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[V_Arnold]

He was exhausted enough that he took the quarter staff to use as a crutch since he had trouble walking on his own. And while real world experience is definitely good, being trained to use a sword isn't meaningless. Especailly when the experience that Mat had up until then was mostly lying on his back because his dumb ass was sick from the dagger. Besides that, I don't really remember Mat fighting much of anyone in the first two books. He was always just trying to survive the onslaught, if he wasn't lying in bed sick. The whole gang in general have done very little fighting. They mostly just tried to escape. Besides THAT, even if he did fight, I'm fairly sure he said this was the first time he wielded a quarterstaff, so any real life experience transfer would be rough at best.

So heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeell no, it wasn't earned at all. Imo.

Straight out of that scene:
"I think ill put my trust in a good bow, or a good quarterstaff. I know how to use those."

 

[Kabuki Waq]

He was exhausted enough that he took the quarter staff to use as a crutch since he had trouble walking on his own. And while real world experience is definitely good, being trained to use a sword isn't meaningless. Especailly when the experience that Mat had up until then was mostly lying on his back because his dumb ass was sick from the dagger. Besides that, I don't really remember Mat fighting much of anyone in the first two books. He was always just trying to survive the onslaught, if he wasn't lying in bed sick. The whole gang in general have done very little fighting. They mostly just tried to escape. Besides THAT, even if he did fight, I'm fairly sure he said this was the first time he wielded a quarterstaff, so any real life experience transfer would be rough at best.

So heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeell no, it wasn't earned at all. Imo.

they explained that he trained with his Dad all the time back in the day.

 

[x-Lundz-x]

Those posting that you started and don't want to finish are missing out. There is a reason this series is constantly on the top of the best all time fantasy lists. It is the greatest fantasy series ever written.

 

[siddx]

I read them all straight through over a few months with a handful of breaks here and there. So the whole series just felt like one long as fuck novel. There were periods where it definitely dragged, and his ability to make every single female character in the book be an insufferable obnoxious twat is astounding. But overall it had more good moments than bad. And I can't imagine just giving up and not finding out what happens to everyone. It's inconceivable to me that a person could get four books in and just say fuck it I don't care to know how it ends.

Edit: now that I think about it, most of the main male characters were completely unlikable as well. Which goes to show how an interesting world and story can overcome a pretty serious flaw like having a cast full of fuckheads.

 

[EmpressInYellow]

It ends fairly strong, but if you're on book 4, it's gonna get worse before it gets better.

 

[Purkake4]

I read them all straight through over a few months with a handful of breaks here and there. So the whole series just felt like one long as fuck novel. There were periods where it definitely dragged, and his ability to make every single female character in the book be an insufferable obnoxious twat is astounding. But overall it had more good moments than bad. And I can't imagine just giving up and not finding out what happens to everyone. It's inconceivable to me that a person could get four books in and just say fuck it I don't care to know how it ends.

Nynaeve's arc is pretty cool in the later half though.

 

[Kabuki Waq]

damn I hated Egwene and the process girl.

All the others were decent.

 

[slightconfuse]

First 5 books were and are great to me.

Series takes a dive after but boy does Sanderson take the ball and run with it.

A memory of light was so good

Matt is one of my favorite characters

 

[Turin Turambar]

First 5 books were and are great to me.

Series takes a dive after but boy does Sanderson take the ball and run with it.

A memory of light was so good

Matt is one of my favorite characters

For me A Memory of Light was the weakest one of the last three.

 

[Veelk]

Straight out of that scene:
"I think ill put my trust in a good bow, or a good quarterstaff. I know how to use those."

they explained that he trained with his Dad all the time back in the day.

I remember specifically reading it as that his dad knew how to use the quarterstaff, but he didn't actually train in it himself. I tried searching for "My dad taught me" but I didn't see anything. From the impression I got, he just had an idea of how it's meant to be done, but not had actual training in it.

But fine, even assuming so, the point stands. You just said he had 'real' combat training. I know I didn't read him quarterstaffing any trollocs. Most of the time, he's been running away. So, at best, he's just trained. And even besides that, I'm supposed to believe, again weak and exhausted to the point where he needs a walking stick, he's well trained enough to take on 2 soldiers trained by warders, the best swordsmen in the world? Even if he wasn't weak and exhausted and taking on only one swordsman, I'd have a hard time buying his victory because I would expect a Warder, whose constantly in battle, to be a better trainer than his dad, whatever mysterious past he may have. But 2 of them, while exhausted? Just because his daddy taught him some tricks?

