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[Bluth54]

So why hasn't any gaming journo asked EA what exactly this restrictive policy is? EA keeps throwing that term out there...

Basically any game released on Steam has to have it's DLC sold through Steam. Game developers and publishers are still free to sell their DLC anywhere else and Valve doesn't get a cut of that, just the DLC sold through Steam.

They don't even have to intergrate the DLC with Steam, for example buying DLC on Steam for Batman Arkham City just give you a code to put in the Games for Windows Live Marketplace. And if you decide to just buy your DLC for Arkham City through the GFWL Marketplace it will work just fine with the Steam version and Valve didn't see a penny of it.

So it's actually less restrictive then what EA deals with on Xbox Live and Playstation Network.

 

[charlequin]

It's well within EAs rights to want full DLC control, but it's disingenuous to refer to it as "restrictive", because it's just as restrictive as charging 30% for the game to be on the service in the first place.

It's also disingenuous for EA to claim it's about "interacting with customers" or other such nonsense. Mojang and Nadeo were both quite straightforward about their desire to run central services that handled all free and paid updates for their products and the incompatibility this had with Steam distribution.

 

[Thoraxes]

Lol @ the butt hurt steam fanboys.. So apparently this game sucks now because you can't buy it through steam. Good grief! Just buy it another way and enjoy what will probably be a contender for GOTY 2012

I'm not mad because it isn't on Steam, i'm mad because it uses Origin exclusively and Origin is a service that can completely lock you out of all your games for saying "shit" or "fuck" once.

 

[AcceptableGhost]

Basically any game released on Steam has to have it's DLC sold through Steam. Game developers and publishers are still free to sell their DLC anywhere else and Valve doesn't get a cut of that, just the DLC sold through Steam.

They don't even have to intergrate the DLC with Steam, for example buying DLC on Steam for Batman Arkham City just give you a code to put in the Games for Windows Live Marketplace. And if you decide to just buy your DLC for Arkham City through the GFWL Marketplace it will work just fine with the Steam version and Valve didn't see a penny of it.

So it's actually less restrictive then what EA deals with on Xbox Live and Playstation Network.

It is actually one of the best things Valve has done to ensure great customer experience (along with getting Valve more money obviously). As a customer EA's Mass Effect 2 DLC was pretty much a nightmare scenario, I am glad Valve did this.

 

[Helmholtz]

Sucks that people who started collecting these games on Steam can't complete the trilogy now. Such a bummer.

 

[heliosRAzi]

Downloading DLC for ME2 was a confusing nightmare and if Origin is anything like that, then I'll pass.

 

[SteveWinwood]

It amazes me that ea loves money so much that they actively try to not take it from some people.

 

[FLEABttn]

because it's just as restrictive as charging 30% for the game to be on the service in the first place.

30% isn't restrictive in any sense of the word. Someone clearly doesn't work with money or selling products.

 

[Rebel Leader]

Did we ever figure out Steams' "strict" TOS with developers?

That they claim

 

[KarmaCow]

Did we ever figure out Steams' "strict" TOS with developers?

That they claim

IIRC it was that you needed to use Steam to sell DLC. Valve added it when they added F2P games. GFWL was grandfathered in. I think Notch and the Trackmania people said something similar when they were asked why their games weren't on steam.

 

[HP_Wuvcraft]

Did we ever figure out Steams' "strict" TOS with developers?

That they claim

Read this very page of they thread?

Steam wants to have all DLC sold through Steam. EA doesn't.

 

[zychi]

There's a few easy solutions to avoid Origin if you don't plan on playing the MP or Co-Op or whatever thing Bioware is shoveling into my SP story.

Buy the game. Install it. Crack it.
or
Buy it on a console.

I personally don't care about Origin as I've been using it for months now with BF3.

 

[DTKT]

Read this very page of they thread?

Steam wants to have all DLC sold through Steam. EA doesn't.

Steam doesn't care if you sell it elsewhere, it just also want to have the content.

Makes sense.

