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[Kadayi]

It is almost as if the writer of this article wants to be a part of the gamer culture (because it’s trendy atm), but doesn’t actually like gaming. So, she would rather brute force it.

Imagine someone wanted to be a part of the scientific academia scene, but didn’t want to put in the work to learn you know, science. Nah, they should just dumb it down so she can be included.

Hilarious when you think about it.

I don't know. I think it's just more her butting up against the brute realities of trying to work for a living and be a full on gamer. You can't be on point all the time, and you certainly can't play everything either. I don't even view myself as a hardcore gamer personally. More an aficionado for the medium. I play when I feel the desire and I like following the news, but these days I'm at peace with the fact that I'll probably never clear most of my backlog, not without a major cloning operation and some memory transfer doohickey (and if that existed I bet their are better memories to have). I dare say if I wanted to brutalise my body I could chug monster like there's no tomorrow to power through those low energy evenings, but that just seems like a bad idea.

 

[danielberg]

Meh there are millions of games on each spectrum from easy to hard demanding that future games all be made for your taste of difficulty exclusively is a bit fucked up.
Just imagine the same in any other entertainment medium like people that dont like horror movies demanding that future horror movies are made less scary for everyone its a bit crazy lol

 

[ptuck874]

no joke, another example of #metoo gone wild, and if this get's into a hive mind type following, I would be kinda happy, lol......

 

[A.Romero]

She should play one of many walking simulators around.

There is no point in the article, it's written in a very pretentious way and obviously insulting to a hobby where competition is one of it's core aspects.

Yes, some people like to play really difficult games and like to act like they are better than people who can't but who cares? Personally I could never get into the Soulbourne games at all because of the difficulty and because I like games to tell a story that is laid out and well executed as opposed to reading item descriptions and piece it all together.

Am I a worse gamer because of that? Maybe. Do I care what unknown people on the net say about it? Not at all. Do I think those games are bad because they are not my cup of tea? Fuck no. I'm happy there are many options for all kind of gamers and I'm also glad being good at these games make a lot of people feel great. What's not to like? Her position is entitled and immature.

She can play Pokemon Go, Gone Home and many other titles that can be enjoyed without putting forward a huge challenge.

 

[Domisto]

Some OTT outrage in here. I'm shit at games, Dark Souls and Cuphead both destroy me pretty badly, turns out they're not for me. That said, throw me a racing game and I'm usually somewhere in the top 10% or so out there once I take a bit of time with it. I don't mind games existing that aren't for me. On the flip side, I'd love to see more adventure games with actual puzzles in the 90s style (yes I know there's a shedload of stuff made in AGS but most of it's so utterly dire with awful writing and voice acting - it's not a patch on the likes of DOTT, Monkey Island 2, etc) but the market is producing mostly puzzle-free stuff like Telltale's output, Life Is Strange, etc. I'm ok with those things existing (I really enjoyed LIS) and won't complain that games are too easy. What I do ask is that people allow me my games and I'll allow them theirs.

Yeah, that's cool. Ideally there'd be games for all types.

The only real problem I have with the Guardian article is that it's framed so negatively. Like so many articles nowadays; it's a common problem from 'progressive' voices. Instead of complaining about the games she doesn't want to get good at, why not talk about what she does want to see. There's a niche of easy games that's been growing for decades for super casual players and that's fine. Write an article that basically says - look at my wallet - I want to give you money if you make more of this and balance the market more to my tastes. Here's some ideas. But it's easier to dash off some whiny humour attempt nonsense which she probably doesn't really care about in order to make a quick buck freelancing.

 

[zenspider]

Like a lot of idiots with nothing better to do, I enjoy playing video games.

What a first line!

This relationship between increasingly meaningless work and increasingly work-like video games is well illustrated by releases like Farming Simulator and American Truck Simulator, which allow you to experience the insane thrills of having a middle-of-the-road job.

