SolidSnakex
Member
Aren't most of the complaints about XIII centered around the linear nature of the game? People seem really hyped about Versus and I haven't seen anyone complain about the fact that it'll have CG cutscenes.
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What's next for the Final Fantasy franchise?
- Thread starter Sadist
- Start date
Aren't most of the complaints about XIII centered around the linear nature of the game? People seem really hyped about Versus and I haven't seen anyone complain about the fact that it'll have CG cutscenes.
* Scale back the cutscenes, use cgi for important events. Save some god damn money
* Medieval/rustic art direction, FF9 looked great. Steampunk is ok too
* Relatable characters that don't go out of their way to piss you off. Guys, you should visably have signs that you shave if you're 18+. Girls, don't act like you're 7. No moes, no shounens.
* Gambits and paradigms are great, so something like that for combat. I loved the flexibility of gambits. Difficulty settings
* Emphasise exploration and a large world with secrets and side quests aplenty
* Customisable weapons and armour slots (head, chest, legs, hands, accesories). Armour dyes. Character creation (yeah i said it)
* Villians. See Kefka. Maybe Sephiroth.
* Stop trying to reinvent the wheel every time. Iterating on ideas that were popular is ok
* Get proper writers in. Characters need to have believable emotions and responses
* Medieval/rustic art direction, FF9 looked great. Steampunk is ok too
* Relatable characters that don't go out of their way to piss you off. Guys, you should visably have signs that you shave if you're 18+. Girls, don't act like you're 7. No moes, no shounens.
* Gambits and paradigms are great, so something like that for combat. I loved the flexibility of gambits. Difficulty settings
* Emphasise exploration and a large world with secrets and side quests aplenty
* Customisable weapons and armour slots (head, chest, legs, hands, accesories). Armour dyes. Character creation (yeah i said it)
* Villians. See Kefka. Maybe Sephiroth.
* Stop trying to reinvent the wheel every time. Iterating on ideas that were popular is ok
* Get proper writers in. Characters need to have believable emotions and responses
Castor Krieg
Banned
That won't fly. Didn't we have discussion about it before? In Japan:
1. Mainly young adults sub-25 years old have time to play, others are working their asses off.
2. Such young adults relate mostly with 15-20 year old characters.
Old people simply do not feature as primary heroes in Japanese games for a reason. How many anime do you have, where the main hero is an adult with past history? ZERO.
Quite a number actually. In fact, one of them is airing this very season, and it does have ZERO in the title.
I remember this one called 'Dragon Ball Z', not sure if it caught on there.
Alright, I'm trying to disassociate my perspective of the status quo of the series from what may be the actual case. There are no problems with Final Fantasy as a marketable franchise right? XIII may have repulsed a number of fans but it is still a successful game (as a product) right?
On that note, is there any real value in making fan calls for Square Enix to change its course with the series?
(Yeah, I'm sick of my nostalgia-induced wishful thinking for the future of the series.)
On that note, is there any real value in making fan calls for Square Enix to change its course with the series?
(Yeah, I'm sick of my nostalgia-induced wishful thinking for the future of the series.)
StoppedInTracks
Member
13 had two likeable characters: Sazh and Fang but the rest was just distasteful. Maybe except Snow but I have a crush on Snooooooooooooooooooooooow <3
And it is pretty funny how so many people (me included) when talking about fixing FF want it to be more like FF12.
We are thinking INSIDE THE BOX. Square should never do the next FF game the same as the last one, Square CAN innovate and surprise us with something never seen before, just like they did with FF12.
13 was just a misstep, I hope.
And it is pretty funny how so many people (me included) when talking about fixing FF want it to be more like FF12.
We are thinking INSIDE THE BOX. Square should never do the next FF game the same as the last one, Square CAN innovate and surprise us with something never seen before, just like they did with FF12.
13 was just a misstep, I hope.
yellowjacket25
Member
They need to really take a look at past Final Fantasy games and what made people love them. The following would help:
- World maps, maybe an airship.
- Towns. I actually like going up and talking to random people. It adds to the story and atmosphere.
- More loot.
- Better story line and dialogue.
- Better gil grinding. Killing turtles for hours in hopes of it dropping certain items should not be the only real way to make money.
- Make summons worth a crap again.
