Xbone won't see a similar turnaround.
The console sector isn't exactly a huge money maker, that's why there are so few players in this market.
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Why does Microsoft not just end this generation earlier than planned?
- Thread starter Tak3n
- Start date
Xbone won't see a similar turnaround.
The console sector isn't exactly a huge money maker, that's why there are so few players in this market.
geordiemp
Member
I for one would buy XB1 if the hardware was not a mess. Next gen consoles should of been designed with 1080 TV's at 60 Hz in mind as the number 1 bullet point. Ps4 failed with weak ass CPU....but xb1 is far far worse
I agree, for all MS money they spent it on anything BUT the console hardware. TV TV NFL Kinect, marketing you name it.
They could of bought a discrete X86 CPU, a 7870 and some GDDR5 and integrated them on a board with matched bandwidth and would of won - easily. I would be playing Xb1 now after 360 and would not have 2 x Ps4. And I made that up in 2 seconds. They could of released that with NO marketing and won...
Try 6 million, around 2:1 worldwide.
thewhitehawk
Member
They are burning money into exclusives that aren't selling or pushing new units. The worst part is that they can only pull that trick once. Once their exclusive (or "exclusives") are out, that's as much as they're ever going to make from that title. If they were investing in new studios they'd instead be able to rely on new software every other year or every three.
That's not doing fine. That is being reckless with money and the constant price drops are showcase of how despaired they are. Right now they are selling closer to half of the release price than they were to their original price. Sony still hasn't budged on their console's price and continues to outsell them every month.
I'd dislike for us to lose another gaming company, and I don't think Microsoft would exit so easily, but I strongly disagree with your sentiment that they're doing fine.
Memorabilia
Member
The last sentence gets it right.
Its way too early to panic or pull out. MS is making inroads just fine due to XBL remaining superior to PSN. Thus far, Sony seems to have taken their foot off the gas-pedal a bit for whatever reason and, as such, PSN remains mediocre by comparison. Additionally, a lot of the seemingly forced parity stuff is lessening the impact of PS4's superior hardware for now. MS will probably remain in 2nd throughout the entire Gen but it doesn't really matter as they can still be wildly profitable since most of their profit comes from XBL anyway.
Were people honestly expecting the Xbox One to do over 300K this month?
Don't get the reaction TBH -- thought everyone expected the gap for September to be big due to the Destiny bundle.
Anyway, we are jumping the gun a bit. I highly doubt the system will ever go above the PS4 in sales worldwide but already talking about ending the gen now? Too early. Give it another 4-5 years.
Don't get the reaction TBH -- thought everyone expected the gap for September to be big due to the Destiny bundle.
Anyway, we are jumping the gun a bit. I highly doubt the system will ever go above the PS4 in sales worldwide but already talking about ending the gen now? Too early. Give it another 4-5 years.
Gravy Boat
Member
I think the PS4 selling better than the Xbone is just a return to form for Sony. The PS1, PS3 and PS3 were the best selling consoles of their generations (outside of the Wii but that's not a direct competitor in the same way the Xbox is). It's awesome that MS outsold Sony in the US and the UK last gen, but honestly that was an anomaly in grand scheme of things.
There's plenty of room in this market for both consoles, but I don't think MS should ever expect to outsell Sony. The Playstation brand is just too strong. They need to differentiate themselves and offer something that Sony don't. They had great ideas with the Xbone, they just went the wrong ass way about implementing and announcing them, and their PR work last year did a ton of damage that they're still feeling the effects from.
I don't see MS winning this gen, or any gen, in terms of overall sales but they can work hard to repair the damage last year did to their brand and they will do very well this gen. Just not better than Sony, unless something radical happens.
There's plenty of room in this market for both consoles, but I don't think MS should ever expect to outsell Sony. The Playstation brand is just too strong. They need to differentiate themselves and offer something that Sony don't. They had great ideas with the Xbone, they just went the wrong ass way about implementing and announcing them, and their PR work last year did a ton of damage that they're still feeling the effects from.
I don't see MS winning this gen, or any gen, in terms of overall sales but they can work hard to repair the damage last year did to their brand and they will do very well this gen. Just not better than Sony, unless something radical happens.
