Rumor: sony in talks to acquire take-two interactive

Aug 3, 2014
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not happening.

yeah they'd get GTA which would be an incredible move but overall it'd be a waste of money. they'd not only be buying Rockstar but also 2K Studios and of course Take Two itself. 2K doesn't have much exciting. Borderlands... eh. Bioshock...what year is it? NBA....just no. Sid Meier...decent I guess.

if it's the only way to get their grubby paws on GTA then i suppose it'd be worth it because it prints money but I think they'd be better just trying to buy Rockstar off them and get the rights for GTA.

also I really don't want it to happen. As much as I love my Playstation i don't want GTA to become a Playstation exclusive.
 
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Dec 9, 2014
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It seems we have these Company A taking over/ Buying Company B, C & D threads every few months and with the exception of Microsoft buying up a few studios a couple months back they almost always end up being nothing. I guess it is always fun to speculate but until There is an official announcement or Press release, always take this shit with the tiniest grain of salt.

Believe nothing of what you hear,
and only half of what you see.
 
Feb 11, 2019
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You don't spend half your liquid assests that you've spent the past 5+ years finally replenishing on one publisher that outputs a couple of games a generation, it to me doesn't make any financial sense on Sony's behalf. Yes they have money to spend but this is a massive amount to them. It only takes a few stupid choices again next gen and the market turns and before you know it you've burned through the last half of the cash reserves you have left and off to selling buildings again. I think they need to stay the course and continue to grow the assets again, spend a couple billion if you feel inclined Capcom etc but half...? Can't see it.
I'm not saying they should or shouldn't do it or even will, but the numbers are easily there. Sony actually acquire a music company EMI last quarter for $2.1b. The thing is Sony is making money now, say clear $1-2b a quarter even for the next 3-4 quarters pays for the cash part of the acquisition, also you're buying revenue and cash generation in the $1.0-1.7b revenue range and about half of that would gross margins. They have plenty of cash to fund this, not sure I see the issue with liquidity - they probably have too much cash right now, acquisition time. $130 would make a ton of sense, anything over that you get into reaching but how much is something worth?

Not a horrible deal for sure, if you're in the gaming business but yeah, I think the smaller fish make more sense at a very tiny fraction of the money.

Even with the EMI and paying their debt off Sony increased its cash position significantly.
According to the SEC filing, Sony has also assumed EMI’s existing interest-bearing debt of approximately $1.3bn as a result of the acquisition, of which $960m was repaid immediately from Sony’s existing cash.
https://www.musicbusinessworldwide.com/sony-completes-2-3bn-acquisition-of-emi-music-publishing/
 
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Likes: Mattyp
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The company i want Sony to buy is Konami. It's market cap is about 6 billion dollars. Wasn't there a rumor a while back that Microsoft tried to get the rights to Silent Hill but Konami wanted Microsoft stock, and alot of it?
 
Feb 11, 2019
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The company i want Sony to buy is Konami. It's market cap is about 6 billion dollars. Wasn't there a rumor a while back that Microsoft tried to get the rights to Silent Hill but Konami wanted Microsoft stock, and alot of it?
If you're doing a stock deal with Microsoft, you better ask for plenty of stock if they want a stock deal (but MS has cash), that stock hasn't fallen off the cliff like everyone else YET. If you're doing a stock deal you're potentially buying real high at these levels - everyone else has already fallen off the cliff, generally speaking. I wouldn't be surprised either way of Take Two looking for a suitor, they probably have a few years before their next big release.

What is funny is someone probably could have bought Silent Hill IP for close to nothing 8-10 years ago.
 
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Oct 10, 2018
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1. Deals are not always all cash, it can be an all stock deal, depends on the deal.
2. Even if it was all cash, and Sony paid the $130 stock price, $13-14b, they probably have enough cash for that, total cash looks like north of $20b, depending on the wording of cash on hand. Could do partial, 70% cash, 30% stock.

