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[Kittonwy]

Sorry to hear that Wipeout might be done. It was the first game my cousin showed me when he had his original playstation way back in 1997.
But, it can't be surprising. Many people love to crow about the breadth of their first party stable, but the more horses you have in the stable the more coin you need for their upkeep.
And if none of those horses are bringing in boku bucks at the races and the one surefire you do have is constantly being retested on his leaps and gait(GT))but never entered, something is going to give.
Its a problem of bloat.

And to the cat guy.....its not the fault of the consumer. If the product you're putting out isn't to the tastes of the market, change the product. Or be satisfied with lesser sales power. Either scale back production costs so they're inline with the likely sales figures, or start from scratch.
I don't have a ps3 yet, but i plan on getting one soon. Primarily for bluray and then games wise for Ueda's LG. Are you saying its my fault that none of the products sonys put out thus far stir me? Uncharted, GOW, Wipeout,MS, etc. Not to my tastes, but when they do release something i see necessary they get my money.
Once again, sorry to hear about the closing.

I'm referring to PS3 users, not you, WHO DOES NOT HAVE THE CONSOLE. If they want to make a different type of racing game, they already have Evolution and PD for that, so why would they be keeping a big team at Liverpool? They ARE responding to the PS3 users. The PS3 users do not want more Wipeout, Liverpool is best known for Wipeout, if Sony goes by the userbase response why would they be hanging onto the bulk of the Liverpool team? They wouldn't. The PS3 users did not respond to Wipeout HD, they did not respond F1.

If Sony has to be scaling back on production it would mean a smaller team, a smaller team would mean they would have to cut people.

I'm not talking about you, YOU ARE NOT A PS3 USER. If you don't even have the console and none of their games are relevant to you then you have nothing to complain about, you don't have the console, you didn't buy Wipeout HD, it shouldn't matter to you.

 

[Massa]

I'm referring to PS3 users, not you, WHO DOES NOT HAVE THE CONSOLE. If they want to make a different type of racing game, they already have Evolution and PD for that, so why would they be keeping a big team at Liverpool? They ARE responding to the PS3 users. The PS3 users do not want more Wipeout, Liverpool is best known for Wipeout, if Sony goes by the userbase response why would they be hanging onto the bulk of the Liverpool team? They wouldn't. The PS3 users did not respond to Wipeout HD, they did not respond F1.

If Sony has to be scaling back on production it would mean a smaller team, a smaller team would mean they would have to cut people.

I'm not talking about you, YOU ARE NOT A PS3 USER. If you don't even have the console and none of their games are relevant to you then you have nothing to complain about, you don't have the console, you didn't buy Wipeout HD, it shouldn't matter to you.

I'd say PS3 users don't want more Motorstorm either.

Liverpool could have done a kart racing game, it would certainly have turned out better than the turd that is ModNation Racers.

 

[yurinka]

I'd say PS3 users don't want more Motorstorm either.

Some million copies sold say it isn't true.

 

[Massa]

Some million copies sold say it isn't true.

Are you talking about Pacific Rift?

 

[TheThunder]

The sad thing is Wipeout HD alone has more value than a lot of PS3 exclusives like Uncharted, R&CToD, Heavenly sword and the first Motorstorm even when leveled at the same price it comes of at a better value.

 

[Elan tedronai]

Are you talking about Pacific Rift?

didnt PR sell a million copies

 

[Forsete]

From Wikipedia

Motorstorm: 3 million +
Motorstorm PR: 1 million +

 

[Massa]

didnt PR sell a million copies

In the US it did about 150k.

 

[Kittonwy]

I'd say PS3 users don't want more Motorstorm either.

Liverpool could have done a kart racing game, it would certainly have turned out better than the turd that is ModNation Racers.

The Motorstorm franchise sold millions, better than F1 and Wipeout, if we're going by that and we have to gut either Evolution or Liverpool, it will obviously be Liverpool. And no, Evolution can't simply push out more of the same.