Uh-uh.

 

[Krowley]

He was exhausted enough that he took the quarter staff to use as a crutch since he had trouble walking on his own. And while real world experience is definitely good, being trained to use a sword isn't meaningless. Especailly when the experience that Mat had up until then was mostly lying on his back because his dumb ass was sick from the dagger. Besides that, I don't really remember Mat fighting much of anyone in the first two books. He was always just trying to survive the onslaught, if he wasn't lying in bed sick. The whole gang in general have done very little fighting. They mostly just tried to escape. Besides THAT, even if he did fight, I'm fairly sure he said this was the first time he wielded a quarterstaff, so any real life experience transfer would be rough at best.

So heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeell no, it wasn't earned at all. Imo.

It's been a while, and it's a very long series, so I may be mistaken but...

I'm pretty sure they make it clear in one of the later books that the two rivers had quarterstaff tournaments at their festivals, and Mat's father is an expert with quarterstaff who won regularly.

So Mat was trained in the use of the quarterstaff, probably from a very early age.

The quarterstaff is a classic farmer's weapon. It's no good against armor, but the idea that farmer's use quarterstaves and other non military weapons with great skill lines up pretty well with real life history. Later in the series, Mat wields a sort of spear/halbred thing, and his quarterstaff abilities transfer over.

Also, since you're probably not going to finish, I'll go ahead and spoil you by saying that

Spoiler

past lives and memories play into this too. Some of these skills are coming from past lives these character's have lived, and in some of those lives they were great heroes.

Edit: looks like someone already beat me to the punch on the quaterstaff training thing. I was pretty sure I remembered reading something like that, but not positive.

 

[Carcetti]

*tugs her braid*

I actually liked the first three books but everything after that made me wish I'd never even heard of the series. Bloat fantasy at its worst.

Those posting that you started and don't want to finish are missing out. There is a reason this series is constantly on the top of the best all time fantasy lists. It is the greatest fantasy series ever written.

I read this and I feel like I'm taking Mugatu brand crazy pills. But questions of taste are like that always.

 

[V_Arnold]

I remember specifically reading it as that his dad knew how to use the quarterstaff, but he didn't actually train in it himself. I tried searching for "My dad taught me" but I didn't see anything. From the impression I got, he just had an idea of how it's meant to be done, but not had actual training in it.

But fine, even assuming so, the point stands. You just said he had 'real' combat training. I know I didn't read him quarterstaffing any trollocs. Most of the time, he's been running away. So, at best, he's just trained. And even besides that, I'm supposed to believe, again weak and exhausted to the point where he needs a walking stick, he's well trained enough to take on 2 soldiers trained by warders, the best swordsmen in the world? Even if he wasn't weak and exhausted and taking on only one swordsman, I'd have a hard time buying his victory because I would expect a Warder, whose constantly in battle, to be a better trainer than his dad, whatever mysterious past he may have. But 2 of them, while exhausted? Just because his daddy taught him some tricks?

Uh-uh.

The point does not stand, but it might valid for you. if YOU feel that it is forced, then sure, by all means, stop. After every character's milestones, achievements and turnarounds, you will be shouting "how????? THAT WAS NOT EARNED" anyway. And that is fine. Go and enjoy the books that are more written to your likings, I guess.

 

[Incendiary]

I read them all straight through over a few months with a handful of breaks here and there. So the whole series just felt like one long as fuck novel. There were periods where it definitely dragged, and his ability to make every single female character in the book be an insufferable obnoxious twat is astounding. But overall it had more good moments than bad. And I can't imagine just giving up and not finding out what happens to everyone. It's inconceivable to me that a person could get four books in and just say fuck it I don't care to know how it ends.

Edit: now that I think about it, most of the main male characters were completely unlikable as well. Which goes to show how an interesting world and story can overcome a pretty serious flaw like having a cast full of fuckheads.

Jordan definitely had issues with writing females - it was even more apparent when Sanderson took over later and made them much better. Tuon was probably the best female.

Mat and Lan were two of the standout male characters. I personally liked Gawyn a lot too. Perrin has his moments (mostly before Faile exists) and Rand is all over the place. Also Moridin is a great villain.

 

[Krowley]

Jordan definitely had issues with writing females - it was even more apparent when Sanderson took over later and made them much better. Tuon was probably the best female.

