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Shadow of the Colossus (PS4) new trailer from TGS

Jawbreaker

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PS3 Remaster vs PS4 Remake: Avion



 
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They probably don't want all that detailed texture work to get lost in blinding mist. The new column looks much better.

I dunno if it's just different time of day (is that even a thing in OG SotC?) in game but second pic definitely looked worse from a art direction standpoint.

It just doesn't have that Ueda ''mysterious green & grey light'' to it, which is also very strong in TLG by the way.

I know the game is still in the making, but a good remake is more than just incredible textures, the art has to be there too, if not better. You can't just have a bunch of technicians to update a piece of artwork without the artist being there telling them what to do.

Blueprint are a bunch of really good ''technicians'' but almost none of them are artists.
 

HueyFreeman

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I think we’re going to have to accept that there will be differences. The original game and remaster are still available to play. I really don’t think you can remake a game two generations old and not expect some differences if it’s done in a modern engine. A lot of ueda’s techniques are mitigation to tech limitations, he confirms this every time he’s interviewed

Blueprint are a bunch of really good ''technicians'' but almost none of them are artists.

I hope you’re basing this on some knowledge of Bluepoint - who are by all accounts a very talented, super hard working team - as opposed to just throwing around a baseless comment.
 

thelastword

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And that is already the PS4 Pro version... At least this version of the trailer says it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txSNn0zIltk

Poor anisotropic filtering really is the plague of this console generation. The strangest part, many cross gen games actually had no problem implementing AF on the PS3/Xbox360, but on PS4 and One.
Yet many games do have good levels of AF, so I'm thinking it's the developers more than anything. However for SOTC, I believe it's still early days and this is bluepoint afterall, so I expect proper AF to be implemented by release....But yes, we have had some issues with AF this gen...I still can't believe Strider was never patched with 16xAF on the PS4...
 

A-V-B

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Jun 10, 2013
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Is it impossible to make this 60fps on the Pro?



Great but the one on top has way better atmosphere and much better color & lighting, it could be just different time of day in game though. At least I hope.

Honestly it looks like they haven't applied any atmospheric effects or lighting to it. The outline of the Colossus vanishes into a background of the same exact color and conditions. Very flat "still in production" look. Almost like a PS2 Dynasty Warriors game. (Not that the assets are!)
 

Monocle

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I completely agree. The original had a very unique atmosphere, and the atmosphere was absolutely fundamental to the game's experience resonating. The textures are clearly much improved, but they change the atmosphere which is so very essential to the original. Based on what we've seen, it contributes to making it a more 'real', a more 'pristine', and more ominous/darker environment than what was found in the initial game. This goes at odds with creating the impression that the player characters is trespassing upon an almost 'sacred', much more worn and battered world from the original. The impact of the final much darker area is reflective of the story's development throughout the game and marks a notable shift as the player's own perspective has become altered. The world is 'empty' but its tranquil, other-worldly, full of detail, and gives the impression that it's veiled. The skybox and lighting isn't extremely realistic, it's extremely fitting in enhancing the feeling of the location. The bridge screenshot, the Phalanx shot, and the Gaius shot are the most worrying that they've traded the atmosphere of the original (which really was perfect for the story and setting) for a more vibrant (but occasionally 'gloomier') but seemingly less fitting newer one.

People joke about the chipped column, but the original was littered with small details like that which create a feeling of it being a lived in and detail-rich world. Yes, the remake isn't suddenly terrible because the column has been amended, but it removes some of the richness and world-detail for really no reason. It reminds me greatly of the Halo Anniversary remake. Yes, the new textures and lighting are technically better; they're more detailed and more reflective of the current extent of technology than the original was, but these adjustments can damage the entire tone of certain sections of the game resulting in a worse experience overall (to use the Halo Anniversary as an example, the level where the flood are introduced, and the library, come to mind where the newer textures betray the tone of the original and lead to a much worse experience). Having already played the HD Remaster of the original, I was quite indifferent to it before but happy that some friends would get the chance to play it, but the trailer hasn't inspired confident that they've been faithful to the tone of the original while modernising the experience (which I feel is in contrast to the Crash Bandicoot remake which, for the original at least, really captured the 'truth' of the design of the original while modernising it). EDIT: I should clarify that it's obviously to early to say how accurate the trailers are of course, perhaps the fully released game will be very faithful to the original's tone, but this trailer isn't very reassuring that will/would be the case.
Yeah, I'm getting a Halo Anniversary vibe too. What a mixed bag that was. Gorgeous detail in a style that utterly ruins the dark imposing interiors, the distinctive color palettes and atmospherics of the outside areas, and the vastness and complexity implied by the original outer surface of the Halo ring.

