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So these "Walking Simulators" on Steam...
- Thread starter Alphahawk
- Start date
Give "Gravity Bone" a shot. It's one of my favorite game experiences, just make sure to go into it blind. Didn't care for the sequel (Thirty Flights of Loving) so much, though.
TheNoblePirate
Member
While I haven't played too many of these games, I really loved Proteus, has a really great aesthetic and sound design. Certainly a pleasant experience all around!
I'm not sure if I could find a better name for this genre...maybe "exploratory games"? "Exploratories" for short? I mean, the main draw is that you walk around and explore the setting ahead of you, although I wonder if that would work for more linear experiences. I mean, even if you aren't necessarily exploring scenery, you might be exploring themes, or feelings, or concepts. I dunno, just thinking out loud.
I'm not sure if I could find a better name for this genre...maybe "exploratory games"? "Exploratories" for short? I mean, the main draw is that you walk around and explore the setting ahead of you, although I wonder if that would work for more linear experiences. I mean, even if you aren't necessarily exploring scenery, you might be exploring themes, or feelings, or concepts. I dunno, just thinking out loud.
I've just heard the term now and I find it hilarious. I've nothing against the games in its crosshairs, and wouldn't be against playing any but you have to have a sense of humour about it. If someone picked on one of these games as a 'fucking walking simulator' naturally in conversation I'd laugh and try to see their point and somewhat do.
Being offended by the term is like being one of the shit-faced actors sat at the hilarious Ricky Gervais presented Golden Globes ceremonies.
Being offended by the term is like being one of the shit-faced actors sat at the hilarious Ricky Gervais presented Golden Globes ceremonies.
John Kowalski
Banned
Thirty Flights of Loving is one of my favorite things of all time.
diggmcbadass
Member
I liked Proteus, Gone Home and Dear Esther. The discussion regarding their status as games is kinda dumb. I enjoyed the stories that they told, and holding down W while looking at pretty graphics is about the same level of interactivity you get from most modern triple A campaigns anyway. Main difference is that the stories are usually more interesting in the indie stuff.
These sort of experiences are probably going to be more popular when VR hits it big.
These sort of experiences are probably going to be more popular when VR hits it big.
CecilRousso
Member
Thirty Flights of Loving and Proteus did nothing for me, but I thought Gone Home and The Stanley Parable were great.
So can walking! See! The name fits!
Proteus is awful, almost no gameplay, boring landscapes and ugly art style imho.
Dear Esther is just walking in a nice setting(loved the island) following some kind of narration I've found slighty interesting.
I don't recommend both of them.
Gone Home has good ideas, nice voice acting, 90s vibe but I think it could have been better, it was a let down for me.
The Stanley Parable is very original and interesting.
The Vanishing of Ethan Carter is very good but I haven't finished it yet.
Dear Esther is just walking in a nice setting(loved the island) following some kind of narration I've found slighty interesting.
I don't recommend both of them.
Gone Home has good ideas, nice voice acting, 90s vibe but I think it could have been better, it was a let down for me.
The Stanley Parable is very original and interesting.
The Vanishing of Ethan Carter is very good but I haven't finished it yet.
bobawesome
Member
Proteus is awful. I've tried to immerse myself on a few occasions but it really seems like the kind of game that was designed for the stoner crowd. It's definitely not the one I'd recommend you start with.
Weltall Zero
Member
I have nothing against the genre (in fact I think many of them like Proteus are a breath of fresh air), but "walking simulators" and "not games" both apply. The problem is that people, especially here, are so used to "game = good" that they immediately assume "not game = bad" and fall into defensive stance any time the comment is made. It's not a dishonor not to be a game . They would fall into the broader category of "interactive media", which also includes "interactive fiction".
You need mechanics to be mechanically deep or shallow. A walking simulator has no "mechanics", you just walk. If there are mechanics it's not a walking simulator by definition.
This is an apt comparison, in the sense that you had to add "bullshit" to provide loaded connotations where there were none: a lot of people that love "waifu RPGs" have no issues with the term.
But they're not; it's you who is interpreting it that way. Case in point:
See? If you're reading that every time someone calls something a walking simulator, you're simply being oversensitive, if not paranoid.
Still I know many fans of the genre (which BTW has no other descriptive term yet) will just be incensed anyone that uses it, so this post is probably useless anyway.
You need mechanics to be mechanically deep or shallow. A walking simulator has no "mechanics", you just walk. If there are mechanics it's not a walking simulator by definition.
