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[NT80]

But, I am trying to explain to you that it won't be an issue as we have proof that near generational leaps are possible with in a generation with out a hick up on game development that provides varying performances levels from low to high settings. The next generation will be a smooth transition where games will be optimized to the fullest extended not matter next gen or current gen. Development for consoles basically has been unified with PC development with the release of DX12 Ultimate that is the bridge between PC's and XSX and its ecosystem creating a seamless transition.

Red Dead example is a whole different issue which has more to do with software/engine innovation than just a generational advancement add to that, that there is a 8 year gap, as well as the 1st Red Dead being made in a era where Moore's law was still in full swing and advancement increased rapidly and exponentially to a point now where some claim the law is dead or on a significant slow down so advancement is much slower.

You don't understand the difference between a mid gen refresh where a game is made for the lower end base console and then tarted up for the higher end console and a new generation where games are made specifically for that console and fully take advantage of what it brings. The mid gen refresh consoles were nowhere near being a near generational leap. We have a more significant upgrade with the new consoles than the last too. It's like it's a pointless upgrade to you

 

[Jigga117]

This is shaping up to be a real annihilation from MS. Those 1st party games from MS are going to look absolutely insane as they have more raw power to work with and more RT ability as well. Sony stumbled so badly for next generation, they should have taken their sweet time with PS5.

The system was built for 2019. The boost came when they found out by their own insiders what MS was doing.

 

[Jigga117]

Well, both consoles will suck with raytracing. They're both using CU's for ray tracing, as far as I'm understanding this.
People are gonna be so dissapointed when they see that console ray tracing will be used for some small rooms and shiny puddles of water and metallic surfaces.

? How do you post this and make the claim you just made in a thread that shows what MS is doing on Monday and what MS proved with the hardware ray tracing they are providing that is designed specifically to handle the ray-tracing to take the workload off the GPU???? Yet make a statement that BOTH will suck?

 

[Elektro Demon]

? How do you post this and make the claim you just made in a thread that shows what MS is doing on Monday and what MS proved with the hardware ray tracing they are providing that is designed specifically to handle the ray-tracing to take the workload off the GPU???? Yet make a statement that BOTH will suck?

You mean the Minecraft demo? That's laughable. That's a game that has very basic graphics, will the same level of raytracing be possible in a AAA level of quality game?
I don't think so.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

What I'm saying is that no way will the XSX ever have anything like it's full potential reached in a game while still having to release that same game on Xbox one. To think that is to ignore everything that's been coming out of Microsoft, Sony, developers and the tech heads about how significant the changes these new consoles will bring to game development.

But you're exaggerating the period in which they will even support cross-gen. And again, Sony will have at least a few cross-gen games as well. 3rd-parties will definitely have cross-gen titles. Cross-gen games are usually done by contracted 3rd-party studios. Engines are massively scalable in components going from graphics to AI to physics to logic. Etc. etc.

I explained every factor into this and why your notion doesn't hold up, including the actual time range for 1st party mandate on cross-gen support, how titles between next-gen and cross-gen will be developed (top-down, not down-up), and the fact that there really hasn't been full clarification from MS on how they will implement the cross-gen support. It could be through streaming via Xcloud for all we know. That would certainly be an option for supporting older systems down the line, without incurring any design limitations on 1st-party titles targeting XSX natively.

 

[Azurro]

The system was built for 2019. The boost came when they found out by their own insiders what MS was doing.

That's not how hw design works, that's not how ANY of this works, you don't engineer an entire machine around a sustained power envelope in just a year. Jesus, too many children that know nothing about hardware trolling over a 15-20% difference.

 

[NT80]

But you're exaggerating the period in which they will even support cross-gen. And again, Sony will have at least a few cross-gen games as well. 3rd-parties will definitely have cross-gen titles. Cross-gen games are usually done by contracted 3rd-party studios. Engines are massively scalable in components going from graphics to AI to physics to logic. Etc. etc.

I explained every factor into this and why your notion doesn't hold up, including the actual time range for 1st party mandate on cross-gen support, how titles between next-gen and cross-gen will be developed (top-down, not down-up), and the fact that there really hasn't been full clarification from MS on how they will implement the cross-gen support. It could be through streaming via Xcloud for all we know. That would certainly be an option for supporting older systems down the line, without incurring any design limitations on 1st-party titles targeting XSX natively.

That's not really the point I was making. I was just saying Series X won't fully realize it's full potential until it leaves the old Xbox One behind. I have no idea how Xcloud factors into it so I'm not considering that until there's clear info on how that'll work.

 

[sinnergy]

That's not how hw design works, that's not how ANY of this works, you don't engineer an entire machine around a sustained power envelope in just a year. Jesus, too many children that know nothing about hardware trolling over a 15-20% difference.

I bet that's what happened and I overclocked .