Not getting the hate for ModNation Racers and who knows if there's even a market for kart racing games on the PS3.

 

[Kittonwy]

The sad thing is Wipeout HD alone has more value than a lot of PS3 exclusives like Uncharted, R&CToD, Heavenly sword and the first Motorstorm even when leveled at the same price it comes of at a better value.

Not sure how Wipeout HD has more value than Uncharted 2.

 

[TheThunder]

The first Motorstorm benefited in sales from probably being the most bundled game on the PS3 so far. As for the second one how much of those sales were at $60 ? I remember here it constantly went on sale for $30 starting Jan 09and I don't even think it broke 300k in NPD right ?

Edit: Kittonwy I was talking about Drake's Fortune.

Damn 500s !!

 

[Lagspike_exe]

The first Motorstorm benefited in sales from probably being the most bundled game on the PS3 so far. As for the second one how much of those sales were at $60 ? I remember here it constantly went on sale for $30 starting Jan 09and I don't even think it broke 300k in NPD right ?

Edit: Kittonwy I was talking about Drake's Fortune.

Damn 500s !!

Motorstorm: Pacific Rift broke 1 million world wide in a couple of weeks IIRC.

 

[Zen]

Reported in December of the same year

Despite failing to set fire to retail sales chart, Sony Worldwide Studios reveals that MotorstormL: Pacific Rift has still managed to move over a million copies since launch.

In an interview with GamesIndustry.biz, Sony Worldwide Studios head Michael Denny revealed that the sequel to the PlayStation 3's hit offroad racer has done quite alright by itself since its October release.

"In terms of the other titles it was also important to focus on – the sequel to MotorStorm, we're pleased with the high Metacritic rating of 82 per cent and it's sold over a million units worldwide."

This puts it on par with the original title, which sold 1 million copies in June of 2007 following its March release in the states. Looks like the original audience stuck around for more.

MotorStorm: Pacific Rift passes one million sales [GamesIndustry.biz]

http://kotaku.com/5105352/motorstorm...a-million-sold

NPD wise, PR had a debut of something like 75k when it came out and I remember MS1 sold 200k in its first month (PS3 launch wasn't it?). Launch titles and all (Resistance 1 is still one of Sony's top sellers in America for instance).

The Motorstorm franchise sold millions, better than F1 and Wipeout, if we're going by that and we have to gut either Evolution or Liverpool, it will obviously be Liverpool. And no, Evolution can't simply push out more of the same.

Not getting the hate for ModNation Racers and who knows if there's even a market for kart racing games on the PS3.

Personally I found everything from the driving physics, acceleration, weapons, and camera angles to be pretty terrible. They better polish it up for the final release because the demo gameplay was about the worst kart racer I've ever played. Everything else about it was nice though.

I'm not talking about you, YOU ARE NOT A PS3 USER. If you don't even have the console and none of their games are relevant to you then you have nothing to complain about, you don't have the console, you didn't buy Wipeout HD, it shouldn't matter to you.

He could easily not have the console but games within the genre (Wipeout even) could be relevant to him. It's not like owning the console is barrier to entry to having an opinion.

 

[Zen]

DP

 

[Garjon]

A question I do have is how are Sony going to 'replace' SL; are they going to hire more staff at their other studios or something? It's just that restructuring =/= laying off staff. Plus, it's a bad idea to start laying off staff at this sort of length just as the economy/sales are starting to improve.

 

[Scootydowopp]

I'm referring to PS3 users, not you, WHO DOES NOT HAVE THE CONSOLE. If they want to make a different type of racing game, they already have Evolution and PD for that, so why would they be keeping a big team at Liverpool? They ARE responding to the PS3 users. The PS3 users do not want more Wipeout, Liverpool is best known for Wipeout, if Sony goes by the userbase response why would they be hanging onto the bulk of the Liverpool team? They wouldn't. The PS3 users did not respond to Wipeout HD, they did not respond F1.