I think if they make another good Final Fantasy game, it will be accepted well and sell well. The franchise is not dying in my opinion, it has just lost its way.
- World maps, maybe an airship.
- Towns. I actually like going up and talking to random people. It adds to the story and atmosphere.
- More loot.
- Better story line and dialogue.
- Better gil grinding. Killing turtles for hours in hopes of it dropping certain items should not be the only real way to make money.
- Make summons worth a crap again.
I think if they make another good Final Fantasy game, it will be accepted well and sell well. The franchise is not dying in my opinion, it has just lost its way.
Some of my thoughts on this above: ^^^^
Other than that, I agree with most of what's listed here.
A few other things:
-Visible armor: Xenoblade, along with a few other FF games do this, and it's one of things I liked. Pretty neat to see actual armor. (FF already does visual weapons)
-Randomized Loot: By this, I mean having a loot system similar to like Diablo. Have the different attributes/properties and other stuff.
-Don't save the world: It's a tried-and-true concept, but surely we can have a good story that doesn't involve this, right?
-Summons: Make 'em semi-useful again!
-Back to your roots: Make an all-new game using 2D sprites and harkening back to the game of yore. Sadly, probably would've been a better idea realized back on the GBA or DS. 4 Heroes of Light was a decent attempt at this, but looked kinda bad ascetically.
-Demake: Why not?
Green Mamba
Member
It desperately needs to stop trying to reinvent the wheel every time. Go back and play four through nine and figure out what made them as great as they were. Thirteen was an awful misstep for the franchise (made with only a very shallow understanding of why people actually like FF), but hardly irreversible.
The sales say it all. The franchise has used up all the goodwill of broad-spectrum players. Now only the diehard fans will take a chance on it. The series has been bloated into irrelevancy. Even if Square can make some of the 'fixes' I'm reading here the general game-playing population is not likely to notice.
FF13 sold a bit under FFX's sales.
I can only think of three things that need to be done.
- Cancel everything in development now. Yeah, that includes Versus too.
- Arrange a team to make Final Fantasy VII Remake.
- Another team to make the entry XV. No Fabula Nova Cristalys, no XV-2, just XV and just announcr it when it's ready.
Don't get me wrong, FFVII is not my favorite entry (that honor belongs to IX), but is the currently most popular entry and the one with greater fan demand. The script is already here, the characters are here. Just Remake it in HD and try to make a worthy sequel. There's no way it won't make money.
And while a team does VII, do your research on western market, find a better writter who can balance western and eastern elements and work on XV. I won't even bother trying to point out what needs to change on asthetics, narrative, characters. But they need to get rid of whatever is writing XIII whatever and do a goddamn good research.
- Cancel everything in development now. Yeah, that includes Versus too.
- Arrange a team to make Final Fantasy VII Remake.
- Another team to make the entry XV. No Fabula Nova Cristalys, no XV-2, just XV and just announcr it when it's ready.
Don't get me wrong, FFVII is not my favorite entry (that honor belongs to IX), but is the currently most popular entry and the one with greater fan demand. The script is already here, the characters are here. Just Remake it in HD and try to make a worthy sequel. There's no way it won't make money.
And while a team does VII, do your research on western market, find a better writter who can balance western and eastern elements and work on XV. I won't even bother trying to point out what needs to change on asthetics, narrative, characters. But they need to get rid of whatever is writing XIII whatever and do a goddamn good research.
Im under the impression it should of sold more though, being that it was the first multplatform single player game.
It likely did.
Many people in this thread seem to have this bizarre idea that FF13 sold poorly. It did not.
Cheesemeister
Member
It's time to give it a rest. Fire Nomura. Take a generation off, bring it back on the PS5 with only numbering titles and no spin-offs/remakes.
I'd be fine with gambits returning, just not having to buy or unlock them as you go. That was pointless.
He directed and produced FFXII: ZIJS.
Sickboy007
Member
Rename Versus, removing any FF connection, for the benefit of both Versus and the FF series.
Let the series breath for a while, put the team on KH3 for consoles.
While designing/prototyping the next FF main game, ask Eidos for inputs and feedback.
Try not to kill dragon quest while you're at it.
Let the series breath for a while, put the team on KH3 for consoles.
While designing/prototyping the next FF main game, ask Eidos for inputs and feedback.
Try not to kill dragon quest while you're at it.