Mat and Lan were two of the standout male characters. I personally liked Gawyn a lot too. Perrin has his moments (mostly before Faile exists) and Rand is all over the place. Also Moridin is a great villain.

I liked Tuon, Moraine, Nynaeve, and Aviendha. Min was cool, too.

There were times when I hated Egwene and Elayne. And actually, there were other times when I liked them. I hated Faile. She was the worst.

I liked Lanfear, but hated the ultimate payoff on that character in Sanderson's book.

 

[ExVicis]

Jordan definitely had issues with writing females - it was even more apparent when Sanderson took over later and made them much better. Tuon was probably the best female.

Mat and Lan were two of the standout male characters. I personally liked Gawyn a lot too. Perrin has his moments (mostly before Faile exists) and Rand is all over the place. Also Moridin is a great villain.

Really? Me and another friend who grew up on WoT absolutely loathed Gawyn. He was okay when you first met him but after that with the whole misunderstanding thing with Rand and all the Egwene stuff he was just horrible.

Galad though? Galad was rad.

I liked Tuon, Moraine, Nynaeve, and Aviendha. Min was cool, too.

I liked Min too but she was really underused as a character.

 

[ExVicis]

he's well trained enough to take on 2 soldiers trained by warders, the best swordsmen in the world?

According to the Author, Gawyn apparently wasn't as good as everyone said he was. Just competent and very fortunate in the middle of his fights.

Also...best Swordsmen in the world? Hahaha, not even close.


Edit: Oh hell sorry for the double post, I don't know why I thought but I though I had hit the edit button.

 

[Veelk]

The point does not stand, but it might valid for you. if YOU feel that it is forced, then sure, by all means, stop. After every character's milestones, achievements and turnarounds, you will be shouting "how????? THAT WAS NOT EARNED" anyway. And that is fine. Go and enjoy the books that are more written to your likings, I guess.

I can agree insofar that what is earned it's a subjective element, but it's kind of rude to just assume I will denounce every achievement as unearned. I just think this one was, for reasons stated. I think most would agree that it remains a stretch even accounting for possible training he had from his dad. Especially since the Warder, after the fight, seems to credit it to the quarterstaff being in some bizarre way a superior weapon to the sword.

But yeah, I'm definitely not going to be reading any more of it, so we'll never know.

According to the Author, Gawyn apparently wasn't as good as everyone said he was. Just competent and very fortunate in the middle of his fights.

Also...best Swordsmen in the world? Hahaha, not even close.

Well-regarded, whatever. Everyone shits themselves at warders. We're splitting hairs here. Point is, they're certified badasses.

Okay, so without giving any indication of it in the book, Gawyn was just blah? And the other dude too? And even Warder training doesn't put them above Mat and his backwater village training?

If I'd have paid something for that warder training, I'd want my money back.

 

[Man God]

The whole last battle was done extremely well.

And Matt's character and his arc are really entertaining. During the boring books (for me a lot of 8-10 were a slog) any Matt storyline almost made up for the rest of the book. And a lot of the elements in those books came into play big time when Sanderson wraps it up in the final three books.

For me the journey was extremely satisfying.

Hey remember the book where Matt is not in it at all?

NEITHER DO I!

 

[Incendiary]

I liked Tuon, Moraine, Nynaeve, and Aviendha. Min was cool, too.

There were times when I hated Egwene and Elayne. And actually, there were other times when I liked them. I hated Faile. She was the worst.

I liked Lanfear, but hated the ultimate payoff on that character in Sanderson's book.

Moiraine was infuriating for a couple books, same for Nynaeve. Aviendha I'm biased towards and tend to leave her out of character discussions because I have an undeniable wish she was not a fictional character. If I subscribed to the idea of waifus Aviendha would be one to me (and she'd kick my ass for saying it).

As someone else said, Min was great but underused. Egwene got insufferable sometimes, same for Elayne. And don't get me started on Faile. Siuan was badass, though, I forgot about her.

 

[ExVicis]

Well-regarded, whatever. Everyone shits themselves at warders. We're splitting hairs here. Point is, they're certified badasses.

Okay, so without giving any indication of it in the book, Gawyn was just blah? And the other dude too? And even Warder training doesn't put them above Mat and his backwater village training?

If I'd have paid something for that warder training, I'd want my money back.

