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[Matlock]

omfg, kinesis


you're killing me

:lol

 

[akascream]

In Serifitia's defense, if she really was after sexual attention at GAF, she would have posed as some hot male model or something. :lol

 

[fart]

Well, I've been thinking about this, and finally have enough thoughts together to say something.

First of all, I think this situation is far more sad than funny. I don't know much about Serafitia, but I think whoever said that there was a note of self-loathing in her final post was right on the money. It's one thing to want to remain anonymous, but think about what kind of self-value you must have to craft an entirely different persona for yourself to be more accepted...or to steal someone else's face because you think it's better than your own. Yes, what Sera has done is worthy of rebuke -- I'm not a fan of dishonesty, especially when it's dragged someone else into this mess -- but consider where those kind of choices must have come from before you are so quick to judge.

Second, while I'm on the subject of "quick to judge," I think that there are a lot of people on this board who ought to be considered accomplices to this situation. Do you want to know why there aren't more female posters here? Take a look around at your own behavior: all the little boys wanting to see ass and titties, all the judgmental fucks complaining that legitimately model-quality women don't meet their "high standards," all the misogynistic attitudes towards dating and marriage and children. I can certainly understand why Serafitia -- if she is a female -- would be tempted to be someone other than herself in this environment.

Finally, I feel terrible for Camilla. She is guilty of nothing more than having a pretty face...and all of a sudden she's involved in some bizarre situation. I can understand her decision not to post here, but it's too bad that she couldn't feel welcomed to this place.

More and more, I think it might be time for me to leave this place for good.

this entire thread should be replaced with just these three paragraphs.

ps, jinx: please don't leave. i don't even want to think about what would happen to the forum without the few pillars of reason we have in moderation.

 

[Boogie]

Well, I've been thinking about this, and finally have enough thoughts together to say something.

First of all, I think this situation is far more sad than funny. I don't know much about Serafitia, but I think whoever said that there was a note of self-loathing in her final post was right on the money. It's one thing to want to remain anonymous, but think about what kind of self-value you must have to craft an entirely different persona for yourself to be more accepted...or to steal someone else's face because you think it's better than your own. Yes, what Sera has done is worthy of rebuke -- I'm not a fan of dishonesty, especially when it's dragged someone else into this mess -- but consider where those kind of choices must have come from before you are so quick to judge.

Second, while I'm on the subject of "quick to judge," I think that there are a lot of people on this board who ought to be considered accomplices to this situation. Do you want to know why there aren't more female posters here? Take a look around at your own behavior: all the little boys wanting to see ass and titties, all the judgmental fucks complaining that legitimately model-quality women don't meet their "high standards," all the misogynistic attitudes towards dating and marriage and children. I can certainly understand why Serafitia -- if she is a female -- would be tempted to be someone other than herself in this environment.

Finally, I feel terrible for Camilla. She is guilty of nothing more than having a pretty face...and all of a sudden she's involved in some bizarre situation. I can understand her decision not to post here, but it's too bad that she couldn't feel welcomed to this place.

More and more, I think it might be time for me to leave this place for good.

Well said.

 

[Azala]

Do you want to know why there aren't more female posters here? Take a look around at your own behavior: all the little boys wanting to see ass and titties, all the judgmental fucks complaining that legitimately model-quality women don't meet their "high standards," all the misogynistic attitudes towards dating and marriage and children. I can certainly understand why Serafitia -- if she is a female -- would be tempted to be someone other than herself in this environment.

Nicely put. I don't blame her either. It wasn't the healthiest or best route to go, but who am I to judge? I can certainly understand her motives.

[edit] Jinx, I second what's being said. Don't go. You're one of the reasons I started posting and one of the reasons I have kept posting, even though every day there's at least one topic/comment that makes me cringe and feel uncomfortable.

 

[beerbelly]

More and more, I think it might be time for me to leave this place for good.

Please don't. You are one of the best posters on GA.

 

[Shogmaster]

OMG, the first page had me in stitches. I don't even dare read the rest of the thread for the fear of dying from laughter. :lol

GA indeed knows drama!

 

[totoro'd]

Just in case anyone has doubts, since Lemurs did it, I can too!

me sitting on the floor just a minute ago:

 

[MrPing1000]

jinx making the most sense as per usual. I salute thee

 

[Azala]

me sitting on the floor just a minute ago:

In a way you have more nerve than I do! The only pictures I've ever posted are my baby pictures. I guess I fail to see why anyone has to prove or defend their gender.

 

[MrPing1000]

Just in case anyone has doubts, since Lemurs did it, I can too!

me sitting on the floor just a minute ago:

tbh lemurs have never really posted definate proof. Unlike yourself.

 

[AstroLad]

Well, I've been thinking about this, and finally have enough thoughts together to say something.