This is actually a really interesting point buried under the privlige. Video games can be a sort of simulacrum for the pressure to - and rewards from - doing a good job. It does speak to the relative meaningless of a lot of people's jobs, and how they may let those hooks get pulled by something more entertaining and gratifying.

Funnily enough, that lack of desire to do a good job, regardless of how meaningful you find it a.k.a. work ethic, is something I find lacking in most of the people mistakenly call millennials (iGen is a more useful demarcation).

 

[Durask]

Is this a preview of her PhD thesis?

I think this is her PhD thesis.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/sep/30/intersectional-feminism-jargon

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

The OP may be the most-liked post on GAF. Is there a way to check?

I think this is her PhD thesis.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/sep/30/intersectional-feminism-jargon

Took me a long time to get through all of that. Interesting...

 

[A.Romero]

I think this is her PhD thesis.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/sep/30/intersectional-feminism-jargon

TBH I really liked the article. She has a good style, very acid.

I don't necessarily agree with her ideas but the article was fun to read.

 

[Sonny Black]

Yes the first line already tell some things about her;

Like a lot of idiots with nothing better to do, I enjoy playing video games.

Then she say;

I don’t want to “git gud” at video games.

And yet, you will still have trouble with most of those games because even little kids are willing to learn, to progress and to get better at video games.

 

[YayNJ]

I remember when Gaf was a games forum, and not a echochamber masquerading as one.

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

I remember when Gaf was a games forum, and not a echochamber masquerading as one.

You've been here since the end of July...

 

[Orpheum]

I sure hope she gits gud. at writing articles and gaming alike

-Orpheum (someone who apparently replaces his success in gaming with irl success because my job is unfulfilling)

 

[cormack12]

I find the more interesting point of this article is the entry barrier the author speaks of. Especially since all the AAA publishers are trying to attract a bigger audience. She freely admits she is new to videogames or her interest in them is a recent development. She basically does not like the 'unknown' or trial and error. Some video games do incorporate this learning logic and we all go through it.

"Can I make that jump? Oh, shit No. Now I'm dead and I have to go back to my (un)forgiving checkpoint/save point."
"Can I quickly swim to that cover? Shit, spotted by insta-death piranha's. Try again."


Secondly, she then bemoans the lack of 'detective mode' that is pretty much rampant in every major AAA release, and was so disliked it's now becoming a toggle/user activated in many titles..

Thirdly, she makes the assumption that all people currently playing games just picked up a controller - like she has - watched a youtube video and cracked through a game. She doesn't make any sort of acknowledgement that for lots of us we had to transition from various controls, 2D to 3D, and all very different. We had to go from a D-Pad in a first person space, to something like the N64, then into the dual analogue sticks. These sticks are now ubiquitous and fairly engrained into console FPS players from the start. I mean I sympathise with her to some extent, my wife just started playing through Until Dawn in piecemeal fashion and she struggles with basic camera control. But over time she is getting better. And when she plays Zelda on the Switch. But she doesn't have the dexterity, transferable muscle memory or experience to play something like God Of War.

Fourthly, she talks about the steering assist in Mario Kart, which is meant for youngsters. Yes, so they can gently acclimatise to hand/eye co-ordination for the process we went over in the point above. And eventually be weaned off. If you expect to be able to sit down and jump boost around every corner while lobbing weapons and controlling the Kart in a 150cc race on your baptism to these games, then you're setting yourself up for failure.

Lastly, she gets to her actual article point which is the 'git gud' part. Yes it's unhelpful when you ask for how to beat a specific section of a game and that's all people spam. Like in Souls threads. If people post a few lines of assistance and tag on the end '..and eventually you'll git gud'. That's fine because you're still offering something. To be honest, when anyone posts git gud, I just assume they haven't played the game or are poor at it but want to show they are part of the 'hardcore collective', but can't offer any actual help. But also, not every game is something you can hop online for and find a point by point walkthrough for. It's like trying to find a next step when someone in NBA2K dunks, or someone in Fifa scores.

