Support NeoGAF

[Cheez-It]

I absolutely love the impatience and sense of entitlement people display here.

Some people seem to forget that they don't need games right away, and that they can save money for the purchase.

If you can't save money for the purchase? YOU SHOULDN'T BE FUCKING GAMING*.

*Don't have a job? Get one. Or offer a service through craigslist or something along these lines.

Also: Piracy is not stealing, but piracy is still wrong. Should it carry stiff fines (for those not profiting off of it)? Probably not. Is it the worse thing you could do? Of course not. Doesn't change the fact that it is wrong.

Go buy World of Goo.

PS: Bets on Xizer's age? I'm going with 18 or under.

 

[Cheez-It]

You're taking something that doesn't belong to you. You're devaluing the product. You're helping distribute the game to other pirates who have no interest in buying the game. In what way is this at all fair to the developer? In what way is this at all just? "Because I can" is a bullshit argument, and "Rules and laws are for losers" is a bullshit argument. Give me a legitimate defense of how your act of downloading a product with no intent of ever paying for it is anything but stealing.

I in no way think this justifies piracy, but one can certainly argue that certain situations that involve piracy could benefit an organization/developer. If someone were to pirate World of Goo, love it, and spread the word or played the game with other people, it could potentially increase sales. If this person enjoyed the game, and grows out of the "piracy" mindset, they will probably be more likely to purchase games by this developer/organization in the future.

etc.

Also, stop using the word "stealing" It is not stealing.

 

[AstroLad]

Also: Piracy is not stealing, but piracy is still wrong. Should it carry stiff fines (for those not profiting off of it)? Probably not. Is it the worse thing you could do? Of course not. Doesn't change the fact that it is wrong.

I've actually always been in favor of a punitive litigation and prosecution-oriented approach rather than the DRM approach that is largely in favor now. Reason being that an effective litigation campaign has been shown to have a deterrent effect (downside being a slight PR hit, but if you target your prospective defendants carefully, this can be nullified), and it has the nice associated benefit of not punishing legitimate buyers by giving them a relatively inferior product.

 

[TheExodu5]

The 90% figure is ridiculous. I say this because, quite simply, out of every 10 people 9 of them know how to pirate things? Nope. That is way too high.

9 out of 10 know how to pirate things? Are you saying the entire world's population has played World of Goo? Rather, roughly 8 out of 10 people that have played the full version of World of Goo have pirated it...people who buy World of Goo are likely somewhat computer savvy, as they are buying it through Steam or directly from 2DBoy, so it's not a stretch to imagine they know how to point their browser to piratebay.

These people are supposedly smart enough to develop a game? Apparently they've never heard of *gasp* dynamic IPs. Or perhaps they think everyone is on a business connection with a static IP address.

Not reading the OP is bannable.

I also am amused by how they seem to think hundreds of peers on a torrent is some massive number or something. Spore torrents on TPB reached over a million peers within days. There are few torrents that don't reach hundreds of peers eventually.

Not reading the OP is bannable.

I in no way think this justifies piracy, but one can certainly argue that certain situations that involve piracy could benefit an organization/developer. If someone were to pirate World of Goo, love it, and spread the word or played the game with other people, it could potentially increase sales. If this person enjoyed the game, and grows out of the "piracy" mindset, they will probably be more likely to purchase games by this developer/organization in the future.

etc.

Also, stop using the word "stealing" It is not stealing.

Agreed on all points. Yes, piracy does have some positive effects. Whether it's benefitial or not is irrelevant though, as the developers cannot condone it (it would be desastrous if they did). The best they can do is offer a superior product to the pirated version, so that people that hear about the game, or enjoyed the pirated version, can feel good about buying the game. 2DBoy understands this. On the other hand, you have games like Spore...why would any pirate in their right mind buy the game to have draconian DRM?

And yeah, as much as I disprove of pirating, it's not stealing. It's like sneaking into a movie theatre. It's unlawful, and unfair, but you're not physically depriving anyone of their property (well, unless the movie theatre is full).

 

[vareon]

I think we can all agree (except for some idiots) that piracy is WRONG, whether you consider it stealing or not. There's no justification, especially the "I'm poor but I have to play gamez so I must pirate it else I wont play gamez hur hur hur" bullshit.

I've actually always been in favor of a punitive litigation and prosecution-oriented approach rather than the DRM approach that is largely in favor now. Reason being that an effective litigation campaign has been shown to have a deterrent effect (downside being a slight PR hit, but if you target your prospective defendants carefully, this can be nullified), and it has the nice associated benefit of not punishing legitimate buyers by giving them a relatively inferior product.

+_+

 

[diffusionx]

I in no way think this justifies piracy, but one can certainly argue that certain situations that involve piracy could benefit an organization/developer. If someone were to pirate World of Goo, love it, and spread the word or played the game with other people, it could potentially increase sales. If this person enjoyed the game, and grows out of the "piracy" mindset, they will probably be more likely to purchase games by this developer/organization in the future.

