Rumour: PS5 Devkits have released (UPDATE 25th April : 7nm chips moving to mass production)

What do you guys think about that guys?

https://www.psu.com/news/ps5-leak-looks-totally-fake-but-you-be-the-judge/

  • 100% backwards compatible with PS4 games
  • Fully compatible with PS VR and PlayStation Move offering a improved VR experience
  • CPU: AMD Zen 8 cores – single-chip custom processor
  • GPU: 14.20 TFLOPS, AMD Navi-based graphics engine
  • Memory: 32GB GDDR6 technology
  • Storage – 1TB SSD
  • $599
1 TB SSHD, RAM 16-24 GB max, lower clock leading closer to 12 TFLOPS single precision FP... $399-499... possibly $399.
 
What do you guys think about that guys?

https://www.psu.com/news/ps5-leak-looks-totally-fake-but-you-be-the-judge/

  • 100% backwards compatible with PS4 games
  • Fully compatible with PS VR and PlayStation Move offering a improved VR experience
  • CPU: AMD Zen 8 cores – single-chip custom processor
  • GPU: 14.20 TFLOPS, AMD Navi-based graphics engine
  • Memory: 32GB GDDR6 technology
  • Storage – 1TB SSD
  • $599
If they are implying this year, absolutely will not happen. Holiday 2019 would be best hopes and wishes. 2020 would be the most realistic release for such a console. Will greatly struggle at that price, though, regardless of specs.
 
Before I get into it, I would just to point out one moment you state you would like for nVidia to win console hardware contracts because they are the richest and can deliver you the best graphics possible. But then in the next sentence you use the GPU in the Switch to drive this point home?

The Switch is a great console with great games but the Tegra X1 isn't blowing my mind in terms of graphics by any means.

All that does is underscore that the needs of the console manufacturer (in this case, Nintendo) is the most important element to shape the design of a console.


For sure, just about everyone agrees nVidia has the technology edge when it comes to designing PC desktop GPUS...

Where the stumbling block starts is when the other elements of console design come into play, like an X86 CPU for backwards compatibility and game development migration, for instance.

Nintendo doesn't have a ton of customers with massive digital game libraries like Sony does. Since this is the case, a backwards compatible ecosystem whereby customers could seamlessly "bring forward" their expensive accumulated digital purchases to a theoretical PlayStation 5 might be of more interest to Sony than it might to Nintendo, for example.

Further complicating things, is rival Xbox, who is more aggressive than anyone at delivering a seamless Backwards Compatible experience to their customers, who are probably worrying the least about their digital purchases at the moment.

If you think this isn't a big deal, just ask a Nintendo fan how happy they feel about re-buying some of the same Virtual Console games they already own once a new console like the Super NES Classic arrives!

So although nVidia is capable of designing the best, most powerful GPU on the market, I still expect Sony to go AMD next generation. What AMD brings to the table seems to be more in sync with the needs of a customer like Sony. And don't forget, AMD can also bring some heat to the graphics table when their customers demand it. The Xbox One X is pretty damn good gaming hardware for $500 in my eyes.

Can nVidia win the PS5 contract? Of course!

That said, I believe that there would be a much more complicated path towards that design since they would somehow have to also provide a CPU that would be competitive with a forthcoming Xbox One successor. Would Sony really be willing to potentially give up a CPU power and backward compatibility crown to rival Microsoft just to have the prettiest graphics?

I really doubt that and I hope they are not that dumb.
And that doesn't even speak about the cost of the console. I agree with you.
 
What do you guys think about that guys?

https://www.psu.com/news/ps5-leak-looks-totally-fake-but-you-be-the-judge/

  • 100% backwards compatible with PS4 games
  • Fully compatible with PS VR and PlayStation Move offering a improved VR experience
  • CPU: AMD Zen 8 cores – single-chip custom processor
  • GPU: 14.20 TFLOPS, AMD Navi-based graphics engine
  • Memory: 32GB GDDR6 technology
  • Storage – 1TB SSD
  • $599
Did they remove the price from the article? Or was it within a link? Did it also mention a date?

I’m going with fake overall though.
 
What do you guys think about that guys?

https://www.psu.com/news/ps5-leak-looks-totally-fake-but-you-be-the-judge/

  • 100% backwards compatible with PS4 games
  • Fully compatible with PS VR and PlayStation Move offering a improved VR experience
  • CPU: AMD Zen 8 cores – single-chip custom processor
  • GPU: 14.20 TFLOPS, AMD Navi-based graphics engine
  • Memory: 32GB GDDR6 technology
  • Storage – 1TB SSD
  • $599
$599 isn't happening at all, unless it's a day 1 pro version.
 