Again, I'm going with unlikely but yes, in theory they have enough at these levels on the surface.
Doesn't matter, stock won't pay for the costs post buyout during integration. Money doesnt stop being spend on the surface buyout, they do not have the money to sustain that acquisition.

When companies buy other companies the mid/long term is considered, not just for the sake of doing it. Sonys stalk would crumble after the initial bump, and shorts would go crazy.
 
Feb 11, 2019
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Doesn't matter, stock won't pay for the costs post buyout during integration. Money doesnt stop being spend on the surface buyout, they do not have the money to sustain that acquisition.

When companies buy other companies the mid/long term is considered, not just for the sake of doing it. Sonys stalk would crumble after the initial bump, and shorts would go crazy.
They have freaking $25b and they have $1-2b per quarter coming in, yes, they can afford this acquisition easily, even an all cash deal. TTwo has $500-900m of operating profit per year which Sony would be buying. (Just stop) Again, I would bet it won't happen but yes, they have plenty of money, the stack is getting higher.
 
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Doesn't matter, stock won't pay for the costs post buyout during integration. Money doesnt stop being spend on the surface buyout, they do not have the money to sustain that acquisition.

When companies buy other companies the mid/long term is considered, not just for the sake of doing it. Sonys stalk would crumble after the initial bump, and shorts would go crazy.
TTwo is self-sustaining, Sony has also hired an M&A specialist recently, if they are good at their job, they can do a really good vertical integration job. This would result in far lower running costs... there would be layoffs but only for middle and upper management.
 
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They have freaking $25b and they have $1-2b per quarter coming in, yes, they can afford this acquisition easily, even an all cash deal.
No they cannot. You are simplifying how acquisitions work, once Sony buys the company they STILL have to spend MORE money during the transition which you aren't considering, then once they finally absorb take 2 they still have to maintain everything in the studio after as well, that takes MORE CASH.

They DO NOT have the money to sustain the acquisition, nor will the acquisition get them out the red, they could never balance the losses with profits.

This is a toxic buy for any company in the industry right now, including MS, while MS or even Google could handle the first round of major cash drain it'll be a bigger financial loss over time then Nokia for either.

T2 has had many of the best selling franchises for almost 20 years, and some of them have several microtransaction systems for the last few years of releases, plus over 100 million GTAV sold, and they still lose money occasionally and "only" have a $10b cap?

You see nothing wrong here? There's a reason no ones even attempted to make that move, even in the San Andreas days
 
Likes: phil_t98
Feb 11, 2019
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No they cannot. You are simplifying how acquisitions work, once Sony buys the company they STILL have to spend MORE money during the transition which you aren't considering, then once they finally absorb take 2 they still have to maintain everything in the studio after as well, that takes MORE CASH.

They DO NOT have the money to sustain the acquisition, nor will the acquisition get them out the red, they could never balance the losses with profits.

This is a toxic buy for any company in the industry right now, including MS, while MS or even Google could handle the first round of major cash drain it'll be a bigger financial loss over time then Nokia for either.

T2 has had many of the best selling franchises for almost 20 years, and some of them have several microtransaction systems for the last few years of releases, plus over 100 million GTAV sold, and they still lose money occasionally and "only" have a $10b cap?

You see nothing wrong here? There's a reason no ones even attempted to make that move, even in the San Andreas days
I'm not saying it would be a great buy, I said they can easily buy it. TTwo would only be tiny part of their business, not sure what you think, TTwo is completely self funded with no debt and nearly $2b in cash. TTwo has huge margins, Microsoft buying Lumia was buying $9b of stuff Nokia didn't want - trash. TTwo clearly doesn't need to be funded, huge gross margins. I'm not sure why you think billions would need to be spent on TTwo after the acquisition, they're barely a $1.8b business annual revenue - its still small potatoes.

Stop digging.
 