It's painfully obvious which posters actually have something worthwhile to discuss and which are just firing blanks while being totally ignorant.
Yes, let's fire the only guy who has been directing and producing popular and profitable games in the company.
Nomura hasn't been directly involved with the main FF series since FFX.
That was 10 years ago.
Yeah, I find this to be confusing as fuck.
What you people want is something that's not a JRPG, which.. is what Final Fantasy has always been.
RPGCrazied
Member
I think its needs a reboot. While I didn't hate XIII, I think it needs a fresh start.
Cheesemeister
Member
The bishounen thing has kind of run its course. Gackt isn't as popular as he used to be, and Final Fantasy's popularity has been following the same downward slide. What's needed is some fresh creative direction that won't fall into the same character design clichés we've seen for the past decade.
Huh?
How so? This isn't like Star Trek where the previous entries have canon and precedence. What are they going to reboot, the Chocobo appearance?
Each FF is its own "reboot". They can change the mythology whenever they want.
I think he means drop the numbered approach. At least that the only thing I can think of that can be "rebooted".
Not the best reply, unless you're just trolling by this point?
You were raging about Nomura just now but it doesn't sound like you know what he's done lately.
He was directly involved with FFX's design and creation, working closely with Nojima to write the characters to fit Spira's worldbuilding. This is well established. And you mentioned Seymour in your post, did you know Yusuke Naora designed him? And you mention Vaan, when Nomura didn't design him either.
He didn't have anything to do with FF12.
He was involved with some initial designs for SOME of FF13's characters, but there's zero reports of any work on the worldbuilding. Nao Ikeda did most of the designs.
Nomura has been busy directing Kingdom Hearts and has given interviews saying he hasn't worked on a main FF in years. He obviously professionally works WITH the mainline FF staff when minor input is needed, but otherwise he's busy with his own projects.
So blaming Nomura for...anything to do with the main FF series in the past 10 years is just ignorant.
charlequin
Banned
FFX-2 sold 1.5m in its first week and cleared 2m lifetime. This game is going to stall out at like 650k. The two situations are not remotely analogous.
The same youthful Japanese aesthetics that people have been complaining about with the FF brand since X came out ten years ago. There's certainly much less problem than XIII, but again: topic of discussion involves things that can appeal to a Western audience rather than simply fail to offend.
http://www.destructoid.com/world-map-airships-confirmed-for-ff-versus-xiii-168113.phtml
What I'm talking about in the point you're arguing here is very much a specific approach to world design that Versus isn't taking. The approach Versus does take may well be great, it's just not the same.
Because there's not much use arguing point-by-point with a position that's so far gone from reality. Versus has every hallmark of a project in development hell, from the incredibly long development window through the complete lack of specificity regarding its scheduling; from the vagueness about the game's content to its repeated no-shows at public events. More specifically, it's getting exactly the same treatment as Square-Enix's previous vaporware projects like XII and XIII, where initial impressions are strung along for years and tiny pieces of information are meted out to hide the fact that the game is way behind the state it ought to be in.
To argue with a straight face that Versus is not in development hell is nothing short of videogame Stockholm syndrome. You cannot possibly be examining the situation with a critical eye and draw this conclusion.
I despise Nomura, but I think he should be kept around.
What Square NEEDS to do is let new talent have a shot at their mainline franchise. Don't fire Nomura, but let him supervise new blood. He shouldn't have ultimate veto power (ie Miyamoto) nor should he have huge creative input, but he should be there to keep the new guys in line and make sure the product is delivered in an efficient and timely manner.
You know, like a good producer should.
Yoshitaka Amano did most of the designs of FF6.
The actual characters were created by a team of three people, Sakaguchi, Kaori Tanaka, and Nomura.
Hironobu Sakaguchi and Kaori Tanaka did most of the writing.
Nomura did the designs of FF7.
Nojima was the main writer of FF7. Sakaguchi was still involved, but I think he was loosening his grip by this stage...
So, for all the wailing and hate for Nomura, he's been involved from the get-go.
Sakaguchi is, sadly, long past his prime, though, as his new company's failure shows.
ULTROS!
People seem to like me because I am polite and I am rarely late. I like to eat ice cream and I really enjoy a nice pair of slacks.
Kitase and Nomura.