I don't think either Sony or MS are going to switch from AMD to Nvidia... Who would provide the CPU if they switched? Getting AMD to work with Nvidia on an APU is something I don't believe will ever happen. What would be the advantage anyway from a console perspective?
Also, didn't Nvidia screw MS with something on the original xbox? I heard some stories, but I don't know what really happened.
 
I don't think either Sony or MS are going to switch from AMD to Nvidia... Who would provide the CPU if they switched? Getting AMD to work with Nvidia on an APU is something I don't believe will ever happen. What would be the advantage anyway from a console perspective?
Also, didn't Nvidia screw MS with something on the original xbox? I heard some stories, but I don't know what really happened.
they also screwed over sony with the RSX.
 
What do you guys think about that guys?

https://www.psu.com/news/ps5-leak-looks-totally-fake-but-you-be-the-judge/

  • 100% backwards compatible with PS4 games
  • Fully compatible with PS VR and PlayStation Move offering a improved VR experience
  • CPU: AMD Zen 8 cores – single-chip custom processor
  • GPU: 14.20 TFLOPS, AMD Navi-based graphics engine
  • Memory: 32GB GDDR6 technology
  • Storage – 1TB SSD
  • $599
I think it sounds unrealistic. 32gb of ram is unneccesarily overkill, and i doubt sony nor ms will swap a hdd for the significantly more expensive ssd. Especially for a base model.
 
So you thinking late 2020 for launch then? I find it surprising any devkits are out at all in this case and certainly not in third-party hands. They never get them this early.
Yes.

But from what I heard there aren't "loads" of devkits going out, actually VERY few. And as Kotaku pointed out, they're absolutely not an actual console unit, the hardware is not even finalised yet. It's basically a PC with specs close to what is expected from the console, but that will pretty much change overtime.
 
Not buying it.

This was the devkit release schedule for the ps4 which was an architectural departure from the ps3 . Sending out devkits if the ps5 was more than 2 years away would be completely pointless. Initial dev kits would be between 18 months to 2 years before launch and given the possibility of keeping the same architecture it could b shorter but definitely not 2018.

http://vgleaks.com/orbis-devkits-roadmaptypes/

Given Sony’s release pattern this is almost definitely a 2019 release date and the above article sounds like click bait
 
Yes.

But from what I heard there aren't "loads" of devkits going out, actually VERY few. And as Kotaku pointed out, they're absolutely not an actual console unit, the hardware is not even finalised yet. It's basically a PC with specs close to what is expected from the console, but that will pretty much change overtime.
Well like I and others have said it makes no sense for anyone but PS5 OS writers and the likes of ICE team making game libraries this far out (more than 2.5 years!). Even Matt said devkits don't go out this early. He's gone very quiet over at the other place, though.

For me you can't have your cake and eat it too! If devkits (even early PC-based ones) are out then a late 2019 launch makes the most sense especially with PS5 being newer semi-custom PC tech.

Also I really do think if GG are doing a Horizon sequel, and most thinks this for sure, then finishing the game in late 2019 or early 2020 makes perfect sense as the first game was made in 3 years (the other few years of dev was a few people concepting/designing while Shadow Fall was made) if you watch the GDC presentation.
 
Yes.

But from what I heard there aren't "loads" of devkits going out, actually VERY few. And as Kotaku pointed out, they're absolutely not an actual console unit, the hardware is not even finalised yet. It's basically a PC with specs close to what is expected from the console, but that will pretty much change overtime.
Thanks God, 2020 is a perfect timeline for a release. Especially late 2020.
 
Before I get into it, I would just to point out one moment you state you would like for nVidia to win console hardware contracts because they are the richest and can deliver you the best graphics possible. But then in the next sentence you use the GPU in the Switch to drive this point home?

The Switch is a great console with great games but the Tegra X1 isn't blowing my mind in terms of graphics by any means.

All that does is underscore that the needs of the console manufacturer (in this case, Nintendo) is the most important element to shape the design of a console.


For sure, just about everyone agrees nVidia has the technology edge when it comes to designing PC desktop GPUS...

Where the stumbling block starts is when the other elements of console design come into play, like an X86 CPU for backwards compatibility and game development migration, for instance.