I think in this case you could say...compare them to those shitty nobility raised teenagers in other fantasy books and put less importance on how they should have won.

This is a very old trope that is even in The Name of the Wind where you're presented a bunch of kids with money and influence that are sure of their own value as the best as "X" and that everyone else could never measure up to them because they simply have the best training, the best trainers, the best swords, the best upbringing and the best birth.

Then here comes the guy from a backwater town that didn't have all that and beats him. So I guess it doesn't bug me as much because I've both seen it before...and also because these guys are still teenagers at this point. Hell how long had they been training for by this fight? A year? That's not nearly long enough to become a Master Swordsman.

 

[FrontalMonk]

I think in this case you could say...compare them to those shitty nobility raised teenagers in other fantasy books and put less importance on how they should have won.

This is a very old trope that is even in The Name of the Wind where you're presented a bunch of kids with money and influence that are sure of their own value as the best as "X" and that everyone else could never measure up to them because they simply have the best training, the best trainers, the best swords, the best upbringing and the best birth.

Then here comes the guy from a backwater town that didn't have all that and beats him. So I guess it doesn't bug me as much because I've both seen it before...and also because these guys are still teenagers at this point. Hell how long had they been training for by this fight? A year? That's not nearly long enough to become a Master Swordsman.

Yeah I didn't really read into this scene very much beyond "cocky fucks get schooled by one Matrim Cauthon".

 

[BlueWord]

That's where I quit when I took a stab at the series, too. Story loses a lot of momentum at that point, and Jordan's little writing quirks were really starting to grate.

 

[siddx]

Jordan definitely had issues with writing females - it was even more apparent when Sanderson took over later and made them much better. Tuon was probably the best female.

Mat and Lan were two of the standout male characters. I personally liked Gawyn a lot too. Perrin has his moments (mostly before Faile exists) and Rand is all over the place. Also Moridin is a great villain.

I just never liked mat from almost the minute he was introduced. He felt like the goofy sidekick who gets his ass kicked constantly and needs to hide behind the hero all the time. I've always hated that character in almost every book or movie.
And even when Jordan realized he could extend the series by making all three into heroes and splitting them up, and in doing so gave mat super invincible god luck powers while making him a super shaolin monk with a staff, he still always reeked of dorky sidekick.

The other issue for me was I didn't feel like there was a strong hero until rand had his little born again moment late in the series. Every time he got close to being someone you could cheer for, he'd have his emo freak out and go back to being intolerable. Yeah lan is a badass, but he isn't ever written as the main hero that you can cheer on the whole series. He swoops in when it's convenient for the plot.

 

[Kabuki Waq]

I remember specifically reading it as that his dad knew how to use the quarterstaff, but he didn't actually train in it himself. I tried searching for "My dad taught me" but I didn't see anything. From the impression I got, he just had an idea of how it's meant to be done, but not had actual training in it.

But fine, even assuming so, the point stands. You just said he had 'real' combat training. I know I didn't read him quarterstaffing any trollocs. Most of the time, he's been running away. So, at best, he's just trained. And even besides that, I'm supposed to believe, again weak and exhausted to the point where he needs a walking stick, he's well trained enough to take on 2 soldiers trained by warders, the best swordsmen in the world? Even if he wasn't weak and exhausted and taking on only one swordsman, I'd have a hard time buying his victory because I would expect a Warder, whose constantly in battle, to be a better trainer than his dad, whatever mysterious past he may have. But 2 of them, while exhausted? Just because his daddy taught him some tricks?

Uh-uh.

oh...nah Matt only had quick hands and great aim before the duel. the whole quarterstaff thing with training was brought up before the duel.
But it was implied throughout the books that all 3 of the mains trained a lot ..hunting, tournaments, etc... throughout their farm years.

 

[V_Arnold]

I just never liked mat from almost the minute he was introduced. He felt like the goofy sidekick who gets his ass kicked constantly and needs to hide behind the hero all the time. I've always hated that character in almost every book or movie.
And even when Jordan realized he could extend the series by making all three into heroes and splitting them up, and in doing so gave mat super invincible god luck powers while making him a super shaolin monk with a staff, he still always reeked of dorky sidekick.

The other issue for me was I didn't feel like there was a strong hero until rand had his little born again moment late in the series. Every time he got close to being someone you could cheer for, he'd have his emo freak out and go back to being intolerable. Yeah lan is a badass, but he isn't ever written as the main hero that you can cheer on the whole series. He swoops in when it's convenient for the plot.