First of all, I think this situation is far more sad than funny. I don't know much about Serafitia, but I think whoever said that there was a note of self-loathing in her final post was right on the money. It's one thing to want to remain anonymous, but think about what kind of self-value you must have to craft an entirely different persona for yourself to be more accepted...or to steal someone else's face because you think it's better than your own. Yes, what Sera has done is worthy of rebuke -- I'm not a fan of dishonesty, especially when it's dragged someone else into this mess -- but consider where those kind of choices must have come from before you are so quick to judge.

Second, while I'm on the subject of "quick to judge," I think that there are a lot of people on this board who ought to be considered accomplices to this situation. Do you want to know why there aren't more female posters here? Take a look around at your own behavior: all the little boys wanting to see ass and titties, all the judgmental fucks complaining that legitimately model-quality women don't meet their "high standards," all the misogynistic attitudes towards dating and marriage and children. I can certainly understand why Serafitia -- if she is a female -- would be tempted to be someone other than herself in this environment.

Finally, I feel terrible for Camilla. She is guilty of nothing more than having a pretty face...and all of a sudden she's involved in some bizarre situation. I can understand her decision not to post here, but it's too bad that she couldn't feel welcomed to this place.

More and more, I think it might be time for me to leave this place for good.

I don't think that's entirely true. As far as the misogyny, objectification, and "impossibly high standards," well just turn on the TV or read any magazine, I don't see this forum as being particularly unique in harboring these characteristics, and it's actually a lot better than many forums where misogyny, racism, pornography, etc. are the norm. Let's go on the assumption that Sera is an "average" or "below average" looking girl (a huge assumption, but just for the purposes of argumen, I'll make it). If this girl felt "average" and not up to higher standards of SEXIENESS, but still wanted to post a pic, 90% of people would probably post something relatively nice or nothing at all and maybe 5-10% something jackassy (and they would then get banned since GA is a pretty tight ship), but then again male posters have to put up with pretty much the same thing (though obviously a "girl" picture will draw more attention since it's just a rarity). If she feels just hideous for whatever reason, well then why post a pic to begin with? 98% of the forum has managed to survive without posting a pic. Again, a few people might harass with "post a pic!" but I don't think it's that hard to either treat that as a) a joke (which it usually is, at least somewhat), b) if it's bad just say fuck off and wait for the person to get banned, c) ignore it. I have to say that the forum is not entirely (or even in largely) to blame for the posting of the pics to begin with and the resulting problems it created. If the poster has some desire to be seen as a SEXIE woman or just play a joke, well that's purely the poster's desire, and it seems slightly unfair to pin that all on the forum (though admittedly a few members may be partially to blame).

The simple fact is that GAMING FORUMS ON THE INTERNET don't appeal to girls. Games may slightly, forums very, very little. Forums about games? No dice. I don't quite see my fiancee spending an four or five hours a week on here like I do and I think most girls are the same; yet I don't think it's because the forum is particularly uninviting to girls who would otherwise want to post here, but rather that girls don't wanna come here anymore than most guys want to spend their Saturdays getting manicures and pedicures and shopping for furniture.

 

[fart]

the last thing this should turn into is a call for all gaffems to somehow prove that they physically fit into their gender roles.

 

[Chesapeake Silt]

Girls don't post here because we talk about Lindsay Lohan's boobs too much? I can live with that. Those boobs are fucking big. Like.... really big.

 

[Lemurnator]

Well, I've been thinking about this, and finally have enough thoughts together to say something.

First of all, I think this situation is far more sad than funny. I don't know much about Serafitia, but I think whoever said that there was a note of self-loathing in her final post was right on the money. It's one thing to want to remain anonymous, but think about what kind of self-value you must have to craft an entirely different persona for yourself to be more accepted...or to steal someone else's face because you think it's better than your own. Yes, what Sera has done is worthy of rebuke -- I'm not a fan of dishonesty, especially when it's dragged someone else into this mess -- but consider where those kind of choices must have come from before you are so quick to judge.

Second, while I'm on the subject of "quick to judge," I think that there are a lot of people on this board who ought to be considered accomplices to this situation. Do you want to know why there aren't more female posters here? Take a look around at your own behavior: all the little boys wanting to see ass and titties, all the judgmental fucks complaining that legitimately model-quality women don't meet their "high standards," all the misogynistic attitudes towards dating and marriage and children. I can certainly understand why Serafitia -- if she is a female -- would be tempted to be someone other than herself in this environment.

Finally, I feel terrible for Camilla. She is guilty of nothing more than having a pretty face...and all of a sudden she's involved in some bizarre situation. I can understand her decision not to post here, but it's too bad that she couldn't feel welcomed to this place.

More and more, I think it might be time for me to leave this place for good.

If you leave, I leave.