Nintendo doesn't have a ton of customers with massive digital game libraries like Sony does. Since this is the case, a backwards compatible ecosystem whereby customers could seamlessly "bring forward" their expensive accumulated digital purchases to a theoretical PlayStation 5 might be of more interest to Sony than it might to Nintendo, for example.


Further complicating things, is rival Xbox, who is more aggressive than anyone at delivering a seamless Backwards Compatible experience to their customers, who are probably worrying the least about their digital purchases at the moment.

If you think this isn't a big deal, just ask a Nintendo fan how happy they feel about re-buying some of the same Virtual Console games they already own once a new console like the Super NES Classic arrives!

So although nVidia is capable of designing the best, most powerful GPU on the market, I still expect Sony to go AMD next generation. What AMD brings to the table seems to be more in sync with the needs of a customer like Sony. And don't forget, AMD can also bring some heat to the graphics table when their customers demand it. The Xbox One X is pretty damn good gaming hardware for $500 in my eyes.

Can nVidia win the PS5 contract? Of course!

That said, I believe that there would be a much more complicated path towards that design since they would somehow have to also provide a CPU that would be competitive with a forthcoming Xbox One successor. Would Sony really be willing to potentially give up a CPU power and backward compatibility crown to rival Microsoft just to have the prettiest graphics?

I really doubt that and I hope they are not that dumb.
well, like I said I don't have any secret information or anything. just speculating. and if it actually is coming in two years, or two years+ who knows how things will look :eek:
 
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The focus of these dev kits could be just the SDKs. I think it makes sense to start providing these as soon as possible to devs, since games take so long to make and to guarantee that the games are ready for the release of the console.
 
I don't think those 1TB SSD and 32GB of RAM specs are even possible on a Pro model, let a lone a standard model

On next-gen topic, I'm still confident that 3 years is enough to cycle between releasing standard and Pro model going forward, full backward compatibility, PSX is a spec bump with some added bells and whistles (to justify a next-gen jump), PSX Pro for even more spec bumps, 3 years apart, rinse, repeat
 
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Essentially, as we were saying before the 32 GB of RAM and 1 TB SSD are not console retail specs, but the usually more powerful dev kits. Although they will need to be careful about allowing the devout to accurately emulate final HW as SSD have a lot higher throughout (and ability to load scattered data faster) than normal HDD.
That’s true, I’m still leaning to SSHD so that should at least give some similar performance for cache. We really have no idea how Sony would decide to use a SSHD. The extra RAM could be for debugging tools.
 
Those must be "special" devkits sent to Square Enix only. Since they already released a Final Fantasy this gen, the next will be ready just in time for the Ps6 release (+/- 10 years). So Sony skips Ps5 devkits and starts sending them pre-pre-alpha Ps6 ones.

That’s true, I’m still leaning to SSHD so that should at least give some similar performance for cache. We really have no idea how Sony would decide to use a SSHD. The extra RAM could be for debugging tools.
If the final product has 16-20gb ram, 32 gb ram just for debugging tools would be an overkill, unless they want 32gb ram for the higher bandwith and not so much because games will need it.
 
Those must be "special" devkits sent to Square Enix only. Since they already released a Final Fantasy this gen, the next will be ready just in time for the Ps6 release (+/- 10 years). So Sony skips Ps5 devkits and starts sending them pre-pre-alpha Ps6 ones.


If the final product has 16-20gb ram, 32 gb ram just for debugging tools would be an overkill, unless they want 32gb ram for the higher bandwith and not so much because games will need it.
The ps4 kits had 4GB extra RAM back when the system was only supposed to have 4.
 
well, like I said I don't have any secret information or anything. just speculating. and if it actually is coming in two years, or two years+ who knows how things will look :eek:

Since the next PlayStation will be THE baseline for future console development (since it should appeal to the widest demographics of fans all over the world) it should have the most support and the widest variety of games (again)

I am sure you will find a whole bunch of cool stuff to make you happy. And I bet the graphics from the first party Titans will be plenty impressive.
 
it would be cool if the consoles had 32GB of HBM3 RAM @ 2TB/s now this is nexgen =) but it wont happen. probably just get 16GB of GDDR5.
For me Sony will go for a 256 bit bus bringing with it the ability to cost reduce and bring out a slim. A 384 bit bus limits/kills this possibility. And it would cost more/be harder to shrink?

16GB if 2019
32GB if 2020 if they want to repeat PS4's 8GB RAM moment.
 