 

[Yeef]

Lol @ the butt hurt steam fanboys.. So apparently this game sucks now because you can't buy it through steam. Good grief! Just buy it another way and enjoy what will probably be a contender for GOTY 2012

I've never thought any of the Mass Effect games were amazing. I bought both for less than $20. They're good enough, but far from top-tier, in my opinion. It's still baffling to me that Mass Effect 2 won game of the year on GAF, but to each their own. Anyway, It's not a huge loss if I don't get to play the third, especially after seeing that 'gameplay' video they had during the VGAs.

On the plus side, before this thread I hadn't heard of Kingdoms of Amalur, so something good came out of all of this. That game looks interesting.

 

[shintoki]

It is actually one of the best things Valve has done to ensure great customer experience (along with getting Valve more money obviously). As a customer EA's Mass Effect 2 DLC was pretty much a nightmare scenario, I am glad Valve did this.

It probably saves a lot of hassle with compatibility issues also. It made no sense why Mirror's Edge DLC did not work with the Steam version for example. Or the nightmare of ME2/DA DLC. Or why I think I had 3 or 4 different accounts required for different services for EA titles. Or why don't the SecuROM revoke tools work for every title they put it in? Or why the Battlefield Heroes data was leaked and installed in such basic security that someone made a 1 line script to crack them? Or on the console side where they like to close servers down. Yeah, I went off topic with it at the end, but its exactly why any gamer should be weary of EA.


Another point mentioned a lot is EA's customer service. While true its better than Valve's, I'll also ask why did you need it in the first place? All my Valve games registered for Steam. They actually gave me the entire Half Life pack for my CS copy too. Just like that. I didn't have to go to the CS line and ask them to register it to my account. 2+ years since I hoped on board the Steam train and I never needed them for anything. If I have to contact CS right when I make my account to register games I've purchased just from a year ago. I don't see it as a good thing even if they let me do it. Bnet let me do the same thing Valve did. Part of a good service is making going to that help line the last option.

 

[Nemo]

Eh, don't really care about that. What I do care about is the stupid decision of not including native 360 pad support :/ Has refrained from playing the series

 

[HP_Wuvcraft]

Steam doesn't care if you sell it elsewhere, it just also want to have the content.

Makes sense.

All the DLC that exists to be sold through Steam? It makes perfect sense for them. Just like doing Origin to counter that makes perfect sense for EA.

I see where my wording is confusing in the initial post. But honestly, a majority of games are becoming Steamworks-only now, so Steam is really getting what Steam wants.

 

[papersleeves]

I have 2 types of games on my PC. Retail boxed games all installed in a \games folder and Steam. Steam manages its part of the games. I do mine. I simply do not want to reinstall Origin ever again. With all the horror stories I've heard plus my own problem I've had with the service, why would I jeopardize half of my DD game library ? The reality is that Steam has been very, very good to me since 2004 and because of that, I am loyal to it. Makes sense right ?

If EA wants me to buy one of their games, they'll have to sell it on Steam OR sell it in a retail box with no obligation to install Origin afterward. That's how it's going to be. Not the other way around. This is my term. Now, EA obviously doesn't give a fuck for customer like me. That's fine. It's their right. Just like it is mine to not buy their games.

Fortunately for me, my slowly but surely growing lack of interest regarding games helps me not bend over. I still do love gaming, but I do not feel obligated anymore to buy specific games, meaning I can skip whatever the fuck I want.

 

[Stumpokapow]

All the DLC that exists to be sold through Steam? It makes perfect sense for them. Just like doing Origin to counter that makes perfect sense for EA.

Steam's rule is "If you sell your game on Steam, and you sell DLC, that DLC has to be at least available on Steam." Their argument is that it's easier on users, and that DLC is an increasing revenue stream so putting out a product on the store, leveraging the store to get more eye-traffic and sales, and then cutting them out of the DLC action is unfair.

