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TLOU2's player count after 45 days vs other Sony games in the same timeframe

Krisprolls

Banned
i would like to live in a world where merit counted and people weren’t actively trying to force their beliefs into video games

Those are 2 different things.

In our world, merit sometimes counts, not always. Sometimes we work and we get what we deserve, sometimes we don't. You're right, I agree, it's not really fair, unfortunately it's our world and it's difficult to change it (nearly impossible). It has never really been fair in the past either, to be honest. We should try to live happily our time here with the people we love and probably accept what we can't change, only change what we can control. Or if you're really ambitious, be the change you want for the world, like Gandhi said. But you'll have to work a lot.

I agree on the second point video games shouldn't force their views on us, but I disagree that TLoU2 tried to force anything on me. I have my opinions, Neil Druckmann has his, you have yours. He wrote the story he wanted to write, I thought about it what I wanted to think about it, nobody forced anything on anybody.

He's ok with the fact you disagree with his views or don't like his story. He doesn't try to please you with his story, that's just what he wanted to write. He hopes you'll like the game though. Explain me why you feel TLoU 2 forced something on you. (it's late here, I may answer tomorrow though)
 

Woggleman

Member
Does anyone else find it bizarre that a bunch of people here are trying hard as they can to convince those that enjoyed the game, that they are wrong for enjoying the game? What kind of retarded shit is that.
If they hate it so much why do they post so much about it. They are more obsessed with it than the fans. I can't fathom being that obsessed with something I don't even like.
 

Rikoi

Member
If they hate it so much why do they post so much about it. They are more obsessed with it than the fans. I can't fathom being that obsessed with something I don't even like.
I guess for the same reason why people that hate Xbox and will NEVER buy the console open 10 threads everyday about Xbox having no games and PS5 being the winner. What's the point?
Maybe to make Microsoft change.
 

Woggleman

Member
I guess for the same reason why people that hate Xbox and will NEVER buy the console open 10 threads everyday about Xbox having no games and PS5 being the winner. What's the point?
Maybe to make Microsoft change.
I couldn't care less. I will probably buy an X Box series X because muli-plats will probably play better on there. I am considering waiting to play Cyberpunk on it.
 

Krisprolls

Banned
Man, TLOU 2 is a brutal game, a story about a brutal revenge, and you enjoyed it.
Are you aware of how hypocritical and cringe this is sounding?
Pull down your angel mask, nobody is falling for it.

This makes zero sense about the thread in question.

Well yes, humans are brutal, hateful, they're not angels, neither am I. It seems to me that was part of the point of this story. How the characters feel both hate and love, whoever they are. That there is no "good" side and everything is grey. I'm not better than you, we're the same. That's what it says in my opinion.

There's a difference between the art piece itself and what the art piece depicts.

I can enjoy an art piece representing death without enjoying death. Those are very different things.
 

idrago01

Banned
Does anyone else find it bizarre that a bunch of people here are trying hard as they can to convince those that enjoyed the game, that they are wrong for enjoying the game? What kind of retarded shit is that.
well the topic is about how fast tlou2 is losing players and most people are just pointing and laughing (at least i know i am) i don’t think anyone here seriously cares about trying to change your shietty taste in games
 
I feel like Covid should be factored into this as well - I got TLOU2 but didn't get GOT because Covid has really screwed me financially. Spiderman and GOW didn't come out in the midst of a huge economic shitshow. People who were super excited and had the game preordered already were sure to still buy it, but anyone on the fence or people who had heard about the leaks and didn't have money to spend on a game they weren't sure if they would like probably passed and saved their $65 to pay the bills. Just a thought.
 
well the topic is about how fast tlou2 is losing players and most people are just pointing and laughing (at least i know i am) i don’t think anyone here seriously cares about trying to change your shietty taste in games
I liked the game, but it really doesn't have replay value. Of course people would stop playing it a month or so later - it's a 35 hour, very story heavy, emotionally draining game. Not a game where you swing about on spiderwebs that you can complete in around 10 hours and then go back for full completion. It has nothing to do with enjoyment of the game in this sense, there are many games I absolutely loved playing but wouldn't want to play again, at least not immediately after I finished the game.
 