This is an apt comparison, in the sense that you had to add "bullshit" to provide loaded connotations where there were none: a lot of people that love "waifu RPGs" have no issues with the term.
But they're not; it's you who is interpreting it that way. Case in point:
See? If you're reading that every time someone calls something a walking simulator, you're simply being oversensitive, if not paranoid.
Still I know many fans of the genre (which BTW has no other descriptive term yet) will just be incensed anyone that uses it, so this post is probably useless anyway.
I agree it's not for everyone, but I enjoyed the game a lot and gladly paid money for it.
Gone home is also pretty great. I'm looking forward to The Witness (although it has a puzzle focus, so it's a bit different).
Jazzpunk was also very interesting! I'd say it didn't impact me as much as the other two.
Baron von Loathsome
Member
I liked Gone Home,The Stanley Parable, and Jazzpunk. Haven't played any others.
I've largely seen the term used in a derogatory manner, however.
I've largely seen the term used in a derogatory manner, however.
storafötter
Member
Havent played many of them but isnt Unfinished Swan one? It had some interesting parts but it was pretty boring for most part.
VibratingDonkey
Member
The connotation that these games have less merit or value, that general derisive attitude the term evolved out of is shitty. but it's what we've had for so long now it's stuck.
It's also bad at accurately describing what these games are about. Walking is not the defining verb. There's walking in pretty much every game featuring a player character. Also they're not simulators.
To me, the definition of "walking simulator" is "environmental exploration and/or narration focused game with violence not being the main way of interaction".
Exploration is more key than walking. Whether you're exploring the environment or the narrative. First person exploration. Exploration-based adventure.
Anyway, I liked Gone Home, Ethan Carter, Stanley Parable.
Jazzpunk's alright.
Did not like Proteus, like, at all. It's my Vinny's Flower (35:00).
Suppose Flower is also a walking simulator, despite a distinct lack of walking. I liked Flower. Journey was ok.
Currently eyeing Homesick.
Also Sunset's been getting some good words said about it.
It's also bad at accurately describing what these games are about. Walking is not the defining verb. There's walking in pretty much every game featuring a player character. Also they're not simulators.
To me, the definition of "walking simulator" is "environmental exploration and/or narration focused game with violence not being the main way of interaction".
Exploration is more key than walking. Whether you're exploring the environment or the narrative. First person exploration. Exploration-based adventure.
Anyway, I liked Gone Home, Ethan Carter, Stanley Parable.
Jazzpunk's alright.
Did not like Proteus, like, at all. It's my Vinny's Flower (35:00).
Suppose Flower is also a walking simulator, despite a distinct lack of walking. I liked Flower. Journey was ok.
Currently eyeing Homesick.
Also Sunset's been getting some good words said about it.
Weltall Zero
Member
Catchy!
storafötter;166495119 said:
It's absolutely not one; it has mechanics and puzzle solving. And so does Journey, by the way; which is why (length aside) I disagree with the above definition: it would include both of these games, which are completely different beasts from what this thread is about.
I guess that comes down to whether you consider, say, a visual novel a game.
Most "walking simulators" have mechanics outside of walking (Ignoring how walking itself is a mechanic). Gone Home for example has you click on objects to examine them and pick them up.
Also, would adding mechanics make them more games? If you took Mario from Super Mario 64 and put him in Dear Esther, would it cease to be a walking simulator?
More_Badass
Member
It has some slight survival mechanics so it's technically not a pure "walking sim" but Eidolon is gorgeous
More_Badass
Member
Exploration, collecting items, piecing together a narrative. Most have a definite ending that you reach by achieving certain goals. Even Proteus has mechanics and an objective: finding and touching the stones.
Sure, some are essentially virtual art installations. But most are more than just walking
CitizenCope
Member
I may have trolled that game with that exact title on Twitch back in the day. I showed them!
DirtyLarry
Member
This topic reminded me that I cannot help but think that 10 years or so from now once VR is completely established and graphics are damn new life like, a big part of it is not even going to be games, but Historical Recreations.
Being a passenger on the Titanic as it is sinking.
The Normandy Invasion.
JFK the moments before he is assassinated.
Paul Revere letting everyone know "the British are coming"
It is literally endless. Just any major moments in history.
Sure, there have been games like the Medal Of Honor series that have already done this, but if it can be done in VR, as authentically replicated as possible, I think it would be huge, and actually appeal to a much wider audience than just gamers.
There is also Sports. I think so many people would love to experience some classic moments in sports history from the perspective of those who created them...
