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Sonic the Hedgehog 4 - Wii/PS3/360; downloadable episodic release - [Update: $15?]

jman2050

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May 18, 2005
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Fox said:
- classic level design and gameplay. something inspired by the best of sonic 2. this will be the real sonic the hedgehog 4, not sonic advance 4 or sonic rush 3
We absolutely still do not know this.
 

Gattsu25

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Jun 6, 2004
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Fox said:
- sonic and eggman are the only characters in the game, excepts from badniks and animals. tails and knuckles will arrive in ep.2 ?
Last I checked this was a sonic thread so forgive me if I'm missing something but...who the fuck is this eggman I keep seeing mentioned?

We all know sonic is in this game and based on an image (that was taken down?) we also know robotnik is in...so who is this third character?
 

Diablohead

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Gattsu25 said:
Last I checked this was a sonic thread so forgive me if I'm missing something but...who the fuck is this eggman I keep seeing mentioned?

We all know sonic is in this game and based on an image (that was taken down?) we also know robotnik is in...so who is this third character?
Eggman is Robotnik, his original and Japanese name is Eggman.
 

Teknoman

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jman2050 said:
We absolutely still do not know this.
Thats true. But the closest legit stuff we have to go on is Iizuka pushing the team to include the "best" things from Sonic 2. The special stages better be one of them. Edit: whats funny is the preview section of the NP article kept referring to him as Robotnik.
 

jman2050

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The fact is we're still not going to know anything until either the game comes out or we have a ridiculously extended gameplay video.
 

Iknos

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Oct 3, 2004
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Gattsu25 said:
Last I checked this was a sonic thread so forgive me if I'm missing something but...who the fuck is this eggman I keep seeing mentioned?

We all know sonic is in this game and based on an image (that was taken down?) we also know robotnik is in...so who is this third character?
Don't think people will get your point...as the responses to my last joke didn't see my point.

Good point though. Who knows if it will be localized in the same way the previous Sonic games were localized.

- classic level design and gameplay. something inspired by the best of sonic 2. this will be the real sonic the hedgehog 4, not sonic advance 4 or sonic rush 3
I applaud your efforts.
 

Teknoman

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Iknos said:
Don't think people will get your point...as the responses to my last joke didn't see my point.

Good point though. Who knows if it will be localized in the same way the previous Sonic games were localized.



I applaud your efforts.
Ten-Song said:
That's actually impossible to know currently, but everything I've seen also points to that not being the case.
Fox is basically just summing up what the recent Nintendo Power preview/interview stated.
 

Ten-Song

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Teknoman said:
Fox is basically just summing up what the recent Nintendo Power preview/interview stated.
Hm... even so, no amount of PR should let anyone believe that's even remotely true. Though I imagine Sega PR wouldn't be happy if Nintendo Power had a side bar next to the article that just said "Yeah, right" really sarcastically.
 

Fox

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May 17, 2007
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Teknoman said:
Fox is basically just summing up what the recent Nintendo Power preview/interview stated.
thank you, teknoman. with all this hatred, even if sonic 4 become better than the previous three, haters will bash anyway. after all, green eyes affect gameplay.
 

Fox

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May 17, 2007
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seriously, guys... you are bashing EVERYTHING of this game.

the real problem are the sonic haters. not the sonic fans. they buy a sonic game or not, depending on the quality, judging it after playing it. haters gonna hate, and nothing else.

i don't know what the hell do you want, but previews, screens and interviews talk about what everyone always wanted in the last 15 years
 

Iknos

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Fox said:
seriously, guys... you are bashing EVERYTHING of this game.
If there's any part of this game that sucks it'll be bashed.

Unfortunately EVERYTHING sucks so it's all getting bashed.
 

Ten-Song

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I AM JOHN! said:
So I've been playing Sonic Adventure again for the past two days.

I still love that game.
I want to love it still, but the problem I have is, I beat Sonic's campaign, and then I have the other characters...

