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[enzo_gt]

are these real? jesus christ, this is the biggest trolling i've seen ever

Straight from the interview, paraphrased a few, most are word for word.

 

[soultron]

Straight from the interview, paraphrased a few, most are word for word.

It was more entertaining than an E3 press conference gone bad. But just 1111430% more infuriating.

 

[firehawk12]

It was more entertaining than an E3 press conference gone bad. But just 1111430% more infuriating.

YOU WILL BE SUCKED!

If only. :lol

 

[JaseC]

I feel for you Canadians. As an Australian, I've been through similar shit with regards to broadband pricing and quotas.

 

[Deku]

CBC panel criticizes GAF users -- (our position is not popular)

Edit: video will be available later tonight.

Summary - most users subsidize 'heavy users' and the correct way to fix this is pricing internet usage.

More importantly, as a policy issue, this is dangerous as the CRTC is an independent regulator and the government stepping in to influence CRTC decisions opens up the agency to lobbyist influence as lobbyists in the future need only to influence the government and they can overturn any CRTC ruling -- basically the opposite of what Liberal GAF was implying all week about the conservatives being in bed with the big TelCos and Cable companies on this ruling.

 

[EvilMario]

I feel for you Canadians. As an Australian, I've been through similar shit with regards to broadband pricing and quotas.

Given your timeline, I figure we're roughly five to seven years behind you right now. But we're moving backwards at an increasing rate.

 

[TouchMyBox]

CBC panel criticizes GAF users -- (our position is not popular)

Edit: video will be available later tonight.

Summary - most users subsidize 'heavy users' and the correct way to fix this is pricing internet usage.

More importantly, as a policy issue, this is dangerous as the CRTC is an independent regulator and the government stepping in to influence CRTC decisions opens up the agency to lobbyist influence as lobbyists in the future need only to influence the government and they can overturn any CRTC ruling -- basically the opposite of what Liberal GAF was implying all week about the conservatives being in bed with the big TelCos and Cable companies on this ruling.

I have a feeling listening to this will just infuriate me.

Criticizing people who use their internet connections for purposes other than plain text on a video podcast? Seriously?

Spoiler

I guess it's also on OTA broadcasts, but whateves.

 

[erpg]

What infuriates me the most is that commentators are only viewing Clement's decision are politicking, and only discussing it as such. They'll mention competition, consumer, and the market off-hand, but the apparently real crux of the matter is that conservatives are bending over to prevent public outrage.

None of the guest I've seen so far actually know what's going on with the Internet in Canada, or world-wide. Worst part is, none ever venture beyond the bullet points Bell/CRTC are putting out there.

 

[YYZ]

no one on TV has come close to describing how the internet actually works and why the technical arguments are all flawed. Even the TekSavvy spokesperson didn't get into it. They're all treating bandwidth as if it's fucking oil or how easy it is to clog the tubes.

 

[JaseC]

Given your timeline, I figure we're roughly five to seven years behind you right now. But we're moving backwards at an increasing rate.

Sounds about right. 7 (well, roughly 6-and-a-half) years ago I was paying $90 a month for 1.5Mbit/256Kbit with a 10GB quota. Fortunately, all I did back then was play CS on the ISP's servers so the quota was enough. In retrospect, though, it was a huge rip-off.

 

[Zombie James]

no one on TV has come close to describing how the internet actually works and why the technical arguments are all flawed. Even the TekSavvy spokesperson didn't get into it. They're all treating bandwidth as if it's fucking oil or how easy it is to clog the tubes.

Do you have any idea how hard it is to find a good bandwidth deposit? And then once you do find an area with a good concentration of gigabytes, you'll have to dig it out, refine it (only the purest gigabytes will do), and ship it. Some of you just don't get it.

 

[firehawk12]

What infuriates me the most is that commentators are only viewing Clement's decision are politicking, and only discussing it as such. They'll mention competition, consumer, and the market off-hand, but the apparently real crux of the matter is that conservatives are bending over to prevent public outrage.

None of the guest I've seen so far actually know what's going on with the Internet in Canada, or world-wide. Worst part is, none ever venture beyond the bullet points Bell/CRTC are putting out there.

To be fair, they're more interested in the government overriding the CRTC more than the decision itself.

Of course, Coyne is a D-bag of the nth degree.

 

[Slavik81]

no one on TV has come close to describing how the internet actually works and why the technical arguments are all flawed. Even the TekSavvy spokesperson didn't get into it. They're all treating bandwidth as if it's fucking oil or how easy it is to clog the tubes.

It would make more sense to treat it like solar or wind power than oil. Those resources also have high fixed infrastructure costs but low marginal costs.

I'm curious, though, as to what technical claims you're dismissing.

 

[Grayman]

It would make more sense to treat it like solar or wind power than oil. Those resources also have high fixed infrastructure costs but low marginal costs.

I'm curious, though, as to what technical claims you're dismissing.

Also like solar and wind the power bandwidth is used or is not used at any moment. Even renewable hydroelectric power has restraints from reservoir levels while bandwidth use has no effect once it has passed.

