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Ten Years of Final Fantasy VII

So uhhhh, why is anyone trolling FFVII in an FFVII thread after this bloodbath?

At any rate, this was a pretty great game.

The gameplay was a bit off because of all the minigames and the bad advancement system (interchangeable materia levels up, characters stay the same), but the storyline and characterization were top notch.

A remake could be the best damn thing ever provided they drastically alter the advancement system (look at the international versions of X or XII).

All the milking and bad sequels wreaks of Disney straight-to-DVD crap, perhaps a bad result of association with the Mouse in Kingdom Hearts... but a remake could be wonderful.
 
Anihawk, I usually love you, but I think you are wrong here. For its time, FFVII was great. While perhaps the story was not perfect, the limits of the technology, the time constraints on getting the game out, and the execution of the antagonists were designed with a frame of mind from the 2D era: Let the user imagine what is to be. The fact that so many came to the conclusion, without a ridiculous amount of pushing, that Cloud and Aeris / Cloud and Tifa were bone buddies / in love is because the game's text guided them, and they filled in the holes.

Nowadays, you have to show everything or else no one imagines anything, and this is why 2D still rocks.
 
SantaC said:
thank god, and sephiroth is the most overrated villian. i dont understand the love for him.

I liked the game due to music and battle system

but it's not on my top3 ff list.
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since sephiroths arrival, he's seriously influenced so many anime and manga villains after. So is he overrated, yes he is but the delusional character he is, is attractive for a villian. Yes I know FFVI had that clown villian but clowns aren't attractive, they are just scary.
 
tnw said:
I don't get the 'it's aged terribly' bit. I mean I used to kind of think so, but now I just see it as a style. I mean you wouldn't say steamboat willy has aged terribly, and I bet people in the 1950's thought it was crap because it was only black and white, etc.

It is what it is, and I think it looks fine. I don't want a remake. I think the charater models they have made don't capture the spirit of the original game at all.
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I love you. My words exactly.
 
JayDubya said:
So uhhhh, why is anyone trolling FFVII in an FFVII thread after this bloodbath?

At any rate, this was a pretty great game.

The gameplay was a bit off because of all the minigames and the bad advancement system (interchangeable materia levels up, characters stay the same), but the storyline and characterization were top notch.

A remake could be the best damn thing ever provided they drastically alter the advancement system (look at the international versions of X or XII).

All the milking and bad sequels wreaks of Disney straight-to-DVD crap, perhaps a bad result of association with the Mouse in Kingdom Hearts... but a remake could be wonderful.
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uh... just no,this isn't the first final fantasy with all samey character,the only difference would be that you can switch materia around which actualy sound like a good idea since you don't end up with a bunch of underdeveloped character... i don't see what the internationational version altered to make it better than the normal version of X
 
ItsInMyVeins said:
Stuff like that have happened to me in several games though.
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That doesn't make it any less stupid.
It's just one symptom of a team that had no clue about how to design a game around their world and story, which are, granted, kind of nice.
 
Magicpaint said:
Great game, but the sheer fandom nearly kills it at the same time. I do have some issues with the game, but I still really, really enjoyed it and those memories remain untainted.

Midgar is probably my favourite area in any RPG.
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This cannot be stressed enough, FF7 is one of the best games ever made, but god do the fans irritate the hell out of me. They put FF7 on a pedestal and call it one of the best games ever, that no game after it was remotely as good.

FF7 isn't perfect, and better RPG's have come after FF7.
 
Hcoregamer00 said:
This cannot be stressed enough, FF7 is one of the best games ever made, but god do the fans irritate the hell out of me. They put FF7 on a pedestal and call it one of the best games ever, that no game after it was remotely as good.
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Well maybe we should just get rid of that hyperbole then. We can start right here:
Hcoregamer00 said:
FF7 is one of the best games ever made
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Why even say that?
It's the same thing with the goddamn OoT fans, or the SoA fans, or the Baten Kaitos fans or whatever. Nobody minds if you like a game, but these fucking superlatives never fail to get people riled up. Quit using them, and world peace shall ensue.
 
Watching that speed run is super nostalgic.
I think a lot of amazing, innovative design choices came out of FF7.
The music was also excellent.

I really enjoyed the FF7 story, and I think it did a pretty good job of making you care about Cloud and his journey. I was seriously attached to his character and really felt vindicated at the end of the game. The ending was interesting and touching, without being too overdone and blatant. Although I also loved FF6's ending, which spells a lot of things out for you, I appreciated the different style.

