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[Commanche Raisin Toast]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X86-64

Since AMD64 and Intel 64 are substantially similar, many software and hardware products use one vendor-neutral term to indicate their compatibility with both implementations. AMD's original designation for this processor architecture, "x86-64", is still sometimes used for this purpose,[4] as is the variant "x86_64".[5][6] Other companies, such as Microsoft[8] and Sun Microsystems/Oracle Corporation,[7] use the contraction "x64" in marketing material.

unless you have certain types of server processors, if you have something that's intel or amd in your home PC right now it's an x86-x64 CPU that can run 32bit or 64bit versions of Windows, and is compatible with x86 instruction sets (as well as x64 so long as you're using a 64bit OS).

 

[gofreak]

16 threads is really nice.

My CPU is finally going to be used decently.

Not sure where people are getting that from. It's one thread per core, 8 cores.

 

[Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew]

general consensus is all over the place

2 camps:

1. Orbis > Durango >>>WiiU

2. Orbis = Duragno

I think more people are in camp 1 than camp 2

More like Orbis > Durango > Orbis > Durango > WiiU.

 

[open_mouth_]

Microsoft is truly trying to create the all-in one media box of the future. It's a big gamble, but they'll make a compelling case IMO.

-Xbox Gaming
-XBLA and downloadable gaming
-Surface/Ipad/Iphone/etc. Smartglass Integration
-Blu-ray Movie playback
-DVR/Cable Integration (seamless) w/ Twitter/Facebook/Skype overlay
-IPTV capability (seamless)
-Video/Music Marketplace Integration
-Kinect integration (voice/gesture control everything + physical universal remote)
-Bing search built-in for internet and content/game searches and launching

 

[shinra-bansho]

There are only 8 threads.

I was wondering if I was going crazy, since I couldn't find where multiple people were reading 16...

 

[JonathanPower]

"Why go first, when your competitors can look at your specifications and come up with something better?"

LOL, Hirai has spoken.

 

[thuway]

Hey guys, remember when thuway posted this:

32 MB is 100% correct . I'll throw in one more:

102 GB/S

 

[Globox_82]

This is why I hate the fact the the PS3 wasn't a monster success. Companies now more then ever play for safe which is a shame.
No more strange architectures from Sony...

why would you want strage architecture from Sony? What benefit did they have from it? Horrible to work cpu and average gpu? People give too much credit to CELL, and not to ND, SSM, GG and talented devs, combined with massive budget that first party gets.

Sony would have done so much better if there was no cell. if they had standrad CPU like 360 and invested ridiculous RND that CELL had into stronger GPU.

 

[Psychotext]

Looks as though Wii U will definately be getting next-gen ports with these disgustingly pathetic specs.

lol, your posts are hilarious. Keep them coming. I'm really looking forward to seeing more of you in the system wars style threads we'll see around release.

 

[mrklaw]

Any framebuffer depending on resolution uses a specific amount of memory, if there are 32MB of eDRAM we know for sure you can't use more than that, thus limiting deferred rendering.

of course you'll still have lots of deferred engines. MS being the 'king of tools and 3rd party hugs' wouldn't make a machine that forces developers to change their rendering systems.

Most likely the move chip comes in here, moving buffers out into main ram during quiet periods, so the esram can be used by the GPU for the next pass etc.

and we still had deferred engines this gen with 10mb edram on the 360 - this is 3x more so may just about be enough for 1080p anyway.

 

[Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew]

Microsoft is truly trying to create the all-in one media box of the future. It's a big gamble, but they'll make a compelling case IMO.

-Xbox Gaming
-XBLA and downloadable gaming
-Surface/Ipad/Iphone/etc. Smartglass Integration
-Blu-ray Movie playback
-DVR/Cable Integration (seamless) w/ Twitter/Facebook/Skype overlay
-IPTV capability (seamless)
-Video/Music Marketplace Integration
-Kinect integration (voice/gesture control everything + physical universal remote)
-Bing search built-in for internet and content/game searches and launching

Yep. It's going to be interesting to see what Orbis has and if the system block diagram will reveal anything like how HDMI In did for Durango.

 

[x-Lundz-x]

the better system is the one that has better developement tools(microsoft has been better in this respect). that will become the lead platform for developement and the ideal choice for multiplatform games. simple as that.

I think it depends on which system most people play Call of Duty on, which is Xbox.

 

[i-Lo]

Only power-wize. Both architectures will enable much easier creation of games [especially multi-platform ones].

 

[Eideka]

There are only 8 threads.

Oh, I read wrong then.

Well, 8 threads is not that bad. My 3770K is not completely outdated yet.

 

[Hana-Bi]

Pathetic specs, disappointing "secret sauce".

Hell, it even looks as though Orbis will have a better secret sauce with its compute module.

Durango won't be much more than a cable box with Kinect packed in. Not a game console, but a tv tuner.

Respect to stevie for predicting all this.

Yeah man, we know that now. Why are you posting this crap like thousands of times in Durango rumour threads?

 

[Persona86]

Damn new generation of console wars.

 

[pixlexic]

Not sure where people are getting that from. It's one thread per core, 8 cores.

