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[Dorfdad]

Serious question with all of the PS5 and Xbox series consoles that are out there Why do the developers not embrace mouse and keyboard more?

Most of these games release on pc as well and support them, while there console ports seem to remove them.

Sure there are some outliers that support m/k but it seems there are so many genres and games that would sell well / benefit from m/k support as well.

There are tons of genres of games that should be able to be played on these consoles that just aren’t I know many people who have them sitting on their desk just like a PC. What is the harm or what is the reasoning that they don’t want to include mouse and keyboard support??

Consoles now support 60fps even 120fps and while it’s not 240 or 360hz as PC can do I don’t see a valid reason for this not to become normal.

Am I missing something?

 

[Mossybrew]

Hmmm let's see, use a mouse and keyboard to control a game while sitting on the couch? Highly awkward. Use a mouse and keyboard, which was not designed to play videogames at all, vs. a controller specifically designed to play games.

Pretty easy to see there's very little demand for such a setup.

 

[Chastten]

Apart from some people on Neogaf that I see pictures of, I know LITERALLY no one in real life who has their console placed on their desk.

This is just a guess, but I'd say at least 90% of all console users have their consoles under their TV, making KB/M setups pointless.

And that's besides the obvious, if you want KB/M, why not just get a PC?

 

[Topher]

Apart from some people on Neogaf that I see pictures of, I know LITERALLY no one in real life who has their console placed on their desk.

This is just a guess, but I'd say at least 90% of all console users have their consoles under their TV, making KB/M setups pointless.

And that's besides the obvious, if you want KB/M, why not just get a PC?

Typically that's what I do, but there are times when I like to trophy hunt on PS5. So for some games like Far Cry, I definitely want keyboard and mouse but can't do that on PS5. That's a really specific example though and probably not prevalent enough for devs to go to the trouble. Although I'm not sure how much trouble that actually is considering they have to do this for PC.

 

[Dorfdad]

Apart from some people on Neogaf that I see pictures of, I know LITERALLY no one in real life who has their console placed on their desk.

This is just a guess, but I'd say at least 90% of all console users have their consoles under their TV, making KB/M setups pointless.

And that's besides the obvious, if you want KB/M, why not just get a PC?

Because consoles can graphically handle 98% of all game currently. Why should someone have to spend 1000+ to match the ps5 specs? I have a gaming pc but why not allow these to also be “pc” gaming consoles? What does it hurt it’s an option

 

[RoadHazard]

Because consoles are typically played in front of the TV, and while you might have a sofa table you probably don't keep a mouse and keyboard there.

 

[Dorfdad]

Typically that's what I do, but there are times when I like to trophy hunt on PS5. So for some games like Far Cry, I definitely want keyboard and mouse but can't do that on PS5. That's a really specific example though and probably not prevalent enough for devs to go to the trouble. Although I'm not sure how much trouble that actually is considering they have to do this for PC.

Is it really trouble when they already have the code for m/k from of versions? It’s just adding code in nothing hardware related / specific.

 

[SEGAvangelist]

Seems like an easy addition, so yeah. I think it should be an option in a lot of games.

 

[Dorfdad]

Because consoles are typically played in front of the TV, and while you might have a sofa table you probably don't keep a mouse and keyboard there.

I hear you and get that, however why have 4k/120 when the ps5 launched when the average home owner had 1080p tv sets such a waste… I’m being sarcastic of course but it’s kinda similar?

 

[Topher]

Is it really trouble when they already have the code for m/k from of versions? It’s just adding code in nothing hardware related / specific.

I don't know. Doesn't seem like it would be, does it?

 

[RoadHazard]

I hear you and get that, however why have 4k/120 when the ps5 launched when the average home owner had 1080p tv sets such a waste… I’m being sarcastic of course but it’s kinda similar?

Pretty sure 4K TVs have been the most common for quite a few years now.

 

[rofif]

Because it needs a surface to play on, is expensive, cumbersome and the fact that it works for gaming is a side effect of it's purpose.
Because games are more than just 360 headshots. Analog movement and triggers are cool

 

[Chastten]

Because consoles can graphically handle 98% of all game currently. Why should someone have to spend 1000+ to match the ps5 specs? I have a gaming pc but why not allow these to also be “pc” gaming consoles? What does it hurt it’s an option

You could also grab a controller for your PC and ditch your consoles. That way you get the best of both worlds

But in all seriousness, probably just a matter of costs. Sure, it probably wouldn't cost the developer all that much to implement one more control scheme, but it would be unnecesary costs as barely anyone would use it.

