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Whiny Diablo fans don't like Diablo III's BAD ART, start whiny petition to cry

Monroeski

Unconfirmed Member
Allow me to expound on the effect that an internet petition will have on a publisher's decision to make a game look a little bit like one of their other titles, which happens to be far and away the most successful MMORPG of all time and one of the overall biggest games in any genre -


FUCKING NONE.
 

puebla

Member
i've never played a Diablo game in my life but i do play WoW and i have to say that when i saw the gameplay video of Diablo 3, i thought, this looks like it's inspired by WoW. it takes my excitement away from Diablo 3, makes me feel like i've been there before. most likely i'm still going to buy it, i want to see what all the fuss is about.
 

Kiriku

SWEDISH PERFECTION
Actually, I partly agree with them. I was disappointed in the style they went with as well, but it's mostly the character design I don't like. I just find it kind of disapponting to see them take the cartoony route of Warcraft since that's not really Diablo in my eyes. Would've been nice with something other than the WoW look, but at least the camera is zoomed out most of the time so I won't have to see the character in detail very much. :)
 
You know guys, whining about people whining about the art direction is like a lot more pathetic and "internet is serious bizness" than the whiners themselves.

Just sayin'
 

Vinci

Danish
puebla said:
i've never played a Diablo game in my life but i do play WoW and i have to say that when i saw the gameplay video of Diablo 3, i thought, this looks like it's inspired by WoW. it takes my excitement away from Diablo 3, makes me feel like i've been there before. most likely i'm still going to buy it, i want to see what all the fuss is about.

Go buy D2. Play it. If you don't like it, there's no sense waiting for D3 and suffering through this 'ARGH THE GRAPHIX!' nonsense. If you do, congratulations, you now have something to keep you busy during the long wait for D3.
 

speedpop

Has problems recognising girls
I saw this over at that piece of shit site 4chan and had to throw it in. This is how important a lot of gamers opinions are and why most developers should just ignore them.

gamers.jpg
 

Kipe

Member
Monroeski said:
Allow me to expound on the effect that an internet petition will have on a publisher's decision to make a game look a little bit like one of their other titles, which happens to be far and away the most successful MMORPG of all time and one of the overall biggest games in any genre -


FUCKING NONE.

Um, Blizzard actively listens to criticisms. They have Q&As in their conventions and during panels they acknowledge player complaints and frustrations. They have top raiding guilds test out new raids. Professional starcraft players are brought in to try out SC2. I could go on and on honestly.
 

Vashu

Member
Kipe said:
Um, Blizzard actively listens to criticisms. They have Q&As in their conventions and during panels they acknowledge player complaints and frustrations. They have top raiding guilds test out new raids. Professional starcraft players are brought in to try out SC2. I could go on and on honestly.

This is true, but in the case of Diablo 3 I think they should not listen. D3 is NOT D2, and to be honest, I like the new look. Heck, there could be an active day/night cycle which would explain the lighter shots.

Who knows?

Those whiney 'fans' sure as hell don't.
 

Teknoman

Member
Kiriku said:
Actually, I partly agree with them. I was disappointed in the style they went with as well, but it's mostly the character design I don't like. I just find it kind of disapponting to see them take the cartoony route of Warcraft since that's not really Diablo in my eyes. Would've been nice with something other than the WoW look, but at least the camera is zoomed out most of the time so I won't have to see the character in detail very much. :)

Even the characters arent cartoony or even close to WoW style.

Go look at the classes section of the Diablo III site. Tell me either one of those guys looks cartoonish.
 
I'm consistently amused at the rediculous things gamers find to complain about, especially before a game is even released. I'll reserve my opinion for when I actually play the game.
 

gutshot

Member
Vinci said:
Ironically, people now miss the Wind Waker art style and wish the next game featured it.

Pretty much. People screamed bloody murder when the first screens were released, now it's hailed as the most beautiful Zelda game ever made.

My guess is D3 will end up following a similar path.
 

Flynn

Member
What morons. The first thing I thought when I saw those screens was that they looked like gorgeous Boris Valejo paintings. Then I though how awesome that shit would look in action and creamed a little.

Art whiners are the lowest of the low.
 
ravenstorm said:
I'm consistently amused at the rediculous things gamers find to complain about, especially before a game is even released. I'll reserve my opinion for when I actually play the game.

That isn't exactly some noble and novel approach. The people behind the petition see the art design as a problem, and in their own meaningless way they are attempting to fix it.
 

Durante

Member
I wasn't nearly as aggravated by the graphical changes as some of my fellow hardcore Diablo fans, but this thread is an abortion. The facts are that the style is different. It is less "gritty"/"realistic"/"dark"/"brutal" and more colorful than Diablo 2. Even Lut Gholein and the surrounding areas were different (if not particularly dark). "Sun-drenched" you could call it.