I see a lot of people here have 2010 hardware mind sets. Things have changed people.

 

[MikeE21286]

More like Orbis > Durango > Orbis > Durango > WiiU.

This...this is the correct equation.

Now how does it all equate to DBZ.

 

[Jadedx]

I never stated how much. However, if Kinect is to be included in every system (speculation on my part) plus all of these super cool features that everyone else is speculating on, it will take up a sizable amount of ram. I'm thinking about 2 gigs minimum.

No, just no. Kinect 2.0 will not need to user more ram than the total amount the 360 had. 1.5 gb will be the max amount of ram the OS.

 

[Chuck Norris]

the better system is the one that has better developement tools(microsoft has been better in this respect). that will become the lead platform for developement and the ideal choice for multiplatform games. simple as that.

Yeah, not really simple as that at all

 

[GHG]

Not sure where people are getting that from. It's one thread per core, 8 cores.

Confusing these two:

- each core has one fully independent hardware thread with no shared execution resources

- each hardware thread can issue two instructions per clock

I'm guilty of it as well from when I scanned through the specs the 1st time round!

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

My fault with 16 threads guy's.........sorry! I mixed up two instructions per clock with threads.

 

[Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew]

 

[PapaJustify]

Not sure where people are getting that from. It's one thread per core, 8 cores.

Virtual Threads

 

[Gemüsepizza]

It doesn't really matter whether it's easy or not. They won't do that (on purpose) because it will affect software sales when another version is noticeably better than the other.

3rd party will definitely scale down to the lesser specs, whichever it ends up being. And for this reason I seriously doubt there is going to be more than 5% difference in performance between the 2 systems because the more powerful one would have a lot of "wasted" power (= wasted money) for anything not 1st party title.

Wat. Why? I don't think a publisher cares if they sell 600k on Xbox 3/600k on PS4 or 300k on Xbox 3 and 900k on PS4... Just look at what happened during the PS2/GC/Xbox generation.

 

[GlamFM]

Pathetic specs, disappointing "secret sauce".

Hell, it even looks as though Orbis will have a better secret sauce with its compute module.

Durango won't be much more than a cable box with Kinect packed in. Not a game console, but a tv tuner.

Respect to stevie for predicting all this.

Forever junior.

 

[Psychotext]

So have Sony and Microsoft really gone for exactly the same CPU? No customisations whatsoever?

 

[Dzidza1978]

Durango: 8 GB DDR3 @70 GB/s + 32mb Esram @102 GB/s (Combined 170 GB/s using 32mb Esram).

Can somebody explain me how it can be 170GB/sec combined, when at the best ddr can give 70GB/sec????
I am noob so sorry for this question.

 

[AuthenticM]

Both the CPU and GPU seem very similar if not identical to the PS4's. So, the deciding factor in knowing which is more powerful is the RAM ?

 

[shinobi602]

This doesn't make sense.

 

[sangreal]

not blown away, but lines up with every other leak. I see they're confirming Kinect included though

So have Sony and Microsoft really gone for exactly the same CPU? No customisations whatsoever?

this is the strangest part

 

[Baki]

Does these leaks means Sony will delay an announcement until after MS has announced?

 

[TheOddOne]

The extra silicon on the next Xbox will be dedicated to freeing up resources for the GPU. You can expect things like MSAA, certain situations in lighting, AO, etc. to be completely free. I've heard rumors that the machine is designed to where exploiting 100% of the hardware will be very simple. Something I have not heard on Orbis. Than again, I never heard of any such Orbis special sauce either.

Sony on the other hand is using a brute force method. I have zero idea which will win, and if any one is a dev on this board or programmer, we want to hear what you have to say.

Microsoft's specs on paper suggest a smaller profile, thinner unit, and a lighter BoM. This is certain.

You have nothing to worry about. This machine was designed by the people who made Direct X. They chose hardware for very specific reasons. You will see in the few months ahead why.

AND- cut the shit that it is weaker. It is comparable, and has a different skill set. It is like asking a Japanese Chef and an Italian Chef to make a Burrito using what is in their own kitchen. It's not apples to apples.

Ok.

 

[Persona86]

This doesn't make sense.

I think he's suggesting WiiU is last gen.

 

[quest]

16 threads is really nice.

My CPU is finally going to be used decently.

It is not 16 threads. This is what the article was talking about.

http://semiaccurate.com/2012/08/28/amd-let-the-new-cat-out-of-the-bag-with-the-jaguar-core/


Luckily for coders, Jaguar has two ALU pipelines to process those instructions on the integer side, so no bottle-necking here. The Int unit also has a Load Address Generation Unit (LAGU) as well as an independent Store AGU (SAGU). This is exactly the same as Bobcat, the differences are in how each unit executes those instructions. Of these optimizations the most comprehensive is the divide unit, it is more or less lifted from Llano.

This allows Jaguar to speed up that instruction from one bit processed per clock to two, a huge increase if you have divide heavy code

 

[Blades64]

I don't know anything about tech and whatnot. My question is while PS4/Durante games will be at 1080p (60fps?) will it be possible to downport to Wii U at 720p (30fps?)?

