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Television Displays and Technology Thread: This is a fantasy based on OLED

D

DOT DASH DOT

Member
MosquitoSmasher said:
I know you can't truly how HDR on photos or videos but i still gave it a shot and i have to say, the results are pretty decent. The first pic is SDR and is from Gamersyde PC footage and the lower pic is HDR. I tried taking a photo of how SDR on my TV looks but it just made it look overly bright and not representative. Oh also....the HDR pic here has a very blueish tint, but not here, it's just the photo. I love how HDR gives these armors a shiney look to them, how that moon is almost blinding me, and much more similar to the very first Gears 4 footage that was properly dark and i've always found Gears 4 looking too bright for my liking when i played it on my EC9300.


IMO it just shows what HDR really adds to the overall visual experience.

RWJre5d.png


tEdg2aO.jpg
Click to expand...

It is definitely possible to show some benefit in pictures that's for sure!

You should play the multiplayer map Reclaimed, has the best lightning I've seen in a game, so bright and impactful, even better than the lightning in the campaign.
 
M

MosquitoSmasher

Member
So I've been messing around a bit trying to get HDR Game mode on the B6 as bright as possible and as close to HDR Bright and indeed with putting Dynamic contrast at medium or high it comes very close to being as bright as HDR Bright, so that's good. What's not good is that HDR Game mode is just not very great overall.

Take the Gears 4 main screen for example with JD in his armor. The blue things really light up significantly with HDR Bright, looks awesome. They don't at all with HDR Game mode and I can't seem to get it that way either. The same with very bright sun or moonlights. Great with HDR Bright, pale with HDR game mode. So I would say HDR game mode being too dim isn't its only problem. A shame really because the input lag difference is very easy to notice.

DOT DASH DOT said:
It is definitely possible to show some benefit in pictures that's for sure!

You should play the multiplayer map Reclaimed, has the best lightning I've seen in a game, so bright and impactful, even better than the lightning in the campaign.
Click to expand...

Isn't that a DLC map? I don't have any of the dlc sadly.
 
Bustanen

Bustanen

Member
EmilioLargo said:
Super annoyed by LG‘s 2016 OLED models apparently not supporting Dolby Vision 4K@60Hz. Doesn’t seem to be a limitation set by the HDMI standard since 2017 models support it.

Didn’t know of this issue until I got my Apple TV4K on friday. Apple TV4K not switching modes (to DV 4K@24Hz mode for applicable sources) automatically also doesn’t help.

Do we have a thread dedicated to this problem? Just found a petition for an update of lg‘s firmware https://www.change.org/p/lg-electronics-2016-oled-can-display-60hz-4k-dolby-vision-mass-effect-andromeda-is-dolby-vision but I wonder if a software update would even be able to solve this...
Click to expand...
Yeah was disappointed that it didn't work in ME:A. 1080@60 and 4K@30 work but I'd rather play in HDR10. Then again we don't even have DV Game mode either..
 
psychotron

psychotron

Member
Does the Vudu app on the new Apple TV 4k support HDR? Some say it’s only DV, others say HDR too. It doesn’t seem to on the app on my 900e.
 
M

MosquitoSmasher

Member
Just curious but are currently all LG OLED owners coping with the dim HDR game mode or is it only the B6, E6 and C6 sets so far? I read here that 7 series can enable pc mode with HDR but now it's unclear to me if there are downsides to that as well.
 
S

Solid Shammy

Banned
MosquitoSmasher said:
Just curious but are currently all LG OLED owners coping with the dim HDR game mode or is it only the B6, E6 and C6 sets so far? I read here that 7 series can enable pc mode with HDR but now it's unclear to me if there are downsides to that as well.
Click to expand...

The B6 isn't so bad, but the C6 , E6, and G6 are fucking broken and it's disgusting to me that LG has yet to fix this. They're as dim as SDR with an OLED light of 25, you do get more detail in highlights with this new mode but it destroys the screen brightness. The only solution is using dynamic contrast but I hate the defects that dynamic contrast comes with. I've successfully downgraded my TV and am staying that way but I am still incredibly upset over this situation. I truly don't think it's getting fixed and it doesn't help that the B6 dilutes the problem, sure B6 owners have it rough but nothing that us C6, E6, and G6 owners are suffering from. The saddest thing about the C/E/G series is that they used to have a perfectly functioning HDR game mode in line with HDR standard for almost a year. But now we're stuck with a mode that's much dimmer than the B6 due to the recent firmware. Just what the hell?
 