This is without also offering side eye criticism at the grind/collectibles/towers that pad out games, which we all generally dislike. There's a lot to cover in that article and none of it really goes in depth which is why there is such a meh response to it. She probably has about 5 focused articles in there really. However, the biggest takeaway here is that she just wants to enjoy games, but doesn't necessarily do so. If she were at an arcade would she still be standing there feeding the machine quarters or would she have walked out and found something else to do?

 

[linker]

Since I took the time to actually read the article, I still don't get how people completely miss the point she's making.

Gaming can be a way to escape reality and just relax.
I think we all have that sometimes, just turning on your console or pc and just casually wanting to play some games without feeling any pressure to "git gud" and give it your all, but to just soak in the experience.

So, like I posted earlier, something like the "Gimme a story" modes of Horizon Zero Dawn or TLOU Remastered.
There are lots of people out there looking for escapism instead of a constant need of improvement, who at the same time want to enjoy the same games everybody else is enjoying.

Really amazed to see how narrow-minded and quick to jump the gun people are in here.
Especially since she didn't offend anyone with her article.

The woman made a valid point and devs like Guerrilla Games and Naughy Dog are aware of people who just want to relax and escape our stressfull reality.
It really wouldn't hurt if more devs would do the same.

There is really a need for every game to cater to everybody?
Walking simulators do nothing for me, so should I start saying their lack of interactivity and puzzles are offensive and they should have a "brainlet" mode and a "me" mode?

 

[dark10x]

"Git gud" is pretty fucking dumb like a lot of the internet.

That said, in some cases, that's the only way.

I remember when Gaf was a games forum, and not a echochamber masquerading as one.

I remember when OpaOpa got stuck in the first room of Silent Hill 2 and also couldn't figure out how to crawl under the first pipe in Metal Gear Solid. Those were the days...

 

[cireza]

I remember when Gaf was a games forum, and not a echochamber masquerading as one.

...why are you here then ?

 

[Psykodad]

There is really a need for every game to cater to everybody?
Walking simulators do nothing for me, so should I start saying their lack of interactivity and puzzles are offensive and they should have a "brainlet" mode and a "me" mode?

No, not every game. But her point is valid.

Yes, ofcourse, a game like Bloodborne or COD isn't meant for her and she could/should look for something else, but that's not her criticism.

To me, her whole article comes across as satire to illustrate a point.

There is a userbase that just wants to fully experience the experience of gaming and there is nothing wrong with that.
That's why I said that both "sides" of this discussion have a valid point, because I don't think that every single game needs to cater to that demographic too.

 

[Schrödinger's cat]

Expecting the world at large to reward you trophies merely for participating is unrealistic.

Life, and the world, is competitive. It's the height of dishonesty to act like the rules have to be changed because you are unwilling to make the effort that others are.

It's not a crime, nor is it a problem of others, that your fragile ego and sense of importance are not being massaged to the degree you believe you are entitled.

Grow up.

 

[Luffytubby]

Is getting better at something really equivalent to a "job"? Don't I need to git gud, if I want to learn to play the Flute? Is playing an instrument a job?

I think she is off the mark when she says that engaging in something in pursuit of mastery is like having a second job. I think she might mean that video games aren't for her. Because she sounds like she is not enjoying it. People who play Truck and Farming Simulators, don't think it's a job. They actually enjoy it and it relaxes them. Cities Skylines is one of my most played steam games, and getting good at city layoutting doesn't mean I am living out a secret life as a minister of transportation. It's legitimately stimulating to improving your skills.

This writer to me sounds like she doesn't take pleasure in the pursuit of difficult things, which is a shame. To excel at anything you must learn to love the grind. The holiest of all gameplay philosophies lies in the classic "Easy to learn, hard to master". But there are many games that are easy to learn, easy to master. And there are games (particularly online team games) that aren't difficult at all. A game like World of Warcraft has raiding mechanics and time investment that is fairly complex, but the game is very simple once you have your role and do one thing for a number of hours (like healing) with all your UI mods installed. Overwatch, even though you have a bad K ration can be a lot easier when you play a support role and nothing else.


