been living under a rock I presume?
No. I just don't think that Valve can do it. They aren't a company like Apple. They might have quite a few guys like Wozniak. But what they need is guys like Steve Jobs. They also don't understand the market. People don't care about Linux like they do. People care about comfort. They care about the latest tech. They want all their games to run. Windows already does that. Linux is a solution to a problem which gamers simply don't have. This problem only exists in the heads of a few idealists.
Besides that, D3D has always been proprietary and has always introduced a dependency on Windows. I would think that is common sense that the games industry would want to avoid any dependency on a proprietary system, maintained by a company that has been investigated by the US DOJ for anticompetitive behaviour and has consistently demonstrated incompetence in both management and software development
The game industry does not care about this "dependancy on a proprietary system", because it does not affect them negatively. Again, this is a problem that only exists in the heads of some idealists. This is not a real problem for developers. Companies like EA, Ubisoft or Activision don't have any problems with Windows being what it is.
Gemüsepizza, you really are something else, huh!
Guess what: DX12 and Windows 10 is NOT the only thing that matters.
I did not say that it is the only thing that matters. It is the only thing that matters for AAA development in the future.
Let me tell you why.
First: Vulkan IS compatible with Win10.
So you have two choices, basically.
One: develop for Win10 and Win10 only
Two: develop for everything, targeting Vulkan - which includes Win10 as well.
Companies that develop AAA titles will offer a DX11 and DX12 rendering path for a transitional period. After that, they will switch to DX12. Their engines already support DX11. This is not a problem.
At that point, it does not matter where the AAA devs flock, because there *IS* a market for non-aa products, indie games and a tons more in between.
I never said there wasn't.
Therefore, it makes MORE sense to support Vulkan in the long term than to lock yourself to a single api.
Like I said above, the big companies do not have a problem with locking themselves to a single API for their AAA titles. They have been doing this for over a decade.
At this point, this is like arguing for focusing on Swift because iOS is what matters only in mobile gaming (right? right? eh), so who cares whether other platforms are able to run your code or not...
This is a silly comparison. I was arguing that Windows/DX12 will be the future of AAA development. Swift is neither the present or the future of all mobile gaming, because it's only on iOS, and the market is split between iOS and Android. There is no such split in the PC market. Windows dominates everything. Linux doesn't have anywhere near the relevance for PC gamers like Android has for mobile gamers.
Maintaining DX11 and DX12 means maintaining two rendering paths which are fundamentally different in their approach.
Instead, simply maintaining one Vulkan path for compatibility with all relevant versions of WIndows and alternative OSes is much easier and less costly.
Really, did Vulkan piss on your pizza?
They only have to do this for a transitional period for select titles, and all major graphic engines already support DX11. They only have to add DX12 support, so the costs won't be high. I also don't think game devs want to trade in the comfort of DirectX regarding things like documentation. And like I said, alternative OSes are irrelevant when it comes to AAA gaming.
Really, did Vulkan piss on your pizza?
/* microsoft faboy gibberish */
same rock I presume?
Grow up guys.
So the usual "nothing will change, why bother" horseshit? Which has already been proven false by Microsoft's reaction to Mantle/Vulkan. Just the threat of a viable competitor has given us a DX12 comprised of largely the same features in short order. Any work done to compete with entrenched proprietary API via open source should be encouraged, it benefits literally every developer and end user. There is plenty of room for Linux/Vulkan to grow in the entertainment/living room PC space, since Microsoft have botched those initiatives at every turn, which drove them to Xbox in the first place.
And devs will welcome DX12 with open arms.
But please, give us some good reasons for Khronos group members to just bend over and say "yeah, we should probably just keep tying our business to the whims of an anticompetitive company that is willing to lock their proprietary API to whichever operating system they're trying to push". As if that's good for them or their customers.
Again, show me how this affects companies like EA, Ubisoft, ... negatively. It doesn't. They don't care about that stuff,
Unknown Soldier: what you do not seem to realize is that you will NOT be able to distinguish a Vulkan-ran game on Win10 and a DX12-ran game on Win10.
Therefore, the fact that linux is now a possibility without extra effort is just a bonus (although rationally thinking, even if a > (b+c+d), a+b+c+d is STILL > a. That is just rationality.
Supporting Vulkan does not mean mandatory linux installations. It means linux support becomes "default" alongside Win, which is INSANELY good.
But it doesn't. Just because a game will use Vulkan, doesn't mean it will run automatically on Linux "without extra effort".
If you buy a pre-built SteamOS box, then connecting it to your TV and playing supported games on it is as easy as doing the same thing on a console. And with Vulkan, you should be able to actually enjoy competitive performance in large-scale games.