Amy Rose's version of Twinkle Park makes me want to kick puppies.
 

jman2050

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May 18, 2005
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Fox said:
seriously, guys... you are bashing EVERYTHING of this game.

the real problem are the sonic haters. not the sonic fans. they buy a sonic game or not, depending on the quality, judging it after playing it. haters gonna hate, and nothing else.

i don't know what the hell do you want, but previews, screens and interviews talk about what everyone always wanted in the last 15 years
You might want to stay away from this thread in the future.
 

Fox

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May 17, 2007
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Iknos said:
If there's any part of this game that sucks it'll be bashed.

Unfortunately EVERYTHING sucks so it's all getting bashed.
what's wrong?

it's 2d with pre-rendered characters
it's only a platform. no emerald hunt, beat'em up, fishing, racing or shooting sessions.
sonic and eggman are the only characters, no shitty friends
badniks are the enemies
super sonic is playable everywhere after collecting chaos emeralds
you get chaos emeralds from special stages, not during cutscenes
there are no humans or strange storyline and cutscenes with military and alien forces
alternate ending if you finish the game as super sonic
graphic style similar to the mega drive counterparts


of course, we have to confirm that level design and gameplay are REALLY similar to the mega drive classic titles. but this game is all about what fans always desired, without a total recycle in megaman 9-10 style. so if sega deserves our confidence, this is the right time.
 

Ten-Song

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Fox said:
but this game is all about what fans always desired, without a total recycle in megaman 9-10 style.
Yeah, because all the old school fans have really been pushing for the homing attack to show up to give the game an "old school" flavor.

Also, trying to point to Mega Man 9 and 10 in negative terms doesn't help your cause, as those are actually good games.
 

Fox

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May 17, 2007
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Ten-Song said:
Yeah, because all the old school fans have really been pushing for the homing attack to show up to give the game an "old school" flavor.

Also, trying to point to Mega Man 9 and 10 in negative terms doesn't help your cause, as those are actually good games.
of course they are, but there's nothing wrong with a new incarnation of a classic franchise, if this respect the classic gameplay and concept.

the only problem with homing attack is that all of you haters associate it to the worst sonic games. but if it is well implemented, why this is must be a problem?
a new move is not a bad thing. spin dash was a new move, in sonic 2. spin attack was a new move in sonic 3. they haven't ruined sonic 2 and sonic 3.

wow. your changing avatars continue to deceive me x_x
 

Ten-Song

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Fox said:
of course they are, but there's nothing wrong with a new incarnation of a classic franchise, if this respect the classic gameplay and concept.

the only problem with homing attack is that all of you haters associate it to the worst sonic games. but if it is well implemented, why this is must be a problem?
a new move is not a bad thing. spin dash was a new move, in sonic 2. spin attack was a new move in sonic 3. they haven't ruined sonic 2 and sonic 3.
The problem with the homing attack is its only ever been implemented in the Sonic games to minimize any intricacies in the level design or the platforming. Instead of having to land on enemies carefully to hop around, the process is instead automated, and not only that, but it is used in a way that blatantly points out how poor a mechanic it is (bridges made out of completely worthless enemies).

Fox said:
wow. your changing avatars continue to deceive me x_x
:lol I have a pretty big rotating stock at this point, and I keep adding more.
 

Fox

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May 17, 2007
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ok, we all know the purpose of homing attack in 3d sonic games, you're right.

but haven't seen anything about in THIS game. in the classic sonic games nobody never used to jump from badnik to badnik to reach secret places or alternate routes. maybe... 2-3 times in 4 games? so this is not an error, but an extra, if the level design offers some routes accessible only with this technique.

and after all, we still don't know how the timing for homing attack works.
 
Ten-Song said:
I want to love it still, but the problem I have is, I beat Sonic's campaign, and then I have the other characters...