As for the antagonism - I understand the knee jerk to phrases like "git gud" and "stfu, l2p noob" but there are games where the community is not actually like that all that much. Lots of nice people in Warframe for example. Guild Wars 2 also has a fucking awesome community for example. there are jerks but they are mostly in the pvp lounge. Stay in the open world and everyone likes to help, rez and play with you because of the way the game was build for cooperation.

 

[BANGS]

“Git gud” is a fucking trash response and is part of what makes the Soulsbourne community so insufferable. I know it’s a shock to these people that some people just can’t play these games well or that they can be extremely frustrating, so the best advice they often offer is this condescending bullshit.

While I agree it's somewhat condescending, it's far from a trash response, it's actually quite appropriate. Get good to beat the game, it's that simple. There are no secrets that will make you breeze through the game, you just gotta practice and get good...

 

[Redneckerz]

no joke, another example of #metoo gone wild, and if this get's into a hive mind type following, I would be kinda happy, lol......

It's basically

,

That being said, reading the article it is readily apparent that the author does not really play games for her enjoyment, simply because she does not understand the joy of it. This is readily apparent when she says: ''I play games for purely escapist reasons, and part of what I’m trying to escape is..'' Whilst games are a way of escaping things, their most important catch is that they are supposed to be fun and that you enjoy them.

In other words, the author isn't playing games for the fun or to enjoy it, but rather to escape from the grips of life she is personally responsible for. It is okay to make mistakes, but she is just being dramatic about it, as is apparent in her usage of existing but obscure and expensive sounding words and combinations of it like ''hyper-competitive millenial, complacency, vicariously'' and so on.
Hell, the fact she only can experience contentment (Another rich word) is by ''looking at pictures of cats lying in the sun.'' which is

So to me that signals that she is just combining buzzwords to write an opinion on things, with little depth to the story but the personal bewilderings of ''how to deal with life 101'' and doing it in the most social mediaest way (Read: Written as such to generate the most clicks) as possible. She should put her money where her mouth is and improve upon herself to do a better article. Essentially: GIT GUD.


PS: Without face shaming but i figured the author would look like

and it turns out she somewhat was. Heh.

I remember when Gaf was a games forum, and not a echochamber masquerading as one.

Venture here or here to reason cases like that

 

[Breakage]

She's talks as if she is relentlessly being bombarded with messages of "git gud" by –no doubt – "toxic males". She says she plays video games to "escape the relentless pressure to improve herself". Her “hyper-competitive millennial life” must be awful! Surely, she'd be better off indulging in a more passive form of entertainment to escape this so-called "pressure".

She is just another woman with a comfortable life trying to portray herself as an oppressed victim to enjoy all the therapeutic comforts that come with victimhood.
It’s revoltingly insincere.

The Guardian is the go-to paper for the British liberal intelligentsia, and many of its writers revel in this sort of stuff. Sometimes it is explicit, other times less so.
I still visit the site because I think it's important to be aware of the bullshit they often come up with.

 

[hariseldon]

She is just another woman with a comfortable life trying to portray herself as an oppressed victim to enjoy all the therapeutic comforts that come with victimhood.
It’s revoltingly insincere.

I'd argue that this applies to 99% of the current hashtag feminists. Certainly the sample that I've met in real life supports that theory.

 

[linker]

No, not every game. But her point is valid.

Yes, ofcourse, a game like Bloodborne or COD isn't meant for her and she could/should look for something else, but that's not her criticism.

To me, her whole article comes across as satire to illustrate a point.

There is a userbase that just wants to fully experience the experience of gaming and there is nothing wrong with that.
That's why I said that both "sides" of this discussion have a valid point, because I don't think that every single game needs to cater to that demographic too.

