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Take-Two: "Strategy games are just not contemporary."

“The window was really bad and it was a tough one. We were all shooting for autumn and all of us missed. So I think it was the window more than anything else because the critical ratings were good.”
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Against Modern Warfare 2 and what-not? Yeah, makes sense.
 
Furret said:
They were shown an extensive play through of the game at E3, i.e. exactly the same sort of preview as most of the games at E3.

You've just convinced yourself it's no good based purely on what it isn't, rather than what it is.
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Dude, the lead designer and art director just quit the studio.
Why would anyone expect this to be good?
 
Furret said:
They were shown an extensive play through of the game at E3, i.e. exactly the same sort of preview as most of the games at E3.
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The "extensive play through" is just a developer playing the game in a 100% controlled enviroment for 15 mins. Again, they have not touched the game.

And I don't give a crap of what you think about what I think. Thank you very much.
 
This is beyond Spoony's "BETRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL"

This is just ridiculous
 
I vaguely seem to recall a time where there was a market for games of all sorts. But that feels like it was so long ago that I am not sure if it were all a dream.

I doubt very much that contemporary artist and his music will be remembered as fondly, or at all, in 60 years such as is a privilege Ray Charles enjoys. I mean, Ray Charles' music is way, way before my time and I can still enjoy it immensely but I cannot stand that other guy's music even though he is in right now.

Hollywood is about 40 years past its prime, currently with its nose in the gutter with remakes of old favourites and comic book adaptations, though thankfully there is world cinema, especially Korean to save the day. The last generation where I felt games were constantly improving was the previous one, and all I see ahead is a steep downhill slope. And music, well, you know. Literature?... eh, Victorian era and back is the only way forward, at least for me anyway.

The current sheitgeist sure seems soulless and frivolous to an unprecedented degree, but maybe that is just the sign of me getting older.
 
Acosta said:
The "extensive play through" is just a developer playing the game in a 100% controlled enviroment for 15 mins. Again, they have not touched the game.

And I don't give a crap of what you think about what I think. Thank you very much.
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So, exactly the same as almost every other preview at E3? Most of which presumably you're not ignoring for the same reasons?

I was just checking you didn't have some genuine reason for being pessimistic about the game. Clearly you don't, so I'll continue to be cautiously optimistic.
 
Haha wow, his Ray Charles/Kanye West analogy is hilariously telling. He may as well have literally said "who cares about integrity if it's in the service of making a buck?"
 
Furret said:
I love all those games but none of them are going to sell 5 million copies whatever you do with them and that, for perfectly understandable reasons, is all Take two are interested in.

The best you can hope is that if the XCOM is a success it'll spawn a spin-off that's closer to the original. Maybe on the 3DS or something.
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And this is why they don't need to be making another XCOM.
 
Furret said:
So, exactly the same as almost every other preview at E3? Most of which presumably you're not ignoring for the same reasons?
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I'm pretty sure there were many more hands-on previews at E3 than there were 'watch me play for 15 minutes' type deals.

I was just checking you didn't have some genuine reason for being pessimistic about the game. Clearly you don't, so I'll continue to be cautiously optimistic.
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There are many reasons to be pessimistic about this game, like the way it went through development hell of some sort, and especially that the lead designer just quit, 9 months before launch.
 
Furret said:
I was just checking you didn't have some genuine reason for being pessimistic about the game.
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Uh, even if you ignore everything else, how are the Take-Two exec's blatantly cynical statements regarding the reasoning behind XCOM as an FPS not a legit cause for pessimism?

They apparently didn't make the change for game design reasons, i.e. because they actually thought they could improve on some of its elements, or take it in a 'fresh' new direction. They looked at sales charts and decided the best course of action was to do what everyone else is doing, and to use an existing IP for it.
 
Every trailer I've seen of X-Com has made it look like absolute garbage. How this is not a legitimate reason for not being optimistic about the game, I have no idea. Better to just listen to the game critics who give literally everything with over a $20 million budget an 85%+ Metacritic score I guess.
 
tiff said:
Every trailer I've seen of X-Com has made it look like absolute garbage. How this is not a legitimate reason for not being optimistic about the game, I have no idea. Better to just listen to the game critics who give literally everything with over a $20 million budget an 85%+ Metacritic score I guess.
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This. "Critical reaction" from E3 is a laughable joke. They'll love anything that has sweet graphics or a good PR rep.
 
The possibility of success is remote. This position is untenable. If it fails I hope Take-Two will realize that FPS games are archaic and fitness/dance games are the new hotness.

