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[Chairman Yang]

I've heard the term a lot, but I'm still not sure exactly what it means. When people say Mass Effect or Alpha Protocol have bad gunplay, or that Uncharted 2 or Halo Reach have good gunplay, for example, are they referring to the controls? The feel and sounds of the weapons? The absence or presence of various small glitches? Or something else?

 

[the_painted_bird]

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&client=safari&rls=en&q=define+gunplay&btnG=Search

 

[Prophet Steve]

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&client=safari&rls=en&q=define+gunplay&btnG=Search

You do know that is utterly useless right?

 

[Sophia]

"Gunplay is a general term for the discharge or exchange of gunfire."

So yeah, they're basically referring to the feel of the weapon. How it controls, how it shoots, if it feels "meaty" enough, and so fourth and so fourth.

Uncharted 2 has some fantastic gunplay as anyone who's ever fired the Pistole can attest to.

 

[EatChildren]

The culminating feel of the design and presentation of shooting weapons in videogames. Its how they control, how they are animated, their impact effects, their damage values, the way enemies react to shots as well as avoiding shots, etc.

Gunplay is how the guns play. Bad gunplay usually involves weapons that feel weak, controls that are unresponsive, a lack of style and identity to weapon models and effects, and damage values are broken, plus other things.

 

[DaBuddaDa]

It's a bullshit and arbitrary made up journalist term meaning "how much a particular shooter feels like Call of Duty."

The culminating feel of the design and presentation of shooting weapons in videogames. Its how they control, how they are animated, their impact effects, their damage values, the way enemies react to shots as well as avoiding shots, etc.

If only people actually used the term to mean exactly that. And still, it's completely subjective.

 

[the_painted_bird]

You do know that is utterly useless right?

For someone who's not sure exactly what it means (OP) it's not. (?) :lol

 

[Alex Connolly]

I suppose it's a multi-faceted concept. The simulated response of triggering a weapon - sound, visual cues and immediacy - the simulated action of the projectile and the reaction of the target. Tie in the physics of the player character, as well as the physics outside of the player character, and for lack of a better word, it seems to end up having either a good feel - the right mix of these things - or a bad one, whereby something just isn't right.

But it's all rather subjective on what's good or acceptable, bad or unbalanced. And very much weapon-dependent, too.

 

[Prophet Steve]

For someone who's not sure exactly what it means (OP) it's not. (?) :lol

So you think this is an appropriate answer for the OP?

a fight involving shooting small arms with the intent to kill or frighten

It still does not define when it is good or bad.

 

[perryfarrell]

The first Far Cry had some great gunplay

 

[Chinner]

playing with guns, next.

 

[the_painted_bird]

It still does not define when it is good or bad.

Didn't know the OP cared :lol

 

[I <3 Memes]

I've heard the term a lot, but I'm still not sure exactly what it means. When people say Mass Effect or Alpha Protocol have bad gunplay, or that Uncharted 2 or Halo Reach have good gunplay, for example, are they referring to the controls? The feel and sounds of the weapons? The absence or presence of various small glitches? Or something else?

If you cant tell the difference on your own between how shooting a gun feels in a Mass Effect game and a Call of Duty game then I dont know what to say. Does jumping feel the same for you in Oblivion as it does in a Mario game? Does running in Dead Space feel the same to you as running in a Sonic game? Good grief.

 

[BobsRevenge]

The first Far Cry had some great gunplay

I'm going to go ahead and strongly disagree with this one. They felt oddly light in that game. Now, FEAR... that's a game with class gunplay. It doesn't really get any better than FEAR.

Also: Id games.

 

[tiff]

I always just thought it meant whether or not the act of shooting people was fun.

So, like, Mass Effect's combat was awful so it had bad gunplay, and Halo has good gunplay because it controls well for a console shooter and killing aliens is fun.

 

[Shnookums]

The quality of the part of the game that involves shooting guns.

 

[JB1981]

playing with guns, next.