SmartWaffles
Member
Compared to what Sony as a whole corp is, MS is as close to infinite $s as it can be imo, plus the Xbox division isn't bleeding that hard compared to OG Xbox and early 360 days which every hardware sell is a loss.
But on the other hand, now Xbox isn't the wonderboy Bill Gates personally wanted and cared like the OG, they probably need to cover their ass up and not rely on the corp money as 10 years ago.
Miles Quaritch
Member
It's somewhat true in the sense that the 360 was supply constrained in its most important markets (US and UK), which skews the numbers somewhat.
in a nutshell. It would also be ridiculously more expensive to start development on a whole new system when they probably haven't recouped the costs of the current one. More costly would be the perceived betrayal of the loyal customers that support the xbox one. Those guys will not expect to have support pulled, likely resulting in issues for an xbox successor.
Might as well ask why Nintendo doesn't just give up and go home
Bucket-o-roadkill
Member
Perhaps this is why MS isn't even that bothered, with Sonys problems mounting and maybe changes on the horizon.. They just wanna hang in there and pick up the pieces when the shit hits? Seems to be just a matter of time if you believe the doom and gloom forecasts which seem to spring up now and again. MS seemed keen to sell up the Xbox stuff a while back and now it's gone quiet, I do wonder if they now see a potential opportunity coming up..
I speak as a happy PS4 owner I would really dislike if MS going at this gen to completely bankrupt Sony I kinda want them to keep bankrolling Uncharted 4 and stuff
Sony "attacking" always online had a positive outcome in my opinion the Xbox One is in a better place to me as a probable future owner without all that stuff.
Gipsy Danger
Member
It's cool, guys. Phil Spencer promised PC gamers support, that will turn it all around! You'll see!
Possible because they don't want to be king of an anthill, they had greater ambitions than the miniscule, slim margins that gaming can provide. Launching a new console and wasting so much money so they can stay competitive in such a a volatile and insignificant market isn't on their agenda I'm sure.
I'm willing to bet there won't be a next Xbox, the Xbox brand will still exist but it won't be a new games console.
I'm willing to bet there won't be a next Xbox, the Xbox brand will still exist but it won't be a new games console.
since from now on compatibility (I think) will not be such a big problem,
I'd like ms tech guys to take a page out of how modern electronics consumption trends are,
and bring me a fuckin' xbone+ next year, maintaining complete compatibility with all xbone titles but with added beef.
exactly like you would have the same game running in two different pc configurations, difference being gpu/cpu being the next model in same line (or something)
keep the vision for the xbone becoming the watercooler, but take another xbone, drop in a big turbo and a intercooler and offer me this second sku option.
keep same box, packaging, marketing etc exactly the same, only with a small "+" sign being the differentiator on looks of h/w. and not double the price!
dear microsoft team, if you expect that I will keep feeding your box with money for years, then listen to me, offer h/w upgrade options. soon.
I'd like ms tech guys to take a page out of how modern electronics consumption trends are,
and bring me a fuckin' xbone+ next year, maintaining complete compatibility with all xbone titles but with added beef.
exactly like you would have the same game running in two different pc configurations, difference being gpu/cpu being the next model in same line (or something)
keep the vision for the xbone becoming the watercooler, but take another xbone, drop in a big turbo and a intercooler and offer me this second sku option.
keep same box, packaging, marketing etc exactly the same, only with a small "+" sign being the differentiator on looks of h/w. and not double the price!
dear microsoft team, if you expect that I will keep feeding your box with money for years, then listen to me, offer h/w upgrade options. soon.
Miles Quaritch
Member
#hollow
Because it probably wouldn't work. The market is more likely to reject attempts at rapid re-sets than embrace it - there's little evidence the majority of potential console owners want to see new, more powerful consoles popping up every 2 years or so.