Given that Mass Effect 2 is on Steam, and the DLC is not on Steam, and that DLC has never been put on sale, and you have to get BioWare Bucks to buy it, and it's a pain in the butt, I think it's fair to say that the user argument is true.

 

[Stallion Free]

Bioware points can go die in a fire. I'm pretty sure I still have some awkward amount left because of the shitty increments they force you to buy them in.

 

[shintoki]

Bioware points can go die in a fire. I'm pretty sure I still have some awkward amount left because of the shitty increments they force you to buy them in.

 

[Burekma]

To all the people theorizing about DLC being the issue, Back to Karkand (BF3 DLC) is being sold outside of Origin as well, which obviously means EA has zero problems sharing DLC profits with retailers. This should make that specific Steam's requirement irrelevant.

 

[Pureauthor]

To all the people theorizing about DLC being the issue, Back to Karkand (BF3 DLC) is being sold outside of Origin as well, which obviously means EA has zero problems sharing DLC profits with retailers. This should make that specific Steam's requirement irrelevant.

Yes, we know that it's just a cheap excuse from EA.

 

[papersleeves]

Perhaps EA wanted special treatment, and Valve simply denied it so they went ape shit with Origin ? Just a conjecture here.

 

[NIGHT-]

Day one!! ME 1 and 2 were incredible! No way am I skipping this

 

[morningbus]

Day one!! ME 1 and 2 were incredible! No way am I skipping this

Interesting. You're acting like you haven't already posted in this thread.

 

[Stallion Free]

Interesting. You're acting like you haven't already posted in this thread.

But Mass Effect 1/2 were *incredible*!!!!111

 

[Derrick01]

Perhaps EA wanted special treatment, and Valve simply denied it so they went ape shit with Origin ? Just a conjecture here.

Of course they wanted special treatment. Why do you think sony and ms let them use their own servers? They threw a tantrum last gen and refused to put their games out on xbox 1 at first, and the system was crushed. They hold too much power...but not on PC.

 

[NIGHT-]

Of course they wanted special treatment. Why do you think sony and ms let them use their own servers? They threw a tantrum last gen and refused to put their games out on xbox 1 at first, and the system was crushed. They hold too much power...but not on PC.

To be fair, it seems like they held more power than gen than this current one

 

[rollingstart]

Admittedly this switch makes Mass Effect 3 seem less valuable because of the service. It's hard to make a digital/service purchase seem like you own it instead of an extended rental. Depending on the service's security and whatnot, it's hard to feel comfortable with the purchase knowing you may not always own it, even though you bought it. It's why I have a problem buying things from Nintendo's online stores. It's not some "Origin sucx; Steam rulez" thing. I use Origin for a few games because I bought them on Amazon sales or retail; I like things about it like binding any elsewhere EA purchase to receive a free digital copy. It's a lot of minor things. Like there's no mention of backing up your software, or if there are plans in case the service fails and what happens to all our purchases.

I'm probably still buying ME3. Probably definitely. The $60 for a PC game is bothersome too, but that's a whole other thing. Though on the bright side, I'd much rather buy Origin funbucks than Bioware's proprietary shit. I got one of those point cards during an Origin sale, so I might actually get around to the ME2 DLC. Amazingly they haven't cut the cost since release; Origin, at least in this "come us our service!" period has deals all the time.

 

[papersleeves]

Of course they wanted special treatment. Why do you think sony and ms let them use their own servers? They threw a tantrum last gen and refused to put their games out on xbox 1 at first, and the system was crushed. They hold too much power...but not on PC.

Fortunately.

 

[RedSwirl]

The problem with DLC and Steam is that Valve doesn't want someone to release an F2P game on Steam, then sell all the DLC somewhere else and cause the game's entire revenue stream to bypass Valve.

 

[RedSwirl]

Except that Steam asks you if you want to participate. You click "No, Thanks" and your fine.

I think the OP just stated that Origin will also let you opt-out of data mining when you install ME3.

 

[Derrick01]

I think the OP just stated that Origin will also let you opt-out of data mining when you install ME3.