This is why the true main heroes of the book are all women, until the moment you mention.
(Yes, really. Egwene, Nynaeve, Elayne...and Moirane, ofc.)

 

[Acorn]

Is the author a objectivist? Rand!? Lol

 

[Cyan]

If you don't like it at book 4, you are absolutely right to quit. The advice to "just keep pushing until you get to Knife of Dreams" is meant for people who get bogged down in book 8-10, which are super slow. Thing is, if you don't like book 4 you aren't going to like Knife of Dreams and onward either! The things that are good about those books are the same things that are good about the early books in the series.

Basically I'm just validating your decision I guess.

 

[Veelk]

If you don't like it at book 4, you are absolutely right to quit. The advice to "just keep pushing until you get to Knife of Dreams" is meant for people who get bogged down in book 8-10, which are super slow. Thing is, if you don't like book 4 you aren't going to like Knife of Dreams and onward either! The things that are good about those books are the same things that are good about the early books in the series.

Basically I'm just validating your decision I guess.

The thing that makes this decision unique is that I usually power through. I'm a big believer of letting stories play out fully.

I watched Arrow and hated it from episode 1 and made it a pretty good way into season 4 out of sheer stubbornness. I still read some manga I don't like, some books I find dull, just out of a sense of wanting completion.

WoT is the one that's just way, way too much for me. It's the first time, in a long time, that I've ever just flat out quit something. But yeah, I'm pretty confident that in this case, it's the right decision.

 

[Man God]

Is the author a objectivist? Rand!? Lol

Surprisingly...no.

 

[Man God]

oh...nah Matt only had quick hands and great aim before the duel. the whole quarterstaff thing with training was brought up before the duel.
But it was implied throughout the books that all 3 of the mains trained a lot ..hunting, tournaments, etc... throughout their farm years.

They're also heroes of the age. Matt is quite literally just out of his deathbed when he does this.

 

[Voror]

I started reading the series in high school, but ended up stopping. Can't quite remember when but I do remember the bit with Mat getting the amulet and whatnot. Actually thought that was intriguing. Curious if those would hold up for me at all now. I have the first two still I think.

Don't quite remember why I stopped. I think I was just sort of bored or something. The series was also unfinished at that time as well.

I'm a bit curious at some saying it's the greatest Fantasy story when I feel like I've always seen it mentioned that books 7/8-10 are pretty weak and slow things to a crawl with how bogged down they get. Reading some of OP's complaints does remind me of aspects that irritated me.

This does feel like a series that could do well with a good adaptation to streamline some aspects.

 

[NandoGip]

Just want to say that I don't read books but I read every single book in the series including the prequel. Took me like 9 months. Easily my number 1 favorite piece of media, above any show, movie, game, or whatever.

Fingers crossed on that show that there are rumors over


edit: also check out this fan movie from ch4 in eye of the world
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nt10nbVSerY

 

[espher]

WoT is definitely a case where I find the world/setting fascination and the books a chore.

I stopped after the third book.

 

[Brickhunt]

I'm at the beginning of Book 5, but haven't managed to bring myself to keep going. It may feel like a nitpick, but I've got really annoyed by how, generally, females are weaker channelers than males. Sure, there were always differences from the very beginning, like men being more skilled at fire and women more skilled at water, but before this book I got a sense that they were more or less equal.

To be honest, the only reason I may bring myself to finish this series is to see more of Mat. Him kicking ass in Book 3 was the highlight of the series until now. I also need more Lan and Moraine asskicking Trollocs and Myrddraal.

 

[ExVicis]

WoT is definitely a case where I find the world/setting fascination and the books a chore.

I stopped after the third book.

Out of the early books (like the first 5) I probably dislike the third the most. It's about Rand and his change into who he would later but he's not even a character in that book.

But if the world/setting stuff is what interests you, the world really really opens up after the third book and continues to do so.

 

[Hippo_PRIME]

I remember specifically reading it as that his dad knew how to use the quarterstaff, but he didn't actually train in it himself. I tried searching for "My dad taught me" but I didn't see anything. From the impression I got, he just had an idea of how it's meant to be done, but not had actual training in it.