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TTwo is self-sustaining, Sony has also hired an M&A specialist recently, if they are good at their job, they can do a really good vertical integration job. This would result in far lower running costs... there would be layoffs but only for middle and upper management.
T2 has proven over the last 10 year's they aren't self sustaiming by being the only company with major big hits that beat nearly all others and still losing money. People forget all those T2 investor reports, and all the backgtound costs, that Sony would have to pay btw.
 
Feb 11, 2019
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No, they couldn't.

Wiping half your cash value off the balance sheet and replacing it with an asset is not 'easy' lol.
Companies acquire other companies all the time, Sony just closed on another a $2.3b company in Q4, TTwo wouldn't even be 2% of their business.
 
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I'm not saying it would be a great buy, I said they can easily buy it. TTwo would only be tiny part of their business, not sure what you think, TTwo is completely self funded with no debt and nearly $2b in cash.

Stop digging.
No you're evading my point since the first post and keep simplifying the buyout process, if you engaged honestly this would be clear.

You dont understand the background stuff after the surface buyout, all you see are two numbers and ones bigger than another, that's not how acquisitions work, there are two costs, not one, the one post market buyout is the one you continue to ignore.

Sony would be spending within the first few months or however long till absorbed, paying around over $18+ billion dollars.

Then then AFTER THAT would have to throw money o nthe studio itself and that using Take 2 now as an example, would be an additional $5 billion dollars.

They could cut a bunch of staff and studios and focus on few Ips but that would cause less money coming in, not that Sony could make it back anyway.

Vaio caused Sony to press the panic button despite being nearly 8x less of a financial burden. Caused major issues for the company then. Did you forget that?

It's crazy how many of you guys just don't understand how acquisitions work or how companies are run and dangerously assume its like shopoing at a grocery store.
 
Feb 11, 2019
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No you're evading my point since the first post and keep simplifying the buyout process, if you engaged honestly this would be clear.

You dont understand the background stuff after the surface buyout, all you see are two numbers and ones bigger than another, that's not how acquisitions work, there are two costs, not one, the one post market buyout is the one you continue to ignore.

Sony would be spending within the first few months or however long till absorbed, paying around over $18+ billion dollars.

Then then AFTER THAT would have to throw money o nthe studio itself and that using Take 2 now as an example, would be an additional $5 billion dollars.

They could cut a bunch of staff and studios and focus on few Ips but that would cause less money coming in, not that Sony could make it back anyway.

Vaio caused Sony to press the panic button despite being nearly 8x less of a financial burden. Caused major issues for the company then. Did you forget that?

It's crazy how many of you guys just don't understand how acquisitions work or how companies are run and dangerously assume its like shopoing at a grocery store.

You're throwing fucking numbers out left field, why in the fuck would someone need to put $5b into a completely self-funded company, if anything the expenses are going to get cut i.e. the publishing side. headcount. $5b is about 5-7 years of their cost to operate with no funding. It cost less than $800m a year to keep the lights on.

Let me show you how small of an acquistion this would be - it would only represent 2% of Sony's revenue and about 4% of its workforce.

Not sure on what planet someone would have to throw an additional $5b at this company after acquiring it, even if they did, they have that as well. There are always expenses after acquisitions, so freaking what. I never said this would be a super great deal, a $5b dollar acquisition would be good, which is probably where this stock is heading, if someone doesn't acquire it.

More than likely someone at TTwo is just trying to stop the bleeding.
 
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Likes: Bryank75
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GTA6, RDR 3 and Bisohock 4 exclusives: Expand San Diego and allow them to develop every sport title....NBA2k, NHL 2K, try to get back on the NFL2k train......San Diego will also handle, Rockstar Table Tennis and get a Tennis and Golf 2k Series going.....

Bring back Smuggler's run and Midnight Club, Daylight Club (uhhh Driveclub), we need some arcade games.....pretty solid buy if you ask me.....
 
Feb 21, 2018
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That makes no sense at all... they could buy 21st Century Fox but not Take 2 that costs 1/5 of the value?