Yeah you get out of Bioware's data mining, not Origin's as a whole.

 

[jediyoshi]

Steam's rule is "If you sell your game on Steam, and you sell DLC, that DLC has to be at least available on Steam." Their argument is that it's easier on users, and that DLC is an increasing revenue stream so putting out a product on the store, leveraging the store to get more eye-traffic and sales, and then cutting them out of the DLC action is unfair.

Is there a quote or source that this is attributed to? With the amount of leeway Steam seems to give to this, every single bit of speculation is just caught up in the tiniest bit of semantics.

 

[scitek]

Steam has fine customer support, it's just inexcusably fucking slow. Takes a week to get a refund.

 

[Complistic]

They just know if they put it on steam, no one's going to buy from their terrible new service so they're using the BS dlc and "restrictive" arguments to justify keeping it off there.

 

[HP_Wuvcraft]

They just know if they put it on steam, no one's going to buy from their terrible new service

I honestly doubt they care if people buy their product from Origin or not. This is all about how much money they get.

Trying to act like EA is doing this just because they want to spite consumers is a stupid argument. It makes no sense and is simply a byproduct of the "EA must be evil no matter what" line of thinking.

 

[Snuggles]

I honestly doubt they care if people buy their product from Origin or not. This is all about how much money they get.

Trying to act like EA is doing this just because they want to spite consumers is a stupid argument. It makes no sense and is simply a byproduct of the "EA must be evil no matter what" line of thinking.

I don't think the quoted poster was suggesting that EA is doing this to spite us, he was just saying that most gamers would go with Steam over Origin, even if Origin offered a better value with exclusive preorder crap or a discounted price. It's what the people want. But this way, no one has a choice, install Origin or don't play it at all. It's really the only way EA can get people to use Origin.

 

[bhlaab]

All of the characters fuck. All of them. They fuck each other a TON.

There, now you don't need to buy this game.

 

[PatrickLyons]

can anyone who actually has experience with origin comment on whether this is likely to actually result in inconvenience beyond needing to re-register a game on steam to make it appear in that games list?

 

[darkpower]

I've been trying Origin, and right now, there have been a few things I don't really like as opposed to Steam. You have to reinstall games if you decide to move the Origin folders (something you don't have to do on Steam if you move that directory to another drive). There's no achievements yet, and I don't know why EA hasn't added them in yet since I thought they were working on that.

Also, the product codes from Steam will work for Origin, but not vice versa. There's a possible good reason for this, and this leads to my major complaint.

It's that EA seems to just be pushing this Origin thing the way they do as a means to have complete control of their prices. Steam has some damn good deals, sometimes on EA games. Having EA games be exclusive to the Origin platform means that they don't have to participate in the Steam deals and keep their prices however they want. Nothing to do with whatever explanation they gave about the DLC (I can't be bothered to look it up at the moment), but rather the pricing. It's kind of suspicious that they are citing something that's never been a problem with them before on Steam. I think it's because they can't get away with the pricing points that they want to on Steam or other PC DD platforms, and since EA owns Origin, they can just do whatever they want to you or your games without having to answer to a middle man.

That last point is more or less one of the major reasons why people are so outraged. That and the fact that EA has just shown that they don't care about the outrage. They are probably just seeing the outrage as a means to prove that they should continue to do this crap. They're forcing Origin down our throats, and nothing we are doing are convincing them to even try to make peace with Valve or whoever else they have an issue with.

 

[EatChildren]

can anyone who actually has experience with origin comment on whether this is likely to actually result in inconvenience beyond needing to re-register a game on steam to make it appear in that games list?

Outside of the personal grievances people have with EA's business model, Origin's design, and a few technical quirks, installing and playing games is a quick and easy process. Assuming Origin is running you wont have problems booting the game.

 

[Goldstorm]

Steam has some damn good deals, sometimes on EA games. Having EA games be exclusive to the Origin platform means that they don't have to participate in the Steam deals and keep their prices however they want.