It's funny because I really enjoyed FF4, 6, 7, 8, 10 and 12... yet I'm super excited about 13. I just know that it's going to be amazing, just like playing FF7 for the first time.
 
bcn-ron said:
It's the same thing with the goddamn OoT fans, or the SoA fans, or the Baten Kaitos fans or whatever. Nobody minds if you like a game, but these fucking superlatives never fail to get people riled up. Quit using them, and world peace shall ensue.
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Yeah, but the statement itself praised the game, and insulted the rabid fanbase. I don't see anything wrong with the statement because it is true. FF7 is a very loved game, but the fanbase puts it on a pedestal calling it the best thing ever.

FF7's fans are the worst of the bunch.
 
My roommates and I stayed awake for the better part of three days playing FFVII when it came out. In those three days I learned just how much damage instant coffee can do to your digestive system. I had all kinds of horrific shits from that marathon session. The nightmares still haunt me.
 
Teasel said:
i don't see what the internationational version altered to make it better than the normal version of X
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It included a whole second Sphere Grid that allowed the player to direct characters down any stat/ability path the player wanted from the onset, added new abilities on the grid that weren't on the original, and had a completely different layout. It also added the Dark Aeons and Penance and the Ribbon ability, among other things. Mainly the different sphere grid and how it worked was what made it better than the normal version of 10.

Unless you mean the PAL version was the normal one, which it is the International version anyway, but the actual International version played at a normal framerate and didn't have black bars, so those alterations were better than the PAL version as well.
 
bcn-ron said:
That doesn't make it any less stupid.
It's just one symptom of a team that had no clue about how to design a game around their world and story, which are, granted, kind of nice.
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Nah, you're supposed to fight the fight and then die in it. I can understand if it gets annoying if turn it off before dying and starting over again, though. But usually you'll notice that the enemy is (or suddenly becomes) extremly strong and assume what's gonna happen.
 
ItsInMyVeins said:
Nah, you're supposed to fight the fight and then die in it. I can understand if it gets annoying if turn it off before dying and starting over again, though. But usually you'll notice that the enemy is (or suddenly becomes) extremly strong and assume what's gonna happen.
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It's a decision that tells me not just that story-telling took precedence over game design, but that noone interested in game design was even present when that scene was created. You can only progress if you play poorly, or rather the game punishes you (by wasting your time and possibly items) for playing well. It goes against the very substance of gaming.
Again, if my party is supposed to lose for reasons of story, fine, so be it, but do it properly: give the villain an attack that will actually kill them, or just do it in a cut-scene. There are billions of JRPG that have done this properly, without wasting thirty minutes of my time while I'm duking it out with all I got, thinking "Hmmm, nice, this is actually kinda challenging".

edit: Not obvious. Rodriguez isn't that strong at that point in the game. He could only kill my dudes when/because I let him. Was my first time through, obviously, otherwise I would have known.
 
By the way I love how fleshed out the big "evil corporation" was~they really should focused on Shinra abit more! The soldiers were regular guys just like Cloud so it's kinda sad to kill them off. But fighting that fat pencil pusher Palmer was a treat!

Red Scarlet said:
Cloud and Aerith could kind of be somewhat romantically linked if you went out with her at Gold Saucer. Aside from that...
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uh oh!
 
FFVII isn't perfect, but it's so rich, so iconic, so instantly memorable that I even delighted in the areas where it tripped up. W-Item glitch, I'm looking at you!
 
Here's my history of RPGs through 2002.

1998:
Pokemon Red

2000:
Final Fantasy VI
Chrono Trigger
Terranigma
Super Mario RPG
Earthbound

2001:
Skies of Arcadia
Grandia II
Paper Mario
Golden Sun

2002:
Final Fantasy VII
Final Fantasy VIII
Final Fantasy IX
Final Fantasy X
Final Fantasy Tactics
Chrono Cross

So I first played FFVII five years ago. I really think it's a game of its time, where you had to play it in 1997 to really appreciate it. Because in 2002, I played four other Final Fantasy games that were superior (though X is, expectedly, most similar in quality). As I played it, I sorta enjoyed the convoluted story, and I was able to trudge through the gameplay as most other RPGs until then played the same, but I can't imagine a decade later the game can be reasonably compared to anything else on the market. The game gets so much popularity because it was the first big 3D RPG and it had pretty movies. Outside of that, I found it overwhelmingly mediocre.

So my experience with the game is extremely different from most of yours. It's not the big WOW from 1997. It's the aged game from 2002.
 
Lindsay said:
By the way I love how fleshed out the big "evil corporation" was~they really should focused on Shinra abit more! The soldiers were regular guys just like Cloud so it's kinda sad to kill them off. But fighting that fat pencil pusher Palmer was a treat!



uh oh!
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Heh, when given the choice to kick Soldier ass guarding the submarine I kindly spared them.
 