The lesson here is that if you're going to go nuts with detail, make sure to adhere to the original style as closely as possible.
 

breadtruck

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Please let me set my own controls.
I couldn't stand to play the remaster on PS3 due to how the controls felt (never played it in the PS2 era)
 

Shifty1897

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You guys, the more I look at this the more it looks artistically off. I'm not trying to be difficult but surely someone at Bluepoint is looking at that Avion shot comparison above and is thinking "we gotta do something about that."
 

ThatsMytrunks

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I'm hoping for the best, though I'm of course nervous about the changes in aesthetic. The dream for me would be a port of the PS3 remaster to PS4 with 4k/30 and 1080/60 as an option in addition to this nifty graphical overhaul, but I'm pretty sure that's unrealistic.

As far as price, I think $40's the likely point, but I'd buy the hell out of a collectors edition with a statue of a colossi.
 

BigEmil

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Yeah Bluepoint is too focused on texture details etc ignoring the atmosphere etc what makes the original looks awesome not too happy with this remaster
 

Jedi2016

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The more I look at some of those comparison screens, the more I realize that most of the original's "atmosphere" or "fog" effects is simply a ridiculously high level of bloom.

I wish Bluepoint would sit down and talk about it instead of just showing footage.. I'd like to know more about what they're doing, what they're keeping, what they're changing, etc.
 

8byte

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May 12, 2012
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If you are going to come back into the thread perhaps you should argue precisely why something is absurd or highlight who and where somebody is asking for a 'pixel perfect remaster' instead of just writing it off. The original was a highly well-regarded game critically which sold well-enough to justify receiving one of the "Greatest Hit" labels on PS2, a HD remaster on PS3, and now a remake on PS4. I think the market spoke loudly and clearly as to the status of the original game, and if you want to argue that a remake of a game that was so well-receiveded in almost every aspect should NOT be faithful to the tone of the original (and changing that tone is a necessity to "understand the market, the industry, or consumers"), when the tone played such a crucial component of its success, by all means I think most of us interested in the thread would be happy to read it.

Pixel perfect re-creation within the scope of this project is nearly impossible.

It's also worth noting that not everything about the original was a creative choice. Some creative choices are made out of necessity due to hardware constraints. Given that SotC definitely showed it was putting the PS2 to work, it's more than fair to assume that some of the creative choices were made in place of others, or to cover the absence of those that couldn't be accomplished.

That said, simply trying to make a pixel perfect remaster so close to the standard HD remaster would be a bit droll. There's also something to be said about a team sinking in hundreds of man hours per month to bring you a beloved title. To not grant them any creative liberties is asinene, particularly when they've already done that with a few other projects.

They aren't straying so far from the title that it will destroy what it is. Almost every complaint levied this far has been hyperbole. This isn't any different from people screaming about their childhood because their favorite movie is getting remade. You'll be okay. The original game will still exist. New people will probably enjoy this remaster. Let them enjoy it?

This is a highly beloved, artistically-minded game with a unique aesthetic. For some, the littlest changes are going to stick out

I could mention how it bothers me that Wander's stance is more upright than it was in the original. :p edit: it doesn't bother me a bit, it bother me a lot. Wander's animation in the remake is like a failed attempt at recreating the original.





I would question BluePoint's and whoever else is working on this thing's understand of the material.

^^^ Case in point. To question if they "understand the material" is such a self serving and pretentious thing to say. It's absurdly loaded with hyperbole.

They are taking some creative liberties. If you're so captured by the artistically inspired SotC, maybe you can appreciate some people being artistically inspired by a game that love and are recreating? Or should creatives just shelve all of their inspiration so they can make Mr. Negativity the pixel perfect remaster HE wants?
 

Thoraxes

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The more I look at some of those comparison screens, the more I realize that most of the original's "atmosphere" or "fog" effects is simply a ridiculously high level of bloom.

I wish Bluepoint would sit down and talk about it instead of just showing footage.. I'd like to know more about what they're doing, what they're keeping, what they're changing, etc.

They also used that stuff to obscure inadequacies.
 