You're one of the few reasons I'm still here. It's too hard to post here without being constantly judged and looked down upon. I don't like being the butt of peoples jokes just because I'm young and female. People here are too mean mean spirited and if you, the last standing pillar of a decent human beings on GA leaves, than I leave as well.

 

[belgurdo]

Well, I've been thinking about this, and finally have enough thoughts together to say something.

First of all, I think this situation is far more sad than funny. I don't know much about Serafitia, but I think whoever said that there was a note of self-loathing in her final post was right on the money. It's one thing to want to remain anonymous, but think about what kind of self-value you must have to craft an entirely different persona for yourself to be more accepted...or to steal someone else's face because you think it's better than your own. Yes, what Sera has done is worthy of rebuke -- I'm not a fan of dishonesty, especially when it's dragged someone else into this mess -- but consider where those kind of choices must have come from before you are so quick to judge.

Second, while I'm on the subject of "quick to judge," I think that there are a lot of people on this board who ought to be considered accomplices to this situation. Do you want to know why there aren't more female posters here? Take a look around at your own behavior: all the little boys wanting to see ass and titties, all the judgmental fucks complaining that legitimately model-quality women don't meet their "high standards," all the misogynistic attitudes towards dating and marriage and children. I can certainly understand why Serafitia -- if she is a female -- would be tempted to be someone other than herself in this environment.

Finally, I feel terrible for Camilla. She is guilty of nothing more than having a pretty face...and all of a sudden she's involved in some bizarre situation. I can understand her decision not to post here, but it's too bad that she couldn't feel welcomed to this place.

More and more, I think it might be time for me to leave this place for good.

Logic and proper reasoning? In an OT Drama thread? All y'all get to a bunker; it's surely a sign of the apocalypse

 

[Matlock]

I can certainly understand why Serafitia -- if she is a female -- would be tempted to be someone other than herself in this environment.

She could have chose the route of not making her gender an issue, which would be the best way to go about it.

 

[MrPing1000]

Girls don't post here because we talk about Lindsay Lohan's boobs too much? I can live with that. Those boobs are fucking big. Like.... really big.

Ohh shit I can't bare to tell him the news

 

[totoro'd]

the last thing this should turn into is a call for all gaffems to somehow prove that they physically fit into their gender roles.

Yes, but unfortunately I don't want people thinking i'm some 300 lb dude with sexual hang-ups (no offense to the 300 lb dudes with sexual hang-ups though)

 

[Particle Physicist]

Well, I've been thinking about this, and finally have enough thoughts together to say something.

First of all, I think this situation is far more sad than funny. I don't know much about Serafitia, but I think whoever said that there was a note of self-loathing in her final post was right on the money. It's one thing to want to remain anonymous, but think about what kind of self-value you must have to craft an entirely different persona for yourself to be more accepted...or to steal someone else's face because you think it's better than your own. Yes, what Sera has done is worthy of rebuke -- I'm not a fan of dishonesty, especially when it's dragged someone else into this mess -- but consider where those kind of choices must have come from before you are so quick to judge.

Second, while I'm on the subject of "quick to judge," I think that there are a lot of people on this board who ought to be considered accomplices to this situation. Do you want to know why there aren't more female posters here? Take a look around at your own behavior: all the little boys wanting to see ass and titties, all the judgmental fucks complaining that legitimately model-quality women don't meet their "high standards," all the misogynistic attitudes towards dating and marriage and children. I can certainly understand why Serafitia -- if she is a female -- would be tempted to be someone other than herself in this environment.

Finally, I feel terrible for Camilla. She is guilty of nothing more than having a pretty face...and all of a sudden she's involved in some bizarre situation. I can understand her decision not to post here, but it's too bad that she couldn't feel welcomed to this place.

More and more, I think it might be time for me to leave this place for good.

wow.. well said indeed.

 

[Boogie]

Logic and proper reasoning? In an OT Drama thread? All y'all get to a bunker; it's surely a sign of the apocalypse

Ya think?

 

[akascream]

It might have something to do with this being a videogame forum. Then again, perhaps there is something more sinister going on here, perhaps a way I can make this about me? Jesus fuck, serifitia is hardly the only person in this thread with serious issues. lol

 

[AstroLad]

She could have chose the route of not making her gender an issue, which would be the best way to go about it.

Yes. Besides picture threads and some very specific threads which can be distinguished by their titles, when is this ever relevant? I personally don't give a shit about anyone's gender or their age or their race and only idiots who should be ignored by all anyway ever make any of these an issue.

 

[ScientificNinja]

The simple fact is that GAMING FORUMS ON THE INTERNET don't appeal to girls. Games may slightly, forums very, very little. Forums about games? No dice. I don't quite see my fiancee spending an four or five hours a week on here like I do and I think most girls are the same; yet I don't think it's because the forum is particularly uninviting to girls who would otherwise want to post here, but rather that girls don't wanna come here anymore than most guys want to spend their Saturdays getting manicures and pedicures and shopping for furniture.

