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So uhhh Aonuma just admitted Wii U GamePad disrupts gameplay...

T

TheDinoman

Member
One thing that'd kinda suck if the NX doesn't ultilize a second screen is what are they going to do with Super Mario Maker, a game that actually made great use of it and also felt possible to make due to the second screen?

I was wanting to see it be ported over and/or get a sequel.
 
M

Movalpolos

Banned
Freezie KO said:
giphy.gif
Click to expand...

Lol. Perfect.
 
M

Mentok

Banned
I don't know if this is the first time someone from N has admitted this, but he's right. Very few devs utilized the gamepad to where it was a necessity and at the same time not a hinderance. Almost every game I played on my WiiU I used the God-tier pro controller. Gamepad was simply for off-screen play.
 
A

ASIS

Member
jwillenn said:
Yeah, just please bring on Mote & Chuk NX.

Left Side of Gamepad = Chuk NX
Right Side of Gamepad = Mote NX

completely wireless with enhanced precision/accuracy on the "Point & Motion" front, reduction of flaws, and concealable side connectors for attachment

Left + Right Attached = Pro Controller NX

Left + Center (Handheld NX Without Controller Attachments SKU) + Right Attached = Gamepad NX = Full Handheld Gaming System that can also work as a controller for the home console
Click to expand...
I would squeal if the NX controller would be a Wiimote + Nunchuck sequel. If they do that with enough buttons and improved ergonomics and motion controls. I would faint.
 
M

Movalpolos

Banned
Randomizer said:
From one of Gaf's most hated to most loved over night lmao. I've always like him, he made Majora's Mask after all. The best thing about the gamepad is offscreen play. But it is so weak it won't even reach my bedroom.
Click to expand...

Same here. And I live in a small single bedroom apartment. The signal strength is pathetic.
 
R

Red Devil

Member
I find it weird because it has actually worked well with Zelda games on the console. Either way, Amiibo aren't going anywhere so the new controller will at least have a NFC reader on the very least, even if it doesn't have a screen. Then again it might be YET ANOTHER case of people reading too much into a random comment.

Slamtastic said:
This man is becoming my hero.

Give him a promotion.

Please save Nintendo with your acceptance of young talent and upending conventions.
Click to expand...

Aonuma, young?
 
M

Movalpolos

Banned
Rash said:
Pretty simply this. Context is important. The Gamepad is great when utilized smartly. Same could've been said for the Wiimote and motion controls/IR. Some games made the whole thing look like a mistake. Some games were a bit too gimmicky or shoehorned the tech in. Others got it just right.

The problem with the Gamepad is that it's a required component. So when it's not put to the best use and people are forced to use it, they get very vocal.

All that said, I love how people use the statement as vindication of their dislike of the Gamepad. Laughable that Star Fox comes up almost immediately as well. That game wouldn't exist without Miyamoto's desire to experiment with the tech that Nintendo championed for this console. Get over it.
Click to expand...

The game was shittier because of it. Get over it.
 
J

James Scott

Banned
Wind Waker and TPHD both supported the gamepad and the pro controller. Are guy guys saying that fewer options are better?
There's no excuse after experimenting on how to improve the gamepad implementation with WWHD to not at least give the option.
I get that "We're making the Wii U version worse in order to make control parity with NX" is a bad message to send, but he could've said something not dumb
 
Parapraxis

Parapraxis

Member
Busaiku said:
Pausing or opening menu also disrupts gameplay.
Wind Waker was so much better for it. HUDless life is great.
Click to expand...

Not nearly to the same degree.

If you had to look away from the main screen to switch weapons in a game like the Witcher III you would never get past the first battle, a second screen is cool in theory, horrible in practice.
 
M

Movalpolos

Banned
TheDinoman said:
One thing that'd kinda suck if the NX doesn't ultilize a second screen is what are they going to do with Super Mario Maker, a game that actually made great use of it and also felt possible to make due to the second screen?

I was wanting to see it be ported over and/or get a sequel.
Click to expand...

Simple. They will make you buy it twice.
 
K

Kodaman

Member
You guys are giving him waaay too much credit for this...
Whatever they were initially thinking to do with the gamepad was obviously ditched cause the NX version. And so now, he has to justify why they aren't using the 2nd screen in any meaningful way.
 
C

Cymbal Head

Banned
Sir TapTap said:
Why are people bringing up gyro aiming? Why do people ALWAYS bring up gyro aiming? The PS4 controller has a gyro perfect for gyro aiming. You don't have to look at it...it doesn't even have a screen. Gyro aiming does not necessitate or validate the gamepad.