 

[Holammer]

Console games and especially competitive ones should add support for kb+m. Controller players would whittle away by a Darwinian selection-like process.

If they finally got around to release League of Legends: Wild Rift on consoles, it would be a perfect test case. Play with a clumsy controller or enjoy the laser precision offered by a mouse? If you play to win, the solution is simple.

 

[Dorfdad]

I’d love to play some RTS/ MMOs and other games in a closed system where I didn’t have to worry about stuff. FF Online is a great example it plays on ps5 with m/k lovely!

However Baldurs gate 3 which is a major title doesn’t support it even though it was designed around it. Why are options for controls bad? Would t that set you console apart from another??

 

[SEGAvangelist]

You could also grab a controller for your PC and ditch your consoles. That way you get the best of both worlds

But in all seriousness, probably just a matter of costs. Sure, it probably wouldn't cost the developer all that much to implement one more control scheme, but it would be unnecesary costs as barely anyone would use it.

It wouldn't cost a thing for games already using the controls on PC.

 

[RoadHazard]

You could also grab a controller for your PC and ditch your consoles. That way you get the best of both worlds

But in all seriousness, probably just a matter of costs. Sure, it probably wouldn't cost the developer all that much to implement one more control scheme, but it would be unnecesary costs as barely anyone would use it.

Most people probably don't want a big PC tower in the living room. Yeah, yeah, the PS5 is huge etc, but it's small compared to a good gaming PC. And yeah, you could get a long HDMI cable and keep the PC elsewhere, but then you've got that cable going between two rooms or whatever. It's just something most people won't want to bother with.

 

[rofif]

Most people probably don't want a big PC tower in the living room. Yeah, yeah, the PS5 is huge etc, but it's small compared to a good gaming PC. And yeah, you could get a long HDMI cable and keep the PC elsewhere, but then you've got that cable going between two rooms or whatever. It's just something most people won't want to bother with.

ps5 is not only small compared to pc but it's silent. I have phanteks p600s case with be quiet fans locked to max 800rpm... and it's still way louder than ps5. Just sayin because it's fine

 

[Zoloft]

If you want the PC experience GO for a PC.
Plz let consoles for the casual player.
Less nerdy is always better.

 

[Chastten]

Most people probably don't want a big PC tower in the living room. Yeah, yeah, the PS5 is huge etc, but it's small compared to a good gaming PC. And yeah, you could get a long HDMI cable and keep the PC elsewhere, but then you've got that cable going between two rooms or whatever. It's just something most people won't want to bother with.

Not really though? I can build a good gaming PC (outperforming a PS5 easily) with a way smaller footprint than either a PS5 or a fullsize keyboard. If you have room for either of those, you have room for a good PC. I mean, it isn't necesarily the quietest system, but it's damn good. But the whole PC thing was a joke anyways, I actually prefer Switch over PC myself, even though I have a PC way more powerful than any console out there

 

[RoadHazard]

Not really though? I can build a good gaming PC (outperforming a PS5 easily) with a way smaller footprint than either a PS5 or a fullsize keyboard. If you have room for either of those, you have room for a good PC. I mean, it isn't necesarily the quietest system, but it's damn good. But the whole PC thing was a joke anyways, I actually prefer Switch over PC myself, even though I have a PC way more powerful than any console out there

Yeah, the PS5 is mainly that large to keep it quiet, a lot of the volume and most of the weight is the cooling system. They probably could have made it the size of the PS4 Pro, but then it would have sounded like it too, and nobody liked that.

 

[LazyParrot]

99.999% of console gamers don't game at their desk, and they don't want to play against MKB players online.

 

[Robb]

I wouldn’t use it and my guess is 99% of console gamers wouldn’t use it either. That’s probably the reason.

I’m all for it though, more options are only a good thing. I’d personally like to see more Gyro implementations. Would be nice if MS could update their controllers with actual hardware rather than a million different paint jobs.