We really want to play an X-Com Kinect mini-game collection where we pantomime our soldiers' actions. Give us a Vitality Sensor as part of our Psi-Training. Give us Take-Two's take on a U-Draw command tablet. Offer a pre-order exclusive premium autopsy kit for our xenophobic vivisections.

This is what we want.
 
The Ray Charles thing was stupid, but I'm not going to argue with the idea that turn-based strategy games aren't contemporary. People are trying to make their games a success and to reach a massive audience: they'll have a much higher chance of that if it isn't a turn-based strategy game, something that is for a pretty small audience these days.
 
The Mana Legend said:
The Ray Charles thing was stupid, but I'm not going to argue with the idea that turn-based strategy games aren't contemporary. People are trying to make their games a success and to reach a massive audience: they'll have a much higher chance of that if it isn't a turn-based strategy game.
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Why not spend less on a strategy game and be profitable with less sales instead of spending a lot in an attempt to compete in an overcrowded market?
Why does everything need to be 'AAA'?
 
Strategy games may not be "contemporary", but that does not mean there is a lack of demand for good strategy games. Sounds like they just wanted to make another lame FPS and then tacked on the XCOM IP for that extra bit of branding power, whatever good it'll do....

Fredescu said:
You're all laughing, but it worked for Front Mission.
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Profound. Sadness.
 
Pfft. There are a lot of intelligent people here who can prove to you that commercialism does not in any way influence artistic integrity, whatever the facts.
 
The Mana Legend said:
The Ray Charles thing was stupid, but I'm not going to argue with the idea that turn-based strategy games aren't contemporary. People are trying to make their games a success and to reach a massive audience: they'll have a much higher chance of that if it isn't a turn-based strategy game, something that is for a pretty small audience these days.
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So why make X-Com a FPS? Did you miss the part where he said BioShock 2 sales dropped off a cliff two weeks after release. Why not spend less to make an X-Com strategy game that already has a base of fans that would have bought it, instead of taking a huge risk in an already saturated FPS market?
 
The Mana Legend said:
The Ray Charles thing was stupid, but I'm not going to argue with the idea that turn-based strategy games aren't contemporary. People are trying to make their games a success and to reach a massive audience: they'll have a much higher chance of that if it isn't a turn-based strategy game, something that is for a pretty small audience these days.
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First of all, why does a game need to reach a massive audience? There's a market that can be targeted that exists between "$50 million AAA title" and "$10 digital-only title." Secondly, there are still big turn based strategy games being developed. Civilization V was released last year. And this year will see the release of the sixth installment of the Heroes of Might and Magic series. That also doesn't take into account strategy RPG titles, which I'll defer to others for since I've only played the Tactics Ogre PSP remake in recent years.
 
Qwomo said:
I'm shaking my head so hard I think I might have an aneurysm.

Also
KuGsj.gif
@ blaming Bioshock 2's failure on the release date.
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Hahaha, it's comedy gold!
 
If strategy games aren't contemporary in the age of Civilization, StarCraft, and Paradox, then nothing besides shooters is contemporary.
 
GillianSeed79 said:
So why make X-Com a FPS? Did you miss the part where he said BioShock 2 sales dropped off a cliff two weeks after release. Why not spend less to make an X-Com strategy game that already has a base of fans that would have bought it, instead of taking a huge risk in an already saturated FPS market?
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Because they're fucking idiots that's why.
 
GillianSeed79 said:
So why make X-Com a FPS? Did you miss the part where he said BioShock 2 sales dropped off a cliff two weeks after release. Why not spend less to make an X-Com strategy game that already has a base of fans that would have bought it, instead of taking a huge risk in an already saturated FPS market?
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Because everyone sees the $650 million sales that CoD gets and they want a piece of the pie.

People can't be happy with making a profit on their game and giving an enjoyable experience to gamers, they need to have more.
 
Spend a few thousand, remake UFO Defense with better graphics and fix the glitches and put it up on Steam, XBLA, PSN, 3DS eShop, and the Wii U stores. Bam, you'll actually make money compared to this FPS POS
 
Valkyria Chronicles is contemporary (and awesome). All it takes is creativity and wits to unify "older" gameplay with modern conventions.

Regardless of whether the new X-Com is a good game or not the sentiments expressed in the OP are sad and misguided.
 
NullPointer said:
Valkyria Chronicles is contemporary (and awesome). All it takes is creativity and wits to unify "older" gameplay with modern conventions.