I think you're making gross generalisations about women and their forum habits

 

[belgurdo]

It might have something to do with this being a videogame forum. Then again, perhaps there is something more sinister going on here, perhaps a way I can make this about me? Jesus fuck, serifitia is hardly the only person in this thread with serious issues. lol

Many of us are sociopaths, it's just that some tend to be more open about it than others

 

[Ristamar]

She could have chose the route of not making her gender an issue, which would be the best way to go about it.

True, there's no need to blatantly advertise it. Very strange indeed.

 

[Matlock]

Yes. Besides picture threads and some very specific threads which can be distinguished by their titles, when is this ever relevant?

Aye.

Of course, the tactic never fails to get attention--See: Greekboy.

 

[Kon Tiki]

She could have chose the route of not making her gender an issue, which would be the best way to go about it.

Exactly. I did not know Be-Ah-Hui was a female till now. Then again she is a real lady about it.

 

[fart]

I don't think that's entirely true. As far as the misogyny, objectification, and "impossibly high standards," well just turn on the TV or read any magazine, I don't see this forum as being particularly unique in harboring these characteristics, and it's actually a lot better than many forums where misogyny, racism, pornography, etc. are the norm. Let's go on the assumption that Sera is an "average" or "below average" looking girl (a huge assumption, but just for the purposes of argumen, I'll make it). If this girl felt "average" and not up to higher standards of SEXIENESS, but still wanted to post a pic, 90% of people would probably post something relatively nice or nothing at all and maybe 5-10% something jackassy (and they would then get banned since GA is a pretty tight ship), but then again male posters have to put up with pretty much the same thing (though obviously a "girl" picture will draw more attention since it's just a rarity). If she feels just hideous for whatever reason, well then why post a pic to begin with? 98% of the forum has managed to survive without posting a pic. Again, a few people might harass with "post a pic!" but I don't think it's that hard to either treat that as a) a joke (which it usually is, at least somewhat), b) if it's bad just say fuck off and wait for the person to get banned, c) ignore it. I have to say that the forum is not entirely (or even in largely) to blame for the posting of the pics to begin with and the resulting problems it created. If the poster has some desire to be seen as a SEXIE woman or just play a joke, well that's purely the poster's desire, and it seems slightly unfair to pin that all on the forum (though admittedly a few members may be partially to blame).

The simple fact is that GAMING FORUMS ON THE INTERNET don't appeal to girls. Games may slightly, forums very, very little. Forums about games? No dice. I don't quite see my fiancee spending an four or five hours a week on here like I do and I think most girls are the same; yet I don't think it's because the forum is particularly uninviting to girls who would otherwise want to post here, but rather that girls don't wanna come here anymore than most guys want to spend their Saturdays getting manicures and pedicures and shopping for furniture.

this is clearly a complicated social question, but i think jinx's point is quite solid. it is up to us to create a more perfect community, not to observe the chaos around us and figure we are "good enough". there are females who play video games and spend time on the internet as much as males, and there's no reason why these females wouldn't find gaf a perfectly good place to waste time, if it weren't so inhospitable. in theory, off-topic is open to any discussion, but the discussion is dominated by marginalizing discourse on ass and titties, so in practice it's really not so cut and dry.

i think i just stopped making sense. THROAT HURTS

come back sera, thera and fss

 

[AstroLad]

I think you're making gross generalisations about women and their forum habits

Haha... but see forums + Vogue= Maybe some dice. But it's the Vogue element, not the forum element. Anyway I don't want to degenerate into wholesale characterizations of all women (which wasn't what I was trying to do in the first place), but suffice it to say women not being on forums at nearly the same rate as men isn't entirely because of discomfort, and it's mostly because of disinterest.

this is clearly a complicated social question, but i think jinx's point is quite solid. it is up to us to create a more perfect community, not to observe the chaos around us and figure we are "good enough". there are females who play video games and spend time on the internet as much as males, and there's no reason why these females wouldn't find gaf a perfectly good place to waste time, if it weren't so inhospitable. in theory, off-topic is open to any discussion, but the discussion is dominated by marginalizing discourse on ass and titties, so in practice it's really not so cut and dry.

That's true and I agree with that. I wasn't trying to address the point of whether the forum could be improved, but rather the point of if the forum is particularly and uniquely hostile to women such that it could be held responsible. As for the topics about titties, well there is the very simple solution of not clicking on them and if you really get pissed off going in there and saying, in as reasonable a manner as possible, "hey guys I think this is messed up," without even bringing your own gender to issue. Sure some people will say, "fuck off, party pooper," but this would happen anywhere, and maybe you will make some progress toward your ideal. I mean what does a female sports fan do about all the titties she sees in commercials, promos, sidelines, etc.? Ignore them and maybe try to make things better by saying "that's fucked up," but I hardly think so few women watch football because of these things as opposed to just simply not giving a shit about the game.