If you're playing on a difficulty such as you don't even need to learn the game you're playing there's a decent argument to saying that the experience you get is necessarily not complete regarding that game.
Like for instance, yes, you are gonna get the narrative of the game, but at some point you haven't experience the same thing others did simply because the whole appreciation for the mechanics is gone by virtue of, well, not really having engaged with them to their full effect. I mean, in Horizon maybe you have shot a bow and there you go, but the game goes a lot deeper with it, there's weakpoints, types of damage, different weapons and whatnot, so that really isn't the full story about the game now is it?
Of course it's an option and it's obviously welcome, but saying that asking for it is trying to get the same experience is misguided. They're called "explorer", "Just give me the story" and such for a reason, I think.

 

[Breakage]

I'd argue that this applies to 99% of the current hashtag feminists. Certainly the sample that I've met in real life supports that theory.

Yeah, I absolutely agree. The women who attempt to manufacture outrage over the most inane things in life are the types who sit in posh artisan coffee shops, tapping away on sleek Apple devices. They are not "oppressed" or struggling in life at all.

 

[tkscz]

I don't understand. Why would she get mad about playing games that require you to "Git Gud" at them rather than playing games you can jump in and jump back out with little issue. Want to play an online team based FPS but OverWatch and Paladins are too competitive? Play Team Fortress 2. Want an RPG with a good story but don't want to put in the grind to beat them? Paper Mario series, Kingdom Heart series. Want to play a quick platformer that isn't too challenging and you can pick it up and put it down at anytime? Mario games, Sonic games, Kirby games, Ratchet and Clank games. I can go on like this. She can play games of any genre without having to "Git Gud". If she wants to play the games that take the time and grind to get better in them, then she'll have to "Git gud". If it bothers her that people are telling her to "Git Gud" at games that take time to get into, then either ignore them, or stop trying to play the games you won't even have fun with. Because if you aren't having fun, what the hell is the point of the game?

 

[hariseldon]

If you're playing on a difficulty such as you don't even need to learn the game you're playing there's a decent argument to saying that the experience you get is necessarily not complete regarding that game.
Like for instance, yes, you are gonna get the narrative of the game, but at some point you haven't experience the same thing others did simply because the whole appreciation for the mechanics is gone by virtue of, well, not really having engaged with them to their full effect. I mean, in Horizon maybe you have shot a bow and there you go, but the game goes a lot deeper with it, there's weakpoints, types of damage, different weapons and whatnot, so that really isn't the full story about the game now is it?
Of course it's an option and it's obviously welcome, but saying that asking for it is trying to get the same experience is misguided. They're called "explorer", "Just give me the story" and such for a reason, I think.

It's worth noting that also sometimes the narrative is harmed by playing on easy. For instance, Kingdom Come Deliverance, tbh I'm doing ok but people do complain that it's hard. For me (not someone who is into hard games for their own sake) the experience of beating those tough bits coincides with key story beats such that they add to the emotion at that moment, just as there's for instance the mechanic of sawing an arm off in The Walking Dead makes it feel vastly different to just watching it on screen. When mechanics and story meet you can get some wonderful moments in gaming.

 

[ROMhack]

I think this is her PhD thesis.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/sep/30/intersectional-feminism-jargon

Oh shit, I thought you guys were taking the piss with that intersectional feminism line. Haha.

I'd argue that this applies to 99% of the current hashtag feminists. Certainly the sample that I've met in real life supports that theory.

I don't like painting people with the same brush but I've found a similar thing. I once had an argument with a friend about whitewashing in American movies. She was taking the usual Guardian stance of it being really bad or something. After some twenty minutes of talking about it, I asked her if she'd ever actually watched any Chinese movies (taking the upper ground as I'm a big fan of world cinema). She said no and it was like a light bulb moment for me. Like, if she cared that much about seeing Asian heritage portrayed in movies and then she really would have gone out of her way to change her own habits. Sometimes it's like these people want convenience or death, to quote the Dead Kennedys.

 

[Mihos]

Sounds like her life will culminate with a participation ribbon.

 

[Dr. Claus]

You've been here since the end of July...

They are just a former member that account-suicided during the transition. They created a new account to troll here. Sad and petty, really. I would suggest just ignoring the mewling infant.