If no company is already thinking about this and I just created the next big thing, all I ask is you look me up and give me 2% of your profits.
The big thing to it being truly successful is iOS type pricing, with the pricing changing depending on the length and intensity of said moment.
But the visuals need to be damn near life like for it to really be a huge success. So I do believe we are no less than 10 years off. If not further.
Being a passenger on the Titanic as it is sinking.
The Normandy Invasion.
JFK the moments before he is assassinated.
Paul Revere letting everyone know "the British are coming"
It is literally endless. Just any major moments in history.
Sure, there have been games like the Medal Of Honor series that have already done this, but if it can be done in VR, as authentically replicated as possible, I think it would be huge, and actually appeal to a much wider audience than just gamers.
There is also Sports. I think so many people would love to experience some classic moments in sports history from the perspective of those who created them...
If no company is already thinking about this and I just created the next big thing, all I ask is you look me up and give me 2% of your profits.
The big thing to it being truly successful is iOS type pricing, with the pricing changing depending on the length and intensity of said moment.
But the visuals need to be damn near life like for it to really be a huge success. So I do believe we are no less than 10 years off. If not further.
The term was originally supposed to be derogatory, until people figured out that some of these games are actually pretty good. I've played Dear Esther, Gone Home, and The Old City, I've enjoyed them quite a lot. Got a couple of upcoming ones on my radar. I'll probably check out some of the others mentioned here. Sometimes I just want to experience something, I don't need bad guys or puzzles or mechanics or challenges.
SwordStruck
Member
Wow that looks incredible, will definitely check it out.
But yeah, Proteus was really great.
One of the big things with the Nick Arcade spiritual successor was that it was going to have an option to be on the "virtual set" using whatever VR set you had. I think such a thing could be huge. Imagine a show like Lost where you could walk around the island while events were happening,
Haunted
Member
In that case, you've just disqualified more than half of the games mentioned here.
I don't know how anyone can say that The Vanishing of Ethan Carter has no mechanics, it's a goddamn adventure/puzzle game. Eidolon or DayZ have mechanics that fall in line with their survival themes. Jazzpunk has many mechanics, there are a ton of big and small mechanics you experience throughout that game (games within games).
Looking over the examples in this thread, out appears that there aren't many games that get tagged with this attempted insult on Steam that actually have no mechanics other than walking around. Dear Esther, Proteus (P.T. also falls in this category, though it's not on Steam, obviously) - and then you've got something like Mountain, which clearly does not have any mechanics... not even walking around, so the walking simulator label would be wrong again.
I think that tag/label is a wholly unsatisfactory thing, borne out of spite and a lack of understanding and evolved from mean spirited insider joke into an actual thing.
Very disappointing, overall.
In that case, you've just disqualified more than half of the games mentioned here.
I don't know how anyone can say that The Vanishing of Ethan Carter has no mechanics, it's a goddamn adventure/puzzle game. Eidolon or DayZ have mechanics that fall in line with their survival themes. Jazzpunk has many mechanics, there are a ton of big and small mechanics you experience throughout that game (games within games).
Looking over the examples in this thread, out appears that there aren't many games that get tagged with this attempted insult on Steam that actually have no mechanics other than walking around. Dear Esther, Proteus (P.T. also falls in this category, though it's not on Steam, obviously) - and then you've got something like Mountain, which clearly does not have any mechanics... not even walking around, so the walking simulator label would be wrong again.
I think that tag/label is a wholly unsatisfactory thing, borne out of spite and a lack of understanding and evolved from mean spirited insider joke into an actual thing.
Very disappointing, overall.
More or less this.
It 'works' as a label, but someone using it unironically kinda makes them look like a shitty youtube commenter.
You made some very interesting questions, and I agree with all of your points. Sadly I have no idea how to answer them, and that's probably why the "walking sim" label still exists, because people haven't found anything better or more descriptive than that.
I can see where someone using the term "walking sim" comes from, but the moment they start saying the "not games" bullshit is when they lose me. These are a different kind of games from your regular ones, but they are games nevertheless. They do have mechanics, they allow you to move around and give you restrictions in how to do that. They let you go somewhere and not somewhere else, many have a win condition (explore the entire area, get to the end of the level, listen to the whole story). Nowhere in the definition of games is it stated they require a certain degree of interactivity with the environment to be called that. And if you're talking about the lack of fail states, then we should strike Prey and the newer Lego games off the games list because you can't die (or lose) there.