Regardless of whether the new X-Com is a good game or not the sentiments expressed in the OP are sad and misguided.
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There's also a fairly obscure strategy game called StarCraft 2 that no one really played. Ugh, I guess they'll go to any lengths to justify turning every game under the sun into an FPS though. 'Cause that's the only thing that's "contemporary" apparently.

Gonna go cleanse myself with some Frozen Synapse.
 
tiff said:
If strategy games aren't contemporary in the age of Civilization, StarCraft, and Paradox, then nothing besides shooters is contemporary.
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T2 don't want to put the marketing push behind a game that won't sell CoD-style numbers, and a TBS X-Com game would sell, but not at those levels.
 
sillymonkey321 said:
Some insight into the minds behind justifying why everything should be a first person shooter. It's interesting in a disgusting way.
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No, I get that. But this is still a ridiculously bad way to prove an already bad point.
 
demosthenes said:
People can't be happy with making a profit on their game and giving an enjoyable experience to gamers, they need to have more.
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Suits don't like games. They like money. Great games that make decent money aren't as attractive as decent games that make great money - both of which are worse than shitty games that make insane money.
 
ray charles... kanye west

i'm pretty sure that the sheer amount of SMH that is happening is going to give my future cihldren shaking baby syndrome. Dear god this man is a putz
 
ScionOfTheRisingSun said:
I vaguely seem to recall a time where there was a market for games of all sorts. But that feels like it was so long ago that I am not sure if it were all a dream.
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There is likely a market for all or most games, but publishers their game to be a big AAA multi-million seller. Hollywood doesn't just make Transformers for every movie because there is plenty of money to be made in different genres with varying budgets. Most games seem like either Transformers or the Blair Witch Project these days, AAA or small downloadable stuff.

I'm still mad Sega said this same shit about modern games not being turn based when they revived the Shining series after Camelot walked. And the series has been shit since.
 
jay said:
There is likely a market for all or most games, but publishers their game to be a big AAA multi-million seller. Hollywood doesn't just make Transformers for every movie because there is plenty of money to be made in different genres with varying budgets. Most games seem like either Transformers or the Blair Witch Project these days, AAA or small downloadable stuff.

I'm still mad Sega said this same shit about modern games not being turn based when they revived the Shining series after Camelot walked. And the series has been shit since.
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Funny then how Sega's crown jewel right now is the Total War series.

The problem is that most genres that publishers claim have "no market" are simply underserved right now, with an audience waiting in the wings to pounce on a well-made retail-valued game in the genre.
 
Man, for all the shit we give every other company for dancing around the issue of dumbing games down, this mother just comes right out and says it. I can't wait for this guy to get drummed out of the industry.
 
I just played a bit X-Com today... this game still holds up so well and you could easily take the core formula and build up on that to create a million seller. Just hand it to a competent but smaller team and release it with a lower pricepoint and TADAH all the starved pc gamers will be all over it.
 
I 100% agree with him.

I know it must be annoying to be a fan of something and have it drastically changed like this but its a business decision and its the right one.
 
Tylahedras said:
I 100% agree with him.

I know it must be annoying to be a fan of something and have it drastically changed like this but its a business decision and its the right one.
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To create an fps that doesn't even look good and throw it in an oversaturated marked that mostly cares about middle-east warfare fps and even release it on the same day as mass effect 3?
This is a winning strategy right there.
Soundtrack by Kanye West.
 
Tylahedras said:
I 100% agree with him.

I know it must be annoying to be a fan of something and have it drastically changed like this but its a business decision and its the right one.
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No, it's not. Because X-Com:FPS has the opposite of good word of mouth going for it. Fans are not going to buy it, casuals haven't even heard of it and the other things about the game out thus far have been negative reaction to the change. It's an extremely poor decision and the sales are most certainly going to reflect that.
 
Ahoi-Brause said:
I just played a bit X-Com today... this game still holds up so well and you could easily take the core formula and build up on that to create a million seller. Just hand it to a competent but smaller team and release it with a lower pricepoint and TADAH all the starved pc gamers will be all over it.
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And for the consoles please. We don't have nearly as many games of this type on the platforms.

Its a stupid business decision to diminish variety and set your game's expectations against the big shooters that dominate. Not every website can be Facebook, and not every game should be shooter that competes with the likes of COD. When will the bean counters in this industry wake up to that fact?
 
Tylahedras said:
I 100% agree with him.

I know it must be annoying to be a fan of something and have it drastically changed like this but its a business decision and its the right one.
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They could dev a TBS X-Com title on a smaller budget and 'create' a market for themselves, to stick with T2 line of thinking.
 
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