I'm not saying they couldn't do it, I'm saying that it would be a) Difficult and b) a bad acquisition.

Take Twos value is based up selling to three (or four, including Nintendo) markets. If you purchase it to make it exclusive, you would be overpaying on an asset that's value is based upon it's market share. It's also why if they did it (which they won't), the games would continue to appear on all devices.

Buying 21st Century is different. They've bought the catelogue and just continue to distribute the films.
 
Likes: ethomaz
Mar 19, 2013
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I'm not saying they couldn't do it, I'm saying that it would be a) Difficult and b) a bad acquisition.

Take Twos value is based up selling to three (or four, including Nintendo) markets. If you purchase it to make it exclusive, you would be overpaying on an asset that's value is based upon it's market share. It's also why if they did it (which they won't), the games would continue to appear on all devices.

Buying 21st Century is different. They've bought the catelogue and just continue to distribute the films.
Fair enough... I mistook it with the "Sony has no money" talk :D
 
Likes: DanielsM
Feb 4, 2013
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Plus isn't Wedbush Securities --> Wedbush Morgan Securities and thus Pachter level of analyzing?
Mini Pachter in this case as even Google haven't heard much if at all about this analyst prior to this nonsense.
 
Likes: Th3Gr80n3
Feb 11, 2019
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I'm not saying they couldn't do it, I'm saying that it would be a) Difficult and b) a bad acquisition.

Take Twos value is based up selling to three (or four, including Nintendo) markets. If you purchase it to make it exclusive, you would be overpaying on an asset that's value is based upon it's market share. It's also why if they did it (which they won't), the games would continue to appear on all devices.

Buying 21st Century is different. They've bought the catelogue and just continue to distribute the films.
I'm not saying your wrong on your opinions of a bad acquisition at this price level, not sure I have an opinion.

However, if you break out the numbers (or surmise the numbers), one could argue TTwo is pretty much a Playstation-centric company. 85% the revenue is consoles, which is probably mostly Xbox and PS, you break that down you could be talking 50-60% Playstation revenues, PC is only about 15%, but also you have to consider what Microsoft is doing with Xbox at the moment, not exactly a close system anymore, or doesn't appear to be that way in the future. Money in theory could be made up of more PS sales both hardware and software, or a good portion of it.
https://www.fool.com/investing/2019/02/27/heres-how-take-two-interactive-makes-its-money.aspx

Just playing Devi's Advocate here, like I said I think someone is trying to get a stock rise.
 
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Likes: Ogbert
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what does making it exclusive do for you?
Directly? Nothing.

But indirectly in the short story it add value to a platform increasing the investment to more and better games for that platform.

The long story... Sony increasing it portfolio with big exclusives increases the desire to buy a PlayStation consoles, so more buyer = more potential sales = more investment = more and/or better games = my gaming life being better.

Exclusives give more advantages to gamers than non-exclusives... when all the games become non-exclusives the platforms will probably die and so the consoles you love to play.

The health of the industry is strong related to the value of a platform and it investment in exclusives... more exclusives = more competition = better industry... that is true for any platform including Xbox, Nintendo, and PC.

People dream with that Utopian world where every consoles has the same games that will only kill the investment in the industry because gamers won't have desire to buy platforms to play games. Interest is what generate a health in the industry and exclusives generates interest. If all consoles has it own set of high quality exclusives then consumers will need to buy all consoles and so they investment in more exclusives games will be bigger.

It is a big win-win for us gamers.
 
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Feb 21, 2018
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I'm not saying your wrong on your opinions of a bad acquisition at this price level, not sure I have an opinion.