Weltall Zero
Member
Depends on whether the visual novel offers meaningful choice, which most do. Visual novels are the equivalent of "choose your own adventure" books, which carefully straddle the line between game and linear fiction. Some of those books, like the Fighting Fantasy series and related ones, even offer a combat system with hit points, weapons, etc, making them full fledged games.
Is that necessary to progress? If so, that would make it a game, which is my entire point (see below).
Given that Mario's mechanics aren't needed or useful at all in Dear Esther, it would just make it more toy-like. Again, using "toy" as a word with positive implications.
Then they are not walking simulators, and are definitelly games. They're just mislabelled.
Again, my entire point.
Making all of these games, indeed. That's my point! People using this label on them are simply mislabeling them. That doesn't make the label any less valid or applicable in other cases.
Huh? P.T. is fully a game; it's has puzzles needed to progress and you can (and will) get killed if you do or don't do certain actions.
By the way, I saw Journey mentioned as well. Not sure if I addressed that earlier, but Journey is also 100% a game; it has lots of mechanics and challenges to overcome.
- and then you've got something like Mountain, which clearly does not have any mechanics... not even walking around, so the walking simulator label would be wrong again.
I think that tag/label is a wholly unsatisfactory thing, borne out of spite and a lack of understanding and evolved from mean spirited insider joke into an actual thing.
Very disappointing, overall.
Again, I just think people are way too oversensitive and take it to be an insult where it might not necessarily apply. And having such strong personal feelings on the matter seems odd to me, anyway, not to mention counterproductive to any meaninful conversation.
Specific labels like "walking simulator" are more or less irrelevant. What I would like people to understand is that a piece of interactive media can be not a game and being called so is not an insult, it's stating the fact, and not an assessment of its quality or validity. Has this statement been made of media where it doesn't apply? Sure, many examples above. It doesn't make it any less true in other cases.
Then perhaps you should be more open minded and less emotionally invested in the subject.
Perhaps we should start with a definition of "game" we can all agree on. The traditional definition I've seen most often says that they have rules and objectives. In "Dear Esther", where you can and can't physically walk is not a "rule", otherwise me going to the bakery in real life is a game. If I add a rule that I can only go to the bakery by hopping on odd-numbered tiles, that makes it a game. Can any of you provide a definition of game that includes media like Dear Esther but not other stuff we know not to be games?
Nostremitus
Member
I thought this was going to be a joke about FF XIII on Steam.
On topic, I played a game called Serena. Would that count as this type of game, or no?
On topic, I played a game called Serena. Would that count as this type of game, or no?
Instead of PRESS A FOR AWESOME they are HOLD W FOR SENTIMENT.
This is a joke. Sort of.
There's an awful lot of similarity to AAA style of applying the simplest mechanics and delivering a large payoff for the widest of audiences, it's just on the other end of the spectrum. And that's for those that actually have any content. Something like Proteus delivers basically nothing for you to interact with,
This is a joke. Sort of.
There's an awful lot of similarity to AAA style of applying the simplest mechanics and delivering a large payoff for the widest of audiences, it's just on the other end of the spectrum. And that's for those that actually have any content. Something like Proteus delivers basically nothing for you to interact with,
More_Badass
Member
I think the main thing that separates stuff like Dear Esther and Proteus and others from the "not games" is interactivity
For example, Secret Habitat. It's a procedurally generated art gallery. You walk around and admire art.
While Dear Esther has you piecing together a story and finding those pieces. Proteus had you finding the different species and reaching the stones. Even if the mechanics are simple, they're still a form of interactivity with the game world itself. Movement is not enough.
I think that's what separates games from ...interactive experiences. Games have an objective and grant the player a element of agency. Interactive experiences are simply about...well, experiencing, no objectives or purpose required.
crimsonheadGCN
Banned
I have played Dear Esther, Gone Home, The Vanishing of Ethan Carter, and The Stanley Parable.
Gone Home is the best one for story. Dear Esther and The Stanley Parable are good games and the graphics in Dear Esther are amazing. The Vanishing of Ethan Carter was boring and I stopped playing it shortly after the house puzzle (the one where you switch rooms till you get the right layout).
And I hate the tag, walking simulator, since it's mostly used as a negative.
Gone Home is the best one for story. Dear Esther and The Stanley Parable are good games and the graphics in Dear Esther are amazing. The Vanishing of Ethan Carter was boring and I stopped playing it shortly after the house puzzle (the one where you switch rooms till you get the right layout).
And I hate the tag, walking simulator, since it's mostly used as a negative.