If Sony has to be scaling back on production it would mean a smaller team, a smaller team would mean they would have to cut people.

I'm not talking about you, YOU ARE NOT A PS3 USER. If you don't even have the console and none of their games are relevant to you then you have nothing to complain about, you don't have the console, you didn't buy Wipeout HD, it shouldn't matter to you.

My bad titkit, we are saying the same thing, only you seem really angry at your ps3 brethren and thus sound more vitriolic.
And just because i don't own a ps3 console doesn't mean i can't affect its market standing.
For ps1 i owned 4 games for a year before i actually bought the console. My sales counted. The same for ps2.
PS3 will be the first sony console i buy before i have any games for it. Real talk, if it weren't for their goldenboy they might have missed me entirely, since their jrpg presence is lacking.
Until GT releases, i only see more trimming of the fat ahead. First party is only at its best when it is being devoured by the userbase.

 

[Rapping Granny]

Just loaded up Fury for the first time in months, dear god this game is above any other racer in terms of visuals and music.

 

[StealthGoblin]

Just loaded up Fury for the first time in months, dear god this game is above any other racer in terms of visuals and music.

Yeah. I'm playing it at the moment and its just jaw dropping.

This is one of the games I want to play in 3D.

 

[Tiktaalik]

Not really in a country where the (financial) support for the gaming industry is decreasing; unfortunately, that may be their only option if they want to remain as developers.

Reading that quote just reminds me how harsh this industry really can be

Yeah sad but true. The UK has been screwing its industry over for a long time now. I'd love it if these folks all got together and made a great UK studio, but in all likelyhood a bunch will be on the plane headed for Montreal and other places with better tax regimes. :\

 

[RaijinFY]

Wipeout is an almost niche franchise since Wipeout 3 on the original Playstation. The great Wipeout era ended with 2097 (sales wise).


Quite frankly, i'm really disappointed with the outputof the european divisions... I mean aside Killzone and eventually LBP, what else did they release of relevance? I mean Motorstorm is a great franchise, but the second installment didnt perform as it should have been... SingStar, hardly a seller... What else? Sony cant only rely on the North American department and one or two games every 4 years frm the Japanese one.

 

[Lagspike_exe]

Wipeout is an almost niche franchise since Wipeout 3 on the original Playstation. The great Wipeout era ended with 2097 (sales wise).


Quite frankly, i'm really disappointed with the output of the European divisions... I mean aside Killzone and eventually LBP, what else did they release of relevance? I mean Motorstorm is a great franchise, but the second installment didn't perform as it should have been... SingStar, hardly a seller... What else? Sony cant only rely on the North American department and one or two games every 4 years from the Japanese one.

SingStar is actually pretty huge in Europe.

 

[V_Ben]

SingStar is actually pretty huge in Europe.

yeah. it sells at pretty much a constant. the slowest burn possible

 

[RaijinFY]

SingStar is actually pretty huge in Europe.

Do we have some numbers for the PS3 version?

I know it was very popular on the PS2...
They launched SingStar which targets a more casual gamer when the console was still priced at 600....

 

[StealthGoblin]

SingStar, hardly a seller... What else?

Mate, Singstar has sold over 20 million units as of December last year. The singstore also generates money.

16 million units in the PAL region alone.

 

[ClearCELL]

Wipeout is an almost niche franchise since Wipeout 3 on the original Playstation. The great Wipeout era ended with 2097 (sales wise).


Quite frankly, i'm really disappointed with the outputof the european divisions... I mean aside Killzone and eventually LBP, what else did they release of relevance? I mean Motorstorm is a great franchise, but the second installment didnt perform as it should have been... SingStar, hardly a seller... What else? Sony cant only rely on the North American department and one or two games every 4 years frm the Japanese one.

SingStar is huge in Europe.

 

[Lagspike_exe]

Do we have some numbers for the PS3 version?