Besides, to be blunt the major market trends since the initial launch of Xbox have changed so drastically the idea of what MS thought it was chasing is now moot and I wouldn't expect them to try a hugely risky reset in any event. I expect to see their focus and approach change going forward from that which underpinned their original Xbox vision,
Besides, to be blunt the major market trends since the initial launch of Xbox have changed so drastically the idea of what MS thought it was chasing is now moot and I wouldn't expect them to try a hugely risky reset in any event. I expect to see their focus and approach change going forward from that which underpinned their original Xbox vision,
Miles Quaritch
Member
The mobile and tablet market would disagree.
JustAnotherOtaku
Member
Imagine Sony had culled the PS3 in 2008 when it was third in sales by a long way.
apologies, I type as I talk and my laptop has this stupid bug where it double lines all the time... re sorted it
Yep. Wii regularly sold double what the PS3 and 360 did. I guess core gaming was doomed back in 2006-2009. Sony and Microsoft should have just ended the gen there. Heck, we could have probably had the PS5 and Xbox 4 by now if they did!
They may, if they are still interested in consoles. Not in like 3 years, but possibly earlier than Sony - who will obviously want things to keep going for as long as possible.
If stacked ram comes along and really makes a difference to performance, then they could get a noticable bump over PS4
They could do it smartly while keeping BC or forward compatibility if they keep the same x86 architecture. So moving toward more like an ios model where you can have a couple of models on the go at once, and consumers can choose which they prefer based on price/performance.
If stacked ram comes along and really makes a difference to performance, then they could get a noticable bump over PS4
They could do it smartly while keeping BC or forward compatibility if they keep the same x86 architecture. So moving toward more like an ios model where you can have a couple of models on the go at once, and consumers can choose which they prefer based on price/performance.
It will be awhile before second place even earns them money.
They have dropped price way ahead of scehdule and numerous promotions have meant they have had to absorb a lot of losses.
Also a shrinking userbase will have a very big effect on xbl driven profit.
Every exclusive and 3rd party tie in that cost them money has failed, Madden still sold more on PS4 and caused an insignificant sales bump in hardware for MS.
Huge revenue spend, profitability from hardware gone due the huge drop in price within a year and failures in philosophy and design from the get go.
That Tomb Raider deal looks more and more absurd as time goes by, will cost money and do nothing for sales.
They have dropped price way ahead of scehdule and numerous promotions have meant they have had to absorb a lot of losses.
Also a shrinking userbase will have a very big effect on xbl driven profit.
Every exclusive and 3rd party tie in that cost them money has failed, Madden still sold more on PS4 and caused an insignificant sales bump in hardware for MS.
Huge revenue spend, profitability from hardware gone due the huge drop in price within a year and failures in philosophy and design from the get go.
That Tomb Raider deal looks more and more absurd as time goes by, will cost money and do nothing for sales.
Yeah but, the PS3 was selling more than the 360 worldwide from launch onward. Sony knew they would catch up.
Microsoft will never catch up this gen.
Still, Microsoft has that long money. Loooooong money. I see them keeping the X1 afloat no matter how much they're whipped in sales in the coming years.
N30RYU
Member
No, sony hit they in the specs.
MS couldn't foresee sony releasing a better machine due to sony financial situation, and they failed as much a nintendo failed releasing a low-spec/last-gen console not investing with all the money they get with the redesigned gamecube.
If the Xbox One were more powerful than the PS4, MS could may have carry away with all the anti consumer bullshit and be leading right now.
MS and Nintendo arrogance (and sony last gen with PS3) is what lead them where they are (or were)... now they are trying to correct their mistakes... nintendo only can wait to appeal the WiiU consumers with first party games... and satisfy them to encourage to given the time move to the next nintendo (hopping a N64 level of amaze) console, and MS just try and release exclusive games to try and shorten the gap, or maybe try parity clauses, indi bullshits or exclusive (not-yet-confirmed-timed) with the money they didn't spend in good hardware or new studios
I wouldn't call them failures and/or insignificant. The system would obviously be in a worse spot without those deals.
Windom Earle
Banned
This is a great post.
- Leaving out Xbone's biggest problem, the public perception of the brand which persists
- "slightly" less powerful (40% power difference can be the jump to another GPU generation in the PC market) Of course that can still be called a slight difference if you want to spin a certain narrative.
