BadManEd
Neo Member
The kind of "good people" that became judge, jury and executioner against a person because of a fucking facebook post. Good riddance to that kind of "good people".
spot on, coudn't agree more.
The kind of "good people" that became judge, jury and executioner against a person because of a fucking facebook post. Good riddance to that kind of "good people".
Apathy is not ignorance. I am aware. I just don't care. I'm sorry to have to be the one to teach you that different people have different value systems, but I hope this will help you be a more functionally empathetic person in your future endeavors.
So let me get this right .. are you seriously suggesting that the shower move was ok based on the follow up events?
Seriously? Or are you trolling me?
Honestly this is all news to me.
Honestly this is all news to me.
In the interest of clarity, and since moderation is now being handed by untagged staffers, I'd like to say that I'm one of the mods who have decided to step out. I'm going to dearly miss out the euro politics threads and the people at the CW/Cinemax OTs being crazier than a bag of wet cats (in a good way). Huge thanks to all the folks who made NeoGAF an awesome community for so many people, over so many years. You are/were the best.
If you get banned after this it just proves how gross and incredibly sad the new state of Gaf is gonna be like.
No one will care now, the people that made Gaf what it was are all gone, the most toxic side of the forum was the gaming one, not OT.
But oh well, this it what it's gonna be now, just another, more exclusive, 4chan.
In your case, it's both. Hopefully you will avail yourself of more context and information before you puff up your chest to say how much you don't care, at least for appearances sake.
Even if my voice is one in a few thousand, specially in a place as big as NeoGAF, I'm still going to lay here my 5cents.
I'm not going to comment on what happened or did not happen between EvilLore and the girl. I do not know the story, I do not know EvilLore and I certainly do not know the girl in question. So, I do not pass judgment.
I do know that things on the Internet travel too fast and the voice of anonymity speaks too loud so things get out of hand and people loose touch with reality.
This being said, I've been on NeoGAF for almost a decade and it has become my main website, not only for news but also diverse discussions.
The Gaming side was where I had most presence, but the Off-Topic also had some interesting topics I used to check. It is a gaming website in it's core and genesis, so I understand the "going back to the roots" thing, if it is to demote toxic behavior.
I do worry that the community went too much bezerk and things will fall apart.
Let's wait and see.
It was never just about that single event. That was just the drop and not because of the accusation, but how it was dealt with. Banning everyone who even tried to talk about it, promising statements while banning people and even making a cheeky comment how it would take longer when people keep trying to talk about it.The kind of "good people" that became judge, jury and executioner against a person because of a fucking facebook post. Good riddance to that kind of "good people".
Assuming you're not lying to everyone, why not sue her for slander?An allegation of sexual misconduct has been made against me by an ex. It's not true, the individual making the accusation isn't credible, the story doesn't reconcile logically with the facts, and there's plenty of evidence and witnesses to corroborate that
This.The kind of "good people" that became judge, jury and executioner against a person because of a fucking facebook post. Good riddance to that kind of "good people".
Easy to get "polarised" when EL or the mods go on a ban and lock rampage before shutting the forum down for a weekend. Doesn't seem like something an innocent person would do.I've been here for around a decade. I mostly lurk and discuss a few games (I was sucked in as it was one of the few places you could discuss Disgaea games without being trolled mercilessly) and a few OT fripperies besides but I've never been tempted to venture too far into political or social discussions on the Internet in general, not just GAF. People get polarised very quickly and I wonder what the point of a discussion is if noone is actually discussing anything, people take sides and get upset. This seems to be even worse on social networks.
To discuss sensitive, emotive issues I think you have to do them in person otherwise you miss so much nuance and expression and people's hackles rise very very quickly and before you know it the barricades are up and various sides are lobbing artillery at each other and calling each other pricks.
What the fuck does a woman have to do to be taken seriously as a victim of sexual abuse? Y'all will make excuses for the man no matter what. I'm sick of this.
<3In the interest of clarity, and since moderation is now being handed by untagged staffers, I'd like to say that I'm one of the mods who have decided to step out. I'm going to dearly miss out the euro politics threads and the people at the CW/Cinemax OTs being crazier than a bag of wet cats (in a good way). Huge thanks to all the folks who made NeoGAF an awesome community for so many people, over so many years. You are/were the best.
Well, at least with videogames we could express different opinions.You're for equal rights, LGBTQ, women's rights...so you celebrate the total ban on all those topics on this forum? Go video games.