:lol

 

[EatChildren]

It think it is subjective to a point, but I also believe are there are certain factors that can be used to argue that a game has good gunplay. Vanquish, for example. I can see how maybe the game's play style is not to someone's taste (even if it means they have bad taste ), but I would argue that the game's gunplay is objectively high quality. Controls are buttery smooth and responsive, damage and ammunition values are finely balanced, and the visual and audio presentation of all the weapons and their effects are of high quality.

Subjectively, Vanquish has gunplay that may not appeal to everyone. Objectively, Vanquish has high quality design and presentation present in its gunplay. Therefore one could easy state that Vanquish has great gunplay.

 

[Sophia]

Now, FEAR... that's a game with class gunplay. It doesn't really get any better than FEAR.

No game has really outmatched FEAR's gunplay. It's just that amazing. Uncharted 2 comes close.

 

[tass0]

The feeling, animation and detail of firing your gun. For me, anyway.

Rxample of good gunplay: Magnum and Pulse Rifle in HL2

 

[the_painted_bird]

The quality of the part of the game that involves shooting guns.

Buut... it's not the quality. It's just the part of the game that involves shooting guns.

Applying the term 'gunplay' to games does not immediately bring to mind the quality, IMO. Simply being an entity with a gun and being able to fire it off at objects, other players, the environment around you, et cetera- would be. The balance of the gameplay is something different, I think.

 

[JB1981]

No game has really outmatched FEAR's gunplay. It's just that amazing. Uncharted 2 comes close.

For TPS I prefer Gears.

 

[Sophia]

For TPS I prefer Gears.

I dunno, Gears has pretty good gunplay, but I can never get past the fact that every enemy in Gears can take about two cliploads of bullets before going down. :lol

 

[BobsRevenge]

No game has really outmatched FEAR's gunplay. It's just that amazing. Uncharted 2 comes close.

I dunno, Uncharted 2 feels great but it is hard to compare to FEAR. The styles are very different. FEAR is all about impacts. Like, the way the gun sounds when fired, the way dudes react, and the way the environment reacts. You get ridiculous parallax bullet impacts, bodies falling apart, blood and debris flying everywhere, and all in slow motion. Uncharted 2 is much more direct.

 

[Graphics Horse]

If you cant tell the difference on your own between how shooting a gun feels in a Mass Effect game and a Call of Duty game then I dont know what to say. Does jumping feel the same for you in Oblivion as it does in a Mario game? Does running in Dead Space feel the same to you as running in a Sonic game? Good grief.

Obviously not, Mario and Sonic clearly have better jumpplay and runplay.

Gun-play was a term used in describing John Woo films and the like, it got highjacked by games somehow, possibly it was around the time of Max Payne and was misused ever since.

 

[Wallach]

I'm going to go ahead and strongly disagree with this one. They felt oddly light in that game. Now, FEAR... that's a game with class gunplay. It doesn't really get any better than FEAR.

Also: Id games.

I'd consider Crysis in the same tier. Two of the only games to ever make me say things like "WABADOOSH" as I shot people point blank with a shotgun. :lol

 

[Rikyfree]

KZ2 had orgasmic gunplay

 

[tiff]

I dunno, Gears has pretty good gunplay, but I can never get past the fact that every enemy in Gears can take about two cliploads of bullets before going down. :lol

Uncharted 2 enemies weren't exactly one-shot kills either.

 

[Raiden]

No game has really outmatched FEAR's gunplay. It's just that amazing. Uncharted 2 comes close.

I sure hope so, i am playing Uncharted 1 right now and the "gunplay" really blows, also the way the guys die is a joke. Still fun game though, but im hoping the 2nd is better.


/derail

 

[EatChildren]

Subjectively, I have no idea how people can even mention Uncharted 2 in the realm of FEAR. Uncharted 2's was good, but FEAR and many other games were, in my opinion, leagues ahead.

But now we're getting into a debate of personal enjoyment.