 

[Baconäger]

Second, while I'm on the subject of "quick to judge," I think that there are a lot of people on this board who ought to be considered accomplices to this situation. Do you want to know why there aren't more female posters here? Take a look around at your own behavior: all the little boys wanting to see ass and titties, all the judgmental fucks complaining that legitimately model-quality women don't meet their "high standards," all the misogynistic attitudes towards dating and marriage and children. I can certainly understand why Serafitia -- if she is a female -- would be tempted to be someone other than herself in this environment.

:lol

Yeah, ok. It's OUR fault she's a loser nut job. Also, very few women post ANYWHERE, and you shouldn't be shocked that this place isn't an exception to that trend. I really hope you aren't expecting people to be all apologetic here over this crap.

Oh and btw, "female" isn't a noun...

 

[Azala]

I don't think that's entirely true. As far as the misogyny, objectification, and "impossibly high standards," well just turn on the TV or read any magazine, I don't see this forum as being particularly unique in harboring these characteristics, and it's actually a lot better than many forums where misogyny, racism, pornography, etc. are the norm. Let's go on the assumption that Sera is an "average" or "below average" looking girl (a huge assumption, but just for the purposes of argumen, I'll make it). If this girl felt "average" and not up to higher standards of SEXIENESS, but still wanted to post a pic, 90% of people would probably post something relatively nice or nothing at all and maybe 5-10% something jackassy (and they would then get banned since GA is a pretty tight ship), but then again male posters have to put up with pretty much the same thing (though obviously a "girl" picture will draw more attention since it's just a rarity). If she feels just hideous for whatever reason, well then why post a pic to begin with? 98% of the forum has managed to survive without posting a pic. Again, a few people might harass with "post a pic!" but I don't think it's that hard to either treat that as a) a joke (which it usually is, at least somewhat), b) if it's bad just say fuck off and wait for the person to get banned, c) ignore it. I have to say that the forum is not entirely (or even in largely) to blame for the posting of the pics to begin with and the resulting problems it created. If the poster has some desire to be seen as a SEXIE woman or just play a joke, well that's purely the poster's desire, and it seems slightly unfair to pin that all on the forum (though admittedly a few members may be partially to blame).

The simple fact is that GAMING FORUMS ON THE INTERNET don't appeal to girls. Games may slightly, forums very, very little. Forums about games? No dice. I don't quite see my fiancee spending an four or five hours a week on here like I do and I think most girls are the same; yet I don't think it's because the forum is particularly uninviting to girls who would otherwise want to post here, but rather that girls don't wanna come here anymore than most guys want to spend their Saturdays getting manicures and pedicures and shopping for furniture.

Hold up, I agree with you that it's about more than just GAF's pressure on women. It's everywhere. And I avoid magazines with pretty models. I do everything in my power to avoid and resist such pressures and constraints on my self esteem. So by the same token, just because we're already getting hit from every side with it, why does GAF have to add onto it? Does it really make it ok? I mean the media is very easy to dismiss, but hearing it from the average guy is harder to take. I mean, no offense, but as a real life person not living in a magazine either, you'd think we'd all be more understanding of each other. It doesn't make it very welcoming, because who wants to hang out with that?

The thing is most of my friends don't give a rat's ass what I look like, and I wish I could say the majority of GAF was the same way; but a lot of the topics here relating to women do cast them in a poor light, view them as pieces of meat without brains or feelings, and have really high expectations of their physical appearances. Now as a girl who loves gaming, and would spend almost every minute of her day gaming and/or talking about gaming, if she was able, I have to say it's hard to feel like a part of a group here. If am airbrushed supermodel who spends 30 hours a week to have the perfect body and look gets flack around here, then what is an average girl supposed to expect? You don't necessarily have to flat out insult a girl to put the pressure on her self esteem. Think of all the times you made the mistake of pointing out a hot girl in front of your girlfriend. :lol It's only natural to think, "If he thinks her thighs are fat, then what the hell does he think about mine?" or to feel like you somehow have to compare to that fantasy he has.

And please do not even threaten me to with manicures, pedicures and shopping. I get that enough from my mother.

 

[ScientificNinja]

She could have chose the route of not making her gender an issue, which would be the best way to go about it.

What about the male posters who make an issue of their gender? (like Greekboy) Or the posters who constantly keep refer to their sexual orientation? What of the people with race issues who constantly discuss how black/white they are or why they're entitled to an Asian fetish? And what about that guy who can't help his fetish for anime porn? Believe me, I think quite a lot of people in this forum are a bit kooky.