Lol @ people asking to be banned as if they're being all noble. Just leave the site and don't come back, no one cares. I hope OT returns as I thoroughly enjoyed browsing it. Whatever the owner may or may not have done has no impact on how I view this forum.
What the fuck does a woman have to do to be taken seriously as a victim of sexual abuse? Y'all will make excuses for the man no matter what. I'm sick of this.
The website, yes. The community that made the website... mhm. A lot of good people opted to go to Reset and other successors or just plainly other sites.
some mods hit their emotional limit, expressed concerns about the community coming after them, and decided to leave. A few people resigned, and many more quickly followed for similar reasons, citing stress and harassment.
Just wanted to echo the sentiment, especially since I recall your time here from around when you joined. I've been on this site for the same timeframe at around the same age. Didn't post too much, but I learned a whole lot, and it was an integral part of my everyday life.This has been difficult for me to process.
I've been a member of NeoGAF since I was 13, having joined during the pre-release of Zelda SS for the Wii and using my middle school's private email. At first this was just a cute little gaming site for me to browse, speculate about video game theories, gawk at screenshots and read about tech specs (I'm an engineering major now, I think video games ended up informing much of that decision).
This site has been in the background of my adolescent life. When I would read academic papers or news articles, I would browse GAF to see what sorts of discussion would pop up around that. Conversing and debating with adults two to three times my age shaped my mind, improved my diction (especially since English wasn't my first language), and taught me to realize - adults are fucking clueless. Grown men and women could be just as inept as the teenage me - but I learned empathy.
I read anecdotes from people of all leanings. The lack of organization in Off-Topic led me to wander into so many different areas of discussion, good or bad, controversial or not. Even when I didn't participate, just reading what different people had to say, the arguments tossed back and forth - it was so valuable. It gave me the confidence to speak up, assert my identity and my positions.
People declare this place to be an echo chamber, but that has negative connotations I don't think belonged to this site. Even amongst hard liberals, there were disagreements. "Conservatism" took on different meanings due to international users. This place aided in my critical thinking, I was able to discern which threads were worth browsing, and what discussions were nuanced and worthwhile to join in on. And it still managed to be my quirky little fun gaming site, from "Zelda U" to BotW's DLC release.
It definitely seems... weird. But being born in 1998, I'm certainly one of the earlier generations to be 'raised by the Internet', so to say. It's a marvel to read about so many different experiences from so many different personalities, and this site has managed to sustain an air of civil discourse for so long. Even with the instances of absolute stupidity, idiocy, criminal activity... ultimately there was a corpus of members with good spirit and morals who were able to keep it going.
So to see this site reach this point... it's disappointing. It's disheartening. I'm 19, I'm still young, naive, stupid. I don't think the recent course of actions have been right. I think communication should have been more open. The countless sub communities of this site whose members have invested so much of themselves, deserve better. Now as I browse Gaming Side, I feel physically uncomfortable.
There's no real reason for me saying all of this. I suppose I just want my perspective out there. I suppose I'm just procrastinating. I already knew I'd be posting less on this site due to college, but it's a conscious decision at this point. Gaming is getting more exciting - cool tech toys, great graphics, better and better games - I still want to browse and see all that in a well designed website, and I still want to be able to ask specific questions or PM people since sometimes users can be better than Google, but the atmosphere here has changed. And not for the better.
Lol @ people asking to be banned as if they're being all noble. Just leave the site and don't come back, no one cares. I hope OT returns as I thoroughly enjoyed browsing it. Whatever the owner may or may not have done has no impact on how I view this forum.
PREACHright then, done copying some of my efforts over to slaent, so here goes:
this is cowardice.
let's be clear: much of the gaming community, as it were, is a dumpster fire. you'd be hard pressed to find a decent corner to talk about culture & games without hearing basement dwellers bemoan SJW's, diversity/representation in gaming, etc.
one of the only things separating GAF for years was its zero tolerance for gamergate, and for the most part (let's be honest, the late aughts were rough here & most places), bigotry, misogyny (hello friends), homophobia, transphobia, etc.
we literally watched the cesspool that was gg bleed into the alt-right. harassment of women & minorities continues to this day, and we exist in a timeline with open white supermacists in the white house. you don't get to straddle the fence with shit like this. this is literally why dudes like boogie (rightfully) got chased out of here with pitchforks: you stomp these things out & deny them a platform, or you sit back and quietly co-sign them, standing for nothing.
evilore: you handled this in the worst possible way.