 

[willothedog]

Most people probably don't want a big PC tower in the living room. Yeah, yeah, the PS5 is huge etc, but it's small compared to a good gaming PC. And yeah, you could get a long HDMI cable and keep the PC elsewhere, but then you've got that cable going between two rooms or whatever. It's just something most people won't want to bother with.

If only matx based systems existed.....

 

[killatopak]

I'd rather not. Just on competitive MP alone there are already abusers. Like PC users using controllers to enable aim assists. Being used on console would further fragment it leading to controller or keyboard only servers. That's just MP alone.

I can be in bed, on the couch or standing while playing with a controller, less storage space especially for multiple user games like fighting games or party games.

Really the only reason I would support for KBM are certain games like RTS which are highly optimized for KBM usage.

 

[Del_X]

Because just buy a PC at that point jfc

 

[Cyberpunkd]

Use a mouse and keyboard, which was not designed to play videogames at all, vs. a controller specifically designed to play games.

Baldur’s Gate 3 enters the chat.

 

[rodrigolfp]

Because for some reason people likes aim assists, claw grip, L3/R3, weapon wheels, slow interface navigation/inventory management...

 

[rodrigolfp]

Hmmm let's see, use a mouse and keyboard to control a game while sitting on the couch? Highly awkward. Use a mouse and keyboard, which was not designed to play videogames at all, vs. a controller specifically designed to play games.

Pretty easy to see there's very little demand for such a setup.

I use kb mouse on a mattress and you think it's awkward use on a couch?

Those "designed for games" controllers still suffers more with deficiencies for games than kb+mouse not designed for games. The irony.

Most people probably don't want a big PC tower in the living room.

Build a tiny tower.

 

[Beer Baelly]

 

[T4keD0wN]

Use a mouse and keyboard, which was not designed to play videogames at all, vs. a controller specifically designed to play games.

 

[Danjin44]

I have been console player all my life and never once used M&K, I just more comfortable with controller.

 

[RoboFu]

eww. Why would they want to ?

 

[SlimeGooGoo]

Because when you buy a console, you get a controller.

So developers know that the only guarantee is that players have at least one controller with them.
Mouse and keyboard is not guaranteed

It's a simple choice.

 

[Kataploom]

Hmmm let's see, use a mouse and keyboard to control a game while sitting on the couch? Highly awkward. Use a mouse and keyboard, which was not designed to play videogames at all, vs. a controller specifically designed to play games.

Pretty easy to see there's very little demand for such a setup.

Many people, specially young people, play consoles attached to a monitors on a computer desk, that's why Series S is kinda popular in Latinoamérica. Curiously enough I do use them from couch sometimes when I play multiplayer shooters with my friends (for the rest I just use controller).

I also wished mouse and keyboard were more common on consoles, that way console players not also have more choices but also they'd also be able to compete against PC players.

Also, I suspect all this PC gaming boom came out because streamers played LoL and other PC only games, that way consoles could also eat from that market for budget players.

 

[intbal]

There are 170 games on Xbox with mouse and keyboard support.
I suspect the number for Playstation is similar.

 

[rodrigolfp]

I have been console player all my life and never once used M&K, I just more comfortable with controller.

How do you know if you never used?

Because when you buy a console, you get a controller.

So developers know that the only guarantee is that players have at least one controller with them.
Mouse and keyboard is not guaranteed

It's a simple choice.

No one is saying to drop controller support.

 

[Danjin44]

How do you know if you never used?

I just never felt I need one, the type of games I mostly play controler is more than enough for me.

 

[rodrigolfp]

There are 170 games on Xbox with mouse and keyboard support.
I suspect the number for Playstation is similar.

Sadly several exclusives still don't have.

 

[BlackTron]

It's maddening how haphazard m/kb support is on console. This is why I bought RDR2 on PC instead of console, even though I wanted the convenience of a console/controller for that type of game on TV. Now I have to switch things around and use my laptop, but when I start shooting, I can switch my right hand to the mouse on my armrest and get dead aim accuracy without the lock on bullshit. (Yes I used both for this game, controller for open world extended game couch comfiness and just grab mouse when things get heated). Why not have that option on the console? It takes nothing away.

It's just complete dice roll whether you are locked out of mouse/kb for FPS games, but it's gotten much better. Some big games have mouse/kb support on console now. COD, Fortnite, Halo. Overall support sucks, but if you are a kb/mouse player you can get by now instead of just dismissing it as totally useless if it's all you have available.