- Stealth parity praise
- Downplaying of PC version advantages (which is again subjective). It could be argued that the difference between PC and consoles has never been bigger this early into the genration.
JustAnotherOtaku
Member
Was it? I can't remember accurate numbers, but I seem to remember Europe taking to the 360 in places like the UK, far more early on than PS3.
Same applies to 3DS as well. It was a sales disaster for the first few months of its life yet look at it now.
it'd be a bad move
are you fucking kidding me
I don't even know where to start with this post
[imagine this is a block of text]
tldr you're wrong
are you fucking kidding me
I don't even know where to start with this post
[imagine this is a block of text]
tldr you're wrong
Power really doesn't have much to do with it. PS4 would more than likely still do better if the specs between the two were switched.
PS4 got a huge advantage from being the cheaper box for new gen multiplats alone. Combine that with the PS4 being part of the more popular gaming brand worldwide & Xbox One not having a head start and boom -- these are the results; PS4 greatly ahead of Xbox One in worldwide sales.
samurai1226
Member
Both consoles are pretty disappointing hardware-wise. Usally Sony and MS sold their consoles for a loss the first years to bring powerful consoles that can hold on to mediumclass pcs for quite a time. Now both wanted to make profit from day 1 but the consoles are not able to fullfill the needs of the new engines the studios are working on (UE4, Frostbite 3, Snowdrop, etc).
Me and a lot of my friends switched to pc to get the full nextgen graphics in 1080p60 for upcoming games. I really hope this generation will not last more than 5 years, 360 und PS3 blocked the technical progress long enough. Crysis 1 can still hold up to modern games and that game is 7 years old!
Me and a lot of my friends switched to pc to get the full nextgen graphics in 1080p60 for upcoming games. I really hope this generation will not last more than 5 years, 360 und PS3 blocked the technical progress long enough. Crysis 1 can still hold up to modern games and that game is 7 years old!
That's a poor comparison and you know it.
And the games would be limited by having to run on the weakest hardware. Devs won't give console owners limited graphics options, I doubt they'd be own to having to make their games work on multiple hardware revisions of each platform.
the wii u wasn't early. it was late. all three of the current consoles were late. last gen went on for way too long. but it's not like having an early console is a curse. the genesis replaced the master system after just three years of the master system being on the market. the 360 replaced the xbox after four years. blaming all the failures of failed consoles on one aspect is really lazy.
Stardust_Comet
Neo Member
Why would MS do that? That would be a dumb move on their part.
The current XB had a lot of changes and revamping done to it months before its release. This is a problem that shows in the fact it has less power than the PS4, when normally this is something the XBs have been known to be superior in before, and how they had to have a lot of OS updates to fix up those little bugs they didn't have the time to stamp out before its release.
You don't rush a great game console. MS should not be ending the XBone's life too early. Instead, they should use this time before the next console generation to work on making the next console even greater and to play test the hell out of it to make sure no problems could be left in it so that it'll run perfectly on its release date.
Consider each game console gen a step in the direction of progress. With each gaming gen that happens, they're just closer to the product that people will consider a household essential.
The current XB had a lot of changes and revamping done to it months before its release. This is a problem that shows in the fact it has less power than the PS4, when normally this is something the XBs have been known to be superior in before, and how they had to have a lot of OS updates to fix up those little bugs they didn't have the time to stamp out before its release.
You don't rush a great game console. MS should not be ending the XBone's life too early. Instead, they should use this time before the next console generation to work on making the next console even greater and to play test the hell out of it to make sure no problems could be left in it so that it'll run perfectly on its release date.
Consider each game console gen a step in the direction of progress. With each gaming gen that happens, they're just closer to the product that people will consider a household essential.
Memorabilia
Member
This is one of the most important - but least talked about - benefits of moving both console platforms to similar x86 architectures. Moving forward into the next gen(s) backward compatibility should become much easier to implement over multiple successive gens. Hopefully MS and Sony both realize the value of this and their next consoles will inherently take advantage of this.
Ummm so OP is suggesting that they end support early again like the original Xbox? Doing that to two of your three consoles doesn't instill much confidence in your fanbase. Who the hell will buy their console except for the diehard fans if MS is just going to take their ball and go home every time they lose in sales?