we all know your past, and why you weren't given the benefit of the doubt here. you built a fantastic base of people to run things here - stumpkapow, y2kev, xander, eatchildren, blackace & so many others - and you left all that by the wayside, because you'd rather nuke any talk of your personal conduct from orbit until it's too large, and then just half victim-blame instead of simply owning something & standing for the progressive values you parade when it's convenient & walk back when it's not. at least now your ego can stay front & center and you won't feel the dissonance from having to front as riding for something you're not about.
to those of you just wanting to talk vidya games: literally every other corner on the internet allows this. i realize a few threads/posts here & there on why supporting people down with hateful garbage is momentarily inconvenient, but this place was something because it fostered input from circles usually unwelcome in gaming communities.
that's gone now, because anyone (myself included) who cared about social/racial/etc justice isn't comfortable abiding a serial sexual assaulter who saw the ad revenue here & met a chance to be about something with a slap in the face to what he'd built. alamo drafthouse'd, if you will - so yeah, you likely won't hear from many people who aren't white males anymore, enjoy that.
this place stands for nothing now. i'm grateful for my time here when that wasn't the case. take care, all.
oh, and for posterity:
^^
always, in all ways
Serious or sarcasm?But cmon, Evilore seems like a real stand up individual!
What do you think of handling this situation? Why do you think all the former mods left in unison?This is my take on this whole situation. Some of you may remember my position during the Naughty Dog harassment issue. I fully supported the alleged victim's right to disclose any such incident because making these incidents public helps bring forth change in industries where sexual harassment ends up being institutionalized due to the power structure and fear of retaliation. Hopefully my earlier firm position on this issue will stop people from calling me names.
Evilore might be a cool dude or he might be a giant douchebag, I've never met him so I have no idea. This case of sexual harassment or assault that involves him is different to previous cases like Weinstein or Naughty Dog. There is no power dynamic between him and his accuser, no credible threat of retaliation or abuse of one's position in return for sexual favors. It is an issue between two individuals and it has nothing to do with recent other cases of sexual misconduct in the workplace.
I've read the original Facebook posts, Evilore's response and Patrick Klepek's article. Based on the information at hand I believe there's an equal chance of the alleged victim telling the truth, Evilore telling the truth or both of them bending the truth. As such I find it impossible to determine whether or not Evilore was targeted by a scorned ex lover or if he actually is a sexual predator.
In any case, I won't be boycotting NeoGAF because of this incident. Even if everything the alleged victim said is true, Evilore's behavior doesn't cross the line that I've personally set as the threshold after which I stop supporting an individual or company. Assuming the victim's story is true, I don't think that Evilore completely misinterpreting the victim's intentions and making a cringeworthy move after a night of the two of them drinking and partying is such a heinous crime to warrant a boycott.
Evidence or corroborating witnesses are a good start.What the fuck does a woman have to do to be taken seriously as a victim of sexual abuse?
Is that how you talk about people like Shinobi, Leafhopper and ZhugeEx?Anti-gaf, alt right, gamer gate etc are having a field day over this. There's been a quite a few dormant or alt user accounts becoming active to help promote account suicide so I would suggest to existing members to give it a week for the dust to settle then make a decision on your own.
There really isn't another community like gaf out there. Reset might sound like an alternative on paper but there's already a movement brewing to rot that site from the inside out and its not even up yet.
I've found political discussion on GAF as meaningful and relevant, especially highlighting problems of economy, militarism and, yes, sexism. I think off-topic was moderated well
Pretty much this exactly.Cut it out with the passive aggressive mods. Stop with the shit user tags, stop with the smarmy ban messages. It got to the point where mods because like emperors flaunting their power from high above the peons, and that's unacceptable. However, shadow mods are not the answer. Modbot is bullshit, and threads should never be closed with smart quips from a faceless entity. If Modbot needs to be used, then have the balls to sign the name of who used it in that instance. Also, mods should not be decided when the conversation in a thread is "done" outside of obvious circumstances. Tons of great discussions in threads have been prematurely killed just because some mod didn't personally find it worthwhile. And for god's sake, don't allow any more deification of mods—a situation like Bish should never, ever happen again.
Have a clear and fleshed out list of rules, and if someone does something that's not on the rules list, don't ban them for it. That's bullshit. It's been impossible at times to know what would and wouldn't get you banned around here unless you happened to see a thread where a new rule was announced. And, again, ban messages should actually be clear about why the person was banned and what they did wrong, and not the chance for a mod to act like they're an action hero using a one-liner before taking out a bad guy.
Well, at least with videogames we could express different opinions.