But fine, even assuming so, the point stands. You just said he had 'real' combat training. I know I didn't read him quarterstaffing any trollocs. Most of the time, he's been running away. So, at best, he's just trained. And even besides that, I'm supposed to believe, again weak and exhausted to the point where he needs a walking stick, he's well trained enough to take on 2 soldiers trained by warders, the best swordsmen in the world? Even if he wasn't weak and exhausted and taking on only one swordsman, I'd have a hard time buying his victory because I would expect a Warder, whose constantly in battle, to be a better trainer than his dad, whatever mysterious past he may have. But 2 of them, while exhausted? Just because his daddy taught him some tricks?

Uh-uh.

If I'm remembering correctly, the two that he fights in that scene aren't Warders, they're swordsman being trained by Warders. Important distinction because that would mean they're not battle hardened and they don't have the supernatural reflexes and stamina of the Warders.

Also, one of those swordsman (I think?) was Galad, a pretty good guy all things considered, but also quite sure of himself because of his skill. Going into a fight cocky against an opponent you're unprepared for pretty believably puts you at a disadvantage.

As to Mat just recovering, you're right, that is a bit of a stretch, but I'll go with the same explanation the book does so often: Ta'veren. Million-to-one odds become way more likely.

 

[Purkake4]

The thing that makes this decision unique is that I usually power through. I'm a big believer of letting stories play out fully.

I watched Arrow and hated it from episode 1 and made it a pretty good way into season 4 out of sheer stubbornness. I still read some manga I don't like, some books I find dull, just out of a sense of wanting completion.

WoT is the one that's just way, way too much for me. It's the first time, in a long time, that I've ever just flat out quit something. But yeah, I'm pretty confident that in this case, it's the right decision.

You could try the audiobooks, the two narrator setup is excellent.

 

[Krowley]

You could try the audiobooks, the two narrator setup is excellent.

Next time I do a reread, I'm almost certainly gonna try the audiobooks just for a different experience. I keep hearing they're very well done.

 

[Purkake4]

Next time I do a reread, I'm almost certainly gonna try the audiobooks just for a different experience. I keep hearing they're very well done.

Everyone can check out the samples on Audible to get a feel for the narrators: Michael Kramer
and Kate Reading.

 

[NandoGip]

Everyone can check out the samples on Audible to get a feel for the narrators: Michael Kramer
and Kate Reading.

Audio books > books (For WoT at least)

 

[x-Lundz-x]

Next time I do a reread, I'm almost certainly gonna try the audiobooks just for a different experience. I keep hearing they're very well done.

I did this a few years ago. Worth the subscription to Audible, was FANTASTIC. They don't really nail the voices until about the third book but they both do an excellent job.

 

[Man God]

I've only ever listened to the audiobooks.

The first time I got to the shitty ones I was playing Diablo 2 while listening to them to pass the time.

 

[Turin Turambar]

It ends fairly strong, but if you're on book 4, it's gonna get worse before it gets better.

Book 4-5-6-7 are the best part of the series!

 

[Pimplitosaurio]

I quit in book six I think, I wasn't jus feeling it and the books just got longer and longer and longer and the sixth book I just decided that I wasn't for me, and just stoped midway or so

 

[Risible]

You did far better than me. I had heard it was a good series so decided to give it a shot. Got to book one chapter five or so and did the Seinfeld gif:

Not my cup of tea AT ALL.

 

[grumble]

I read the first nine books. It got to the point where I could skip whole chapters and nothing would change. It was hundreds of pages - per book - too long. The most bloated series I have ever read.

 

[woodland]

I think I remember you making a thread or posting about reading it and I heavily advised you against it back then lol.

Reading your analysis of it reminded me of all the shit I hated, especially Jordan's shittily written female characters. If I could go back, I would stop myself from reading it. Thank god I didn't pay for it and borrow them instead.

I read the first nine books. It got to the point where I could skip whole chapters and nothing would change. It was hundreds of pages - per book - too long. The most bloated series I have ever read.

This too. Game of Thrones introduced me to skipping chapters (Cersei), but Wheel of Times was seriously the most boring series I've ever read.

 

[Mr. Bad Example]

I feel your pain. I made it up to about either book 5 (Braids: the Tuggening) or 6 (Wool-Headed Men and the Skirt-Smoothing Women Who Love Them) before I said:

...and moved on.

 

[bionic77]

Hey remember the book where Matt is not in it at all?

NEITHER DO I!

It's hazy but I think Perrin cries a lot and tied some knots. Rand went crazy.

And all the bitches were smoothing the fuck out of their skirts 24/7 when the men folk were around.