 

[Sacred]

Basically she is saying, I want to ruin gaming for everyone because developers these days care about challenging players and it's too hard for poor little old me. I so hate 3rd wave feminism.

 

[Psykodad]

If you're playing on a difficulty such as you don't even need to learn the game you're playing there's a decent argument to saying that the experience you get is necessarily not complete regarding that game.
Like for instance, yes, you are gonna get the narrative of the game, but at some point you haven't experience the same thing others did simply because the whole appreciation for the mechanics is gone by virtue of, well, not really having engaged with them to their full effect. I mean, in Horizon maybe you have shot a bow and there you go, but the game goes a lot deeper with it, there's weakpoints, types of damage, different weapons and whatnot, so that really isn't the full story about the game now is it?
Of course it's an option and it's obviously welcome, but saying that asking for it is trying to get the same experience is misguided. They're called "explorer", "Just give me the story" and such for a reason, I think.

I get where you're coming from and I personally fully agree with you, but at the same time, for someone like the author the added depth of something like the games mechanics is not a requirement and in a way it might even detract from what their goal is.
Escapism in this case is a form of stress-relieve and going in with that viewpoint in mind, getting stuck on a certain boss or whatever actually prevents you from losing stress (it even adds more stress, in the broader sense of the word).
You and me find it utterly boring, but someone in it for escapism might not even want to experience (much) challenge.
There is nothing wrong with asking or wishing for more games to have a "super-easy" mode.

Take Bloodborne for example. It's just too frustrating for me, personally. I'm skilled enough to complete it, but I severely lack the patience to keep my cool, so I always end up just quitting the game. It just isn't for me. And that's fine.
But it doesn't mean that it doesn't suck that I can't complete the game, just because I can't find motivation to stick with the game.

So yes, an obvious answer would be for her to find more laid-back games, but at the same time it might be an idea for devs to possibly think about adding an easier way of completing a game for those that just want to experience everything except all the challenge.
Who come home from work or whatever and just want to enjoy any game without any frustration.

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

I get where you're coming from and I personally fully agree with you, but at the same time, for someone like the author the added depth of something like the games mechanics is not a requirement and in a way it might even detract from what their goal is.
Escapism in this case is a form of stress-relieve and going in with that viewpoint in mind, getting stuck on a certain boss or whatever actually prevents you from losing stress (it even adds more stress, in the broader sense of the word).
You and me find it utterly boring, but someone in it for escapism might not even want to experience (much) challenge.
There is nothing wrong with asking or wishing for more games to have a "super-easy" mode.

Take Bloodborne for example. It's just too frustrating for me, personally. I'm skilled enough to complete it, but I severely lack the patience to keep my cool, so I always end up just quitting the game. It just isn't for me. And that's fine.
But it doesn't mean that it doesn't suck that I can't complete the game, just because I can't find motivation to stick with the game.

So yes, an obvious answer would be for her to find more laid-back games, but at the same time it might be an idea for devs to possibly think about adding an easier way of completing a game for those that just want to experience everything except all the challenge.
Who come home from work or whatever and just want to enjoy any game without any frustration.

You're stretching the article again to make a point that she herself didn't make. You keep repeating "there is nothing wrong with asking or wishing for more games to have a "super-easy" mode", yet that's not what her article is about. Almost seems intentional.

Mind answering?

 

[petran79]

I think this is her PhD thesis.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/sep/30/intersectional-feminism-jargon

On the one hand she criticises the new left's focus in identity politics, unlike the old marxist movements true protests. Yet she ignores that according to the old marxists you are not born gay but become gay by choice due to various social and family circumstances. Whe social structures improve they will be embodied to the ideal society without the need for medical and psychiatric evaluation. Plus on socialist countries gays were imprisoned.

This is why the Left is today so confused and split.

I prefer her gaming article tbh

 

[Psykodad]

You're stretching the article again to make a point that she herself didn't make. You keep repeating "there is nothing wrong with asking or wishing for more games to have a "super-easy" mode", yet that's not what her article is about. Almost seems intentional.