I know it was very popular on the PS2...
They launched SingStar which targets a more casual gamer when the console was still priced at 600....

Not sure, although on April 28th 2008. the series hit 12 million sales in PAL regions only, with additional 1 million downloaded tracks on the PSN (and that was when PS3 had really bad sales and Playstation Network/Store were in much worst shape than now).

Mate, Singstar has sold over 20 million units as of December last year. The singstore also generates money.

All right, please ignore my post.

 

[Noshino]

Wipeout is an almost niche franchise since Wipeout 3 on the original Playstation. The great Wipeout era ended with 2097 (sales wise).


Quite frankly, i'm really disappointed with the outputof the european divisions... I mean aside Killzone and eventually LBP, what else did they release of relevance? I mean Motorstorm is a great franchise, but the second installment didnt perform as it should have been... SingStar, hardly a seller... What else? Sony cant only rely on the North American department and one or two games every 4 years frm the Japanese one.

Its kind of sad that the great european/japanese Sony studios of the PS and PS2 don't have the same impact nowadays (with some exceptions), it pisses me off sometimes. Who is to blame for their lack of success? Yoshida came far too late, I really don't understand why people keep blaming him

As much hate as he gets, sometimes I wish Kutaragi was back controlling SCE, it was then that Sony studios were performing well :C

 

[yurinka]

Just loaded up Fury for the first time in months, dear god this game is above any other racer in terms of visuals and music.

I agree. I also went back to the game today. Posted some screenshots in the other thread.

 

[V_Ben]

I agree. I also went back to the game today. Posted some screenshots in the other thread.

i just posted some too

 

[Lagspike_exe]

Its kind of sad that the great european/japanese Sony studios of the PS and PS2 don't have the same impact nowadays (with some exceptions), it pisses me off sometimes. Who is to blame for their lack of success? Yoshida came far too late, I really don't understand why people keep blaming him

As much hate as he gets, sometimes I wish Kutaragi was back controlling SCE, it was then that Sony studios were performing well :C

Kutaragi was a tech guru who didn't know shit about business and management.
Only an insane man could make a console cost more than $1000 FREAKING DOLLARS to manufacture on launch. Thanks to him, Sony lost billions and billions on PS3.

He knew how to make an excellent product, but he went a little lol) over the line with his PS3 ambitions.

 

[StealthGoblin]

Its kind of sad that the great european/japanese Sony studios of the PS and PS2 don't have the same impact nowadays (with some exceptions), it pisses me off sometimes. Who is to blame for their lack of success? Yoshida came far too late, I really don't understand why people keep blaming him

As much hate as he gets, sometimes I wish Kutaragi was back controlling SCE, it was then that Sony studios were performing well :C

I think Sony have spread themselves too thin.

PS2
PS3
PSP
PSN
Arc
3D gaming. (Waste of time if you ask me, hardly anyone will bother)
Home.

They need to focus themselves on fewer things, and do them really really well.

 

[V_Ben]

I think Sony have spread themselves too thin.

PS2
PS3
PSP
PSN
Arc
3D gaming. (Waste of time if you ask me, hardly anyone will bother)
Home.

They need to focus themselves on fewer things, and do them really really well.

yeah. drop the ps2 i'd say. that system has run it's course imo.

 

[StealthGoblin]

On a Singstar related note:

Why haven't Sony cross promoted Singstar with the X-Factor in the UK so far? Sony get the winner on their label and Simon Cowell works for Sony BMG. If they had a singstar competition and mentioned it on air etc, the promotion would be immense.

 

[ClearCELL]

I agree when Sony was on top with PSX and PS2 their only focus was on that single PS home console. After the launch of PSP, it suffered a lack of games because they had to shift SCE's focus to PS3. PS3 never had a chance like PSX or PS2 because of its price and SCE made too many new IP's instead of getting PS franchises like Gran Turismo / God of War / Final Fantasy / MGS within its 1st 2 years of existence.