It isn't that simple but many of it's biggest critics are the ones obsessed with being anti-sjw. There is a big overlap. On Restera and other progressive platforms it has received a much better reception.

No one is denying there is a massive over reaction from a crowd that is just going through and leaving hateful comments behind about the characters. Just as I feel the idiocy that has rallied behind this game to retcon prior character choices and decisions in service of a pretty shallow story.

However the crucial problem is how the narrative has shifted by labeling the criticism as homophobic or transphobic or whatever. You and your like, defending this game as you have so displayed the same tactic to shield any legitimate criticism of the game of which there are plenty.

The fact that whenever this game brought up in discussions is met with detractors and fans is indicative that the game just doesn't stand up to the original.
 
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Nintendo games always sell well because they are family friendly. Kid's stuff usually does great sales numbers. We don't compare a Tarantino movie to Frozen. The only M rated game that has super long legs is GTA V for god knows what reason.

I mean this game isn't close to a Tarantino movie with such gems as 'bigot sandwich'. I mean, GoT is depressing - the whole of the countryside you tour, there are people hung, strung up and more. There's a constant reminder that one's home is ravaged beyond belief which is reflected in the gameplay.

In TLOU2 when you see something stupid like 'dOcToR sAveD zEbRA - he must be benevolent'. You let go of any critical thinking of the fireflies as an organisation that was shown to be just as brutal and pragmatic as Joel which was reflected in the *gameplay*, it's just dumbing down the character decisions and removing the complexity and gray morality that was great in the first game.
 

GhostOfTsu

Banned
I feel like Covid should be factored into this as well - I got TLOU2 but didn't get GOT because Covid has really screwed me financially. Spiderman and GOW didn't come out in the midst of a huge economic shitshow. People who were super excited and had the game preordered already were sure to still buy it, but anyone on the fence or people who had heard about the leaks and didn't have money to spend on a game they weren't sure if they would like probably passed and saved their $65 to pay the bills. Just a thought.

Makes no sense since Gaming went up everywhere since Covid. The big 3 are breaking records, GOT came out a month later and it's already on track to surpass it.

I liked the game, but it really doesn't have replay value. Of course people would stop playing it a month or so later - it's a 35 hour, very story heavy, emotionally draining game. Not a game where you swing about on spiderwebs that you can complete in around 10 hours and then go back for full completion. It has nothing to do with enjoyment of the game in this sense, there are many games I absolutely loved playing but wouldn't want to play again, at least not immediately after I finished the game.

??? We're on page 6 and multiple posters still don't understand what this thread is about. Embarrassing.

Game lenght and open world is totally irrelevant with the numbers.
 

GhostOfTsu

Banned
I mean this game isn't close to a Tarantino movie with such gems as 'bigot sandwich'. I mean, GoT is depressing - the whole of the countryside you tour, there are people hung, strung up and more. There's a constant reminder that one's home is ravaged beyond belief which is reflected in the gameplay.

In TLOU2 when you see something stupid like 'dOcToR sAveD zEbRA - he must be benevolent'. You let go of any critical thinking of the fireflies as an organisation that was shown to be just as brutal and pragmatic as Joel which was reflected in the *gameplay*, it's just dumbing down the character decisions and removing the complexity and gray morality that was great in the first game.

Exactly but don't bother with Woggleman, he will just say you didn't like it because Abby has muscles and Ellie is a lesbian. You can't reason with these people.
 

aries_71

Junior Member
It's a good game technology-wise, with an amazing art direction, but it left me a very bad taste. My word of mouth will evidence that bad taste.
 

