What? Who cares what happened. She's been let go. It's never your own accord when your boss says "you've been let go. You're fired." That's it. No matter if you're president of your own department, if the top people of the company decides they want to go a different direction and you're not a part of it, you don't get to decide your own accord. What happens within should stay within; personnel evaluation are private. If Amy chooses to write her autobiography one day and tell the truth, we'll find out then. If you want to know now because you're a big fan of hers, start digging.
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Scott Rohde on Amy Hennig's Departure [Up: Naughty Dog responds]
- Thread starter Jonboy
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They'll sue the fuck out of her claiming she violated her NDA, and take back the severance package. There is a reason why you sign a NDA.
More people should understand this.
graywolf323
Member
what? that's a huge stretch, she was there for what ten years? just because she was fired doesn't mean she wants to burn bridges
They confirmed that they as co-presidents of the company were responsible for her leaving. The people who claimed they will buy ND games used now to punish them have no reason to change from that.
Juliet's 8½ Spirits
Banned
no, but they can/will sue her
No one is asking for that, just for them to elaborate on the accusation that Neil and Bruce were responsible.
It's no reference, what part of the game's industry wouldn't consider them to be rockstars after TLoU?
It's hard to imagine the internal talk within the studio, but just for Amy it must be brutal, she's been directing action games for fifteen years, Bruce and Neil took major roles in UC2, it achieved new levels of acclaim for the studio, then they made TLoU, which was a major step up and beyond anything Amy's made.
She went from being the creative force of the studio to playing second fiddle overnight. Even without whatever forced her out the studio, it must be incredibly deflating to see TLoU blow up the way it did, and the pressure to deliver with UC4 must be obscene right now, most people don't know or care that there are two ND teams. Uncharted is Sony's flagship title, and ND are expected to deliver a technological monster, just thinking about that situation makes my blood pressure spike.
Lol, I guess need to pay closer attention to the wonderful journalism in the Enquirer too.
They could probably sue her.
Based on the evidence we have, I'd say we should wait for more information to come to light before pointing any fingers.
Yep. One person does not take on the entire responsibility for that. Under the assumption the game is on track, it is not the best idea to place a negative stigma when that particular staff member has likely been on since pre-production.
I have no love for IGN but them sticking to their story is the kind of thing you want your journalists to do. Aren't we always picking on IGN et al. for being mouthpieces for devs and publishers?
I'm sure the love people have for ND's games is influencing the way some people approach this topic. When Klepek broke the Infinity Ward scandal, did we demand he reveal his sources and accuse him of clickbaiting? Of course not, because no one loves Bobby Kotick's Activision.
I'm sure the love people have for ND's games is influencing the way some people approach this topic. When Klepek broke the Infinity Ward scandal, did we demand he reveal his sources and accuse him of clickbaiting? Of course not, because no one loves Bobby Kotick's Activision.
Wells and Balestra are much higher profile figures and they took responsibility for Hening leaving. They are literally the company personified.
Commanche Raisin Toast
Member
god forbid both parties have some professionalism and refrain from giving us details about what happened.
Bruce and Neil, according to ND and Sony, weren't involved in why she left, and are claiming that the IGN report was false. if Neil and Bruce weren't involved then Sony and ND are legally allowed to talk about that.
they've gone above and beyond necessary by even giving us these statements. i think it needs to be let go.
Bruce and Neil, according to ND and Sony, weren't involved in why she left, and are claiming that the IGN report was false. if Neil and Bruce weren't involved then Sony and ND are legally allowed to talk about that.
they've gone above and beyond necessary by even giving us these statements. i think it needs to be let go.
Doctor_Thomas
Member
Right, here's what Mitch Dyer can do.
Get in contact with his "source" and find out what "forced out" actually means because, as it stands, it could mean:
- They physically marched her out the door
- They took over Uncharted 4, leaving her with nothing
- She didn't like their approach to the TLOU DLC and felt pressured to leave
- She felt pressured to follow up on The Last of Us and cracked
- She was unhappy with the attention being heaped on them
- There was a bust up over the direction the studio should go
- She just dislikes the atmosphere in the studio
- Management unhappy with Uncharted 4 writing and got someone else to help clean it up
- They wanted to make Uncharted 4 more like The Last of Us and she objected and was fired immediately.
- And so on and so on.
What does "forced out" mean?
Get in contact with his "source" and find out what "forced out" actually means because, as it stands, it could mean:
- They physically marched her out the door
- They took over Uncharted 4, leaving her with nothing
- She didn't like their approach to the TLOU DLC and felt pressured to leave
- She felt pressured to follow up on The Last of Us and cracked
- She was unhappy with the attention being heaped on them
- There was a bust up over the direction the studio should go
- She just dislikes the atmosphere in the studio
- Management unhappy with Uncharted 4 writing and got someone else to help clean it up
- They wanted to make Uncharted 4 more like The Last of Us and she objected and was fired immediately.
- And so on and so on.
What does "forced out" mean?
TheDarkKnight774
Member
well they need to actually expound on the events if they back it.