SuperRaddy
Member
If the system is selling better than the 360 was at the same point in its lifetime then Microsoft has nothing to worry about. It would only be at a time when figures don't begin to stack up and actual sales start to decline to below what the historic sales of the 360 performed st the same point in lifetime to date sales, then even then microsoft may market differently, change price strategy.
Just because the xb1 is a weaker console then the ps4 doesn't mean that Microsoft are not turning a profit, you don't have to be the market leader to "win". The notion of winning is absurd, as long as sales meet or beat the sales of the 360 then Microsoft is already in a better position.
You also don't go just realease a new console earlier This will just piss off the existing fan base who have spend their hard earned cash.
What Microsoft needs to do is perhaps entice current Xbox 360 users across to their new system because if those users are still on last ten systems ps360 then clearly not everything is about pixels and frame rate.
Just because the xb1 is a weaker console then the ps4 doesn't mean that Microsoft are not turning a profit, you don't have to be the market leader to "win". The notion of winning is absurd, as long as sales meet or beat the sales of the 360 then Microsoft is already in a better position.
You also don't go just realease a new console earlier This will just piss off the existing fan base who have spend their hard earned cash.
What Microsoft needs to do is perhaps entice current Xbox 360 users across to their new system because if those users are still on last ten systems ps360 then clearly not everything is about pixels and frame rate.
Too soon my friend. Too soon.
I don't get why many people can't see why MS being in this position is just perfect for us gamers.
If there ever was an incentive for MS to finally listen to us and deliver quality gaming experiences its now. Because of the uphill struggle facing them, they are left with their backs against the walls and look how we have forced them to deliver on changes:
Phil Spencer has already gone on record to say that he's going to vary his approach from that of his predecessors by focusing on fostering more exclusive titles associated with the Xbox brand.
The Xbox One isn't flopping. It's just getting its ass handed over to it by Sony but that will just ensure a greater fightback from them.
Its sink or swim time for MS and they know it.
I don't get why many people can't see why MS being in this position is just perfect for us gamers.
If there ever was an incentive for MS to finally listen to us and deliver quality gaming experiences its now. Because of the uphill struggle facing them, they are left with their backs against the walls and look how we have forced them to deliver on changes:
Phil Spencer has already gone on record to say that he's going to vary his approach from that of his predecessors by focusing on fostering more exclusive titles associated with the Xbox brand.
The Xbox One isn't flopping. It's just getting its ass handed over to it by Sony but that will just ensure a greater fightback from them.
Its sink or swim time for MS and they know it.
I don't think MS are entirely wrong with their entertainment approach, they just went too far and botched the hardware along with Kinect 2.0 that should be sitting in labs at this moment in time rather than a consumer device.
To the OP, they aren't going to cut and run quite so soon, they can still carve out something while licking their wounds. I think 5 years if the PS4 wipes the floor with them.
To the OP, they aren't going to cut and run quite so soon, they can still carve out something while licking their wounds. I think 5 years if the PS4 wipes the floor with them.
on the flipside they were even more constrained by the crazy specific architecture of the ps3, which has limited profitability (and the ability to get low enough on price to properly target the children's market like microsoft did with 360, kinect and minecraft to some success, and the parts of the wordwide market that kept the ps2 selling for years and years), through the generation despite selling more in pure numbers in the worldwide market.
it would still have been a terrible idea for them though and the ps4's success started with the ps3's comeback
jimbobsmells
Member
I see MS maybe doing a 'relaunch' of the brand somehow once they release the inevitable XB1 slim. Not the hardware.
XB1 is doing fine right now, they are still excellent competition to Sony and are setting record sales for the division.
Although saying that I 100% except them to be first out of the gate with the next round of consoles. It won't be ANY time soon though OP.
XB1 is doing fine right now, they are still excellent competition to Sony and are setting record sales for the division.
Although saying that I 100% except them to be first out of the gate with the next round of consoles. It won't be ANY time soon though OP.
The most understated reason for the PS4's current success, right there.
poopninjamvc3mk
I sucked six dicks to get this tag.
Thank god OP doesn't work at MS