M

MosquitoSmasher

Member
Solid Shammy said:
The B6 isn't so bad, but the C6 , E6, and G6 are fucking broken and it's disgusting to me that LG has yet to fix this. They're as dim as SDR with an OLED light of 25, you do get more detail in highlights with this new mode but it destroys the screen brightness. The only solution is using dynamic contrast but I hate the defects that dynamic contrast comes with. I've successfully downgraded my TV and am staying that way but I am still incredibly upset over this situation. I truly don't think it's getting fixed and it doesn't help that the B6 dilutes the problem, sure B6 owners have it rough but nothing that us C6, E6, and G6 owners are suffering from. The saddest thing about the C/E/G series is that they used to have a perfectly functioning HDR game mode in line with HDR standard for almost a year. But now we're stuck with a mode that's much dimmer than the B6 due to the recent firmware. Just what the hell?
Click to expand...

Holy shit man, i had no idea it was this bad. That situation makes the B6 sound like peanuts really, damn. Good though that you managed to downgrade it. And yeah i agree, it's pretty ridiculous that LG seems to be fine with it and in no hurry to fix it, if at all. It's odd though, they did listen to requests for a HDR game mode and it happened but they are being very annoying with this shit.
 
holygeesus

holygeesus

Banned
MosquitoSmasher said:
Holy shit man, i had no idea it was this bad. That situation makes the B6 sound like peanuts really, damn. Good though that you managed to downgrade it. And yeah i agree, it's pretty ridiculous that LG seems to be fine with it and in no hurry to fix it, if at all. It's odd though, they did listen to requests for a HDR game mode and it happened but they are being very annoying with this shit.
Click to expand...

Currently I find the B6 HDR Game mode is fine in a dark room but pretty much unusable during daytime conditions. I only operate regular content with OLED Light at 40 though so maybe that is why it looks OK to me.

I had no idea the C6/E6/G6 had a worse version though. That completely passed me by. That would be useless pretty much at night too if that is the case and I'd stick to HDR Standard and just accept the lag.
 
A

Alfredo_V

Neo Member
LG B7 owner.. haven't played enough yet to validate best settings in game (PS4pro), anyone with same model experience issues reported with HDR mode too dark/dim? And have you tried the difference between HDR game and PC input?
 
Dave_6

Dave_6

Member
US spec B6 here. Is color gamut preferred to be set to normal instead of wide when possible? I know SDR game mode locks it to wide.
 
M

MosquitoSmasher

Member
holygeesus said:
Currently I find the B6 HDR Game mode is fine in a dark room but pretty much unusable during daytime conditions. I only operate regular content with OLED Light at 40 though so maybe that is why it looks OK to me.

I had no idea the C6/E6/G6 had a worse version though. That completely passed me by. That would be useless pretty much at night too if that is the case and I'd stick to HDR Standard and just accept the lag.
Click to expand...

I'll try it tonight. But chances are i won;t like it. OLED Light 40 sounds...just so low :(

But yeah, i'm gonna do the same. The difference between HDR Bright, Vivid and Game is just so big, i'm gonna do my best to adjust to the worse input lag. For third person shooters it's playable i've noticed but not so much for BF1 and such. But a higher input lag is no biggie for many other genres like racing, RPG, action adventure, puzzlers and so on. Mostly for the snappy FPS games.

Alfredo_V said:
LG B7 owner.. haven't played enough yet to validate best settings in game (PS4pro), anyone with same model experience issues reported with HDR mode too dark/dim? And have you tried the difference between HDR game and PC input?
Click to expand...

So the 7 series is coping with the dim bullshit as well? Unbelieveable that LG is just ignoring the people. This is mostly fine for many other non OLED televisions?
 
H

HooYaH

Member
Alfredo_V said:
LG B7 owner.. haven't played enough yet to validate best settings in game (PS4pro), anyone with same model experience issues reported with HDR mode too dark/dim? And have you tried the difference between HDR game and PC input?
Click to expand...

Yes, HDR game mode is dim on all 2017 OLED series with the latest firmware. As for PC mode, you do get low input (21ms) if set to PC mode, but the drawback for HDR PC is that you will receive major gradient banding.
 
D

darkazcura

Member
MosquitoSmasher said:
I'll try it tonight. But chances are i won;t like it. OLED Light 40 sounds...just so low :(

But yeah, i'm gonna do the same. The difference between HDR Bright, Vivid and Game is just so big, i'm gonna do my best to adjust to the worse input lag. For third person shooters it's playable i've noticed but not so much for BF1 and such. But a higher input lag is no biggie for many other genres like racing, RPG, action adventure, puzzlers and so on. Mostly for the snappy FPS games.