Amy Rose's version of Twinkle Park makes me want to kick puppies.
Cutting me deep, man. I'm playing Amy's campaign right now; she's tied for my second favorite campaign in the game with Gamma. :(

I'm probably going to end up writing something more in-depth about this for my friend's site (which I'll most assuredly plug like a shameless bastard if I do it), but the thing I'm noticing as I play this is when you look past the fact that it's a twelve-year-old game with ridiculous amounts of texture pop, Saturn levels of draw distance (minus the fog), and goofy, mediocre voice acting made even worse by a script that borders on Speed Racer territory at times, it's a surprisingly creative and well thought-out game. It's certainly not perfect; in fact, the common trend I'm noticing throughout the entire game is that it comes incredibly close to feeling like classic Sonic with an added dimension to it (pun kind of intended) and yet always slightly misses the mark. The physics feel off at times; levels are varied and oftentimes have multiple paths you can take and secrets to find, yet there usually ends up being no real tangible benefit for doing so; I could go on. And yet there's still something about the way it feels, removed from whatever nostalgia gameboner is being stroked for me, that makes it feel like someone actually looked at what made Sonics 1-3K work and bring it into 3D. I know I'm being kind of vague - to be honest I'm having trouble putting all this into words right now - but there's something about SA that I feel like has just been completely lost in every subsequent Sonic game; and I don't feel like this is just the nostalgia nerve talking considering that Sonic Adventure 2 was kind of a more important game in my life than Sonic Adventure 1 was for reasons I won't go into.

In short: I feel WAY more comfortable calling that "Sonic 4" than this fuckin' thing. :\
 

Ten-Song

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I AM JOHN! said:
Cutting me deep, man. I'm playing Amy's campaign right now; she's tied for my second favorite campaign in the game with Gamma. :(

I'm probably going to end up writing something more in-depth about this for my friend's site (which I'll most assuredly plug like a shameless bastard if I do it), but the thing I'm noticing as I play this is when you look past the fact that it's a twelve-year-old game with ridiculous amounts of texture pop, Saturn levels of draw distance (minus the fog), and goofy, mediocre voice acting made even worse by a script that borders on Speed Racer territory at times, it's a surprisingly creative and well thought-out game. It's certainly not perfect; in fact, the common trend I'm noticing throughout the entire game is that it comes incredibly close to feeling like classic Sonic with an added dimension to it (pun kind of intended) and yet always slightly misses the mark. The physics feel off at times; levels are varied and oftentimes have multiple paths you can take and secrets to find, yet there usually ends up being no real tangible benefit for doing so; I could go on. And yet there's still something about the way it feels, removed from whatever nostalgia gameboner is being stroked for me, that makes it feel like someone actually looked at what made Sonics 1-3K work and bring it into 3D. I know I'm being kind of vague - to be honest I'm having trouble putting all this into words right now - but there's something about SA that I feel like has just been completely lost in every subsequent Sonic game; and I don't feel like this is just the nostalgia nerve talking considering that Sonic Adventure 2 was kind of a more important game in my life than Sonic Adventure 1 was for reasons I won't go into.

In short: I feel WAY more comfortable calling that "Sonic 4" than this fuckin' thing. :\
Think Tails and Gamma were the only real side characters I ever played as often. Which is weird, because I hated playing as Tails and Eggman in 2, which were pretty much just like the Gamma levels.

Being able to select characters separately was the best thing the game did, and it was always baffling that Adventure 2 went back on that. But then again Adventure 2 also had like next to no Sonic levels to play, so that's not its only problem.

And for whatever reason, it was the only time I could tolerate a hub world in a Sonic game. It was still mostly empty and pointlessly padded the game, but the mystic ruins theme made it worth it.
 

Fox

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May 17, 2007
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Black_Ice said:
:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
well, of course the most important thing in this discussion is to quote examples.
and sega should listen to WHO?
 

SCULLIBUNDO

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Fox said:
ok, we all know the purpose of homing attack in 3d sonic games, you're right.

but haven't seen anything about in THIS game. in the classic sonic games nobody never used to jump from badnik to badnik to reach secret places or alternate routes. maybe... 2-3 times in 4 games? so this is not an error, but an extra, if the level design offers some routes accessible only with this technique.

and after all, we still don't know how the timing for homing attack works.
Stay in school little fella.
 

Fox

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May 17, 2007
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i love sonic threads, where people with nothing to say come to say nothing.

real sonic fans. real gamers.

bah.
 

DryEyeRelief

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Fox said:
i love sonic threads, where people with nothing to say come to say nothing.

real sonic fans. real gamers.

bah.
That's a funny piece of criticism considering your previous post.
 