Nomura seems to be involved as much as they can push him to be. I wonder sometimes whether he wants to be involved in directing a mainline FF at all.
I don't think asking for XYZ from the past to do ABC from the past will help the franchise going forward.
They're actually different people.
Of the ones who are still there, Nomura and Nojima.
Though if you're looking for that combo, Kingdom Hearts or Versus might fit you well.
He's flat out said in interviews he is not.
Sickboy007
Member
What's the word on Last Story?
Maybe not so ironically, Versus was always the XIII product I was most interested in. I don't like Kingdom Hearts because I have no fondness for anything Disney. I just wish those guys would get the chance to put their spin on a mainline FF once again, ten years later. Sounds like Kitase is never going to take a director's role ever again though.
AranhaHunter
Banned
The Final Fantasy franchise is good and dead for me.
During my NES/SNES days I kinda played it, never finished, was too young and preferred non story driven games like Nintendo games (Mario, FZero, MK, Zelda, etc), or Capcom/Konami games like Street Fighter and Castlevania.
During PSX days, thanks to Sony's incredible hype, I played all main FFs (VII, VIII, IX), liked them all, may even say that IX was arguably my favorite PSX game next to GT and MGS.
During PS2 days I still played the main ones (X, XII), but I can't even come close to making an argument to them being my favorite games, enjoyable, but not close to being one of my favorite games during that era like MGS2, 3, GTA Trilogy, and others.
This generation, I haven't even bothered to play them. I actually haven't even bothered to play JRPGs except for Demon's (and soon to be Dark's) Souls. I find it unlikely that I will ever buy a Final Fantasy game ever again, maybe if they remake the PS1 games and change the random battles and the combat and modernize everything else, I may bite, otherwise, this is a series and franchise that I'm done with.
During my NES/SNES days I kinda played it, never finished, was too young and preferred non story driven games like Nintendo games (Mario, FZero, MK, Zelda, etc), or Capcom/Konami games like Street Fighter and Castlevania.
During PSX days, thanks to Sony's incredible hype, I played all main FFs (VII, VIII, IX), liked them all, may even say that IX was arguably my favorite PSX game next to GT and MGS.
During PS2 days I still played the main ones (X, XII), but I can't even come close to making an argument to them being my favorite games, enjoyable, but not close to being one of my favorite games during that era like MGS2, 3, GTA Trilogy, and others.
This generation, I haven't even bothered to play them. I actually haven't even bothered to play JRPGs except for Demon's (and soon to be Dark's) Souls. I find it unlikely that I will ever buy a Final Fantasy game ever again, maybe if they remake the PS1 games and change the random battles and the combat and modernize everything else, I may bite, otherwise, this is a series and franchise that I'm done with.
SolidSnakex
Member
At one point he said that Versus is a one time thing and after that he just wants to focus on Kingdom Hearts. He hasn't had any significant input in a mainline FF game since FF7 when he came up with the story concept along with Sakaguchi. It's actually really bizarre that he continues to take the blame for some games when designing their characters was his only involvement with them.
sixteen-bit
Member
That would have been interesting. I quite enjoyed BCR.
IIRC, Final Fantasy X was the last time those two had those roles at the same time.
Well, Final Fantasy X-2 as well.
he stated he doesn't
and he's definitely stretched too thin
but having him on board (non-superficial-FFXIII-ly) will be very advantageous
they should match the quality of the past first
before thinking about going forward
Castor Krieg
Banned
We can complain about technical details, some gameplay choices, but one thing is most obvious - STORY BLOWS!
If anyone deserves to be fired, it's Toriyama. The guy clearly showed he might be a competent director, but he never should be allowed to write a scenario.
If anyone deserves to be fired, it's Toriyama. The guy clearly showed he might be a competent director, but he never should be allowed to write a scenario.
Terareflection
Member
I still don't understand the hate for Vaan and Penelo What was wrong with them other than not contributing much to the plot. I thought they were far more harmless than some of the FFXIII characters.
Eaten By A Grue
Member
The sad part is Blue Dragon and Lost Odyssey were my two favorite RPGs of this gen. They felt like more Square Enix games then Square Enix games actually did. That is the direction Final Fantasy should be going in.
Vaan's personality was just kind of bland. I don't think he imparted much of an impact on the story good or bad.
I think he would be less hated if he was less shirtless.
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