So the 7 series is coping with the dim bullshit as well? Unbelieveable that LG is just ignoring the people. This is mostly fine for many other non OLED televisions?
Click to expand...

Do you (or anyone) know the FW level that is affected by this dim HDR mode? Everyone talks about it, but it’s never been clear to me which FW suffers this issue. Want to make sure I don’t have it.

My FW is 4.31.20
 
E

emeadows11

Member
HooYaH said:
Yes, HDR game mode is dim on all 2017 OLED series with the latest firmware. As for PC mode, you do get low input (21ms) if set to PC mode, but the drawback for HDR PC is that you will receive major gradient banding.
Click to expand...


This is not true....2017 models do not suffer from this!
 
Bustanen

Bustanen

Member
darkazcura said:
Do you (or anyone) know the FW level that is affected by this dim HDR mode? Everyone talks about it, but it’s never been clear to me which FW suffers this issue. Want to make sure I don’t have it.

My FW is 4.31.20
Click to expand...
In EU the dimmer HDR Game mode has been the only HDR Game mode we've had. Not sure what version it was introduced in the US.

I barely even notice it since I run the OLED light below 50 in SDR and usually watch HDR movies with dark mode anyway.
 
Hawk269

Hawk269

Member
MosquitoSmasher said:
Just curious but are currently all LG OLED owners coping with the dim HDR game mode or is it only the B6, E6 and C6 sets so far? I read here that 7 series can enable pc mode with HDR but now it's unclear to me if there are downsides to that as well.
Click to expand...

Enabling PC mode allows you to use the other picture modes with the same input lag as game mode. However, in PC mode it introduces color gradients, so it makes it look really bad. While it is a lot brighter and input lag is great, having gradients to contend with is not worth it. This is on the 7 series. So there is definitely a significant downside to doing this. I have only tested HDR content in PC mode on both consoles and PC and the gradients are apparent. I will try later today non-hdr content to see if the gradients are still present, but the whole point is to get a brighter image in HDR and having the low input lag, so it may just be a pointless attempt anyways as SDR in Game Mode looks great.
 
Y

Yawnny

Member
On the B6 when running HDR Game for Gears 4 I almost found the whites TOO bright, and that's with the adjusting of HDR White brightness in the game menu.

I'm 28 years old. Is that older or younger than most people on this thread? I feel like my eyes find my B6 to get more than plenty bright enough. on SDR Game mode I have OLED at 48.. and it will still tend to make my eyes feel weird if I spend too long gaming in front of my B6 using that setting.

I don't consider 28 old, but would younger eyes deal with higher OLED birghtness differently? I just can't fathom when some people say even SDR OLED brigntess isn't enough.

HDR Game for Resident Evil 7 and Gears 4 (the only two HDR games I've tried) have also been more than bright enough. Again, with the whites almost being too much at times. Although OLED brightness is higher with this setting.

Just wanted to chime in...
 
D

DOT DASH DOT

Member
MosquitoSmasher said:
So I've been messing around a bit trying to get HDR Game mode on the B6 as bright as possible and as close to HDR Bright and indeed with putting Dynamic contrast at medium or high it comes very close to being as bright as HDR Bright, so that's good. What's not good is that HDR Game mode is just not very great overall.

Take the Gears 4 main screen for example with JD in his armor. The blue things really light up significantly with HDR Bright, looks awesome. They don't at all with HDR Game mode and I can't seem to get it that way either. The same with very bright sun or moonlights. Great with HDR Bright, pale with HDR game mode. So I would say HDR game mode being too dim isn't its only problem. A shame really because the input lag difference is very easy to notice.



Isn't that a DLC map? I don't have any of the dlc sadly.
Click to expand...

Everyone gets the DLC maps mate, they rotate! It's currently in the playlist for competitive.
 
Hawk269

Hawk269

Member
emeadows11 said:
This is not true....2017 models do not suffer from this!
Click to expand...

That is accurate. I have talked with people that had both a 2016 and 2017 and reports are that HDR game mode is much brighter on the 2017 models, however, people like me still feel it is a little dim, especially when you compare it to the Standard Picture mode and see how bright and vibrant it can look in HDR...but then you get the input lag. For me, if LG would allow the input lag of game mode to be used in Standard with of course certain things blocked off would be ideal. ---OR---- they fix the PC mode from having gradients.