Danthrax

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riceandbeans said:
Doubt it. There's still E.G.G. Station Zone. 4 zones with three acts isn't enough to be able to get the 99 lives or more achievement unless you collect every single ring out there and I'm not sure 4 zones fits in with the collect all Chaos Emeralds and Super Sonic theme. 7 zones or so makes more sense, one per level.

Destructoid Uses Neogaf and Sonic Retro for Article Ideas

Some of it's funny (green eyes argument), some of it's not-so funny (Sonic Rush similarities are there if you look for them). I see Jim Sterling wants to be the Bill O' Reilly/Keith Olbermann of gaming journalists.
I'm sure it will let you keep your extra lives after you've beaten the game. Like, when you replay a level, you'll still have all your extra lives, just like a save-game file on Sonic 3 & Knuckles.

So you'll just have to replay levels a LOT to get to 99 lives.
 

Fox

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May 17, 2007
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DryEyeRelief said:
That's a funny piece of criticism considering your previous post.
i've posted so much in this thread, bringing news and talking about the leaked media. some people come here only to laugh, troll, and hate speaking about nothing. i really don't understand why.
 

DryEyeRelief

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Fox said:
i've posted so much in this thread, bringing news and talking about the leaked media. some people come here only to laugh, troll, and hate speaking about nothing. i really don't understand why.
You did, and I appreciated it, but I'm referring to your post about the homing attack. You didn't really address anything Ten Song actually said in his post about the homing attack being basically being "Sonic's "solution" from transitioning from 2d to 3d: a simplification of method to destroy enemies.

Granted, destroying a lot of enemies in the old games were simple, but this mechanic doesn't belong in a 2d sonic game. Especially a 2d sonic game being advertised as being classic. Iizuka wanting to bring back the bridge mechanic from the 3d games as well is another nail in the coffin of Sega's genuine concern of how much this game will replicate the classics.


Overall, people in this thread have different expectations than you. Saying that this game automatically fulfills their expectations won't get you anywhere if they beg to differ.
 

Danthrax

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Fox said:
i've posted so much in this thread, bringing news and talking about the leaked media. some people come here only to laugh, troll, and hate speaking about nothing. i really don't understand why.
This is NeoGAF, dude. You need a thick skin, especially when it comes to something as derisive as Sonic.
 

Fox

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May 17, 2007
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DryEyeRelief said:
You did, and I appreciated it, but I'm referring to your post about the homing attack. You didn't really address anything Ten Song actually said in his post about the homing attack being basically being "Sonic's "solution" from transitioning from 2d to 3d: a simplification of method to destroy enemies.

Granted, destroying a lot of enemies in the old games were simple, but this mechanic doesn't belong in a 2d sonic game. Especially a 2d sonic game being advertised as being classic. Iizuka wanting to bring back the bridge mechanic from the 3d games as well is another nail in the coffin of Sega's genuine concern of how much this game will replicate the classics.


Overall, people in this thread have different expectations than you. Saying that this game automatically fulfills their expectations won't get you anywhere if they beg to differ.
i understand now, thank you.

anyway, as i said earlier, i feel optimistic. for the first time in 15 years, sega seems to know what he's doing with sonic. i'm not afraid of homing attack, if the platforming will be bold. but, as everyone, all that i can do for now is to wait a gameplay video to judge the choice.

the positive thing is that in the preview - and not in the interview, where software house PR can say whatever they want about their product - talk about classic platforming, REAL platforming, different from sonic rush.
 

RobbieNick

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Welp, I'm back with more Sonic 4 scoops!!

I looked through the latest X-Box magazine at Wal-Mart, and there's a 2 page spread on Sonic 4. Mostly images that have already been shown, and what little text was there didn't provide much new info EXCEPT an important detail on the story and I quote!!......

"No cutscenes, no dialouge"

That means just like in the old days, everything that deals with story will be pantomimed. SWEET!

One odd bit of info is that X-Box mag says the opposite about the cliffhanger. Basically, that you'll get the CH if you DON'T get all emeralds, and that getting all emeralds actually brings a resolution to the cliffhanger. So which is right? OXM, or NP and GI? Hmmmmm...
 

Danthrax

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RobbieNick said:
Welp, I'm back with more Sonic 4 scoops!!