Diablo historically is Blizzard's least stylized and darkest franchise -- and it fits the setting and story perfectly. I don't think it's justified to attack long-term fans of the series over their concerns about the visual direction apparent in the media released so far.

(I wonder how many of the people mindlessly bashing the fans in this thread actually played Diablo 1 and 2)
 
Kinitari said:
Fuck it, why don't they just make the game black and white.
Make the game black and white using the Diablo 2 engine. Surely this will satisfy the fans.


Haven't people been bitching about the lack of color in games lately? Now people are bitching about this game's moderate use of color. Amusing.
 

Durante

Member
This isn't about "games" in general looking colorful. It's not even just about Diablo 3 looking good (which anyone would be hard pressed to argue against). It's about the Diablo series staying true to its artistic identity, which does much to support its setting and atmosphere.
 

Vashu

Member
Durante said:
I wasn't nearly as aggravated by the graphical changes as some of my fellow hardcore Diablo fans, but this thread is an abortion. The facts are that the style is different. It is less "gritty"/"realistic"/"dark"/"brutal" and more colorful than Diablo 2. Even Lut Gholein and the surrounding areas were different (if not particularly dark). "Sun-drenched" you could call it.

Diablo historically is Blizzard's least stylized and darkest franchise -- and it fits the setting and story perfectly. I don't think it's justified to attack long-term fans of the series over their concerns about the visual direction apparent in the media released so far.

(I wonder how many of the people mindlessly bashing the fans in this thread actually played Diablo 1 and 2)

Yeah, the artstyle is different. So what? It's only for the better, since it suits the 3D (take note!) quite well. And yes, I've played both games since day 1, and I actually like the new direction they're taking. A refreshing change compared to other games who turned darker just because it was the 'awesome' thing to do.

Don't think there are fans who can't appreciate good and stylish art. Don't like it, stick to Diablo 2 while the rest of us embark on a journey through the 3D world of Sanctuary.

Durante said:
This isn't about "games" in general looking colorful. It's not even just about Diablo 3 looking good (which anyone would be hard pressed to argue against). It's about the Diablo series staying true to its artistic identity, which does much to support its setting and atmosphere.


If anything, both D1 and D2 are artistically kind of bland. Now I'm not much of an artist myself, but the first time I saw Diablo 1 being announced I asked myself why the game looked so 'generic'. Of course, I played the game for the first time and was hooked. The Diablo series could use a little change of direction like this in my humble opinion.
 
Crescendo170 said:
http://i27.tinypic.com/2jexp1x.jpg

So their solution is to remove all colors from the game... genius!

On the one hand, I sort of see their point. Diablo III is clearly infected with WC3/WoW-style cartoonish art designs, just as SCII is to a degree, and just like Starcraft and Diablo I and II were not... with Warcraft it started earlier; WCII was the first cartoonish one (WC1 being more realistic styled). Blizzard has slowly extended that style across all of their games, it seems -- and those shots of Diablo III do look a LOT like WoW or WC3 shots, I will agree... and I would also agree that that isn't necessarily a good thing. I have nothing against cartoonish graphics, it works well in Warcraft, but... Diablo and Starcraft are different... the styles are bleeding over a bit too much, perhaps. Blizz thinks they need a "Blizzard" art style, perhaps? Sure SC had humor, and definite cartoonish elements to its art design, but it's definitely more pronounced in SCII, like the whole game went through a WCIII/WoW filter. It maintains enough of a SC look to look distinct from WCIII/WoW, but it looked less different than SC and either WCII or WCIII, I think. In the case of Diablo III, things seem to be even worse. Some of those shots look indistinguishable from Warcraft stuff... but the old Diablo games were distinctly different in art style. Those differences are obviously much less pronounced now, though they are still present.

It is worth nothing that the concept art hasn't changed. It's just the ingame models that have. Compare WCI and WCII and WCIII's concept art, for instance... each game has a very different ingame art style, but much more similar concept art designs.

Anyway, but on the other hand, too many games these days have no color, so is the solution "drain out all the colors" really a good one? There's too much brown-and-grey as it is... but is Diablo the right game for cartoonish graphics and bright colors? Probably not. But even so, some of their pictures aren't improvements. The answer isn't "just remove all of the blue, green, and yellow!" Diablo II had plenty of colors, where they were appropriate... and longer draw distances and bright colors, in the day, particularly in the desert. The question really is if what we've seen of Diablo III so far is representative of the whole game or not, and we can't answer that question yet. As for their edits, removing a lot of the blue and green really doesn't help anything. In some the darker colors make things look better, but just removing almost all of the blue from spell effects, for instance? That's not a good change. Color isn't inherently bad, it just needs to be used appropriately. Blue in spell effects looks fine...