Because when you buy a console, you get a controller.

So developers know that the only guarantee is that players have at least one controller with them.
Mouse and keyboard is not guaranteed

It's a simple choice.

That doesn't make any sense to me, devs don't have to choose between controller and mouse. They can just add support for mouse as an option. Loads of PC games use both, they just pull the mouse support for console version. Should they pull controller support for PC because it didn't come with one?

 

[SmokedMeat]

They’ve got $70-$200 controllers to sell. There’s no royalties from a mouse/keyboard purchase.

 

[SlimeGooGoo]

No one is saying to drop controller support.

Which is... my point?
I said they don't support keyboards and mouses often because there is no guarantee the consumer has either alongside their console.
With controllers it's a 100% guarantee to be true.

That doesn't make any sense to me, devs don't have to choose between controller and mouse. They can just add support for mouse as an option. Loads of PC games use both, they just pull the mouse support for console version. Should they pull controller support for PC because it didn't come with one?

Which is... my point?
But they don't do it because most people play with their controllers. It's the only guarantee.

Also, it would require them adjust their UI for a niche of their userbase (navigation, size, events, all that stuff)

 

[BlackTron]

Which is... my point?
But they don't do it because most people play with their controllers. It's the only guarantee.

Also, it would require them adjust their UI for a niche of their userbase (navigation, size, events, all that stuff)

Huh? Why do you need a guarantee to have an option? Bizarre answer.

"We decided to lock our game at 1080p because even though many people have 4k, 1080 is the only guarantee. Therefore we have removed the option dropdown from settings"

They don't have to redo the UI, it is already done from PC version. They just remove all the work done already for console version.

 

[rodrigolfp]

Which is... my point?
I said they don't support keyboards and mouses often because there is no guarantee the consumer has either alongside their console.
With controllers it's a 100% guarantee to be true.


Which is... my point?
But they don't do it because most people play with their controllers. It's the only guarantee.

Also, it would require them adjust their UI for a niche of their userbase (navigation, size, events, all that stuff)

Your point doesn't make any sense as many games already have m+kb support and almost all of them don't have or need UI changes and the ones that have changes had already the PC version done it for them as it is very ease for devs to do it

 

[adamsapple]

There's a decent and growing list of games that support KB+M on Xbox, this is not a complete list but should give you a good idea:

All Xbox Games With Mouse & Keyboard Support

The latest keyboard & mouse list for Xbox One, Series X, Series S

www.purexbox.com

 

[OverHeat]

Console gamers like auto aim

 

[Stuart360]

I'm a PC only player and i use controllers in 99% of the games i play. In fact the only games i dont use a controller is with really old games that have no controller support.

 

[Fabieter]

To ensure that devs dont care to optimize controls for pc usual games?

 

[Mibu no ookami]

I think OPs argument here is that it makes a lot of sense financially for studios to support KB/M on console as an option. It costs little given that the controls are already mapped out and it might get more people who prefer PC gaming to play on Console. Could also open up people playing various genres on console that just play much better with a kb/m.

Not everything has to be a silver bullet.

 

[SlimeGooGoo]

Huh? Why do you need a guarantee to have an option? Bizarre answer.

"We decided to lock our game at 1080p because even though many people have 4k, 1080 is the only guarantee. Therefore we have removed the option dropdown from settings"

They don't have to redo the UI, it is already done from PC version. They just remove all the work done already for console version.

Your point doesn't make any sense as many games already have m+kb support and almost all of them don't have or need UI changes and the ones that have changes had already the PC version done it for them as it is very ease for devs to do it

It's a common practice to support first and foremost the DEFAULT input method in any platform you develop for.

The DEFAULT input method for consoles is the gamepad
The DEFAULT input method for PC is mouse + keyboard
The DEFAULT input method for mobile is the touch screen

ANYTHING ELSE is extra work and NOT GUARANTEED for the end consumer to have readily available.

You people are assuming every developer use Unreal Engine and has that feature available out of the box.
A lot of developers have engines with very poor support for mouse + keyboard, and UI that only works with controllers.

They usually outsource the PC porting to other companies, as some companies lack the time and personnel to get the job done.