 

[ClearCELL]

On a Singstar related note:

Why haven't Sony cross promoted Singstar with the X-Factor in the UK so far? Sony get the winner on their label and Simon Cowell works for Sony BMG. If they had a singstar competition and mentioned it on air etc, the promotion would be immense.

Maybe Simon Cowell will make a new show called SingStar D:

 

[V_Ben]

On a Singstar related note:

Why haven't Sony cross promoted Singstar with the X-Factor in the UK so far? Sony get the winner on their label and Simon Cowell works for Sony BMG. If they had a singstar competition and mentioned it on air etc, the promotion would be immense.

well he does want to make a video game...

http://www.mcvuk.com/news/36801/Simon-Cowell-courts-PlayStation

 

[Zen]

I think Sony have spread themselves too thin.

---
PS3
PSP
PSN
Arc
---
Home.

They need to focus themselves on fewer things, and do them really really well.

To be fair, PSP and PS2 are one in the same these days (and there are no actual original projects developed for PS2 anymore). The PS2 is basically dead and they're riding out whatever it will sell because of the profit margin.

3D gaming will just be a feature added into existing development, so while it does take resources, I don't think we're talking about something on equal merit to actual platform support.

Not that I disagree with you, -HOME seems like it has turned out well for them-, but what we've seen so far seems like they don't have the bandwidth to properly execute ARC, but we'll see. Their 'lineup' list was beyond lacking.

 

[Kazuma Kiryu]

I think Sony have spread themselves too thin.

PS2
PS3
PSP
PSN
Arc
3D gaming. (Waste of time if you ask me, hardly anyone will bother)
Home.

They need to focus themselves on fewer things, and do them really really well.

home is bringing cash to sony i believe, so i'd say keep that alive. i'm sure it doesn't take a whole lot of people just to maintain it.
they also need 3d gaming because sony sells tv's and they want to sell you their new ones, so they need content.
arc is just there because microsoft and sony are trying to go after the wii audience that's crushing them in sales.
sure the ps2 is shifting a few(very few i believe) resources (singstar ps2/ps3, the latest motorstorm psp/ps2, etc i might be forgetting), i don't think there's anything wrong with that. not to mention the ps2 is giving them profit in hw and sw sales, which is a plus to sony right now.
i do believe however that sony is wasting resources on psp development. the system only sells in japan. they did pretty good in the fight with nintendo (better than anyone else did) and people already know "psp". but the piracy on that thing is so big, the sw sales are as bad as it can get. 2010 should be as far as the psp should be allowed to live, bring out psp2 in 2011 (this time, more secure as to guarantee software sales) and stop with the ps1/ps2/ps3 adaptations. the psp needs original content and go after some of that nintendogs and whatever crowd while keeping the rest of us happy.

 

[Kittonwy]

I think Sony have spread themselves too thin.

PS2
PS3
PSP
PSN
Arc
3D gaming. (Waste of time if you ask me, hardly anyone will bother)
Home.

They need to focus themselves on fewer things, and do them really really well.

They hung on to the PS2 for WAY too long, and some of the teams like Bend basically have not transition properly to the PS3 yet, and they made the mistake of giving Slant Six the SOCOM franchise's PS3 debut instead of having Zipper handle their own series.

 

[Kittonwy]

On a Singstar related note:

Why haven't Sony cross promoted Singstar with the X-Factor in the UK so far? Sony get the winner on their label and Simon Cowell works for Sony BMG. If they had a singstar competition and mentioned it on air etc, the promotion would be immense.

They don't own Simon Cowell, it's basically another large expense they would have to pay, the problem is that you don't want to associate the franchise with a particular individual, because the fan loyalty wouldn't be to the franchise.