Jawbreaker

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Please let me set my own controls.
I couldn't stand to play the remaster on PS3 due to how the controls felt (never played it in the PS2 era)

They're introducing "modernized" controls as an option. In theory, it should quell the complaints of those who were averse to the original controls.
 

notacat

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Already know they won't fix the horrible horse controls, my only bane in video gaming.

Still going to buy it though. SoTC blew me away. With it's 10fps content on PS2, way past it's end of life.

So figuring the remake can only make it better, even though I already liked it despite all those things.
 

Neith

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You know, it's funny. I know that this is a major step up graphically, but in my memory, SotC looked just as good as that other than a few textures here and there. Power of amazing art direction, people.

Not that I object to this game in any way. I love the concept of remakes so long as the original remains accessible.

Well you should probably remind your memory that this game kinda looks bad even in the HD version.
 

Neith

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I agree, in terms of the art. That said, as someone who's only played the original...will be nice to play without the framerate chugging.

I don't agree with this at all. This game looks amazing.

I played through the HD version and honestly it never really blew me away because the graphics were so dated. The technical problems were numerous even in the HD version. You are never going to please everyone.
 

RoboPlato

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There were a number of artistic inconsistencies and missing visual effects whenever we got footage of the Uncharted collection, even up to a couple months before launch. All that was ironed out by release. Bluepoint does several passes for that stuff.
 

Jawbreaker

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There were a number of artistic inconsistencies and missing visual effects whenever we got footage of the Uncharted collection, even up to a couple months before launch. All that was ironed out by release. Bluepoint does several passes for that stuff.

That's why I'm not worried. Not only do they know their shit on a technical level, but outside of Sony Japan and genDESIGN/Team Ico, no one knows the game better than Bluepoint.
 

Azzanadra

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Any chance of additional Colossi and new game play elements?

Or maybe we finally get the "hidden ending" (aka the fanservice one that never actually existed) where Wander managed to not get sucked in by the vortex thing and lives happily ever after?
 

Jawbreaker

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Any chance of additional Colossi and new game play elements?

Or maybe we finally get the "hidden ending" (aka the fanservice one that never actually existed) where Wander managed to not get sucked in by the vortex thing and lives happily ever after?

Unless they're lying and keeping it a surprise, no. Just expect a remake, an optional control scheme that's more in line with "modern' games, and possibly a re-orchestrated (hopefully optional) soundtrack.
 

RoboPlato

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Fog and the heavy bloom also may have been disabled for trailer purposes just to demonstrate the texture and asset improvements.
 
May 5, 2013
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Already know they won't fix the horrible horse controls, my only bane in video gaming.

Still going to buy it though. SoTC blew me away. With it's 10fps content on PS2, way past it's end of life.

So figuring the remake can only make it better, even though I already liked it despite all those things.

The horse controls were fine and the ai was pretty good. The 10th Colossi was the only boss with many issues and that had more to do with the boss mechanics than Agro. Going through tight spaces just take your hands off of the controller and he gets through on his own. In forest areas with multiple pathways he'll get stuck occasionally but you're better off going through them on foot as they're pretty small.
 

Inuhanyou

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This looks just wrong.
Why is it so hard to simply stick to the original lighting and color palette?

There was no lighting in the original game, just overagressive bloom. Same with the fog effects, they were primarily there to mask geometry pop in and low LODs into the distance.

Art style changes with the growth of technology is just a fact of life
 

Danjin44

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Already know they won't fix the horrible horse controls, my only bane in video gaming.

Still going to buy it though. SoTC blew me away. With it's 10fps content on PS2, way past it's end of life.

So figuring the remake can only make it better, even though I already liked it despite all those things.

WHAT!!! The horse controls were fucking awesome. I loved it. It really felt Argo was alive instead of being just another vehicle.
 

Baroquemantic

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PS3 Remaster vs PS4 Remake: Avion



I disagree that there's less atmosphere in the remake shot. The remake looks like a different time of day and has a more haunting vibe to it, with the original look being more whimsical(?). It's a completely different tone, but still just as atmospheric. And speaking of, it'd be cool to fight the colossi in a different time of day. Some nighttime fights under the moonlight could be amazing.
 

notacat

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Yes, the "Horse controls" were great. My bad.

No, that horse was an ass and he hated me as much as I did it. It showed through the entire game. I eventually got kinda used to it though.

Much like how you get used to spooning lava into your mouth when you're dead and in hell, with satan laughing the entire time, proud you fell for his lies of good "realistic" horse controls.