I don't see why ND presidents would lie about Staley and Druckman NOT being involved. I can't imagine them being naive enough to think that if that was the case, it wouldn't get out sooner or later. People move throughout the industry constantly, so I'm sure the whole story will get out from former ND employees who knew the details of the firing.
EL CUCO
Member
Thanks!
Idk man...leaving presumably halfway through production on your first heavy hitting next gen game is a pretty significant move.
Scott Rhode's statement seems like pretty standard PR-ish. Something pretty drastic had to have happened.
BloodMoney
Banned
onward and upward
Of course they fire people, but speculating that Druck and Stray told him how the project was fairing, and that Ann might be an issue isn't unreasonable. Everyone's clean, and everyone will die in the next Uncharted, win win.
If Drake dies in the next one, I would buy a PS4 to play it. Seriously, not even Kojima got to kill a totem yet. I was so hyped at the start of Uncharted 3, then sad. It never got better.
I hope you're reading this Naughty Dog.
Jest Chillin
Member
How do you come to the conclusion in bold?
No one is necessarily guilty of anything. Just because you worked with a criminal doesn't mean that this situation is in any way comparable.
D
Deleted member 80556
Unconfirmed Member
Cue the IGN image of the 1080p thread that said "If we're wrong, we're wrong, we don't really care".
So let me get this right: If they don't respond "they are totally hiding something and don't want to put more attention to it", but if they respond "oh we weren't totally there, so there was probably something else there!"
For Christ's sakes, people.
I don't know why, but I'm starting to feel that you're using the PS logo in your avatar ironically.
They commented on this already ridiculous situation to set the record straight. It's a shame they have to dignify the rumor in the first place. There's no evidence whatsoever to show that Bruce and Neil had a grudge with Amy or wanted her out.
So let me get this right: If they don't respond "they are totally hiding something and don't want to put more attention to it", but if they respond "oh we weren't totally there, so there was probably something else there!"
For Christ's sakes, people.
I don't know why, but I'm starting to feel that you're using the PS logo in your avatar ironically.
They commented on this already ridiculous situation to set the record straight. It's a shame they have to dignify the rumor in the first place. There's no evidence whatsoever to show that Bruce and Neil had a grudge with Amy or wanted her out.
This is what you got out of it? Is your monitor broken and you can't read or something?
I know that an Uncharted game without Amy Hennig is going to turn out differently than an Uncharted game made by her, for better or worse. To claim nothing changes is ridiculous, unless the game is done and coming out next month.
That's now how the development process works on those games. They don't write and hand off a script, they supervise every bit right up to the end.
See above. There's no way Amy Hennig is proposing a follow-up project when they aren't even close to being finished with Uncharted.
"[I'm] never going to agree with the term 'pushed out'" implies to me that whatever happened at least somewhat resembled being pushed out, and Naughty Dog's additional comment seems to reinforce that in their emphasizing a shifting of responsibility as opposed to any actual denials.
It's possible Amy Hennig's leaving was perfectly mundane, but suddenly I feel there's a little more credence to the idea that something "shadier" went down. The Druckmann and Straley bashing remains as silly as it ever was, though.
Edit: "Shadier" is a terrible word to use in this case, even in quotes. I just mean that it seems Hennig may not have left on her own terms after all, and it's surprising Naughty Dog would let someone like her go.
It's possible Amy Hennig's leaving was perfectly mundane, but suddenly I feel there's a little more credence to the idea that something "shadier" went down. The Druckmann and Straley bashing remains as silly as it ever was, though.
Edit: "Shadier" is a terrible word to use in this case, even in quotes. I just mean that it seems Hennig may not have left on her own terms after all, and it's surprising Naughty Dog would let someone like her go.
It's also been in development for longer than any of the other games in the series have been already and we haven't even seen it. They probably have a very well defined path for it.
I know how development works and I know a lot about the process at ND. Of course things change over time but the main story points have likely been set in stone for a long time and teams decide what their next project is long before completion.
Fired by boss =/= forced out by co-workers. That's the rumor that was reported, and that's why ND responded.
Vire
Member
It wasn't run as a rumor, it was run as a report of what happened.
That is all that was said. If you are going to personally single out the names of two high profile developers and potentially damage their careers, you need to provide more evidence than a one-off line that may or may not be substantiated.
Talk about why they would cause a possible force out. Creative differences? Sexism? Say something.
You are talking about people's livelihoods. It's called responsible journalism. You don't just say something like that so casually.
Nightengale
Member
This.
Neither of them are denying the fact that it was an unhappy split that was mutual. Just the involvement of B & D.
If the two of them really were the masterminds,it will come out sooner or later.
shinra-bansho
Member
People expect Wells and Balestra to divulge the exact nature of Hennig's departure? They're only making a statement to dispel a false insinuation about two of their other employees.
It could have been that they couldn't reach an agreement towards renewing her tenure, it could be that she simply wanted a move, it could be that Wells and Balestra were unhappy with her project management, it could be many things. None of which they're going to spell out, nor do companies usually divulge.
I am curious about how much there's genuine concern for the treatment of Hennig, who I consider a great talent and has given me fantastic games to play, and how much is just "Look how horrible ND are" point scoring.