Bodomism

Banned
Interesting data. But we all knew TLOU II has no legs.
Go take a look at the previous threads of fastest selling 1st party game PR, a lot of people on GAF and Ree stated the game didn't have any problem to cross 20M mark lol. Looks like 10M itself will be a mammoth and daunting task, needed many price reduction promotions and given away for free in order to clear 10M mark like HZD and UC4.
 

idrago01

Banned
Go take a look at the previous threads of fastest selling 1st party game PR, a lot of people on GAF and Ree stated the game didn't have any problem to cross 20M mark lol. Looks like 10M itself will be a mammoth and daunting task, needed many price reduction promotions and given away for free in order to clear 10M mark like HZD and UC4.
i think he meant all sane people knew it didn’t have legs
 
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Azurro

Banned
You didn't like the game included LGBT people and a woman had muscles ? Wow, big deal. They knew some people wouldn't like that, it's okay.

I guess that there are really people that think that this is really people's biggest issue with the game, not the dour, depressing story, mistreatment of the original characters and nonsensical characters in the apocalypse.

"The world is in flames, society is broken down...but uwuhhhuuuuuu my gender identity is what's important here! I'll just rest here with my roided up, SJW friendly Joel replacement."
 

Krisprolls

Banned
I guess that there are really people that think that this is really people's biggest issue with the game, not the dour, depressing story, mistreatment of the original characters and nonsensical characters in the apocalypse.

"The world is in flames, society is broken down...but uwuhhhuuuuuu my gender identity is what's important here! I'll just rest here with my roided up, SJW friendly Joel replacement."

Strange take. I can assure you that you wouldn't suddenly become gay if the apocalypse was here. Or would you?

Well, that's the same for them. They stayed what they were before. Crazy I know.
 

Azurro

Banned
He's ok with the fact you disagree with his views or don't like his story. He doesn't try to please you with his story, that's just what he wanted to write. He hopes you'll like the game though. Explain me why you feel TLoU 2 forced something on you. (it's late here, I may answer tomorrow though)

Wasn't he making fun of "salty people" on twitter with that Joel gif? Wasn't he also telling people that if they didn't like the game because of who the protagonists are, you are an -ist and fuck off or something like that? He's hardly an innocent dude that just wrote a story close to his heart, he's a raging SJW.

In any case, it seems in the end I was right and the legs of the game are terrible. I am not even sure it will reach half the sales of the profit game.
 

rofif

Can’t Git Gud
It's lower because of hate leaks and people being too stubborn to let go of those leaks.
Game is fantastic. For sure not worse than Horizon: maximum repetition and Spider-Man: what are those mary jane missions. (imo imo imo don't hurt me these are all good games)
 

mikeaka

Neo Member
Why push an agenda just to shit on the game? If its against your “political views “ then simple dont play it and stop badmouthing a game that will be hugely successful and millions will enjoy. There are thousands of dude bro games you can plan instead of wasting time trying to prove TLOU 2 is shit
 

Krisprolls

Banned
Wasn't he making fun of "salty people" on twitter with that Joel gif? Wasn't he also telling people that if they didn't like the game because of who the protagonists are, you are an -ist and fuck off or something like that? He's hardly an innocent dude that just wrote a story close to his heart, he's a raging SJW.

In any case, it seems in the end I was right and the legs of the game are terrible. I am not even sure it will reach half the sales of the profit game.

I mostly saw him discuss the game. He obviously preferred if people like you liked the game, but you see enemies everywhere so it's hard.

There's no warrior here. Games move on, world moves on, with or without you or me...
 
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Azurro

Banned
Strange take. I can assure you that you wouldn't suddenly become gay if the apocalypse was here. Or would you?

Well, that's the same for them. They stayed what they were before. Crazy I know.

Why is their sexual identity an important part of a game set in the fucking apocalypse? I don't care and don't want to know about their struggle against oppression, there are more important things going on, like not getting eaten by cannibals.

But Neil went ahead and created this thinly veiled allegory for Christianity that wanted to kill Lev. Lazy and preachy.

Now, Abby is just something else. This has been discussing ad nauseum, but basically she's a character that would never exist in the apocalypse, as the amount of injected help and nutrition she'd need is impossible to find in the apocalypse. The score board where she's the strongest of all the buffed up dudes is just ridiculous.

She's a replacement for Joel and Neil tried to repeat what happened in the first game with Joel and Ellie, but did it with an impossible, unlikeable, dour character with anger issues.

