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Wii 2 (Project Cafe): Officially Announced, Playable At E3, Launching 2012 [Updated]

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H

herzogzwei1989

Banned
AceBandage said:
The problem with Samaritan is that it's running on 3 580s. That's three of the best GPUs out on the market TODAY.
Now, let's say, theoretically, they get it running perfectly on a single 580. That 580 uses more power and heat than the entire 360 console.
Regardless of what Epic wants, the next generation of consoles are not going to run Samaritan as it is without serious neutering.
Click to expand...


We'll see, if PS4 uses a Maxwell-generation GPU, it will probably be able to run Samaritan just fine. Not trying to be a Sony fanboy here, just saying.
 
A

AceBandage

Banned
herzogzwei1989 said:
We'll see, if PS4 uses a Maxwell-generation GPU, it will probably be able to run Samaritan just fine. Not trying to be a Sony fanboy here, just saying.
Click to expand...


Sure, and launch in 2014 at $500 again.
 
ipukespiders

ipukespiders

Member
I hope at E3 they mention if they will support backwards compatibility for Wii/VC/Wiiware/(gamecube?) titles. A new online strategy would remove all current titles online capabilities, but I could live with that.

Not expecting upscaling, but it would be nice. Actually, I expect them to resell us the same games again in HD.
 
A

AceBandage

Banned
ipukespiders said:
I hope at E3 they mention if they will support backwards compatibility for Wii/VC/Wiiware/(gamecube?) titles. A new online strategy would remove all current titles online capabilities, but I could live with that.

Not expecting upscaling, but it would be nice. Actually, I expect them to resell us the same games again in HD.
Click to expand...


Wii and GC BC is all but confirmed. VC should be possible in the same way that DSi->3DS is.
As for online, dunno about that.
 
F

Fat Goron

Member
What about this?

t_cryengine3_gdc11_excz7no.gif


Not talking about Café itself, but about the next generation as a whole.....
 
linko9

linko9

Member
So people keep mentioning the insane horsepower required to run the Samaritan demo, but wasn't that at an above-1080p resolution? With some optimization, I wouldn't be surprised at all if the next generation of consoles could run that at 720p; or even less if they have to; I'm not convinced that upscaled 540p gaming is going away after this generation. Devs will continue to go for effects over resolution in most cases. I do doubt that the Cafe would be able to run Samaritan at any resolution, because it's using technology that already exists, while Sony and MS can wait until the technology is ready for their consoles to run something like the Samaritan demo. I think that at least Sony still cares way too much about being a graphical powerhouse, so they'll make sure their console can push come crazy pixels. They might be in for a surprise when nobody cares though. As I say, most CoD players don't need their game to look any better than it does now. So what this means for Cafe is that as long as they can get the 3rd party support, the graphical disadvantage to the PS4 and 720 won't really matter all that much.
 
A

antonz

Member
Fat Goron said:
What about this?

http://h-6.abload.de/img/t_cryengine3_gdc11_excz7no.gif

Not talking about Café itself, but about the next generation as a whole.....[/QUOTE]

Cryengine 3 is currently running on this gens HD consoles. We will just see it run even better with the more advanced features on Cafe etc
Click to expand...
 
A

antonz

Member
From The Dust said:
Epic did say that with some optimization, they can run the demo on one 580.
Click to expand...
They said they think they can get it down to 1 580. Even then its gonna take alot more than just some optimization.
 
A

ace3skoot

Member
Log4Girlz said:
Ok, uses and ideas for a 6 inch touch-sensitive display (by all means list what you want to see as well). I like the idea of 1, 2, 7 and 9 most.

1. Using the display as a track pad, replacing the use of a mouse in games like an RTS or Tower Defense game

2. A mid-way decent keyboard. Would make social games and anything demanding typing fun. I can imagine a typing of the dead like game, but it would have to played solely on the controller.

3. Your own display during an FPS, reducing cheating in local multiplayer

4. Showing alternate camera angles. Perhaps on one screen i'm in first person view, because I think its cool, and on the second display I'm in 3rd person, giving a wider field of view. Or perhaps a top down perspective

5. Showing lesser, though still useful HUD elements in the controller. Like Radar, item durability/degradation/MAP

6. An always up inventory screen. Any item you need is a glance and touch away

7. Drawing Tablet. Imagine Mario Paint or any sort of custom art that could be added to a game

8. Alternative filter. Imagine an always on X-ray mode

9. Displaying an area in alternative state or time-line. I mentioned earlier, how about a Zelda game where you enter an area in the present, only to see the area in the past or future on the tablet. You can then tap the tablet to travel to the time displayed to solve a puzzle.

10. Having hints and tutorial elements display on the controller so they can be effectively skipped by advanced players by simply ignoring the fucking screen.