It could have been that they couldn't reach an agreement towards renewing her tenure, it could be that she simply wanted a move, it could be that Wells and Balestra were unhappy with her project management, it could be many things. None of which they're going to spell out, nor do companies usually divulge.
I am curious about how much there's genuine concern for the treatment of Hennig, who I consider a great talent and has given me fantastic games to play, and how much is just "Look how horrible ND are" point scoring.
Evidence of what? Short of leaked emails and anonymous sources, there likely won't be evidence of anything arriving anytime soon. It's in everybody's best interest to keep quiet here. Nobody wants to risk their careers over this, which is what going around badmouthing people would do. People from Naughty Dog doing that would make them look like bullies and Amy saying shit would make her seem disloyal.
In ten years we might find out the whole story when it's all cooled down (like I listened to an interesting interview regarding the localization disputes in MGS, many years after the fact). But we're not owed an explanation here, and people seem to be drawing wildly different conclusions from everything going on. Again, there's really not enough evidence to blame anyone here.
The cynicism from some of you people. Honestly I don't get it. You don't hear what you want to hear so you assume the worst. Why are you so emotionally invested in scandal being the only explanation for this?
ND doesn't owe anybody a detailed explanation except Amy. Have you never worked before? Situations in even the most amicable enviornments can change and people move on to different things. It doesn't mean it's some conspiracy or drama.
ND doesn't owe anybody a detailed explanation except Amy. Have you never worked before? Situations in even the most amicable enviornments can change and people move on to different things. It doesn't mean it's some conspiracy or drama.
Oyashrio-Sama
Member
There are no federal laws restricting what information an employer can disclose about former employees. If you were fired or terminated from employment, the company can say so. They can also give a reason as long as it is truthful as to what actually took place.
They got one right this week, when they broke the news that Amy Hennig was let go from Naughty Dog.
Callibretto
Member
Considering that one of the first thing sony said officially regarding her leaving is that uncharted schedule is not affected, maybe what happen is that after seeing tlou success, amy hennig feel like she has to step up and make some changes to uncharted 4, which will cause delay or rushed games to meet deadline. Naughty dog presidents doesn't want that, things got heated and led to her getting fired. Amy herself may felt a little bitter since tlou got the extended development time and she couldn't have one
one.
So in that scenario, druckmann and straley may be part of the reason she got fired, but they're not actively trying to force her out.
D
Deleted member 80556
Unconfirmed Member
I wonder how many of you guys that are thinking the Neil and Bruce rumor is true also thought that Ken Levine was the one who willingly closed Irrational.
Really, you think NDA's cover being fired now?
LookAtMeGo
Member
Well Mr. Dyer, it's a good thing the human eye can read bullshit otherwise you would be out of a job.
Really though, who slings accusations like that and doesn't back it up?
I am disapoint.
Really though, who slings accusations like that and doesn't back it up?
I am disapoint.
WordsintheWater
Member
*Sigh* all those posters on GAF that were quick to call Druckmann and Straley names, glad that their names are clear.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
I don't see how an official statement settles the deal. Hennig didn't come out and say the report was false and his twitter message about the deal indicates that something happened. We don't know how bad is what happened, but I don't see how we can go to the typical "lol gaming journalism" just with this.
Uh...yes?
EmptySpace
Banned
i do not want to believe ign, but at the same time no matter how much i like naughty dog and its games, i do not want to believe in them 100% as well. no company is going to throw their current employee under the bus for a person they just fired.
just use logic. think of a company, even the one you work for. there are a lot of politics that go around, and what seems like on the outside is far different that what internal employees think since they have that unique perspective. there are a lot of employees at naughty dog, 200+ people. not to mention the business-side of things at playstation, all of which can be valid sources that could have dropped some hints to ign. if ign did not break that story, we probably wouldn't even know amy isn't with the company anymore.
so i give ign the benefit of the doubt. i would not call them outright liars because at least they had the info that amy was even let go.
so what i am saying is there is probably some truth to that article made by ign, but they failed to communicate the truth properly.
hopefully the game press actually do their job.
bananafactory
Banned
Agreed, Naughty Dog is not obliged to give any more information than they are willing to share. They already dispelled the comment about Neil and Bruce.
The ONLY one here who needs to explain themselves is IGN. When you make an accusation that's in direct contradiction with an official statement from the company, you better fucking have more to back it up with than "Someone told us this, guys!"
The ONLY one here who needs to explain themselves is IGN. When you make an accusation that's in direct contradiction with an official statement from the company, you better fucking have more to back it up with than "Someone told us this, guys!"
Just reading all of this and people's theories is making me feel so uncomfortable. I don't know who to believe, but from all the different stories that have come out recently, it seems Sony and its studios is doing some serious restructuring, for better or worse.
I really hope Amy gets back on her feet soon. If it does come out that Neil and Bruce did have a part in it I'm going to be very disappointed, they seem like great guys and I simply cannot imagine them behaving in such a way.
I really hope Amy gets back on her feet soon. If it does come out that Neil and Bruce did have a part in it I'm going to be very disappointed, they seem like great guys and I simply cannot imagine them behaving in such a way.
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