There are multiple legitimate aspects of the game that don't work. And it's just Neil blatantly inserting his political propaganda into the game.
 
tumblr_oynarnT4Zr1rbijdfo7_500.gif


Loved GOT a lot! But to me:

1-God of War.
2-Uncharted 4.
3-Ghost of Tsushmia.
4-Horizon: Zero Dawn.
5-The Last of Us Part 2.
6-Spider-man.
Yep God of War is the best Sony game this gen (I am excluding Bloodborne here). TLOU2 gameplay is incredible, but the story is lacking. I haven't played Ghost of Tsushima yet though.
 
It's obvious that the naughty dog and sony must have had incedible high expectations for the sale's of this game. They sold millions of units but they failed to beat spiderman and gow and propably ghost of tsushima after 45 days and that's little bit disappointing for something like TLOU1 sequel imo
 

Roxkis_ii

Member
I dont care for the story of TLOU2, so seeing it not do as well as other games make me feel better knowing a lot of people may feel similarly. 🤷
 

Krisprolls

Banned
Why is their sexual identity an important part of a game set in the fucking apocalypse? I don't care and don't want to know about their struggle against oppression, there are more important things going on, like not getting eaten by cannibals.

But Neil went ahead and created this thinly veiled allegory for Christianity that wanted to kill Lev. Lazy and preachy.

Now, Abby is just something else. This has been discussing ad nauseum, but basically she's a character that would never exist in the apocalypse, as the amount of injected help and nutrition she'd need is impossible to find in the apocalypse. The score board where she's the strongest of all the buffed up dudes is just ridiculous.

She's a replacement for Joel and Neil tried to repeat what happened in the first game with Joel and Ellie, but did it with an impossible, unlikeable, dour character with anger issues.

There are multiple legitimate aspects of the game that don't work. And it's just Neil blatantly inserting his political propaganda into the game.

I actually liked Abby. While I somewhat agree not everything works in the story, I wouldn't say it was forcing anything on us but I get you felt differently.

I don't think it was criticizing Christianism specifically either, more like every religious extremism. It's not like minorities aren't oppressed outside of Christianism too.

You have the right to think what you want, I don't think he wanted to change your mind...
 

mikeaka

Neo Member
Why is their sexual identity an important part of a game set in the fucking apocalypse? I don't care and don't want to know about their struggle against oppression, there are more important things going on, like not getting eaten by cannibals.

But Neil went ahead and created this thinly veiled allegory for Christianity that wanted to kill Lev. Lazy and preachy.

Now, Abby is just something else. This has been discussing ad nauseum, but basically she's a character that would never exist in the apocalypse, as the amount of injected help and nutrition she'd need is impossible to find in the apocalypse. The score board where she's the strongest of all the buffed up dudes is just ridiculous.

She's a replacement for Joel and Neil tried to repeat what happened in the first game with Joel and Ellie, but did it with an impossible, unlikeable, dour character with anger issues.

There are multiple legitimate aspects of the game that don't work. And it's just Neil blatantly inserting his political propaganda into the game.

Are we playing a different game here? I think it was obvious the Seraphites were a cult and not christianity. WLF were no better. The game basically showing all groups formed after the infection are vile. Look at the rattlers at the end! They were the worst , slavers ffs!
Abby is fully justified killing joel and she dedicated her whole life to train and get ready to kill him. The WLF seemed pretty organised in resources and training facilities so im pretty sure in 4 years she could , with revenge in her heart, get that big and ready
 

zkorejo

Member
Those are 2 different things.

In our world, merit sometimes counts, not always. Sometimes we work and we get what we deserve, sometimes we don't. You're right, I agree, it's not really fair, unfortunately it's our world and it's difficult to change it (nearly impossible). It has never really been fair in the past either, to be honest. We should try to live happily our time here with the people we love and probably accept what we can't change, only change what we can control. Or if you're really ambitious, be the change you want for the world, like Gandhi said. But you'll have to work a lot.