I looked through the latest X-Box magazine at Wal-Mart, and there's a 2 page spread on Sonic 4. Mostly images that have already been shown, and what little text was there didn't provide much new info EXCEPT an important detail on the story and I quote!!......

"No cutscenes, no dialouge"

That means just like in the old days, everything that deals with story will be pantomimed. SWEET!

One odd bit of info is that X-Box mag says the opposite about the cliffhanger. Basically, that you'll get the CH if you DON'T get all emeralds, and that getting all emeralds actually brings a resolution to the cliffhanger. So which is right? OXM, or NP and GI? Hmmmmm...
Fears somewhat alleviated! Sounds good.

As for the inconsistency, the Xbox mag's version makes more sense, IMO.
 

Brashnir

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Fox said:
i understand now, thank you.

anyway, as i said earlier, i feel optimistic. for the first time in 15 years, sega seems to know what he's doing with sonic. i'm not afraid of homing attack, if the platforming will be bold. but, as everyone, all that i can do for now is to wait a gameplay video to judge the choice.

the positive thing is that in the preview - and not in the interview, where software house PR can say whatever they want about their product - talk about classic platforming, REAL platforming, different from sonic rush.
So what do you say to the assertion that the very nature of the homing attack is contrary to the basic principles of platforming?

Platforming is primarily about precise control of your on-screen character's movement, while homing attack is "press this button to let the game take control of your character from you." The reason it hasn't been done well in the past is that it is fundamentally at odds with the games' chosen genre. They may as well just make gap-crossing a fucking QTE.
 

Ten-Song

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Brashnir said:
So what do you say to the assertion that the very nature of the homing attack is contrary to the basic principles of platforming?

Platforming is primarily about precise control of your on-screen character's movement, while homing attack is "press this button to let the game take control of your character from you." The reason it hasn't been done well in the past is that it is fundamentally at odds with the games' chosen genre. They may as well just make gap-crossing a fucking QTE.
Sonic Unleashed did that actually. Well, not "gap crossing," but pretty much every branching path that I've seen in the game is just a QTE sequence.
 

Brashnir

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Ten-Song said:
Sonic Unleashed did that actually. Well, not "gap crossing," but pretty much every branching path that I've seen in the game is just a QTE sequence.
which is yet another reason that game is garbage.
 

f-castrillo

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I don't see an immediate problem with the homing attack. It could prove interesting, especially if the badnik bridges can fire projectiles, which would make the timing of the homing attacks crucial so that you won't ram into a fireball.

Sonic 2 added the spindash, Sonic 3 & Knuckles added that insta-shield double jump thing, so it's only natural that Sonic 4 get some kind of new mechanic. I'll hold my judgment on it until the day I play it
 

RobbieNick

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Who the fuck says they are using homing attacks as bridges? It's most likely being used to find branching paths and harder to reach places up high.
 

f-castrillo

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RobbieNick said:
Who the fuck says they are using homing attacks as bridges? It's most likely being used to find branching paths and harder to reach places up high.
It's kind of assumed if I'm reading things right. You use homing attacks on a consecutive number of badniks to reach a certain area, hence the term "bridge"
 

RobbieNick

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f-castrillo said:
It's kind of assumed if I'm reading things right. You use homing attacks on a consecutive number of badniks to reach a certain area, hence the term "bridge"
I see what you mean. Sorry if I'm sounding over-defensive.
 

Stat Flow

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f-castrillo said:
I don't see an immediate problem with the homing attack. It could prove interesting, especially if the badnik bridges can fire projectiles, which would make the timing of the homing attacks crucial so that you won't ram into a fireball.

Sonic 2 added the spindash, Sonic 3 & Knuckles added that insta-shield double jump thing, so it's only natural that Sonic 4 get some kind of new mechanic. I'll hold my judgment on it until the day I play it
Sonic 3's was subtle and helpful but not obtrusive, it was optional. Also, Sonic 3 added elemental shields. Sonic 4 does not need to fuck with the formula to much in adding this new mechanic.

I wouldn't mind an air shield that allows for a double jump like the electric shield and also saves you from a bottomless pit (once, of course) if you fall down one.