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

That's not really the point I was making. I was just saying Series X won't fully realize it's full potential until it leaves the old Xbox One behind. I have no idea how Xcloud factors into it so I'm not considering that until there's clear info on how that'll work.

What makes you think they won't? If there's one thing we've observed from MS (and like what Sony's realized as well), it's that they're pretty good at misdirecting. They likely misdirected Sony into thinking XSX was going to be something their original PS5 target could at least match if not beat (remember the rumors back in 2017 about MS leaving the gaming industry? Granted, they referenced actual comparatively poor XBO sales as the basis, but they went about nonetheless), and could have been misdirecting with the E3 2019 comments as well.

In any case you're looking at the dev process completely wrong; no one will invest money into systems as powerful as PS5 and XSX without having intent to fully exploit their capabilities. If any downports happen, that's exactly what they are: downports. And there's no saying if those are actually handled by the same teams doing the next-gen versions or not.

 

[tryDEATH]

You don't understand the difference between a mid gen refresh where a game is made for the lower end base console and then tarted up for the higher end console and a new generation where games are made specifically for that console and fully take advantage of what it brings. The mid gen refresh consoles were nowhere near being a near generational leap. We have a more significant upgrade with the new consoles than the last too. It's like it's a pointless upgrade to you

Just look at the state of PC gaming and stop running in circles. PC games have multiple entry levels and games run based on your own specific performance level, it will be like that for the next/current gen. Are you telling me games were held back on PC due to being made for consoles that is just silly.

You clearly have you head stuck in the sand and don't want to acknowledge all the advancement we have witnessed in the last 2 years with the mid gen refresh what is capable and how Xbox has basically now unified with PC gaming with DirectX12 Ultimate.

You want to believe that fanboi crap so you ignore everything around you. At this point its useless discussing this topic with you anymore as it seems I am talking to a wall, but I will come back to this exact discussion when we get the result and you will end up looking really stupid for ever believing those morons that are spreading this hypothetical limitation bullsh*t for next generation.

Have a nice day.

 

[Journey]

But that's a game that has very basic graphics, so a lot of gpu resources can be used for raytracing.
But will that level of raytracing be possible when you have an intense looking game with proper AAA graphics?
Personally, I don't think so, but we'll see.

Ok, but that's entirely the point. You can make a game like The Witness and go nuts with the Ray Tracing, remember how everyone was going nuts back in the PS4 launch about its visuals? just imaging how that would look using Full path ray tracing, or other small titles like Unravel, Little Nightmares, Inside, Ori, etc., besides, have you seen how amazing Minecraft can look at times? Now imagine the other titles mentioned plus new creations built from the ground up to work with Path Tracing?

 

[NT80]

Just look at the state of PC gaming and stop running in circles. PC games have multiple entry levels and games run based on your own specific performance level, it will be like that for the next/current gen. Are you telling me games were held back on PC due to being made for consoles that is just silly.

You clearly have you head stuck in the sand and don't want to acknowledge all the advancement we have witnessed in the last 2 years with the mid gen refresh what is capable and how Xbox has basically now unified with PC gaming with DirectX12 Ultimate.

You want to believe that fanboi crap so you ignore everything around you. At this point its useless discussing this topic with you anymore as it seems I am talking to a wall, but I will come back to this exact discussion when we get the result and you will end up looking really stupid for ever believing those morons that are spreading this hypothetical limitation bullsh*t for next generation.

Have a nice day.

I got my first gaming pc (dual core, GTX8800, 3gb ram) after the X360/PS3 which worked well for then but when the One/PS4 came out that wouldn't hold up for long. Requirements went up a lot during the next gen. Likewise my current setup (i5, GTX 670, 8GB DDR3 ram) is not going to meet the requirements for high end next gen games. They get left behind for good reason. Mid gen refreshes didn't massively put pc requirements up. Just wait and see what the games are like in the first 2 years and what there like when there no longer shackled by the current gen a few years later.

 

[NT80]

What makes you think they won't? If there's one thing we've observed from MS (and like what Sony's realized as well), it's that they're pretty good at misdirecting. They likely misdirected Sony into thinking XSX was going to be something their original PS5 target could at least match if not beat (remember the rumors back in 2017 about MS leaving the gaming industry? Granted, they referenced actual comparatively poor XBO sales as the basis, but they went about nonetheless), and could have been misdirecting with the E3 2019 comments as well.

In any case you're looking at the dev process completely wrong; no one will invest money into systems as powerful as PS5 and XSX without having intent to fully exploit their capabilities. If any downports happen, that's exactly what they are: downports. And there's no saying if those are actually handled by the same teams doing the next-gen versions or not.

What makes you think they will? When has a game that simultaneously released on a previous gen and a new gen been the best example of what the new gen can do? Just because they have the intent doesn't mean they can until there only developing for the new gen only. Many have said the new consoles offer significant advancements that will offer up new possibilities. I never got that sense from the last gen.