Mind answering?

That's actually exactly what she's trying to say. But somehow people keep spinning it into some kind of attack on gaming and gamers.

Btw, I didn't overlook your post, just didn't get to it yet.
I'll reply to it when I find a bit more time this weekend.

 

[hariseldon]

I so hate 3rd wave feminism.

I too had incorrectly blamed third wave feminism. Turns out it's 4th wave. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third-wave_feminism suggests that 3rd wave was all that riot grrl stuff, though admittedly it did also bring in intersectionality, but fourth wave (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth-wave_feminism) is what we're suffering through now, that smug hashtag feminism by privileged white women. (Note: I am ready to be corrected as I'm probably wrong)

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

Sorry if people have been trying to avoid spoilers during this version of the game, but if you guys want a preview for Fifth Wave feminism, just read Engels.

The pairing family, being too weak and too unstable to make an independent household necessary or even desirable, in no way dissolves the traditional communistic way of housekeeping. But household communism implies supremacy of women in the house as surely as exclusive recognition of a natural mother and the consequent impossibility of identifying the natural father signify high esteem for women, i. e., mothers. It is one of the most absurd notions derived from eighteenth century enlightenment, that in the beginning of society woman was the slave of man. Among all savages and barbarians of the lower and middle stages, sometimes even of the higher stage, women not only have freedom, but are held in high esteem.

What they were even in the pairing family, let Arthur Wright, for many years a missionary among the Seneca Iroquois, testify: "As to their families, at a time when they still lived in their old long houses (communistic households of several families) ... a certain clan (gens) always reigned, so that the women choose their husbands from other clans (gentes).... The female part generally ruled the house; the provisions were held in common; but woe to the luckless husband or lover who was too indolent or too clumsy to contribute his share to the common stock.

No matter how many children or how much private property he had in the house, he was liable at any moment to receive a hint to gather up his belongings and get out. And he could not dare to venture any resistance; the house was made too hot for him and he had no other choice, but to return to his own clan (gens) or,
as was mostly the case, to look for another wife in some other clan. The women were the dominating power in the clans (gentes) and everywhere else. Occasionally they did not hesitate to dethrone a chief and degrade him to a common warrior."

The communistic household, in which most or all the women belong to one and the same gens, while the husbands come from different gentes, is the cause and foundation of the general and widespread supremacy of women in primeval times.

Source at Archive.org

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

That's actually exactly what she's trying to say. But somehow people keep spinning it into some kind of attack on gaming and gamers.

Btw, I didn't overlook your post, just didn't get to it yet.
I'll reply to it when I find a bit more time this weekend.

When you decide to reply, if you could provide quotes to demonstrate this is "exactly what she's trying to say", that would be helpful.

 

[hariseldon]

DunDunDunpachi well that's fucking bleak.

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

DunDunDunpachi well that's fucking bleak.

It was also written in 1884, so take solace that we haven't been dumb enough to implement it despite having the outline for over 130 years.

 

[Gamernyc78]

The society we live in nowadays lol This type of thinking is everywhere and the master plan is for us to think and act in the same way!!!!!! Entitled and really ridiculous.

 

[hariseldon]

It was also written in 1884, so take solace that we haven't been dumb enough to implement it despite having the outline for over 130 years.

You just opened Pandora's box you bastard, they'll see it now, the genie's out, we're all fucking doomed, doomed I tell you!

 

[linker]

I get where you're coming from and I personally fully agree with you, but at the same time, for someone like the author the added depth of something like the games mechanics is not a requirement and in a way it might even detract from what their goal is.
Escapism in this case is a form of stress-relieve and going in with that viewpoint in mind, getting stuck on a certain boss or whatever actually prevents you from losing stress (it even adds more stress, in the broader sense of the word).
You and me find it utterly boring, but someone in it for escapism might not even want to experience (much) challenge.
There is nothing wrong with asking or wishing for more games to have a "super-easy" mode.