In the end though, I think when the game is finished this won't be an issue. The gamestill has quite a ways to go. I think they'll find an acceptable balance between WoW-izing the graphics for better sales and keeping the graphical styles that make the Diablo series what it is.

But still... it really is too bad that the art style and art direction had to change so dramatically. Ignoring all the lighting and color issues (which, as I said, are relatively minor), the fundamental art style of the game is definitely different from Diablo II, and more like WoW. That's too bad.
 
teepo said:
i just want the dungeons to look like the recolored ones.
2jexp1x.jpg


Recolored one ain't that bad. I liked the Dungeons like they were in the demo. The part I didn't like in the demo was the outside area. The environment didn't give me a sense of dread(until it started raining). In Diablo 1 and 2, all areas had a sense of dread. Blue Hues and lime greens and purples don't invoke Dread. But hey, I'm not the Art Director, nor the creative director. I'll play the game however they want it to be cause I'm a fan.

Also the Witch doctor reminds me of a rejected unit for Warcraft 3. If I can find it... it's in the Art of Warcraft book... it used to be for the undeads.

Oh and I wanted to add: All of these art choices might be Samwise Didier's: Blame him if you're against the art style choice. His wowwiki profile states :
Sam 'Samwise' Didier is the art director at Blizzard Entertainment. Among the veteran Blizzard employees, Samwise Didier has been a consistent artist for many years, and recently his style has been the artistic direction of choice for all Blizzard franchises.

Didier's greatly exaggerated physiques and vibrant, bright color palette has dictated the artistic style of Warcraft III, World of Warcraft and even the now defunct StarCraft: Ghost.
 

Leatherface

Member
This really is a lame argument. The graphics look great IMO. Also, things are bound to change before the game launches. I'm sure at the end of the day there will be plenty nightmarish looking scenery and creatures to behold in Diablo 3. You'd be crazy to think it wouldn't.
 
dark steve said:
That isn't exactly some noble and novel approach. The people behind the petition see the art design as a problem, and in their own meaningless way they are attempting to fix it.
My point is they should just trust the developer. We all know how capable Blizzard is and I think most would agree it's probably going to be a fantastic game regardless of a few colors here and there.
 

Durante

Member
Nice thoughtful post Black Falcon.

Vashu said:
It's only for the better, since it suits the 3D (take note!) quite well.
What does this even mean? The artstyle suits the 3D?

Vashu said:
Don't think there are fans who can't appreciate good and stylish art.
So art that is more true to the heritage of the series (darker and more oppressive) would automatically not be "good"? I don't think anyone is arguing for bad art here.
 

Vashu

Member
I don't get how people actually believe themselves when they type (or say) that D3 resembles WoW a LOT. Seriously, get off your high horse and look at the game for what it really is and will be.

You 'hardcore' fans really have a lot of faith in the guys and girls working at Blizzard, and I bet they are disappointed by the vocality of those who state that this is bad art. Or they could just laugh at how artistically challenged they are for not seeing the difference between the D3 style and Warcraft III. Not to mention the 'dread' some people feel for this (only slight) alteration of style.

Honestly, are those people blind?

Durante said:
What does this even mean? The artstyle suits the 3D?

Sorry, I jumbled with words there. I meant to say that the new 3D engine is probably more capable of bringing forth the artstyle in the game. More so than what was possible with D2 and it's 2D isometric view.

So art that is more true to the heritage of the series (darker and more oppressive) would automatically not be "good"? I don't think anyone is arguing for bad art here.

The artstyle for D2 was, in a way, pretty bland and generic. At least, I always thought that when it was shown ingame. I'm not saying the drawings they made were bad, but I always felt it wasn't coming to fruition in the game itself. They could've done more with it.
 

FLEABttn

Banned
emerge said:
Yes please apply real-world aesthetics to a world where the prime evils walk the earth

So does prime evil desaturate all the colors in the world, or does it add a brown/gray tint to everything, or does the evil block out the sun?

Help me here because I really don't know the answer to this one.
 

laserbeam

Banned
Vashu said:
I don't get how people actually believe themselves when they type (or say) that D3 resembles WoW a LOT. Seriously, get off your high horse and look at the game for what it really is and will be.

You 'hardcore' fans really have a lot of faith in the guys and girls working at Blizzard, and I bet they are disappointed by the vocality of those who state that this is bad art. Or they could just laugh at how artistically challenged they are for not seeing the difference between the D3 style and Warcraft III. Not to mention the 'dread' some people feel for this (only slight) alteration of style.

Honestly, are those people blind?