I agree on the second point video games shouldn't force their views on us, but I disagree that TLoU2 tried to force anything on me. I have my opinions, Neil Druckmann has his, you have yours. He wrote the story he wanted to write, I thought about it what I wanted to think about it, nobody forced anything on anybody.

He's ok with the fact you disagree with his views or don't like his story. He doesn't try to please you with his story, that's just what he wanted to write. He hopes you'll like the game though. Explain me why you feel TLoU 2 forced something on you. (it's late here, I may answer tomorrow though)

Good post. I can speak for myself only, nobody can force anything on me. I knew full well what the game was trying to do. I knew it wasn't going to be like the first part. I knew Ellie would be the main character and I also read a few spoilers, so I knew I would play as Abby. I bought the game knowing all that, because I knew I would enjoy atleast the gameplay aspect of it. Being a fan of the TLOU universe, I had to play it and experience for myself if this game worked for me or not.

Gameplay, even though it didnt really innovate or outdo their previous installment, as nothing was groundbreaking but it was a solid, fun gameplay and it worked for me. I wish the gameplay from last level was the case with most of the game as that was the most fun I had in any level. Now my problem with the game is its story ofcourse.

I got the feeling of being manipulated into liking Abby more than Ellie. Abby's side was given way more explanation and had more sympathetic cutscenes. For a story that focuses on grey areas of all characters, She's the most reasonable in her group, she loves animals, she lost her almost angelic father who was trying to save the world, killed by a selfish prick who she hunts down and kills. She decides to not kill Ellie, she lets her pregnant friend go. Alright they established that pretty well, whereas Ellie was nothing like the first game and just came across as a psycho killer, killing animals, all Abby's friends ruthlessly, kills a pregnant woman (who i have no sympathy for btw), kills Abby's love interest that we are forced to explore multiple times in flashbacks.

It almost seemed like the idea wasn't to create a balanced rivalry between Abby and Ellie but Ellie was actually bastardized in this one and came across as a completely different person than TLOU1. Tommy... they destroyed Tommy! The guy says "Lets get over it" and then the next morning leaves without Ellie?! WTF. Did he think Ellie wouldn't go regardless? Specially when she already told him she would? Then at the end he comes and shames Ellie? I mean who the hell is this guy, Tommy wasnt such an asshole in the first game.

Now on to Joel. Joel's reasoning is implied in the first game as to why he decided to kill fireflies and save Ellie... and thats it. While its wholly described why Abby killing Joel is justified, they dont even try to justify Joel's decision when it actually makes sense.

All the main characters from previous game, the characters I loved as a player were done dirty in this one. I bought the game to play their story.. I couldn't give a fuck about Abby and Owen and that pregnant woman who is prancing around going out to adventures without a care. If they wanted to tell the story of Abby, they could have made a sequel as a separate game without any link to the first one. It came across like, they used our love for the previous game as a bridge to put over new characters which weren;t half as good as the first games's.

In addition to that, it felt like every new side characters had some political background to them. He its a Trans, look its a woman with bigger muscles than Joel, shes a lesbian.. Look shes a brave pregnant woman. I mean okay.... I get it. Just stop hitting me on the head with it. If you want me to like them, give me something about their characters that actually impresses me. These all felt like cheap plugs to please specific communities. I dont mind them being a trans or a bi or pregnant or a lesbian or whatever, but can you please give me something more than that? Lev had somewhat of a proper story but then again, it felt like it was shoehorned into the game unnecessarily, which ended up bloating the game for me. IDC about Lev man.. I want to know what happens with the story of Ellie and Abby.

They tried very hard to change the perspective of the player into liking Abby by the end of it, which kind of worked in the sense because I didnt want her to die, and that brings my biggest dislike of the game... the ending.

How f'n dumb is Ellie? Why would she just not kill Abby? I as a player MAY or may not understand Abby's character (because I played as her and know her story), from Ellie's perspective Abby is an enemy who killed her father figure, and she has her right there and she lets her go? Why..? Now she suddenly realizes that "Revenge isnt the answer"? We weren't given ONE cutscene where someone (Dina should have) explained to her why she shouldn't waste away burning in the fire for vengeance... not one! How am I to understand why she doesnt kill Abby? She threw away her perfect life with a farm and a lover and all for revenge... she thinks over it and decides she needs a closure by doing it.. she leaves everything behind for it and then just didnt do it. I mean... why did you waste my 40 hours man.. you should have never left Jackson.

