swapped and are mixing highest performance with the system being an upgrade or not. One system went with more of a brute force approach than architectural improvements (more than, does not mean the architecture was not improved too) and got the performance crown albeit launching later and at s higher price while the other one was meant to come out earlier and at the same price of the launch system so it relied more of architectural enhancements mixed with process enhancements.

PS4 Pro has the newest architectural features actually, it is more based on Polaris and with Vega features added to save bandwidth and improve performance in general math and VR code (like Rapid Packed Math or FP16 at double rate... 4.2 TFLOPS with FP32 and when processing FP16 data the theoretical peak doubles at 8.2 TFLOPS, but it is not like a switch you can flick).

Out of the two Xbox One X wins the performance crown (it was certainly challenging from HW and SW points of view and I quite like the triple OS structure they have developed and how it influenced the HW architecture too [fully virtualised and fast stack]), good job . From an engineering point of view nobody working on the Pro has anything to regret really: delivering that performance target (with the technology they brought to the table) without breaking the $399 barrier and doing it a year earlier than the competition is something to be proud of.

doesnt matter what Sony did they did it half assed with the pro and it wasn't as powerful as they promised,
as for the X its a stop gap till next gen and still the most powerful console and best place to play multiples.

 

[Roni]

IOI is doing something really original with Hitman. If MS acquires them, I hope they either let them continue producing Hitman or let them explore a new IP which incorporates Hitman's gameplay loop.

 

[Dontero]

Hitman 2016 almost killed the company and Hitman 2 isn't goin well and it's already discounted.

Hitman 2016 didn't almost kill company. Square Enix did. They are the one who insisted on episodic structure. Hitman series while never reached amazing sales up until 2016 one didn't have issues selling enough copies to warrant sequels. By the time IO got it back damage was already done and a lot of people still assume Hitman2 is still episodic.

Lack of money for PR also didn't help a lot Hitman2.

Buying financially troubled development houses to aid your own struggling console business is probably not the best plan ever presented in a boardroom.

You are talking about developer which can output meta 90 games. This is what MS needs. High quality developer which can make awesome games. With MS PR budget and reach + usually fandom shenenigans they will be able to deliver high quality games to sell those GamePasses.

And this is a thing everyone misses. Gamepass is what MS have in mind. They want Netflix of gaming and they seems to be at top of the pack to create it right now.

 

[ghairat]

The only smart and good studio acquisition that Microsoft has done is Ninja theory. The other studios are shite

 

[Alexander DeLarge]

Why is it that when Sony buy devs its a genius move, great for gaming etc.. And nobody bat's an eye lid when they destroy and pull the plug on entire teams, But when Microsoft does its 'gaming heading to a dark place'?

I don't like console wars, they are pathetic - but the salt from the Sony side of the room has been very much real and petty recently.

Who has Sony "bought"? Kojima Productions is still independent and every studio I can think of has been built by them from the ground up.

As far as we know, Death Stranding is still due for a PC release despite the removal of the press release stating that it would be a timed exclusive and the usage of the Decima engine.

 

[Castef]

I think it's in IO own interest to not be owned by any of the hardware makers, if MS was to buy IO the next Hitman may be the last.

Given the current sales of Hitman 2, that may occur even if they are NOT bought...

 

[Salty Popsicle]

Who has Sony "bought"? Kojima Productions is still independent and every studio I can think of has been built by them from the ground up.

As far as we know, Death Stranding is still due for a PC release despite the removal of the press release stating that it would be a timed exclusive and the usage of the Decima engine.

Guerrilla Games was purchased by Sony in December 2005.
Media Molecule was purchased by Sony in March 2010.
Sucker Punch was purchased by Sony in August 2011.
Nuaghty Dog was purchased by Sony in 2001. Originally named JAM Software.

Revisionist history would tell you that Sony created all these developers from thin air. The truth is that Sony acquired most of their current line-up of first party developers over the last two decades. It's only a bad thing to purchase developers today because MS is doing it.

 

[Skyfox]

I really like this series and I want them to succeed so whatever works for them!

 

[MilkyJoe]

Microsoft clearly needs games. To get their own games they need more studios. They are now acquiring a lot of more studios (some really good ones too - playground, obsidian, ninja theory)(and building initiative whose talent roster so far is impressive).