 

[Entropia]

He's a fucktard - I was enjoying watching him get thrashed by Tony Clement last night on twitter

:lol just went though Tony Clement's twitter, good stuff.


So when will it be safe for me to cancel my internet with Bell (on a 65 GB cap atm and switch over to TekSavvy?

 

[TheRagnCajun]

I'm guessing its more or less safe already. Clement has made it clear that UBB is never happening and none of the other parties want it either.

 

[Firestorm]

CBC panel criticizes GAF users -- (our position is not popular)

Edit: video will be available later tonight.

Summary - most users subsidize 'heavy users' and the correct way to fix this is pricing internet usage.

More importantly, as a policy issue, this is dangerous as the CRTC is an independent regulator and the government stepping in to influence CRTC decisions opens up the agency to lobbyist influence as lobbyists in the future need only to influence the government and they can overturn any CRTC ruling -- basically the opposite of what Liberal GAF was implying all week about the conservatives being in bed with the big TelCos and Cable companies on this ruling.

CBC is worried because much like the CRTC, they operate at arm's length from the government. This does set a dangerous precedent.

 

[DopeyFish]

Jack Layton will be at the Toronto rally today

CBC is worried because much like the CRTC, they operate at arm's length from the government. This does set a dangerous precedent.

They're at arms length so the government doesn't have to struggle to slap them

 

[Liberty4all]

CBC panel criticizes GAF users -- (our position is not popular)

Edit: video will be available later tonight.

Summary - most users subsidize 'heavy users' and the correct way to fix this is pricing internet usage.

More importantly, as a policy issue, this is dangerous as the CRTC is an independent regulator and the government stepping in to influence CRTC decisions opens up the agency to lobbyist influence as lobbyists in the future need only to influence the government and they can overturn any CRTC ruling .

Oh yes because the CRTC is not influenced by the telco's and cable companies at all

Seriously going through the CRTC's employees linked in profile's past work history makes me sick.

 

[Anony]

anyone going to the CRTC rally today?
i sorta want to go, but it's quite a walk from uoft

 

[Kabuki Quantum Lover]

Help us hold them accountable in committee

Liberals voted to investigate UBB through a Parliamentary committee—one of the most powerful forums in Canadian government. From February 3rd through February 8th, we have the chance to question representatives from the CRTC and Minister Tony Clement on this issue. Submit your questions here and we’ll press for answers in Parliament

Please submit smart questions that make the CRTC look even worse.

 

[krae_man]

I'm guessing its more or less safe already. Clement has made it clear that UBB is never happening and none of the other parties want it either.

But, it already exists and has for almost 5 years. Everything I'm hearing is that Mr Clement doesn't want the cap business model forced on the small ISP's. That is not the same as turning back the clock and eliminating the caps or raising them to more reasonable levels.

 

[gutter_trash]

the CRTC was playing with fire on this issue,

the CRTC is supposed to protect the integrity of broadcast, news and for the people

they sided with Telecoms and raised the ire of the people..

to the point where some peopel want to abolish the CRTC... something that Harper would be happy to do

removing the CRTC would open the flood gates for FOX NEWS and Pierre-Karl Péladeau to unleash false news upon us all

Harper in P-K Peladeau want the CRTC abolished so that the Canadian version of Fox News could begin here

 

[OrangeYouGlad]

But, it already exists and has for almost 5 years. Everything I'm hearing is that Mr Clement doesn't want the cap business model forced on the small ISP's. That is not the same as turning back the clock and eliminating the caps or raising them to more reasonable levels.

At least we will continue to have the choice of Teksavvy opposed to being forced to just be paying a different name for the same service.

As much as they're gouging, it's also up to the consumer to take it upon themselves to find a better deal.

 

[YYZ]

It would make more sense to treat it like solar or wind power than oil. Those resources also have high fixed infrastructure costs but low marginal costs.

I'm curious, though, as to what technical claims you're dismissing.

Basically, everything that the chair of the CRTC said. Also, for example, the host of the CBC show that Clement was on thinks that Netflix doesn't pay to deliver its content.

Also the idea that bandwidth is getting really scarce and there's congestion.

There is no one from the independent ISPs being represented during the committee hearings or any expert witnesses on Internet or any engineers, etc.

 

[erpg]

We should encourage show hosts to bring on internet and media analysts onboard their discussion panels to counter-act the political analysts that are only talking about election potential. It'd really do a world of good to bring a little insight about the actual issues on air. Only talk I saw about it was "Herp derp, Bell says this, and that seems like sound business."

 

[Kabuki Quantum Lover]

There is no one from the independent ISPs being represented during the committee hearings or any expert witnesses on Internet or any engineers, etc.

Well, we'll have some fun next week then: Some representatives from TekSavvy (possibly other indie ISPs as well) will be in the upcoming hearings. In addition, I expect more political figures to prod the issue even further.

 

[OrangeYouGlad]

Are all of the hearings on CPAC? If so, is there a listing of times they're on?

 

[Firestorm]

Please submit smart questions that make the CRTC look even worse.