 

[Kittonwy]

My question to the people who are so upset at Sony for their decision with respect to Liverpool is:

What can Sony do with Liverpool if they actually keep them intact? What can Liverpool do outside of Wipeout and F1 when neither of which is a strong seller? It's not like these guys can all of a sudden branch out and make a 3rd person action-adventure game or a FPS.

 

[StealthGoblin]

They don't own Simon Cowell, it's basically another large expense they would have to pay, the problem is that you don't want to associate the franchise with a particular individual, because the fan loyalty wouldn't be to the franchise.

Well, Syco TV the production company that makes X-factor and Syco Music are all under the Sony umbrella. If they just had a competition running over the course of the show, mentioning the Playstation Exclusive Singstar series, it would rake in sales. It would still have the singstar branding, and the type of people that watch the show are wanna-be popstars. It just screams 'Do it'. Hell, even the sponsored ads would be a good spot for singstar.

 

[Kittonwy]

Well, Syco TV the production company that makes X-factor and Syco Music are all under the Sony umbrella. If they just had a competition running over the course of the show, mentioning the Playstation Exclusive Singstar series, it would rake in sales. It would still have the singstar branding, and the type of people that watch the show are wanna-be popstars. It just screams 'Do it'. Hell, even the sponsored ads would be a good spot for singstar.

I think my point is while you CAN do cross promotion but then you get into the issue of how much do you have to pay Cowell and his company to promote Singstar, as long as they don't put Cowell on the cover, you have to be really careful since you don't really want to turn Singstar brand into a Cowell brand.

 

[StealthGoblin]

I think my point is while you CAN do cross promotion but then you get into the issue of how much do you have to pay Cowell and his company to promote Singstar, as long as they don't put Cowell on the cover, you have to be really careful since you don't really want to turn Singstar brand into a Cowell brand.

I don't mean have Singstar: X Factor or anything, just replace the competitions they have on the show with a weekly featured singstar competition. No Cowell branding, no X-factor branding. People could go to the website for instance, and vote for their favourite Singstar performances.

I don't think Cowell would mind/ask for too much. He loves working for/with Sony.

 

[Lagspike_exe]

I think Sony have spread themselves too thin.

PS2
PS3
PSP
PSN
Arc
3D gaming. (Waste of time if you ask me, hardly anyone will bother)
Home.

They need to focus themselves on fewer things, and do them really really well.

3D gaming isn't really a big investment. Just a few guys from Evo are working on it.

PS2... Motorstorm and Jack&Daxter PS2 ports, if I'm not mistaken, were outsourced to some unknown devs (I believe Motorstorm was handled by some Chinese).

PSN dev is mostly done by 3rd party studios.

PSP is mostly smaller studios (Bend, Bigbig, Slant Six etc.).

The vast majority of Sony's core studios are only doing PS3.

 

[StealthGoblin]

Oh, and they need to approve their fucking approval system.

 

[Doubledex]

I don't think the Wipeout franchise is dead.

The Wipeout franchise isn't dead. And Sony didn't "fire all of the SL guys" etc.
But the flame-force is strong in here

 

[Kittonwy]

3D gaming isn't really a big investment. Just a few guys from Evo are working on it.

PS2... Motorstorm and Jack&Daxter PS2 ports, if I'm not mistaken, were outsourced to some unknown devs (I believe Motorstorm was handled by some Chinese).

PSN dev is mostly done by 3rd party studios.

PSP is mostly smaller studios (Bend, Bigbig, Slant Six etc.).

The vast majority of Sony's core studios are only doing PS3.

I'm still surprised that Bend still hasn't done jack on the PS3, it's going into the fourth year.

 

[Kazuma Kiryu]

I'm still surprised that Bend still hasn't done jack on the PS3, it's going into the fourth year.

syphon filter. 2010. make.believe.

 

[StealthGoblin]

I'm still surprised that Bend still hasn't done jack on the PS3, it's going into the fourth year.

They've been hiring. They were looking for a game tools programmer with PS3 experience ages ago. I'm confident their game will be announced this year.