Take Bloodborne for example. It's just too frustrating for me, personally. I'm skilled enough to complete it, but I severely lack the patience to keep my cool, so I always end up just quitting the game. It just isn't for me. And that's fine.
But it doesn't mean that it doesn't suck that I can't complete the game, just because I can't find motivation to stick with the game.

So yes, an obvious answer would be for her to find more laid-back games, but at the same time it might be an idea for devs to possibly think about adding an easier way of completing a game for those that just want to experience everything except all the challenge.
Who come home from work or whatever and just want to enjoy any game without any frustration.

Eh, I don't know, I mean, that's barely interaction so in a way it isn't even enjoying the game as much as it is enjoying part of the artistry that has gone into it.
I mean, if interaction is detrimental to the enjoyment it's either that someone hasn't enjoyed brilliant moments in the media that make them see the value of it or they really do not like games much in general, so at that point, if you really enjoy Horizon's story so much but despise having to aim, why not just... look up a playthrough?
I mean, your example doesn't come from disdain for interactivity but from an issue you have with the design, which is a different beast. And yet still, as much as it sucks that you can't enjoy it on it's own terms, it would suck even more if the terms weren't even there, because those that can would not have the same game in their hands. Which already makes me err on the side of "the dev decides and sometimes stuff isn't for you and that's ok" (as I already have made manifest, walking simulators or stuff like Telltale's games really doesn't gel with me and I stick to it only if there's a lot of meaningful interaction, which btw makes me eye with interest "What remains of Edith Finch", or a really great story, but I'm not gonna demand for the catering of my taste nor I'm envious of those that enjoy them), when it comes to the article we're sort of in the "games would be great if they were movies" ballpark that came up with Alone in the Dark 2008 which was collectively considered utter bollocks and the game failed (not because of it but the feature didn't really save the game either).
Another thing that irks me about the whole thing is that art is meant to be challenging: even taking mechanic challenge out of the picture, a lot of stuff across a lot of mediums can be hard to enjoy because the terms are what they are. Just think of Joyce or Kubrick: no one would have chastised them over the lack of the "laymen version" of their work.
Now I get it: not everything has to be high art or whatnot, but even entertainment relies on stuff like this: I mean, DMC3 uses challenge to establish Vergil as Dante's superior, and it's not like it's trying to state anything meta, but the weight of the (admittedly quite underappreciated) story and themes and the menace and stature of the villain wouldn't be close to what they are if there was a way to just barrel through it kicking everyone's ass.
So I don't know, I would trust the dev (hopefully with not too much publisher mingling) to know what the terms of their work are, and the public to understand when something wasn't made for them, because if either of these reasonable assessment is not made everyone just has something to lose, the target audience because nothing caters to them anymore, the non target audience because they lost the expression of a team of artists and devs because their vision is either not respected or not valued.

 

[Mihos]

The Guardian's crossword puzzles are too hard, and it makes me feel stupid. Why is the guardian making me feel stupid.... do they just hate me personally, or is it because we live in a society that is oppressive just because I don't know as many words as them?!? or maybe it is because I didn't come from a privileged area with better schools. Why is the Guardian oppressing me!

 

[DeepEnigma]

"I want to escape self-improvement"

We are definitely regressing as a species.

 

[LukeSkywater]

"I want to escape self-improvement"

We are definitely regressing as a species.

That's why I wish the post apocalypse would get here sooner, rather than later. I'm ready for the herd to be thinned of Dumb asses, and I welcome Slim Jim's as the new currency.

 

[DeepEnigma]

That's why I wish the post apocalypse would get here sooner, rather than later. I'm ready for the herd to be thinned of Dumb asses, and I welcome Slim Jim's as the new currency.

 

[Makariel]

This article:

Someone just needs to...

 

[DeepEnigma]

I just think women would like to just stop being raped at the drop of a hat and black people stop being shot dead for simply existing. Once those issues are corrected maybe we can start nit picking their outrage.