Yet somehow in this thread this is being spun as a bad thing. (smfh)

 

[CaptainClaw]

Problem is none of the studios they have bought would make me get an xbox, they took a load of studios that made 'meh' games or company's that made exclusives anyway.

In this case all it would do is ensure I probably never got another hitman game, and I've had them all on ps so far.

So wait a sec...it's a problem because the devs MS acquired wouldn't make you get an Xbox even though you have no idea what type of creative freedom they have...yet at the same time you bought every single Hitman game on PS?, I assume you like Hitman then right if IO were a 'meh' dev that makes 'meh' games surely you wouldn't have played every single Hitman game on PS....hmmm

 

[ArnoldSewerby]

So wait a sec...it's a problem because the devs MS acquired wouldn't make you get an Xbox even though you have no idea what type of creative freedom they have...yet at the same time you bought every single Hitman game on PS?, I assume you like Hitman then right if IO were a 'meh' dev that makes 'meh' games surely you wouldn't have played every single Hitman game on PS....hmmm

The meh studios were the ones at E3, and I love hitman games to bits, but enough to buy an xbox? A console that has more new hardware announcements then game announcements. No

 

[CeeJay]

Who has Sony "bought"? Kojima Productions is still independent and every studio I can think of has been built by them from the ground up.

As far as we know, Death Stranding is still due for a PC release despite the removal of the press release stating that it would be a timed exclusive and the usage of the Decima engine.

I think you need to acquire some knowledge about that, just like Sony did with a lot of those studios you are thinking of.

 

[Thiagosc777]

Buying financially troubled development houses to aid your own struggling console business is probably not the best plan ever presented in a boardroom. I'm just fascinated that Microsoft keeps doing it.

Buy low and sell high. Troubled studios will be cheaper.

 

[KOMANI]

They’ve had capable studios before and produced nothing or mediocre titles. But... new consoles are coming, and this should aid them to produce a great launch line up.

 

[CaptainClaw]

The meh studios were the ones at E3, and I love hitman games to bits, but enough to buy an xbox? A console that has more new hardware announcements then game announcements. No

So then it seems as that it has less to do with the studios they've acquired and more to do with the fact that you just have no interest in owning Xbox...

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

Microsoft need a Team Ninja-esque type of studio. A Japanese development unit capable of creating high quality cult classics. That is what the Xbox platform really lacks these days.

That would be great and it would widen their portfolio by adding diversity, but most Xbox owners do not purchase Japanese games though. Maybe, just maybe they can snag Itagaki or something and he could conjure up something like that?

 

[meirl]

 

[Breakage]

That would be great and it would widen their portfolio by adding diversity, but most Xbox owners do not purchase Japanese games though. Maybe, just maybe they can snag Itagaki or something and he could conjure up something like that?

Yeah, I think the next Xbox could do with a exclusive Ninja Gaiden sort of game. Something that is unmistakably Japanese and really shows of the tech prowess of the hardware. The Xbox One never really had that sort of title. It's not about creating Japanese exclusives that sell 5-6m units. It's about creating exclusive games that cultivate dedicated cult followings. For example, there are people out there who will keep a 360 around just for Ninja Gaiden 2. It all helps to make the platform attractive and the users loyal.

 

[Mattyp]

Who has Sony "bought"? Kojima Productions is still independent and every studio I can think of has been built by them from the ground up.

As far as we know, Death Stranding is still due for a PC release despite the removal of the press release stating that it would be a timed exclusive and the usage of the Decima engine.

Sony has bought nearly every 1st party studio they own, I'm really trying to think of one they created. Polyphony maybe? Santa Monica?

Microsoft has created 343, Turn10, Initiative & Coalition.

Obviously, when a studio stops being profitable, their relationship ends.
I feel it for Studio Liverpool, and Evolution Studios...

But they are still logic business decisions, concerning only Sony and the studio.

I dont think that has nothing to do with what we are talking about : /

If it's logical when Sony does it what isn't logical about shutting down Lionhead?


Still want to see them throw some mojang sized money around and pick up Sega gaming division.