However, if you break out the numbers (or surmise the numbers), one could argue TTwo is pretty much a Playstation-centric company. 85% the revenue is consoles, which is probably mostly Xbox and PS, you break that down you could be talking 50-60% Playstation revenues, PC is only about 15%, but also you have to consider what Microsoft is doing with Xbox at the moment, not exactly a close system anymore, or doesn't appear to be that way in the future. Money in theory could be made up of more PS sales both hardware and software, or a good portion of it.
https://www.fool.com/investing/2019/02/27/heres-how-take-two-interactive-makes-its-money.aspx

Just playing Devi's Advocate here, like I said I think someone is trying to get a stock rise.
Agree.

The thing is, the fact it’s a PlayStation centric company makes it even less of an attractive proposition to Sony. They already have the weight of that market segment. Sure, they would increase revenues on those sales, but to the tune of however many billions? Nowhere near worth it.

You buy what you need, not what you want. As someone else suggested upthread, Sony needs kid centric games and studios. Everything else is running like a dream. They’re not losing revenue to MS, they’re losing it to Nintendo (not that they necessarily care, they’ve been open about the fact they consider themselves to be two separate markets).
 
Likes: DanielsM
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Agree.

The thing is, the fact it’s a PlayStation centric company makes it even less of an attractive proposition to Sony. They already have the weight of that market segment. Sure, they would increase revenues on those sales, but to the tune of however many billions? Nowhere near worth it.

You buy what you need, not what you want. As someone else suggested upthread, Sony needs kid centric games and studios. Everything else is running like a dream. They’re not losing revenue to MS, they’re losing it to Nintendo (not that they necessarily care, they’ve been open about the fact they consider themselves to be two separate markets).
Nice post. I can't find fault in that argument for sure. The money would have to made up somewhere else, it could be something as simple as offering GTA and RDR in PS Now (I hate all this cloud gaming talk but that might be a thinking process for them) and trying to get subscriptions there, or would have to be made up in sales on the PS hardware and software side.

Do they have the money at these levels ($130)? Yes.
Would it be a good acquisition? No idea, I could see it going either way.
Would PS customers like this? Probably most as it strengthens their console platform for sure.
 
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Likes: Ogbert

VALCON 82

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so about this AGENT PS exclusive from years past?? maybe "agent" was actually Sony and TTwo on a super secret collaborative mission to join forces... and I've got nothing after that to keep weaving this tale of fantasy.

On a serious note (this has probably been stated but i came in on the last page of discussion so here we go) couldn't Sony still publish the biggest games to all platforms just like MS does with Minecraft? they would just be able to give themselves better treats inside said games? and reap more sales revenue in process?
 
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This actually wouldn't surprise me at all. Sony have been keeping quiet....keeping quiet....

then BAAM! Here's PS5 with GTA6 as an exclusive launch title.

And lol at people saying Sony can't afford it :messenger_tears_of_joy:
They can "afford" it but is it a wise investment? We're talking about a studio that sold 100 million copies of a game this gen, that's not going to be cheap.
 

Afro Republican

GAF>INTERNET>GAF, BITCHES
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Not only is this thread going on odd based on like 30 news updates not including the OP, but also for the post I mentioned before, the amount of Money Sony would have to divert would kill them, it they already do that with their loss-leader divisions now like Smartphones, Sony can't divert billions to multiple divisions with only a few actually bringing in real money.

Not to mention that GTA can't be made up with PS sales, the amount of money on Xbox and PC is a major thing, next gen could also change things drastically, and don't forget GTA Online, you're cutting off as I said before 2/3rds of GTA's profits or a bit more PLUS for the other titles that are not GTA the money you're looking at maybe 3/4ths.

Whole thing was screw from the start. At least the Google buying Sega rumor is possible, although it'll likely just be a partnership.
 