11. Playing a totally separate quest/game/section on the second display concurrently to the main screen. Imagine a game like Pikmin 2 where you always had your partner on the other screen. Or perhaps you're in an FPS and you've set up a drone sniping station. When you see the target of interest pop up on the second screen, use it to take him out.

12. The ability to create a screen full of customizable buttons and macros.

13. Touch enable special abilities. Run your finger vertically to have Samus turn into a morph ball and launch herself, depending on the speed of your gesture in the direction of your touch. Honestly I saw what they did with Drake jumping over an obstacle in NGP and thought it was cool.

14. Cinematic cutscenes could play on the second screen, saving you the hassle of sitting through one or skipping one in some jarring manner.
Click to expand...

Play 3d and traditional top-down zelda...at the same time!

it would be funny to see what all the zelda fans bitch about next -_-
 
F

From The Dust

Banned
antonz said:
They said they think they can get it down to 1 580. Even then its gonna take alot more than just some optimization.
Click to expand...

which is why I don't think we will see that level on consoles for quite some time. 2014? I have no clue
 
A

AlphaDragoon

Member
Log4Girlz said:
I'm gonna repost this from another thread. With everything we know (Reference BMF's post), what do you expect from the Cafe:



Scenario 1: Xbox 360 level (not much more or less)

Scenario 2: Notch above 360 (running current gen games, regardless of complexity at 1080p)

Scenario 3: Significantly above 360 (running any current game games at 1080p, 60fps with improves textures and IQ)

Scenario 4: Next-gen .5 (Runs current-gen games as listed above, but in addition has just enough horsepower to create innovative new engines to provide graphics and performance never before seen at home, but below expectations for the next Xbox and Playstation)

Scenario 5: True Next-Gen (Xbox 720 or PS4 level, or just a hair or two below)
Click to expand...

I'd say scenario 4 if optimistic, scenario 3 more likely. I don't think Nintendo is totally gonna drop the ball on the graphical capabilities of the machine if they want third parties and the CoD crowd to come back to them.
 
N

NotGameboy

Banned
boyshine said:
Why is last gen amount of RAM maximum for a console released 6 years later in your opinion?
Click to expand...

Because it's Nintendo. They will probably dedicate a good chunk of the 512 MB to that expensive "fast RAM".
 
D

Darryl

Banned
Log4Girlz said:
Ok, uses and ideas for a 6 inch touch-sensitive display (by all means list what you want to see as well).
Click to expand...

I posted about this a bit ago, but one of the greatest uses I can see for the touchpad would be the ability to separate itself from the console/TV for family use. A family can be playing a Blu-Ray DVD on the main TV off the console, and you can let your kids play pre-downloaded (possibly streamed from online?) games on their own individual controllers. Greater control over what your kids watch, keep TVs out of their rooms, etc. Would be a great marketing tool to get the console inside more family homes.
 
B

beje

Banned
From The Dust said:
which is why I don't think we will see that level on consoles for quite some time. 2014? I have no clue
Click to expand...

At soonest. What people still doesn't realise is that you don't magically get a more powerful console out of thin air, it just doesn't work like "hey, I'd like a GTX580 in my next console, start manufacturing now". During this gen, PC graphics cards have been getting more and more huge, even the mid range ones, and there hasn't been any steps in optimisation (getting things smaller and more power efficient). My GTS250 (~HD4850) is a size monster and requires a 500W power supply, and yet it's still the smallest bare minimum to get modern games running at decent speeds and IQ at 1080p. Café is probably pushing the second best graphics card you can sensibly shove in a console heat and consumption wise while still getting a good price tag (speculated as an HD4760 more or less). There's almost nothing above that wouldn't require special refrigeration and/or a PC-sized power supply or case so the only options for PS4/720 would be...
a) wait for 2014 -> "you're too late, we're already supporting just the PC and this one" like the GC and Xbox suffered 10 years ago.
b) release on 2012 -> 500$ consoles + repeat the RROD fuck-up with an over-the-top GPU prone to overheating + ramping up the dev costs EVEN MORE
c) go for the "OK, good enough, but not overkill" route Café is probably taking
Being (c) the most sensible route IMHO
 
G

Gamer @ Heart

Member
Eteric Rice said:
I think that was sarcasm.

I'm expecting 1 gig. 1.5 gigs would be optimal, though. 2 gigs would be pretty awesome.
Click to expand...

Same here. If the rumors are true and Nintendo really wanted to target third parties in both architecture and specs, then it seems counter productive to go less than 1 gig. I cant imagine any third party keeping quiet about wanting more RAM.
 
A

antonz

Member
Crytek was just trying to appease gamers at that point. They shit all over their dedicated players with the latest moves.