One of the best uses of the gamepad is WWHD because it's all ancillary and never required. IT's fine in that sense but the more you force it the worse it is.
Click to expand...

You bring up a good point.

Why don't more ps4 games have gyro aiming?
 
S

Sianos

Member
As far as backwards compatibility is concerned, they could just sell gamepads separately and make them work with the NX. Just like classic Wiimotes work with the Wii U.

I think a lot of interesting things could have been done with the auxiliary screens on multiple gamepads for multiplayer games, but the limit of one gamepad per console was the nail in the coffin. They also treated it too much like the DS where both screens were very close together and did not take into account how the gamepad was inherently more disruptive.

I assume no second screen on the NX controller and backwards compatibility with the Wii U gamepad sold seperately.
 
H

Hilarion

Member
I don't know, I've been playing Xenoblade Chronicles X and the map is the most natural thing in the world to have in my lap. If I had to call up the map on the main screen it'd be so disruptive.
 
S

spazchicken

Member
And the tradition continues of Nintendo finally admitting to or ditching a failed feature/policy that they stubbornly doubled down on with the previous machine.

Without fail. Every gen since the N64, they eat crow.
 
S

spliced

Member
This is an industry full of cutscenes, loading and dialog so in many ways modern gaming at it's core is constantly disrupting gameplay. Looking up from the gamepad takes much less time than opening some chests in Zelda so lets not pretend the hardware is the only thing disrupting gameplay.
 
B

Bluewind098

Member
Truth be told I really did like the Gamepad and I really like Star Fox Zero. However I never really thought the Gamepad was absolutely needed and it kinda shows on how most Wii U games didn't use them and were fine. Hell I only liked Star Fox because of the agency I got from more free form aiming but we could've gotten that with Gyro controls or even just having stick aiming, I do hope the NX has a Screen again but I want it's implementation to be more subtle. Kinda like on how most Nintendo hardware adopted motion controls in the form of Gyro. So next time it could be used more for inventory and Off-TV play and not a central focus and give us things like Star Fox's control scheme.
 
jwillenn

jwillenn

Member
ASIS said:
I would squeal if the NX controller would be a Wiimote + Nunchuck sequel. If they do that with enough buttons and improved ergonomics and motion controls. I would faint.
Click to expand...

During the Wii era I would think about how much better both Wii and Non-Wii games would be with this + hardware with competitive processing muscle.
For example. On one hand, you're playing Red Steel 2 thinking "man, it would be great to have that camera control option of your standard console FPS". But then you're playing Vanquish and thinking "man, it would be great to be able to get that blissful S&P2 control here".

It really should be the standard. But hey... those controllers were popular. I actually think that this dream is possible because... yeah... Nintendo would like Wii numbers again. Yeah, Nintendo's not going to include some expensive ass Gamepad with the system again. Yeah... why drop the more versatile option that you invested in AND benefited greatly from just to downgrade completely to a Pro that pretty much already exists within the Mote & Chuk with some feasible modification?
 
J

James Scott

Banned
spazchicken said:
And the tradition continues of Nintendo finally admitting to or ditching a failed feature/policy that they stubbornly doubled down on with the previous machine.

Without fail. Every gen since the N64, they eat crow.
Click to expand...
They've kept most of the ideas and they've become standard in most places.
Wii and DS's DNA are in a ton of devices now a days
 
S

Slamtastic

Member
Red Devil said:
Aonuma, young?
Click to expand...

The other staff of BotW, who Aonuma is overseeing, who contribute to the way the game has ended up.

http://time.com/4369527/zelda-breath-wild-open-world/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

So it happened to be there was a team that was working on creating a larger world. And this team was a group of younger developers. So we had our old programmers from the Zelda team take a step aside, so we could introduce this new group of programmers.

But then these new, younger developers had no clue about how past Zeldas had been created. The group of new staff actually would ask us, like ‘Well I know that it’s been done, traditionally, in other Zelda titles, but why does it have to be that way?’ And among those questions there were some I just couldn’t answer, that I didn’t know the answer to myself. That was because I just took those things on as a tradition, and I didn’t really know why the tradition existed.
Click to expand...
 
N

NeonBlack

Member
Pro Controller confirmed!

P44 said:
Trying to get as much Zelda completed as he good before Miyamoto was done.
Click to expand...

Aonuma: Do you want to add a feature where you blow into the gamepad to call your horse?!

Programmer: Oh God, No!

Aonuma: Well Hurry up!
 