Right, "supported games". With Windows you do not have to care about "supported games". Everything just works. And you get the best performance. There is no reason for consumers to switch to SteamOS. Like I said, SteamOS is a solution to a problem which only exists in the head of some nerdy, idealistic engineers. Those guys might be willing to put up with the limitations of SteamOS. Gamers aren't.
But more importantly, as a developer you can target all versions of Windows with Vulkan, rather than just Windows 10.
Developers can already do that with their existing engines which support DX9/DX11.
Actually, yes. Go download the latest Ubuntu. A few clicks and you have a full operating system with a functional "app store" anyone can search directly to add games to their system.
Hell, you don't even need to actually install Ubuntu to try it anymore. You just liveboot right off the USB stick, and when you're ready to make the install permanent, you can just install as-is onto the hard drive.
What an absurd statement. Ubuntu is certainly *not* easier to install, configure and play games on than Windows. Windows is a vastly superior platform which is easy to use, mature and stable, offers high performance and support for every imaginable software.
Yup. Linux has come a long way. For a typical user it's actually simpler than windows because it's "closer" to smartphones with appstores (in distros like Ubuntu). Linux gets complicated if something goes wrong and you have to deal with the terminal. But the community and troubleshooting is the best out there. So even that is a lot easier than in the past.
Troubleshooting is a pain in the ass with Linux because of the incredibly fragmented market, the poor support from GPU vendors, game companies and the not user friendly design of virtually all distros. It is just a fact that Windows is superior in almost every way. This is not fanboy-ish. It's simply reality. Windows is the best option for gaming right now.
Stockholm syndrome, or capture-bonding, is a psychological phenomenon in which hostages express empathy and sympathy and have positive feelings toward their captors, sometimes to the point of defending and identifying with the captors. These feelings are generally considered irrational in light of the danger or risk endured by the victims, who essentially mistake a lack of abuse from their captors for an act of kindness.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stockholm_syndrome
First you insult people as Microsoft fanboys, now this. I am not a Microsoft fan. I am not defending Microsoft. I am just describing the reality. What some are doing here is wishful thinking. And if you point that out to them, the become aggressive and insult you.
That is a picture of the Khronos group, which EA has been a part of, and the companies supporting Vulkan. EA's logo is right there.
Just because they are a member of the Khronos group, which many have been for years because of OpenGL, doesn't mean that all their future products will use Vulkan.
That makes no sense. Windows is compatible with older version of DX, but DX is not compatible with older versions of Windows. I can run D3D9 on Windows 10, but I can't run D3D12 on Windows Vista.
People who still use Windows Vista aren't interested in products which use DX12.
Between a Linux distro, creating hardware for the first time, a new graphics API... yeah I'm pretty sure that all counts as "serious efforts"
You need to calm down
Everyone can "create" a Linux distro. They did not "create" hardware. They did not "create" a new graphics API. Valve's problem is that they are viewing this too much from a nerd perspective. Normal users just aren't interested in Steam machines, why should they? To save a few bucks? They buy Windows machines instead. Steam machines only sound cool to nerds.
I think you are very clearly wrong when you're saying that developers will not support Linux. There is a lot of evidence out there that suggests otherwise. Right now Linux is used by so ething like 1% of Steam users, right? Valve released SteamOS, they are working on a new engine and they are pushing a new cross-platform API, but all of the above aren't anything more than baby steps. Right?
So, the fact that as of right now there are 1727 Linux games on Steam is amazing. With very little effort so far Valve has managed to convince tons of developers to port their games to Linux, surprisngly including some very big names. Dying Light, Alien Isolation, Shadows of Mordor, Borderlands series, Grid Autosport, Civilization V, Bioshock Infinite, XCom, Witcher 2, The Metro series, Dead Island. More are coming, Capcom just recently announced that Street Fighter V will be coming to Linux.
Those are old ass games. Nobody cares about those, that's not how you convince gamers. You need same day releases with the Windows version at the very least so that people would even think about considering them. But you won't get those, because devs do not have a problem with Windows. And you won't get gamers to choose the Linux version of a game, because they don't have a problem with Windows. Again, the only people who have a problem with Windows and DX12 are some idealistic nerds. But that's not enough for Linux and Vulkan to succed in the AAA gaming market.
It's one of the reasons why Linux is so widely used for networking (routers, proxies, DNS servers). Even Microsoft have created their own Linux distribution for networking in Azure.
Here's one example, you could probably find a few more by searching:
http://www.slideshare.net/Principle...rise-linux-6-vs-microsoft-windows-server-2012
I don't think it's anything controversial, just one of the key things Linux was made and optimized for.
And this is relevant for gaming how?