 

[Sophia]

Uncharted 2 enemies weren't exactly one-shot kills either.

They still die faster then the BOOLET SPONGE enemies in Gears. x_X

 

[Curufinwe]

I still love RE 4's gunplay. Everything feels great.

 

[BobsRevenge]

I'd consider Crysis in the same tier. Two of the only games to ever make me say things like "WABADOOSH" as I shot people point blank with a shotgun. :lol

Crysis's shotgun is insane. Probably my favorite outside of an Id game.

I personally LOVE Quake 2's gunplay. The weapons sound great, enemies have good reactions (especially for the time), and there are a decent amount of particle effects. It also has gibs, and gibs always help. The super shotgun in Quake 2 is really in its own league. The thing feels like a cannon.

 

[I <3 Memes]

I'm going to go ahead and strongly disagree with this one. They felt oddly light in that game. Now, FEAR... that's a game with class gunplay. It doesn't really get any better than FEAR.

Also: Id games.

If you have FarCry 1 around give it another play. 10 seconds after I got the M4 confirmed what I already suspected when I got the Deagle. Crytek were big fans of Counter-Strike and modeled their gunplay after it. The Deagle, the M4 Colt, the P90, the AWP, they are all there.

 

[Zenith]

Gunplay is how guns feel, how enemies react when being shot.

e.g, weapon with no recoil that does not seem to do any damage to the enemy you're firing it is bad gunplay. Guns that seem to have heft and weight to them with realistic reactions from enemies is good gunplay. I hear a lot of people consider Killzone 2 to be the latter. In Clive Barker's Jericho, most of the guns are definitely the former.

edit: what post #5 said.

 

[akachan ningen]

 

[DaBuddaDa]

Subjectively, I have no idea how people can even mention Uncharted 2 in the realm of FEAR. Uncharted 2's was good, but FEAR and many other games were, in my opinion, leagues ahead.

But now we're getting into a debate of personal enjoyment.

And thus we see how qualifying "gunplay" on a good-to-bad scale is utterly pointless. The word is meaningless and made up by journalists to make themselves sound better without actually saying anything of substance. You can discuss hit detection, you can discuss the sound design or modeling or texturing of the weapons, but wrapping all of it up in the word "gunplay" is meaningless prattle.

The whole concept of "gunplay" was never a consideration or focus in the past; it has propped up within the past ~5 years to try to make a differentiation between games in a extremely homogeneous genre.

 

[Prine]

The mechanics of fighting in which you only use your gun. That includes (most importantly) feedback from enemies (AI), the visceral thrill of taking an object down (weapons), using slight hints to juggle multiple strategies from the moment you engage your opponent (dynamism with combat). Id say just like VF has a system that is dynamic for fighting, gunplay would be the same but with bullets rather than limbs.

Good gunplay = great game.

 

[Yeef]

Uncharted 2 enemies weren't exactly one-shot kills either.

They were if you shot them in the face. Even the armored dudes went down in two or three shots from most guns if you got headshots.

 

[BobsRevenge]

Subjectively, I have no idea how people can even mention Uncharted 2 in the realm of FEAR. Uncharted 2's was good, but FEAR and many other games were, in my opinion, leagues ahead.

But now we're getting into a debate of personal enjoyment.

What props Uncharted 2 up is the great feel of running around and getting in close range shotgun attacks without using the aim function. It feels great. And aiming and crap is no slouch. Its certainly not as juicy as FEAR, but its extremely polished and feels well thought through as a whole.

 

[Raiden]

They still die faster then the BOOLET SPONGE enemies in Gears. x_X

Well the enemies in Gears arent exactly human either, but i get your point.

 

[Veins]

It's when you "play" with your "gun".

 

[Durante]

Great thread, I also never understood this.

And thus we see how qualifying "gunplay" on a good-to-bad scale is utterly pointless. The word is meaningless and made up by journalists to make themselves sound better without actually saying anything of substance. You can discuss hit detection, you can discuss the sound design or modeling or texturing of the weapons, but wrapping all of it up in the word "gunplay" is meaningless prattle.