 

[Instigator]

Exactly. I did not know Be-Ah-Hui was a female till now. Then again she is a real lady about it.

The girl in the pic might be the girlfriend of the real Be-Ah-Hui.

You'll never know anybody's gender for certain, no matter how many pics are produced.

 

[Azala]

this is clearly a complicated social question, but i think jinx's point is quite solid. it is up to us to create a more perfect community, not to observe the chaos around us and figure we are "good enough". there are females who play video games and spend time on the internet as much as males, and there's no reason why these females wouldn't find gaf a perfectly good place to waste time, if it weren't so inhospitable. in theory, off-topic is open to any discussion, but the discussion is dominated by marginalizing discourse on ass and titties, so in practice it's really not so cut and dry.

It's more than just the physical discussions and multitude of sexy pictures, there's a lot of generally demeaning conversations, some of them are in humor I'm sure, but it's not always clear cut, and sometimes it's tasteless regardless.

 

[Kon Tiki]

Well, his a lady about it.

 

[MrPing1000]

The girl in the pic might be the girlfriend of the real Be-Ah-Hui.

You'll never know anybody's gender for certain, no matter how many pics are produced.

<Northern Ireland joke> Don't tell Ian Paisley <Northern Ireland joke >

 

[border]

Do you want to know why there aren't more female posters here? Take a look around at your own behavior: all the little boys wanting to see ass and titties, all the judgmental fucks complaining that legitimately model-quality women don't meet their "high standards," all the misogynistic attitudes towards dating and marriage and children

Oh please. I agree with AstroLad. Toning down the sexy pictures threads and insane dating advice isn't going to make this place a haven for women. At the end of the day it's a gaming forum on the internet, and not likely to see much female traffic.

Is there a more "well-adjusted" gamer forum that has a large female population? Probably not, unless it's for a girl-gamer specific site. Even then it's probably 50% clithanger, 25% guys pretending to be girls, 25% actual girls.

At the end of the day, maybe some people actually just prefer this place as a boys' club anyhow. If you have to be on your best behavior all the time, then it kind of takes the fun of having women around away....

Just in case anyone has doubts, since Lemurs did it, I can too!

me sitting on the floor just a minute ago:

To paraphrase Hitokage, from the Lemurs thread:

Just so you know, those pics don't necessarily prove your case. What they do prove is that you have pics of a girl who wrote or Photoshopped "I'm Be-Ah-Hui" on a piece of paper.

Since you seem to want to make it official and everything, the "challenge/response" method is what you need. That is, somebody asks to have certain things shown alongside yourself and you produce it quickly. (If you run to other forums, google will know. Ask Gigadent.) Still not 100% definitive, but it's the best you can do over the internet, unless you want to get into PGP keys.

[not that I really care to fire up any kind of challenge, myself....]

 

[fart]

Haha... but see forums + Vogue= Maybe some dice. But it's the Vogue element, not the forum element. Anyway I don't want to degenerate into wholesale characterizations of all women (which wasn't what I was trying to do in the first place), but suffice it to say women not being on forums at nearly the same rate as men isn't entirely because of discomfort, and it's mostly because of disinterest.



That's true and I agree with that. I wasn't trying to address the point of whether the forum could be improved, but rather the point of if the forum is particularly and uniquely hostile to women such that it could be held responsible. As for the topics about titties, well there is the very simple solution of not clicking on them and if you really get pissed off going in there and saying, in as reasonable a manner as possible, "hey guys I think this is messed up," without even bringing your own gender to issue. Sure some people will say, "fuck off, party pooper," but this would happen anywhere, and maybe you will make some progress toward your ideal. I mean what does a female sports fan do about all the titties she sees in commercials, promos, sidelines, etc.? Ignore them and maybe try to make things better by saying "that's fucked up," but I hardly think so few women watch football because of these things as opposed to just simply not giving a shit about the game.

i don't agree with this. it's not about fandom, but about the marginalizing effect of its existence. commercial sports exist in a culture that marginalizes the female, so why should they "give a shit about the game", especially if it's doing so would be self-deprecating by default. i think this is entirely applicable here, too. like i said, it doesn't matter if the forum is uniquely hostile if we judge ourselves in a vacuum (which we should), all that matters is that the forum is hostile, and we both agree that it is.

 

[Boogie]

The girl in the pic might be the girlfriend of the real Be-Ah-Hui.

You'll never know anybody's gender for certain, no matter how many pics are produced.

What is this, the Matrix?

 

[AstroLad]

fart- "Marginalizing women" is not why women don't like football. I'd certainly be interested to see this huge group of female football fans that say, "I love the game, I love the schemes and the defenses, so war-like and savage, but I just can't watch because of the marginalizing of women!" And I do agree that the forum can be hostile (though it's much easier to avoid that hostility on a forum than, say, in real life- e.g. don't click on dumb threads) and I would not agree that it's any more hostile than real life.