Sorry, I jumbled with words there. I meant to say that the new 3D engine is probably more capable of bringing forth the artstyle in the game. More so than what was possible with D2 and it's 2D isometric view.



The artstyle for D2 was, in a way, pretty bland and generic. At least, I always thought that when it was shown ingame. I'm not saying the drawings they made were bad, but I always felt it wasn't coming to fruition in the game itself. They could've done more with it.


The art style of D3 leans far more towards WoW cartoony then it does traditional Diablo. Even in the age of 2D Sprites the characters were designed to look far more realistic then cartoony.

Its not 100% WoW Cartoony but its about 85% there.

Its likely more to do with their lust for money and having the game run on every computer even ones from the 1990s then it is for artistic style.
 

syllogism

Member
laserbeam said:
The art style of D3 leans far more towards WoW cartoony then it does traditional Diablo. Even in the age of 2D Sprites the characters were designed to look far more realistic then cartoony.

Its not 100% WoW Cartoony but its about 85% there.

Its likely more to do with their lust for money and having the game run on every computer even ones from the 1990s then it is for artistic style.
You are so full of shit. Do you have any idea how much D2 sold? They chose this art style because it looks better.

ps. there's nothing cartoony about using more than 3-4 colors. Besides that, if anything, what you claim is "cartoony" is a side effect of the move to 3D

by the way, this is pretty "cartoony"

clawviper254.gif

thornedhulk339.gif
 

laserbeam

Banned
syllogism said:
You are so full of shit. Do you have any idea how much D2 sold? They chose this art style because it looks better.

ps. there's nothing cartoony about using more than 3-4 colors. If anything, what you claim is "cartoony" is a side effect of the move to 3D

I have no issue with the colors. I have issues with the Inconsistent 3D. Your right some of it is related to the fact the Game has transitioned from 2D to 3D but that doesnt change the fact they are using the same low Poly Model system World of Warcraft is made upon.

There was more detail in many of the 2D sprites then we are seeing in many of the 3D models.

Obviously there is some fantastic 3D work seen so far but there is also horrible 3D work seen as well.
 

Yoshichan

And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
Sinatar said:
Agreed. She's about to die and she hasn't even reached Baal yet!
 

Vashu

Member
I still don't see it, the D3 style doesn't even come close to the one used in WoW. And D3 using the same low-poly model als WoW? Hardly.

You actually think they'd use an engine fitted for more than 1000 gamers at once for a game where only 8 (I guess) can play together? Like I said, the 'hardcore' fans really have a lot of faith in Blizzard. Besides, what did we really see so far? A trailer and some gameplay, some screenshots and some art.

Talk about jumping to conclusions too fast.
 

phez

Banned
Durante said:
(I wonder how many of the people mindlessly bashing the fans in this thread actually played Diablo 1 and 2)

i wonder how many people are actually reading the thread :|
 

emerge

Member
FLEABttn said:
So does prime evil desaturate all the colors in the world, or does it add a brown/gray tint to everything, or does the evil block out the sun?

Help me here because I really don't know the answer to this one.

I don't fucking know first hand either, but going by Diablo I/II that'd be a yes, yes and a yes.

I think the developer panel during the WWI summed it up best. The lead designer said that they were designing Diablo III with "awesomeness" in mind. "Awesome" is not really what comes to my mind when i think of Diablo II. Rather the urge to kill everything on screen because it's so fucking depressing. Now "depressing", that's a design goal I'd like to see.
 

epmode

Member
arts&crafts said:
You bite your tongue!
He's right. Art style aside, Diablo 2 is pretty hideous, technically. Didn't age well. Messy spritework coupled with that "3D effect" on the backgrounds, yuck. The spell effects are still ridiculously cool, though.

Doesn't stop me from playing it over and over again.
 

Ether_Snake

安安安安安安安安安安安安安安安
I never played Diablo nor wanted to because it looked HORRID.

Put in bold to make sure that if anyone at Blizzard is reading this they'll know they are doing it right with the new style.

I hate the "it's so medieval that there's mud and horse shit all over the floor and everything is made of leather, metal, or straw".

I love this new style, and I'm actually interested in the game too. If they went for the old boring everyone-does-that-generic-brown-medieval-crap-style I'm not playing.

Also, it's logical that they aren't using normal maps and specular; since there is a combination of 3D assets and sprites, it would clash and you could tell the 3D stuff from the non-3D stuff, etc.
 
Flynn said:
God, that shit is ugly.
To be fair, part of what makes it "ugly" is the color overlays on the enemy sprites, which exist for convenience's sake to see the effects of freezing or poison. That stuff makes a lot more sense in motion, as they appear and dissipate over time, and obviously the spell effects themselves look a lot cooler animated.
 
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