When I heard about the PC mode trick I thought I solved the issue. PC mode allowed you to use any pre-set picture mode in HDR with the amazing low input lag. It was not till someone here asked about the gradients and I tested for it and sure enough it introduces gradients. I did not see it before because the game I was testing was Halo Wars 2, which in that game it was something that does not have a sky or big open area of clear visuals to see the gradients. It was not till I tried Forza 7 demo that it was apparent almost immediate. Switch the input back to HDMI resolved the issue...but the point is that PC mode gives you the ability to use any mode with great input lag and a bright image in HDR.

My E7 is pretty good in regards to screen uniformity and the HDR game mode does not look that bad, but I do wish it was brighter and being able to see it in the other modes, you know the set is capable of giving a very bright HDR image for games, it just introduces the input lag.

BTW...The Sony ZD9 65" just went down in price....I am no debating on moving to that...It is just that Colbert and a few others from here and AVS told me to give OLED a shot and having that true black is an amazing thing and games do look fantastic....just not sure if the grass is greener on the other side. I owned a ZD9 for short period but took it back due to moving to another state and I did love the set when I had it. Still unclear as to what I will do.
 
H

HooYaH

Member
Yawnny said:
On the B6 when running HDR Game for Gears 4 I almost found the whites TOO bright, and that's with the adjusting of HDR White brightness in the game menu.

I'm 28 years old. Is that older or younger than most people on this thread? I feel like my eyes find my B6 to get more than plenty bright enough. on SDR Game mode I have OLED at 48.. and it will still tend to make my eyes feel weird if I spend too long gaming in front of my B6 using that setting.

I don't consider 28 old, but would younger eyes deal with higher OLED birghtness differently? I just can't fathom when some people say even SDR OLED brigntess isn't enough.

HDR Game for Resident Evil 7 and Gears 4 (the only two HDR games I've tried) have also been more than bright enough. Again, with the whites almost being too much at times. Although OLED brightness is higher with this setting.

Just wanted to chime in...
Click to expand...

Not just you, but I tend to hover around the 40-50 OLED light range; seems much more natural, but also based on the ambient lighting in the room. As for HDR games, don't follow the optional matching calibration (match white visible) for games as that tends to get clipping according to several posts on AVSforums. Think the max you should set around 700 nits for HDR for LG TVs.
 
holygeesus

holygeesus

Banned
HooYaH said:
Yes, HDR game mode is dim on all 2017 OLED series with the latest firmware. As for PC mode, you do get low input (21ms) if set to PC mode, but the drawback for HDR PC is that you will receive major gradient banding.
Click to expand...

Have you tried changing the chroma output of your games console? Try 4:2:0 if you haven't.
 
psychotron

psychotron

Member
Those pics make me want to play Recore.

Off topic, but anyone own the Sony DN1080 receiver? The product page says that Dolby Vision support is coming through an update, but is Sony reliable? I’d hate to blow $500 and it doesn’t get the update.
 
M

MosquitoSmasher

Member
Kyoufu said:
Yeah. It's like it has completely different textures in HDR.
Click to expand...

Yeah exactly and the sky looks totally different. However this was from a Gamersyde video. What i'm gonna try after dinner is, boot up Recore again. Same area and make a screenshot with the Xbox. I'll go to Xboxdvr.com and check and see if the difference is still that drastic. It probably is.
 
K

Kyoufu

Member
GinoFelino said:
I'm guessing the Definitive Edition had some work done in that department. Nevertheless, the differences are striking.

Having just returned my C7, it's going to be a long wait until I get a HDR set again..
Click to expand...

Wait, those aren't the same game? I thought it was just HDR being flipped on/off.
 
zeomax

zeomax

Member
MosquitoSmasher said:
Man...the difference is lovely
Click to expand...

These are really bad comparisons pictures. The one is from a compressed video the other taken with phone camera.

Please take both pictures from the same source. Deactivate HDR in the game and then make the comparisons pictures with your camera.
 
M

MosquitoSmasher

Member
Kyoufu said:
Wait, those aren't the same game? I thought it was just HDR being flipped on/off.
Click to expand...

The SDR pics are from a older Gamersyde video. It's definitely possible if i just make a screenshot of it with Xbox the results will be different. Fuck it..i'm gonna try that now.

zeomax said:
This are really bad comparisons pictures. The one is from a compressed video the other taken with phone camera.

Please take both pictures from the same source. Deactivate HDR in the game and then make the comparisons pictures with your camera.
Click to expand...

I could do that but it seems there's a weird bug or something when i enable/disable the HDR option on Xbox. When i did that today it started losing the signal and randomly would cut off. Plus i tried this today for Gears 4, but the photos from my phone were just too bright compared to how it actually looked here. I think a screenshot from me from Xboxdvr.com is probably best.
 