 

[i-Lo]

Yeah man, we know that now. Why are you posting this crap like thousands of times in Durango rumour threads?

Because he got tired of berating playstation ogg fourbis. He is angry right now. I guess, even I'm a bit disappointed. Let's just hope these specs can produce results that are greater than the sum of its parts.

This doesn't make sense.

It's more about berating the WiiU

 

[Pagusas]

My point was that while the brand is not listed, that x86 is associated with Intel and that x64 with AMD. There were rumors of an Intel CPU.

x64 isn't associated with AMD at all. All modern processors in desktop/laptop PC's are x64.

You may be thinking LONG ago when when AMD called one of there lines the AMD 64, then 64 x2, but that was just a product line, had nothing to do with the standard.

 

[Audioboxer]

Does these leaks means Sony will delay an announcement until after MS has announced?

Won't really matter, specs will leak anyway. Well of course only an announcement can confirm 100% what the specs are, but Orbis development kits are out there and people are clearly happy to leak info.

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

So have Sony and Microsoft really gone for exactly the same CPU? No customisations whatsoever?

Orbis is supposed to have a CU module from the GPU inside the CPU plus other secret sauce.

 

[SlickShoesRUCrazy]

Sounds like a mediocre jump after 8 years...though my tech knowledge is rather basic.

 

[BlackJace]

This doesn't make sense.

"Current gen console" and all that shit.

 

[Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew]

This...this is the correct equation.

Now how does it all equate to DBZ.

Not sure, but I'll compare it to Fist of the North Star.

WiiU = Jagi
Durango = Kenshiro
Orbis = Raoh

 

[PapaJustify]

not blown away, but lines up with every other leak. I see they're confirming Kinect included though

Hmm, were people really expecting a 1000$ supercomputer?

 

[Zen]

the better system is the one that has better developement tools(microsoft has been better in this respect). that will become the lead platform for developement and the ideal choice for multiplatform games. simple as that.

Not at all. The development tools gap between Microsoft and Sony wouldn't be anywhere near enough to do what you're saying. This isn't the PS3 days that required learning a totally new style of programming because of the CPU architecture, both are very very close, as will be toolsets (not that it will make much of a difference with machines like these that are so friendly).

The biggest advantage Microsoft has and will have is the incubation of customers with Xbox live, and that the machines will still be relatively close in power. Not toolsets.

 

[Derrick01]

"Why go first, when your competitors can look at your specifications and come up with something better?"

LOL, Hirai has spoken.

He was talking about unveiling the systems, not launching.

 

[pestul]

I don't know anything about tech and whatnot. My question is while PS4/Durante games will be at 1080p (60fps?) will it be possible to downport to Wii U at 720p (30fps?)?

Probably, but if they start designing huge games that like 3+GB of memory.. it's going to be really f'ing hard.

 

[Elios83]

Microsoft is truly trying to create the all-in one media box of the future. It's a big gamble, but they'll make a compelling case IMO.

-Xbox Gaming
-XBLA and downloadable gaming
-Surface/Ipad/Iphone/etc. Smartglass Integration
-Blu-ray Movie playback
-DVR/Cable Integration (seamless) w/ Twitter/Facebook/Skype overlay
-IPTV capability (seamless)
-Video/Music Marketplace Integration
-Kinect integration (voice/gesture control everything + physical universal remote)
-Bing search built-in for internet and content/game searches and launching

I wouldn't bet on Blu Ray playback.
Of course they must be using the blu laser technology to have more space for games, but I'm not sure that they're going to pay royalties to the BDA to be a Blu Ray movie player as well.
They could use the same strategy they used with the original Xbox, "if you want DVD playback you have to buy the remote controller which enables it".
Or they could simply say that there is no blu ray playback at all because HD movies can be donwloaded through their own service.

 

[Hana-Bi]

not blown away, but lines up with every other leak. I see they're confirming Kinect included though



this is the strangest part

Or just summing up those old "leaks" from seven months ago.

 

[mrklaw]

Microsoft is truly trying to create the all-in one media box of the future. It's a big gamble, but they'll make a compelling case IMO.

-Xbox Gaming
-XBLA and downloadable gaming
-Surface/Ipad/Iphone/etc. Smartglass Integration
-Blu-ray Movie playback
-DVR/Cable Integration (seamless) w/ Twitter/Facebook/Skype overlay
-IPTV capability (seamless)
-Video/Music Marketplace Integration
-Kinect integration (voice/gesture control everything + physical universal remote)
-Bing search built-in for internet and content/game searches and launching

other than the DVR integration (and that is something that Nintendo is trying), I don't see anything particularly unique

- everyone has retail games
- everyone has downloadable games
- Sony has vita cross play or cross controller; Nintendo have announced they'll bring miiverse to tablets and PC. Sony will hopefully bring remoteplay to PS4 for vita at least (tablets or PC possible too)
- Sony already had bluray playback for 7+ years
- IPTV is doable by both Sony and Nintendo. Both already have on demand services like Netflix and could add linear IPTV
- Kinect is MS' gimmick, Sony has eyetoy/move, Nintendo has the gamepad. None are proven IMO