ILL2 said:
Final Fantasy 7 gave me some good times in life. I usually replay it about every 2 years, and I put in more time every time I do it. FF VII is definitely one of the games I will never forget. I can just listen to the soundtrack, and it brings me back to the first time I played it. Aeris...NOOOO. SEPHIROTH! YOU BASTARD!!! :lol
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I was glad that flirty bitch died.
 
KTallguy said:
Watching that speed run is super nostalgic.
I think a lot of amazing, innovative design choices came out of FF7.
The music was also excellent.

I really enjoyed the FF7 story, and I think it did a pretty good job of making you care about Cloud and his journey. I was seriously attached to his character and really felt vindicated at the end of the game. The ending was interesting and touching, without being too overdone and blatant. Although I also loved FF6's ending, which spells a lot of things out for you, I appreciated the different style.

It's funny because I really enjoyed FF4, 6, 7, 8, 10 and 12... yet I'm super excited about 13. I just know that it's going to be amazing, just like playing FF7 for the first time.
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wtf was innovative about FFVII's design?

The materia system? It was an expansion of the Esper system in FFVI.
FMVs? Definitely not new
the story? Band of fighters against a corrupt conglomerate, as well as a soldier who defected from the aforementioned conglomerate and is bent on world domination and obtaining ultimate power.

The pseudo-amnesia / multiple personality disorder / whatever-the-fuck-you-want-to-call-it that Cloud had was nothing new to games.

A playable character dying was nothing new, especially not to the FF series.

What exactly was INNOVATIVE about FFVII?
 
AniHawk said:
<...>

So my experience with the game is extremely different from most of yours. It's not the big WOW from 1997. It's the aged game from 2002.
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It's really not just about the graphics. When you compare that with the other RPGs you have listed, one aspect where VII competes very well is the pacing. You're in deep shit seconds after the intro flic, and the game is immediately gripping and tense. Compare that to FF IX, where I consider the proper start* of the game to be the moment where you head off into the woods after the crash landing. I need to guess how long it takes up until that point ... two hours?
FF VIII's introduction can be insanely long as well, but much of it is just talking to everybody around the school, and can easily be skipped, unlike FF IX's introduction.
FF X starts slow as hell as well. That swimming shit needs to stop.
Chrono Trigger's fairly quick I think (that prison stuff there is where I feel it starts), so are Grandia II and Golden Sun, but FF7 is still quicker. You got to hand it that one at least, if nothing else.

*freedom to explore an area and fight regular enemy encounters

And then there's the combat system. Of the four ATB systems on your list, VII's is the most deeply customizable one, and at the same time still very accessible. It doesn't have the tedious tasks of drawing 99 of every spell you encounter, nor juggling around the equipment/espers and extracting all the skills for every character you want to have in good shape. I know some people think it's "too easy" if your materia levels transfer to any character, and they all level up regardless of use, but I see it as cutting out mindless repetition and house-keeping. You can still grind your soul out in FF7 if you want to anyway.

So please also acknowledge that the materia system is solid, if not spectacular.

There's a whole wad to be said about the story issues but I'll stop here. I've written a whole 2048 word pamphlet about that shit last month, and I got to draw a line somewhere.
 
bcn-ron said:
It's really not just about the graphics.
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No, it's not. It's also the load times, the poor animation, the uninteresting story, and its uninteresting characters. Honestly, I can't tell one turn-based battle system from the other, so FFVII does nothing for me in terms in combat. But I doubt it was REALLY that revolutionary to anyone that wasn't an avid RPG fan at the time.

Perhaps the most interesting part of the game was the ending. Because the humans didn't make it. But, oh, look at that. There's a huge fanbase and Square needs money. It's really sad that in 2007 the best thing about the Final Fantasy VII series is still Final Fantasy VII.
 
GaimeGuy said:
What exactly was INNOVATIVE about FFVII?
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cinematic presentation, not a single console RPG at the time was as cinematic as FF7 was.
 
But fighting that fat pencil pusher Palmer was a treat!
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palmer.gif
 
Though Chrono Trigger was the first RPG i've ever played, FF7 eclipsed that in terms of personal resonance (though CT is a close second).

I just have a nebulous, ethereal feeling about the FF7 experience...it was all just so amazing for me. The music, the story, the camera angles, the characters, the summons, the bosses, the JOURNEY! Simply amazing.

It was in this game that I also had my most proud gaming moment: leveling up to a gold chocobo (TOOK FOREVER), getting KOTR summon, killing Emerald Weapon, duplicating my most powerful materia multiple times (Mimic anyone?). I think I clocked in at just under 120 hours when I finshed.

I remember beating Emerald then going to fight Sephiroth and thinking he would be hard and casting KOTR. One hit kill! hahahaa :)
 
BrettBullet said:
Though Chrono Trigger was the first RPG i've ever played, FF7 eclipsed that in terms of personal resonance (though CT is a close second).