M

MosquitoSmasher

Member
Ok guys, proper photos this time. And as expected as soon as i disabled HDR it started to act up again. I am guessing this could be preview related.

Anywho, differences aren't as drastic still i'd say prettyyyyyyyy good!

qvg85hD.jpg


bdMTXJ8.jpg


L4S18f7.jpg


kYeao5y.jpg


qVO4AQ5.jpg


6WEXJy7.jpg


reo2Sm9.jpg


uicqotx.jpg
 
zeomax

zeomax

Member
Sorry to disappoint you but this is not what HDR is. In your HDR pictures you have lost so many visible details especially in the brighter parts. With HDR you should see more details not less!!

If your TV would be proper calibrated then there would be no difference in the Pictures. Why not? Because your are watching these pictures on a non HDR Monitor and in the end you are simply looking at two normal SDR pictures.

Here are two examples i made to show what i mean.

20170924_201544o3sx6.png

20170924_201428rps9u.png
Click to expand...

There is a slightly difference in these pictures but just because its very hard to match the exact same setting for SDR and HDR.
 
M

MosquitoSmasher

Member
zeomax said:
Sorry to disappoint you but this is not what HDR is. In your HDR pictures you have lost so many visible details especially in the brighter parts. With HDR you should see more details not less!!

If your TV would be proper calibrated then there would be no difference in the Pictures. Why not? Because your are watching these pictures on a non HDR Monitor and in the end you are simply looking at two normal SDR pictures.

Here are two examples i made to show what i mean.



There is a slightly difference in these pictures but just because its very hard to match the exact same setting for SDR and HDR.
Click to expand...

Well the thing is, HDR is brand new to me, so i am merely experimenting with it. I think a lot of people wouldn't even prefer the HDR Bright mode and rather chose Standard. Also i kept most settings at HDR Bright on default. Colour for example is at 65 i believe which i normally have at 50 for SDR gaming. Colour temp is at 0.
The very bright sunlight and vivid skies in FM7 howevr, that's how HDR is ''meant'' to look right? And i love the more darker look of Gears 4, also the colours.
 
O

oakenhild

Member
RedlineRonin said:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnar...tv-4k-review-13-reasons-you-shouldnt-buy-one/

Part 2 of Johns Apple TV 4k review. Only on reason six and I’m already out. Sounds like a very poorly thought out device.

Maybe it’s better after a few fw updates, but sounds unattractive as is.
Click to expand...

Some of these are pretty far fetched, and hopefully some of them get fixed.

Seeing as how I have all of my digital movies on itunes, and most are now upgraded to 4k for free (did not expect this...), and I can regularly buy new 4k movies at $10 or less...pretty much no other choice but to go with this box once I get a 4k tv. I personally doubt I'd have even known of any of these issues in day to day viewing other than Disney not being on board with 4k (they'll come around).
 
Theonik

Theonik

Member
Off screen pictures of an HDR TV taken with a shitty camera and shown in SDR on an equally shitty monitor in all likelyhood is probably the worst way to illustrate what HDR looks like.
 
M

MosquitoSmasher

Member
Theonik said:
Off screen pictures of an HDR TV taken with a shitty camera and shown in SDR on an equally shitty monitor in all likelyhood is probably the worst way to illustrate what HDR looks like.
Click to expand...

There aren't many other ways though. And honestly, the pictures are actually more representative of how it looks here than I expected.
 
G

GinoFelino

Member
Theonik said:
Off screen pictures of an HDR TV taken with a shitty camera and shown in SDR on an equally shitty monitor in all likelyhood is probably the worst way to illustrate what HDR looks like.
Click to expand...
That’s some shitposting man

Pics look great and are a good indication of some of HDRs virtues, all things considered

zeomax said:
Sorry to disappoint you but this is not what HDR is. In your HDR pictures you have lost so many visible details especially in the brighter parts. With HDR you should see more details not less!!

If your TV would be proper calibrated then there would be no difference in the Pictures. Why not? Because your are watching these pictures on a non HDR Monitor and in the end you are simply looking at two normal SDR pictures.

Here are two examples i made to show what i mean.



There is a slightly difference in these pictures but just because its very hard to match the exact same setting for SDR and HDR.
Click to expand...
I mean, I get what you’re trying to say, but no. HDR and sdr should not look the same in offscreen pictures. That’s just silly nonsense.
 
B

btkadams

Member
Does anyone have the new 4k Apple TV and a B7? There’s some audio delay (even when audio is played out the TV speakers) and I cannot figure out why. It’s painful. I tried doing the AV adjustment but speeding up the audio to the earliest point on the delay-meter is still not enough.
 
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