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They can "afford" it but is it a wise investment? We're talking about a studio that sold 100 million copies of a game this gen, that's not going to be cheap.
nobody is pointing out that a huge number of the games sold are on xbox pc and other consoles, that would wipe sales away straight away from games being PS only. that's a financial hit straight away if they bought them. high price to buy them and a loss in sales going one console only
 
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It wouldn't make financial sense for Sony to do this. There's no game that Take Two/Rockstar makes that doesn't come to the PlayStation anyway, and the Switch isn't even a factor they don't even have GTAV a last gen game. You'd essentially be paying billions to keep them away from Microsoft, who by the way you already stomped down by more than 2 to 1 this gen and who has one foot in the multi-platform door anyway.
While I seriously doubt this story is true, I'd argue you are underplaying the reason they would be doing it. With Microsoft clearly trying to merge xbox and general PC usage, Sony securing a rather large collection of core gaming experiences would allow them to secure console gaming into the future.
 
Likes: DanielsM
Feb 11, 2019
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While I seriously doubt this story is true, I'd argue you are underplaying the reason they would be doing it. With Microsoft clearly trying to merge xbox and general PC usage, Sony securing a rather large collection of core gaming experiences would allow them to secure console gaming into the future.
Yeah, I can see that being discussed, strategic partner, kind of like Microsoft's github acquisition, they didn't want Google to buy it. I don't think the numbers would come close to working on something like EA, and that company seems hell bent on destroying itself anyway.
 
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Fbh

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I seriously doubt this will happen.
Would be fun to see the reactions if it did. I mean, that would be it, console wars over. Might as well call it the GTAStation 5
 
Likes: Bryank75
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While I seriously doubt this story is true, I'd argue you are underplaying the reason they would be doing it. With Microsoft clearly trying to merge xbox and general PC usage, Sony securing a rather large collection of core gaming experiences would allow them to secure console gaming into the future.
But they’ve already secured it. They have blockbuster IPs under their name. They’d be spending billions on acquiring something that’s already coming their way.
 
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Probably time to wrap this up for now.

But a spokesperson for Sony said this morning that “we do not know where the rumor is coming from, but there is no such plan.” And a Take-Two spokesperson said the company does not comment on rumors or speculation. Sony’s comment is a rare denial of something that is outright false, and it nails the coffin on this rumor. Today, Take-Two’s stock price has fallen 3 percent to $93.16 a share.
https://venturebeat.com/2019/03/14/sony-kills-rumor-it-is-buying-grand-theft-auto-maker-take-two/
 
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Likes: CurryPanda
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At this point confirmed it's just a rumor/speculation.

Regardless, for discussion....Judging from other comments here, I'll assume the estimates are correct, that Sony has ~$20B in the bank. I still see it ad too big of a hurdle.

TT is valued at ~$11B-$12B. Someone would have to pay more than market value to acquire....probably closer to $13B-$14B.

Then if u assume PS had the majority of sales over XBox and PC...let's say 2/3 sold on PS. If those ga es go exclusive, you will still be paying market value and then cutting o
No, they couldn't.

Wiping half your cash value off the balance sheet and replacing it with an asset is not 'easy' lol.
Agreed!!

Especially not for a company bring propped up by one successful division.

Also, wasnt Sony going to invest in their networking infrastructure? That isn't cheap.
 
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Well that doesnt really mean anything, how many times do spokemen come out and say something, then their company does the opposite the next day lol.
Having said that, anyone believing this had a chance of happening, was deluding themselves.
I remember when someone told me Microsoft would never let Bungie buy themselves out (when those rumors came out), you never know. My guess someone in TTwo started this, for obvious reasons, that baby is about to come back down to Earth. If you love it at $100, you're really going to love it at $60. :) Most of these game company stocks look like borderline disasters.
 
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I remember when someone told me Microsoft would never let Bungie buy themselves out, you never know. My guess someone in TTwo started this, for obvious reasons, that baby is about to come back down to Earth. If you love it at $100, you're really going to love it at $60. :)
Even if it was Microsoft rumoured to be the one buying, i'd still think there would be zero chance. Its just too much money involved., and wouldn't be worth it, i mean what was it $14bil?, thats like what 300-400mil game sales at full price or something?. It would of took years for them just to get their money back.