I just have a nebulous, ethereal feeling about the FF7 experience...it was all just so amazing for me. The music, the story, the camera angles, the characters, the summons, the bosses, the JOURNEY! Simply amazing.

It was in this game that I also had my most proud gaming moment: leveling up to a gold chocobo (TOOK FOREVER), getting KOTR summon, killing Emerald Weapon, duplicating my most powerful materia multiple times (Mimic anyone?). I think I clocked in at just under 120 hours when I finshed.

I remember beating Emerald then going to fight Sephiroth and thinking he would be hard and casting KOTR. One hit kill! hahahaa :)
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My experience was very similar to yours only I had completed FFVI and was at a buddies house whom had received a demo of FFVII from PSU, after playing it I was floored I begged my parents to get me a PS1 and FF7 for christmas and when I got it all I did was play that game and I continued to play it for years after I think I logged on somewhere around 300-350 hours I'm not sure all I know is I had an Uber file that a jealous friend of mine saved over one day...the point is it sticks in my heart as one of the best games I have ever played and that's how I will remember it always.
 
epmode said:
Who's saying it was INNOVATIVE? The game was great because of its presentation and production values.
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I don't know...

KTallguy said:
I think a lot of amazing, innovative design choices came out of FF7.
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AniHawk said:
No, it's not. It's also the load times, the poor animation, the uninteresting story, and its uninteresting characters. Honestly, I can't tell one turn-based battle system from the other, so FFVII does nothing for me in terms in combat. But I doubt it was REALLY that revolutionary to anyone that wasn't an avid RPG fan at the time.

Perhaps the most interesting part of the game was the ending. Because the humans didn't make it. But, oh, look at that. There's a huge fanbase and Square needs money. It's really sad that in 2007 the best thing about the Final Fantasy VII series is still Final Fantasy VII.
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Man, screw that noise. I always thought that was bull the first time that theory came out way back. Finally glad it was put to goddamn rest.

Vindicated mother******! Then again the original FFVII already alluded as such the first time!!

Bwahahahahaha!!
 
I played the shit out of this game when it first came out. So young at the time.
I'm very nostalgic about the game, even though I don't think as highly of it as other people.
I mean I bought that piece of shit Advent Children just because of the music/nostalgia factor.

I didn't read the thread but for some reason we are bringing up Skies of Arcadia now?
best RPG ever
 
AniHawk said:
So you agree with Gaime then.
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Nope, I think that the game @ the time was some of the best stuff I ever saw in my life. The story kept me interested and to this veryday I play it every once in a while, there is very few games that come close to replays then FF7. Everyone has there opinions but I still think its an awesome game and majority of gamers will remember whether its for the good or the worst. COME ON! How many games has a quest where you have to gather items to pretty much become a cross dresser and also get picked by the pervert so you can save a friend lol.
 
g35twinturbo said:
Nope, I think that the game @ the time was some of the best stuff I ever saw in my life. The story kept me interested and to this veryday I play it every once in a while, there is very few games that come close to replays then FF7. Everyone has there opinions but I still think its an awesome game and Majority of people will remember whether its for the good or the worst.
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Aye.

*high fives g35twinturbo*
 
Flesh Into Gear said:
I played the shit out of this game when it first came out. So young at the time.
I'm very nostalgic about the game, even though I don't think as highly of it as other people.
I mean I bought that piece of shit Advent Children just because of the music/nostalgia factor.

I didn't read the thread but for some reason we are bringing up Skies of Arcadia now?
best RPG ever
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F U man! Advent children was awesome!
yeah the story was lame and all but
that movie was a cameo fanfest, it was amazing.
 
I find it sad that AniHawk hates on FFVII yet at the same time praises Skies of Arcadia as if its even in the same league. All your dislikings with FFVII are only magnified and multiplied tenfold in SoA.

Heres a tip AniHawk, try comparing FFVII to amazing RPGs (a.k.a. not average; eg. SoA) that were released around the same time as FFVII.

Such as Panzer Dragoon Saga. Absolute classic that goes down in history as over-looked due to Sega's failure with the Saturn. One of the best RPGs of all time.

Using Skies of Arcadia to make nasty, fanboyish comments towards FFVII only proves that you're just bitter that everybody bought a Playstation along with FFVII. I wonder if you've even played it? Judging by your comments towards the game, I would think not.

Not even sure why its being mentioned in this thread...
 
ElectricBlue187 said:
I friggen hate this game after Midgar
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I think to myself after reading this comment... yes it did get a little slow after midgar, then I look at your avvy and say "aha! makes sense." to further clarify, Black Isle or rocked rather.
 
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