Hold up, I agree with you that it's about more than just GAF's pressure on women. It's everywhere. And I avoid magazines with pretty models. I do everything in my power to avoid and resist such pressures and constraints on my self esteem. So by the same token, just because we're already getting hit from every side with it, why does GAF have to add onto it? Does it really make it ok? I mean the media is very easy to dismiss, but hearing it from the average guy is harder to take. I mean, no offense, but as a real life person not living in a magazine either, you'd think we'd all be more understanding of each other. It doesn't make it very welcoming, because who wants to hang out with that?

Read my response to fart above on this point.

The thing is most of my friends don't give a rat's ass what I look like, and I wish I could say the majority of GAF was the same way; but a lot of the topics here relating to women do cast them in a poor light, view them as pieces of meat without brains or feelings, and have really high expectations of their physical appearances. Now as a girl who loves gaming, and would spend almost every minute of her day gaming and/or talking about gaming, if she was able, I have to say it's hard to feel like a part of a group here. If am airbrushed supermodel who spends 30 hours a week to have the perfect body and look gets flack around here, then what is an average girl supposed to expect? You don't necessarily have to flat out insult a girl to put the pressure on her self esteem. Think of all the times you made the mistake of pointing out a hot girl in front of your girlfriend. :lol It's only natural to think, "If he thinks her thighs are fat, then what the hell does he think about mine?" or to feel like you somehow have to compare to that fantasy he has.

And please do not even threaten me to with manicures, pedicures and shopping. I get that enough from my mother.

Ummm... the majority of GAF doesn't give a shit what you look like. There are thousands of posters on here who don't even know who you are and don't give a shit if you are boy/girl, age 20/45, black/white. Are there a few morons? Sure. Are they loud? Sure, sometimes. But that is partially the nature of the beast and the loudest ones always get banned. I could post a thread, "I like Ico," praising Ico and I will guarantee you there will be at least 4-5 people trolling, saying how stupid Ico is, etc. Of course we're striving toward better discourse, but let's not forget the human element, there are 14 year old kids on here, sexists, jerks, what have you. I don't understand this fixation on model threads either. I can personally say that if I was on a female forum and there was a thread entitled "HOTTEST BUNS ON THE PLANET [NSFW]" I wouldn't go in, because I don't give a shit, and if I did I wouldn't take it too personally if some really, really SEXIE buns were deemed UNSEXIE, because it's obviously a superficial thread, you can't take that kind of bullshit totally seriously or personally or it will make you miserable. Sure sometimes it leaks into other threads where it shouldn't, and that probably shouldn't happen, but most of the time the mods keep things in line and as long as people don't go actively seeking things they know will hurt/offend them, it's a pretty safe place.

 

[fart]

It's more than just the physical discussions and multitude of sexy pictures, there's a lot of generally demeaning conversations, some of them are in humor I'm sure, but it's not always clear cut, and sometimes it's tasteless regardless.

i realize that. i'm certainly guilty of it too. then again, there's a reason all of us sit around posting on a VIDEO GAME MESSAGE BOARD ON THE INTERNET. however, there is something to be said for self-improvement.

 

[KiNeSiS]

Just in case anyone has doubts, since Lemurs did it, I can too!

me sitting on the floor just a minute ago:

NICE RACK!!!
NOW GET OUTTA HERE YOU FAKE BEFORE I PUSH YOU OVER LIKE A MAGAZINE RACK!!!

That's you standing in front of it.

I WILL CRUSH YOU! YOU WILL FESTER AND ROT RIGHT WHERE YOU LIE!!!

HEATHEN THERE ARE NO REAL WOMAN AT GAF!!!

*Plays Mettalica's Sad But True*


Who are we foolin this is just some sausage factory that talks about gaming and stupid shit about hilary duff...
I should start inviting some woman to the forum, but half of them don't like games =(

On second thought, I'd like to take you on a date
Mrs.

Do you like Egg Foo Yung??
Chop Chop To my place!

 

[Lemurnator]

tbh lemurs have never really posted definate proof. Unlike yourself.

Yes I did.

 

[ScientificNinja]

Something interesting I've noted about this forum - all of the women I've directed towards Gaming Age (whether for a funny thread or pic or whatever), and who've taken the time to browse through some of the other threads, have had identical if not similar reactions to it: they are disgusted to the core by how women are treated/referred to. They're convinced the people on this forum HATE women.