S

stan423321

Member
TheDinoman said:
One thing that'd kinda suck if the NX doesn't ultilize a second screen is what are they going to do with Super Mario Maker, a game that actually made great use of it and also felt possible to make due to the second screen?

I was wanting to see it be ported over and/or get a sequel.
Click to expand...

Mario Maker was not felt possible by the second screen. Mario Maker was felt possible by the touch screen. This is a pretty major distinction.

See: Kirby and the Rainbow Curse/Paintbrush, for instance. By then I was reading Jim Sterling's reviews (I honestly got quite worn out of them by now) and he said something to the effect of the TV visuals being effectively wasted unless someone is watching since everything in the game happens on the GamePad and you have to look at it or draw blindly (I guess some people can do that? I know I can't). This is less of an issue in Mario Maker since you can easily play the created levels on the TV but still it's ultimately not necessary.
 
A

ASIS

Member
jwillenn said:
During the Wii era I would think about how much better both Wii and Non-Wii games would be with this + hardware with competitive processing muscle.
For example. On one hand, you're playing Red Steel 2 thinking "man, it would be great to have that camera control option of your standard console FPS". But then you're playing Vanquish and thinking "man, it would be great to be able to get that blissful S&P2 control here".

It really should be the standard. But hey... those controllers were popular. I actually think that this dream is possible because... yeah... Nintendo would like Wii numbers again. Yeah, Nintendo's not going to include some expensive ass Gamepad with the system again. Yeah... why drop the more versatile option that you invested in AND benefited greatly from just to downgrade completely to a Pro that pretty much already exists within the Mote & Chuk with some feasible modification?
Click to expand...
Nah, they're not going back to the Wiimote, as much as I'd like them to. That things caused great controversy even if it brought in the cash. But honestly I've been replaying metroid prime for the billionth time and that thing controls like heaven. I'm just really sad to see it go.

But on the other hand, a standard controller does not require as much thought into the interface as the Wiimote, so maybe it is a good thing after all.
 
S

SephLuis

Member
I like the GamePad, but it depends a lot on how it's used.
ZombiU, for example, used in a magnificent way since the player always knew which screen to look.

Other good experiences, even those that use the GamePad as a menu, are those that know that the second screen is good for a quick peek in order to obtain some quick information. This is not different from when you're driving and have to focus your view into the mirror.
 
S

Slamtastic

Member
Red Devil said:
Sure, but this is about Aonuma.
Click to expand...

Aonuma listened to the young talent, and acted based on what they said rather than flipping tables and demanding it be a certain way. It's still a Japanese company, so old men will be at the top, but there's a difference in how an old man takes the suggestions of the younger staff below him.
 
Q

QuixoticNeutral

Member
Bluewind098 said:
Honestly I wish more games had Gyro aiming. People got on Nintendo's shit for not having options but if you have the technology why not use it for these other games that would benefit from it.
Click to expand...

In particular, those of us who play on Nintendo+PC (the latter with a keyboard and mouse), aiming with a stick isn't a standard in any sense because it hasn't been relevant in a dozen years. Players in this category may not have any desire to revert to an inferior (or at least less familiar/comfortable/responsive) scheme; I know I sure don't.

I don't care if motion aiming takes the form of a Wiimote+nunchuk or a bulky GamePad or a Pro Controller without a screen, so long as there is motion aiming. (You could, for instance, imagine Splatoon working out if it were designed from the ground up for the Wiimote, with a minimap in the corner and an expanded overlay for teleporting around—hold a trigger, point. Aside from lacking a right stick for camera control, that is.) But I cannot overstate the degree of my antipathy to aiming in a 3D space with a stick. The Pro Controller is fantastic in weight, battery life, and comfort; it's clearly preferable for many games. I wish I could use it for BotW, but even if the GamePad has no interesting purpose, I'll be using that instead (or whatever the hardware interface on the NX is, if it supports motion aiming) solely because the Pro doesn't have a gyro.
 
B

brandonh83

Banned
televator said:
Where is your god now, Nintendo apologists?
Click to expand...

Why do they need one?

It was very cool in some games. Of course it depends on what you do with it. I had a blast playing Wind Waker with it for example. Yeah Star Fox didn't make a great case for it, but it worked. Some didn't like it, some thought it was a lot of fun.

Aonuma is saying that maybe constantly looking back and forth isn't good for everything and that's true particularly for action heavy fare, but some neat things were done with it on other games. This quote is basically a vehicle for those who didn't like it, which is fine or whatever but it's not him saying it was some bad thing in general.

Whatever reaffirms folks, I guess.
 
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