That's pretty much what I assumed.

 

[BobsRevenge]

And thus we see how qualifying "gunplay" on a good-to-bad scale is utterly pointless. The word is meaningless and made up by journalists to make themselves sound better without actually saying anything of substance. You can discuss hit detection, you can discuss the sound design or modeling or texturing of the weapons, but wrapping all of it up in the word "gunplay" is meaningless prattle.

The whole concept of "gunplay" was never a consideration or focus in the past; it has propped up within the past ~5 years to try to make a differentiation between games in a extremely homogeneous genre.

This feels more like the ramblings of a hater than an argument with real substance.

 

[EatChildren]

And thus we see how qualifying "gunplay" on a good-to-bad scale is utterly pointless. The word is meaningless and made up by journalists to make themselves sound better without actually saying anything of substance. You can discuss hit detection, you can discuss the sound design or modeling or texturing of the weapons, but wrapping all of it up in the word "gunplay" is meaningless prattle.

If those journalists wish to do that then yeah sure, that's silly, but for me personally when writing a review I'd happily use the term 'gunplay' as an introduction to further discussion on why the gunplay may be good or bad. Simply stating that gunplay is one or the other is moronic, but there's no harm in using the term where appropriate, eg "Gunplay is well presented with varied and impressive graphical effects that successfully convey the feel of firing a weapon as well as round impacts, but is ultimately hampered by clunky and unresponsive aiming".

 

[dark10x]

I'm going to go ahead and strongly disagree with this one. They felt oddly light in that game. Now, FEAR... that's a game with class gunplay. It doesn't really get any better than FEAR.

Also: Id games.

Really? FEAR?

Guess it shows how subjective this really is. For me, the way they handled gun movement was just terrible. It looked as if the guns were made of plastic. Simply running around felt terrible as a result.

Now, the AI and the effects the weapons had on the environment were awesome, but the gun models, the animation of those guns, and the way they moved with the view were really bad.

 

[Prine]

I still hold RE4 and RE5 as some of the best examples of gunplay. Phenomenal level of satisfaction using guns in those game.

RE4/5 >>>>>>>>>>>>> Uncharted gunplay

 

[tiff]

They still die faster then the BOOLET SPONGE enemies in Gears. x_X

I never played Gears. I'm just sayin'.

Crysis's shotgun is insane. Probably my favorite outside of an Id game.

See, maybe it's just video game thinking at work, but I never use the shotgun in Crysis (or any game where I can help it, for that matter). A close-range weapon like a shotgun never struck me as the optimal choice in Crysis's open-world, long-range engagements.

They were if you shot them in the face. Even the armored dudes went down in two or three shots from most guns if you got headshots.

That's the case for most games. Headshots were really effective in Crysis as well, but I'd still argue that Crysis enemies were kinda bullet-spongey.

Besides, I can't reasonably be expected to consistently get headshots without a mouse and keyboard! *grumbles*

 

[NIN90]

And thus we see how qualifying "gunplay" on a good-to-bad scale is utterly pointless. The word is meaningless and made up by journalists to make themselves sound better without actually saying anything of substance. You can discuss hit detection, you can discuss the sound design or modeling or texturing of the weapons, but wrapping all of it up in the word "gunplay" is meaningless prattle.

The whole concept of "gunplay" was never a consideration or focus in the past; it has propped up within the past ~5 years to try to make a differentiation between games in a extremely homogeneous genre.

You mean it's similar to "graphics", "atmosphere" or "amount of David Bowie characters"?

 

[dark10x]

See, maybe it's just video game thinking at work, but I never use the shotgun in Crysis (or any game where I can help it, for that matter). A close-range weapon like a shotgun never struck me as the optimal choice in Crysis's open-world, long-range engagements.

Well, that just touches on the brilliance of Crysis. You can play the game in a very close quarters fashion, if you choose.