Mine:

Why does the CRTC use depletable resources in it's analogies? Internet infrastructure, like roads, only has issue with traffic all at one time. UBB is like telling people they will get charged if they drive over a certain amount of miles per month instead of improving our roads.

 

[EvilMario]

CBC is worried because much like the CRTC, they operate at arm's length from the government. This does set a dangerous precedent.

Every newspaper is running a similar segment. I'm hoping it's just Conservative bashing by Liberal media, but they're right in some regard. However, I don't really give a shit who has to save us from these crooks.

 

[Dunlop]

Mine:

Why does the CRTC use depletable resources in it's analogies? Internet infrastructure, like roads, only has issue with traffic all at one time. UBB is like telling people they will get charged if they drive over a certain amount of miles per month instead of improving our roads.

nice, mine got a little longwinded

 

[TheRagnCajun]

CBC is worried because much like the CRTC, they operate at arm's length from the government. This does set a dangerous precedent.

The government took action based on citizen/business protest. CBC should be worried since its government funded, and we the people have the right to prompt the government to take action against the CBC should the need arise.

 

[Kabuki Quantum Lover]

I asked about how Internet Protocol Television is not part of the internet. There were some other questions, but I forgot to save my txt

 

[krae_man]

Please submit smart questions that make the CRTC look even worse.

My question:

(Short form) Why are bandwidth caps staying the same or shrinking instead of growing every year? They raise my rates every year, why isn't the cap going up too? My Email inbox storage space has grown over time, why not my download cap?

 

[Presco]

:lol just went though Tony Clement's twitter, good stuff.


So when will it be safe for me to cancel my internet with Bell (on a 65 GB cap atm and switch over to TekSavvy?

I made the switch last night. Moving from Fibe TV and Internet (I'll miss Fibe TV) to TekSavvy and Shaw Digital.

If anyone wants the hook up for a crazy TV deal from Shaw, let me know by pm.

 

[EvilMario]

I asked about the cost mark up on bandwidth and both they justify over charging us these extreme amounts ($0.03 per gb after operating cost, $2.00 per gb after 25gb.. which cost $35 in the first place).

I made a little comment about how our networks are falling behind as well, while these companies rack in the money.

 

[TheRagnCajun]

The petition is over 400,000. To think it was only at about 150k when the wheels started turning.

 

[DopeyFish]

The petition is over 400,000. To think it was only at about 150k when the wheels started turning.

When the UBB ruling hit... It was at about 30,000 (this was last week)

 

[Dunlop]

someone linked this on the digitalhome forums, pretty funny

 

[Kinitari]

Has Bell or the CRTC come out and given any hard numbers on costs? I figure if they want to make a strong argument, that's the way to do it

"For every gig used, it costs us 50c!" Or something like that. 200gb/month users cost them 100 dollars!

 

[EvilMario]

Has Bell or the CRTC come out and given any hard numbers on costs? I figure if they want to make a strong argument, that's the way to do it

"For every gig used, it costs us 50c!" Or something like that. 200gb/month users cost them 100 dollars!

I believe a lot of people, like myself, are referencing this, although others have broken it down to a similar number; http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...ir-price-for-internet-service/article1890596/

Of course, the 6000%+ markup is still nothing compared to wireless carriers.

 

[Zombie James]

Has Bell or the CRTC come out and given any hard numbers on costs? I figure if they want to make a strong argument, that's the way to do it

"For every gig used, it costs us 50c!" Or something like that. 200gb/month users cost them 100 dollars!

IIRC, every time Bell or Rogers are asked they refuse to answer on the grounds of "trade secrets" so the CRTC just believes whatever they tell them.

 

[dem]

25gb is just laughably small
A steam sale would put you over that limit alone.

 

[Zombie James]

Live chat with a Teksavvy rep at 1pm: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...l-isp-reacts-to-crtc-reversal/article1894318/

 

[faust666]

Mine:

Why does the CRTC use depletable resources in it's analogies? Internet infrastructure, like roads, only has issue with traffic all at one time. UBB is like telling people they will get charged if they drive over a certain amount of miles per month instead of improving our roads.

So you'd rather they compare it to the UBB model of the 407 which to my knowledge doesn't offer an "all you can drive" package?

 

[YYZ]

Well, we'll have some fun next week then: Some representatives from TekSavvy (possibly other indie ISPs as well) will be in the upcoming hearings. In addition, I expect more political figures to prod the issue even further.

That's good to hear. The technical details can be boring, but the whole case can and should turn on them. I've heard patent cases and they go into such excruciating detail about how something works, but they're among the most important details (besides times).

 

[Shambles]

Please submit smart questions that make the CRTC look even worse.

I submitted a question regarding the treatment of off-site backup services like dropbox or carbonite. Good luck backing up entire sections of hard drives under a regime like they are proposing.

 

[DopeyFish]

http://twitpic.com/3wggoj

Jack Layton / crowd shot @ rally

 

[TheExodu5]

Jack Layton was shot? D:

Spoiler

har har

 

[krae_man]

Got my question answered on the teksavvy chat.