32gb of RAM is still absolutely overkill. 24gb is even overkill. 16gb is currently the most you'd ever really need for proper 4k gaming and thats on a PC that needs the extra RAM for multitasking. The XB1X currently uses 12gb (less than that technically since several GB's are saved for the UI) and can play up to 4k/60fps (And the games that arent, the RAM isnt the bottleneck, the GPU and Jaguar setup are the bottleneck)

So why does the PS5 need 32gb of RAM? Why does it need SSD? These just come off as unrealistic options that would only inflate the price when they could just aim for an upgradeable HDD slot with a built in 2-4tb of memory and 16gb of RAM
 
I don't think either Sony or MS are going to switch from AMD to Nvidia... Who would provide the CPU if they switched? Getting AMD to work with Nvidia on an APU is something I don't believe will ever happen. What would be the advantage anyway from a console perspective?
Also, didn't Nvidia screw MS with something on the original xbox? I heard some stories, but I don't know what really happened.
I also heard that MS dropped AMD (Original Xbox )and went with Nvidia at the last minute and AMD knew nothing about it until the official reveal, the one when Bill Gates was on stage.
 
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Here's a good site about RAM prices for the last couple of years/decades, it seems to go up/down a lot.
So whatever is happening at the moment doesn't necessarly reflects what it will be by 2020-ish.
https://jcmit.net/memoryprice.htm

I could see Sony going for 24GB of GDDR6 with a 18/6 split, that still runs it on a 384-bit bus.
CPU is predictable at 3.0GHz and 3.2GHz being the max if it's a 8/16 setup (Zen2 with some feats from Zen3).
Navi GPU with maybe some feats from the GPU that comes after that, but this I doubt case for me due to AMD's GPU side of the business as a whole.
The 7nm process will be mature by then and the rest is already available so they are good there, Sony will get a nice push in terms of bandwidth if they go with Samsung again.
Both companies know what lies ahead, I think it comes down to who is going to pull the trigger first and strangely enough I think MS might be the one.

EDIT: the slide sites are claiming to be true is from Twitter, it's the same one that Sony? used for PS4 "Neo" / Pro just edited to make believe.
 
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Here's a good site about RAM prices for the last couple of years/decades, it seems to go up/down a lot.
So whatever is happening at the moment doesn't necessarly reflects what it will be by 2020-ish.
https://jcmit.net/memoryprice.htm

I could see Sony going for 24GB of GDDR6 with a 18/6 split, that still runs it on a 384-bit bus.
CPU is predictable at 3.0GHz and 3.2GHz being the max if it's a 8/16 setup (Zen2 with some feats from Zen3).
Navi GPU with maybe some feats from the GPU that comes after that, but this I doubt case for me due to AMD's GPU side of the business as a whole.
The 7nm process will be mature by then and the rest is already available so they are good there, Sony will get a nice push in terms of bandwidth if they go with Samsung again.
Both companies know what lies ahead, I think it comes down to who is going to pull the trigger first and strangely enough I think MS might be the one.

EDIT: the slide sites are claiming to be true is from Twitter, it's the same one that Sony? used for PS4 "Neo" / Pro just edited to make believe.
Like I say in my post above I can't see Sony doing 24GB/384 bit bus and be stuck on 12 chips the whole generation. I don't know if it is technical reasons or choice but Microsoft don't seem to mind so much as they stuck with 16 chips in One S
and I assume will stick with 12 chips in One X. As for the fake docs going round all I can say is I still have the NEO docs and it seems whoever has created the 'EPSILON' leak has just used that as a template. A shame they couldn't spell (in English at least).
 
Like I say in my post above I can't see Sony doing 24GB/384 bit bus and be stuck on 12 chips the whole generation. I don't know if it is technical reasons or choice but Microsoft don't seem to mind so much as they stuck with 16 chips in One S and I assume will stick with 12 chips in One X.
What are you talking about?
The way that reads is like you're under the impression that "being stuck" with 12 chips (2GB each) is a bad thing when it's rather good.
12x 1.35v = 16.2v, PS4 is at 8x1.50v = 12v, very small increase in power draw for 3x the amount of memory and it might be higher because initially PS4 was supplied with 512MB chips (x16 = 8GB).
It's partially a technical reason as console manufacturer's depend on 3rd parties for memory chips, but beside that the capacity of said chips and the price per chip.
Balancing out power draw, price and space on the PCB, heat, etc etc all comes into play but that's with pretty much any large component and stuff R*D goes into.