 

[fart]

Ummm... the majority of GAF doesn't give a shit what you look like. There are thousands of posters on here who don't even know who you are and don't give a shit if you are boy/girl, age 20/45, black/white. Are there a few morons? Sure. Are they loud? Sure, sometimes. But that is partially the nature of the beast and the loudest ones always get banned. I could post a thread, "I like Ico," praising Ico and I will guarantee you there will be at least 4-5 people trolling, saying how stupid Ico is, etc. Of course we're striving toward better discourse, but let's not forget the human element, there are 14 year old kids on here, sexists, jerks, what have you. I don't understand this fixation on model threads either. I can personally say that if I was on a female forum and there was a thread entitled "HOTTEST BUNS ON THE PLANET [NSFW]" I wouldn't go in, because I don't give a shit, and if I did I wouldn't take it too personally if some really, really SEXIE buns were deemed UNSEXIE,

STOP here.

The mistake you're making is equating yourself and your own cultural perspective with that of a female. In the United States, females are simply not culturally dominant like males are. It's a false analogy.

 

[Mike Works]

Jesus Christ, people are actually defending this? You don't blame her? Are you fucking kidding me?

You can be a woman and post on this forum no problem. Make your name something that isn't gender specific and you're set. That's all you have to do.

To suggest the notion that stealing someone else's face, name, and cat pictures (!) is normal because there are a bunch of teenagers on this forum who don't know how to properly talk to women is fucking ridiculous.

It's one thing to agree that exposing yourself as a woman on this board is unwise because of the current condition, but Serafitia's been doing this for over two years, before she started posting on Gaming Age.

I feel bad for her in this situation, but defending it under the guise that it should be understood or even accepted given the climate of the board is appaulingly ridiculous.

 

[AstroLad]

Jesus Christ, people are actually defending this? You don't blame her? Are you fucking kidding me?

You can be a woman and post on this forum no problem. Make your name something that isn't gender specific and you're set. That's all you have to do.

To suggest the notion that stealing someone else's face, name, and cat pictures (!) is normal because there are a bunch of teenagers on this forum who don't know how to properly talk to women is fucking ridiculous.

It's one thing to agree that exposing yourself as a woman on this board is unwise because of the current condition, but Serafitia's been doing this for over two years, before she started posting on Gaming Age.

I feel bad for her in this situation, but defending it under the guise that it should be understood or even accepted given the climate of the board is appaulingly ridiculous.

IAWTP, and I'm also done arguing that the forum is not totally to blame for this stupidity.

 

[AstroLad]

STOP here.

The mistake you're making is equating yourself and your own cultural perspective with that of a female. In the United States, females are simply not culturally dominant like males are. It's a false analogy.

So females aren't culturally dominant and therefore are somehow more compelled to click on dumb threads? Wow, I never realized the true power of cultural dominance. Look man I agree with you on most of what you are saying but what I'm saying is that there are more factors at play here than just everyone on the forum being a big meanie.

 

[Azala]

Oh please. I agree with AstroLad. Toning down the sexy pictures threads and insane dating advice isn't going to make this place a haven for women. At the end of the day it's a gaming forum on the internet, and not likely to see much female traffic.

Is there a more "well-adjusted" gamer forum that has a large female population? Probably not, unless it's for a girl-gamer specific site. Even then it's probably 50% clithanger, 25% guys pretending to be girls, 25% actual girls.

At the end of the day, maybe some people actually just prefer this place as a boys' club anyhow. If you have to be on your best behavior all the time, then it kind of takes the fun of having women around away....

To paraphrase Hitokage, from the Lemurs thread:

Just so you know, those pics don't necessarily prove your case. What they do prove is that you have pics of a girl who wrote or Photoshopped "I'm Be-Ah-Hui" on a piece of paper.

Since you seem to want to make it official and everything, the "challenge/response" method is what you need. That is, somebody asks to have certain things shown alongside yourself and you produce it quickly. (If you run to other forums, google will know. Ask Gigadent.) Still not 100% definitive, but it's the best you can do over the internet, unless you want to get into PGP keys.

[not that I really care to fire up any kind of challenge, myself....]

It's true to some extent, even on your best behavior you are not going to attract large volumes of women in proportion to the men to this forum. It's just not going to happen. But you might be surprised how many more participate in some fashion or another. I didn't join GAF to change anything, and I do see it as a boys club at times. I make the most of it, enjoy what I can, lurk a lot and it makes me very wary and aware of how to raise my son so he doesn't end up pushing things too far when he's older. Some of the opinions and thoughts expressed, jokes shared are just things I would not want my son to be saying or a boyfriend/husband to be participating in. Am I to believe I'm so different from the general woman trashed talked around here, that I warrant some serious emotions or respect?

Now why would anyone want to go to such great lengths to prove their gender? Do they get a cash award? Does it truly change the way a female is perceived in a more positive way? All I see coming from such lengths is mockery, cheap come ons, and insults. What's the motivation here?