So of course they want consoles to be more pc like next gen. Its gotta hurt them somewhere in their heart to know they went from leading the charge on graphics on PC to being just another console game maker
 
T

ThoseDeafMutes

Member
snesfreak said:
32 gigs minimum or no sale.
Also it has to be able to output 1080P to 8 TVs at once.
Click to expand...

On a more serious note, 250GB (or higher) HDD standard, 2GB unified GDDR5 RAM minimum, I shouldn't even have to mention HDMI output standard.
 
W

wsippel

Banned
ThoseDeafMutes said:
On a more serious note, 250GB (or higher) HDD standard, 2GB unified GDDR5 RAM minimum, I shouldn't even have to mention HDMI output standard.
Click to expand...
Yeah, no. Also, HDDs are already on their way out. Makes no sense to even include them anymore in a 2012 system designed to last five to eight years.
 
T

ThoseDeafMutes

Member
wsippel said:
Yeah, no. Also, HDDs are already on their way out. Makes no sense to even include them anymore in a 2012 system designed to last five to eight years.
Click to expand...

Yeah! They should put in a 128GB SSD instead.

24zyhwy.jpg




I expect around 40GB, non-proprietary HDD
Click to expand...

What would the point be? There is always a sweet spot for HDD manufacturing in terms of cost per GB. At a certain point, legacy drives like 40GB start to become more expensive than newer, larger drives. Cheapo dell laptops (the cheapest they sell) come with 250 GB HDDs standard, or 320/500 GB for a tiny cost bump. My 3 year old netbook came with a 120GB HDD.

I imagine 250-320 is where the sweet spot is for laptop drives right now. Hence, 250GB HDD would be what you'd expect them to come out with.
 
T

ThoseDeafMutes

Member
wsippel said:
I didn't say that, did I?
Click to expand...

Well what are you implying? If they go an SSD route, they are far too costly and get you an extremely low capacity. If they go internal flash storage + SD cards, then the read speeds and capacities are going to be too low. Standard HDDs offer good speeds, a large capacity and a low price. By including them, you allow HDD installs standard, increasing the load times on your games drastically. By including a large capacity drive, it means you can have no limits on your DD games (other than arbitrary ones you set because you're fucking Nintendo), and all sorts of media content. IT also means that install limits won't be like 4GB or whatever it is on PS3, so you won't get any MGS4 installing-each-chapter nonsense.
 
W

wsippel

Banned
ThoseDeafMutes said:
Well what are you implying? If they go an SSD route, they are far too costly and get you an extremely low capacity. If they go internal flash storage + SD cards, then the read speeds and capacities are going to be too low. Standard HDDs offer good speeds, a large capacity and a low price. By including them, you allow HDD installs standard, increasing the load times on your games drastically. By including a large capacity drive, it means you can have no limits on your DD games (other than arbitrary ones you set because you're fucking Nintendo), and all sorts of media content. IT also means that install limits won't be like 4GB or whatever it is on PS3, so you won't get any MGS4 installing-each-chapter nonsense.
Click to expand...
Like I wrote: Small internal flash plus UHS SD card. Read speed won't be an issue (current UHS cards are as fast as most 2.5" hard disks) and capacities increase incredibly fast. Also, Nintendo won't allow installs, won't do media shit, and will use a mass storage device that won't require caches - because that's Nintendo.
 
G

Grampa Simpson

Banned
So, at this point our semi-reliable rumor list is:

R700 based GPU
25 Gig Discs
8 Gig Flash
3-Core PowerPC processor
Traditional layout controller with a 6" screen.
Compatible with Wiimote

Speculation:

Name
Hard Drive/SD Card compatibility
Specifics on CPU/GPU
RAM (type and capacity)
Motion Control (new variation?)

Confirmed Things:

Partnering with an outside company for online. (source)
Spending more time fostering 3rd party relationships.

Common Sense:

Should support all HD resolutions
HDMI support and component/composite

Better than the alternative.

Also, this:

Log4Girlz said:
I'm gonna repost this from another thread. With everything we know (Reference BMF's post), what do you expect from the Cafe:



Scenario 1: Xbox 360 level (not much more or less)

Scenario 2: Notch above 360 (running current gen games, regardless of complexity at 1080p)

Scenario 3: Significantly above 360 (running any current game games at 1080p, 60fps with improves textures and IQ)

Scenario 4: Next-gen .5 (Runs current-gen games as listed above, but in addition has just enough horsepower to create innovative new engines to provide graphics and performance never before seen at home, but below expectations for the next Xbox and Playstation)

Scenario 5: True Next-Gen (Xbox 720 or PS4 level, or just a hair or two below)

I'm expecting scenario 2. You will have developers who may want to show graphics beyond what the 360 can do by just lowering the resolution.
Click to expand...
 
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