So the game didnt only fail to put over new characters with me as a player, but also managed to make me hate the characters I actually already liked from previous games.

Sorry for the long post, having beat the game recently.. I needed to get it out of my system.
 

joe_zazen

Member
Why should they not be grim and depressing? Do people really but TLOU 1 or 2 expecting some sunshine and rainbows story?

CDC released a mental health survey yesterday, which asked people if they have seriously considered suicide in the last 30 days (month of June). The number for 18-24 y.o. was 25%! For reference, 45+ was 2-3%.

The first tlou was a “finding hope and love in a ruined world“ story. The second one forced you to watch
someone cry in devastating pain as a parent was beat slowly to death. And just for kicks, had you murder a dog. Oh, and then, here is your nihilistic ending.
Druckman comes off as a sadist releasing that thing in 2020.

personally, I dislike Naughty Dog gameplay. And when that gameplay is in a depressing as fuck world with a nihilist ending...well I’d rather play lego harry potter or go outside for a walk.

edit: and I loved the dlc for the first game. I was hoping 2 was going to play like that and have a story with love and hope.
 
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Melchiah

Member
I'm still shocked that no one talked about scummy marketing tactics and how they hid the fact that you play as Abby and they've promoted Joel in almost all trailers. That is the number 1 reason why it received so many sales at launch and shortly after and why it's going downhill. While I did not hate TLOU2 fuck ND for pulling this shit.

That shit was infuriating. Along with the forced walking in the Abby story sections (IIRC, there weren't such in the Ellie & Joel sections), which made them even more annoying to go through than they already were. It's beyond me why that isn't criticized at all, like it was in, say, The Order: 1886. I guess the diehard fans are willing to overlook flaws they berate elsewhere, because they can't admit the game having any.
 

Azurro

Banned
...

The WLF seemed pretty organised in resources and training facilities so im pretty sure in 4 years she could , with revenge in her heart, get that big and ready

I don't really want to get into this again, but, usually this is what people that have never gone to the gym and want to appear progressive usually say.

No, a woman can't get that big naturally at the gym. And no, she would not have been able to be the strongest of all the buffed up guys. It's literally impossible. For her to exist in that form, she would need anabolic steroids, which would be a tad difficult to find in the apocalypse. The fact that they have a pristine gym in pristine conditions more than a decade after the apocalypse started is just...ugh.
 

MagnesG

Banned
I don't really want to get into this again, but, usually this is what people that have never gone to the gym and want to appear progressive usually say.

No, a woman can't get that big naturally at the gym. And no, she would not have been able to be the strongest of all the buffed up guys. It's literally impossible. For her to exist in that form, she would need anabolic steroids, which would be a tad difficult to find in the apocalypse. The fact that they have a pristine gym in pristine conditions more than a decade after the apocalypse started is just...ugh.
Incoming "this is fiction, main character could kill tons of enemies, so buff women could too" deflections. Been there, done that.
 

Azurro

Banned
Incoming "this is fiction, main character could kill tons of enemies, so buff women could too" deflections. Been there, done that.

Yeah, I am still disappointed in the game since I really liked Naughty Dog games before, but I'm tired of the debate.

It never ends, because it's an lgbt game and the people that like it will defend it no matter what. I'm tired of talking about it, I'm just glad it has little legs.
 

Azurro

Banned
This means people are thinking logically.

Infected humans? Fine
Butt women? That's going to far.

Can't believe people so upset about it.

It's because you are not thinking logically. Every element in a story needs to be thought of in the context and setting the story provides.

If you present a world of infected humans that destroyed civilization, yes indeed, an unaturally buff woman makes no sense, as the necessary conditions for a woman to get to those proportions, when by nature she literally can't, aren't there.

But as I mentioned, it's an lgbt game so people rush to the defense of it.
 
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