Steam can't make deals and lower prices without the publisher's (EA) permission. It's not benevolent Steam that gives you these prices, it's EA. Sometimes, EA games are even cheaper on Steam than Origin. All your post is wrong then.

 

[Edgeward]

can anyone who actually has experience with origin comment on whether this is likely to actually result in inconvenience beyond needing to re-register a game on steam to make it appear in that games list?

I recently bought DAO Ultimate and activated it on Origin, once I got it I never opened Origin again and just put a shortcut on Steam. This news doesn't bother me or even make me care all that much. It's fine for me.

 

[faceless007]

Having EA games be exclusive to the Origin platform means that they don't have to participate in the Steam deals and keep their prices however they want.

Just to clarify, no EA game is Origin-exclusive (meaning only available for purchase directly through EA). They are and still will be available for purchase on other DD outlets like Amazon DD (great sale right now), D2D, GG, etc. In any case, they never had to participate in Steam sales in the first place.

It's kind of suspicious that they are citing something that's never been a problem with them before on Steam.

Whether or not you believe it's EA's real reason, I don't think it's disputed that Valve in fact changed the terms of their content distribution agreements recently due to the introduction of F2P games on Steam. So there is at least some justification for why this is happening now when it didn't before.

I think it's because they can't get away with the pricing points that they want to on Steam or other PC DD platforms, and since EA owns Origin, they can just do whatever they want to you or your games without having to answer to a middle man.

Publishers set the prices of sales on Steam and every other outlet. Has nothing to do with being unable to set price points.

 

[Volcynika]

Just to clarify, no EA game is Origin-exclusive (meaning only available for purchase directly through EA). They are and still will be available for purchase on other DD outlets like Amazon DD (great sale right now), D2D, GG, etc. In any case, they never had to participate in Steam sales in the first place.


Whether or not you believe it's EA's real reason, I don't think it's disputed that Valve in fact changed the terms of their content distribution agreements recently due to the introduction of F2P games on Steam. So there is at least some justification for why this is happening now when it didn't before.


Publishers set the prices of sales on Steam and every other outlet. Has nothing to do with being unable to set price points.

Isn't Old Republic only available via Origin (at least through digital distribution)?

 

[mhayze]

The most likely reason is that steam wants publishers to drive in game content to be bought through steam (as opposed to being redirected to an external site / store). This means that Valve gets a piece of every transaction, but can now support f2p and any other kind of model, not requiring minimum prices. Fro EA's perspective they lose the ability to sell post purchase content without sharing the profit. You can see the conflict of interest there. Plus they must have decided that loss of current sales and angering a portion of their customer base is worth it to grow Origin.

 

[darkpower]

Steam can't make deals and lower prices without the publisher's (EA) permission. It's not benevolent Steam that gives you these prices, it's EA. Sometimes, EA games are even cheaper on Steam than Origin. All your post is wrong then.

So, because you corrected me on one point (which you didn't prove, anyway, since you want to judge who is right or wrong), my entire post is deemed completely inaccurate? Don't know what kind of logic went into that kind of conclusion!

The most likely reason is that steam wants publishers to drive in game content to be bought through steam (as opposed to being redirected to an external site / store). This means that Valve gets a piece of every transaction, but can now support f2p and any other kind of model, not requiring minimum prices. Fro EA's perspective they lose the ability to sell post purchase content without sharing the profit. You can see the conflict of interest there. Plus they must have decided that loss of current sales and angering a portion of their customer base is worth it to grow Origin.

I'm not sure if every online DD retailer does the same thing or not, but I would be shocked if Valve was the only one that had this kind of bullet point in their contracts with publishers. Again, I could be wrong about this, but I'd be very surprised if, say, Gamers Gate doesn't do something similar!

 

[Gen X]

Imagine what a clusterfuck PC gaming would be if every publisher ran their own distribution program that was limited to only their catalogue.

'Ooooh, I wonder what my mate is playing?'

*Loads up 17 different Publisher developed programs*

'Can't see him online, he must be stuck in traffic on the way home'.