While I understand this viewpoint, 2D Boy did release a demo, actually it was closer to the shareware release, where it had a significant chunk of the early game (the first full chapter, I believe - I was pulled away from it and couldn't go back to it - but I'll probably buy it tonight) that has all the game mechanics, graphics, music, etc. of that chapter. You can see how the game plays, how the levels are constructed, and how it runs on your computer. We aren't talking about Far Cry 2 or whatever where there wasn't a demo and it might be a system hog etc. etc.

Every BS reason pirates give to justify their habit, 2D Boy responded to. I really think its fair to say that anyone who pirated this game is just an asshole.

 

[itxaka]

has somebody already said the Homebrew=piracy thing already that is standard on this kind of threads?

If not, just for the records.

homebrew=piracy



Also, I'm gonna check the game, it looks great.

EDIT:

Holy fuck, 20$ for the Windows, Mac AND Linux versions without DRM? I think in this case, if you pirate this game, you are not just a pirate, you are an idiot and deserve to die. Sales+1

Seriously, having the linux version for free when buying the windows version is awesome ad it should be the standard thing to do.

 

[TheExodu5]

Seriously, having the linux version for free when buying the windows version is awesome ad it should be the standard thing to do.

Buy it now! GOTY, man. GOTY.

 

[spwolf]

I in no way think this justifies piracy, but one can certainly argue that certain situations that involve piracy could benefit an organization/developer. If someone were to pirate World of Goo, love it, and spread the word or played the game with other people, it could potentially increase sales. If this person enjoyed the game, and grows out of the "piracy" mindset, they will probably be more likely to purchase games by this developer/organization in the future.

etc.

Also, stop using the word "stealing" It is not stealing.

i agree that in some ways piracy can spread the word, but not about niche game - because what is pirate going to tell his friend? I have this cool game, I can burn it for you but you are better off being a sucker and paying $20 for it? Or will he just copy it over to the stick and give it to his friend?

Now, if we are talking about some software, then yes. For business software, thats probably the case.

and also, pirating is stealing. No guns, and it does not cost developers extra when you steal the game, but they did pay money to develop it and when you use it without buying it, you are still stealing it.

 

[GitarooMan]

Also, stop using the word "stealing" It is not stealing.

Why do people still care so much about the semantics, whatever the fuck you call it it's illegal and shouldn't be condoned or tolerated.

 

[Campster]

I in no way think this justifies piracy, but one can certainly argue that certain situations that involve piracy could benefit an organization/developer. If someone were to pirate World of Goo, love it, and spread the word or played the game with other people, it could potentially increase sales. If this person enjoyed the game, and grows out of the "piracy" mindset, they will probably be more likely to purchase games by this developer/organization in the future.

etc.

Also, stop using the word "stealing" It is not stealing.

1) This is a horrible justification for piracy. The net gain is still negative, and if I have to lose 1000 sales to make 5 ones I wouldn't have made otherwise, it's still a shitty situation.

And even if the percentages ended up breaking even, and the number of copies I lost to people who would have otherwise paid and the number of copies I sold to people who would have otherwise not bought my game cancelled each other out, it is still an illegal activity.

Piracy is not some super-hip underground adverizing service. It's not a fucking try-before-you-buy program. It's taking something that doesn't belong to you, end of story. The 2% of pirates who guilt-trip themselves into buying it after the fact are still pirates, and that doesn't make up for the 90% of the people who are just going to steal the damned thing.

2) Steal
a: to take or appropriate without right or leave and with intent to keep or make use of wrongfully <stole a car>
b: to take away by force or unjust means <they've stolen our liberty>
c: to take surreptitiously or without permission <steal a kiss>
d: to appropriate to oneself or beyond one's proper share : make oneself the focus of <steal the show>

 

[Sushen]

I in no way think this justifies piracy, but one can certainly argue that certain situations that involve piracy could benefit an organization/developer. If someone were to pirate World of Goo, love it, and spread the word or played the game with other people, it could potentially increase sales. If this person enjoyed the game, and grows out of the "piracy" mindset, they will probably be more likely to purchase games by this developer/organization in the future.

etc.

Also, stop using the word "stealing" It is not stealing.

When someone takes somebody else's product without paying for it nor permission to do so, it is called "stealing". If that word bothers you, then stop stealing No matter how you word it, stealing is bad, and scaring away developers who wants their investments to be paid back, not stolen.

 

[Cheez-It]

whatever the fuck you call it it's illegal and shouldn't be condoned or tolerated.

Are you a conservative? I find it so amusing that people appeal to legality rather than morality. I also find it amusing that you think illegal acts should not be condoned or tolerated (or are you just talking about this specific case?).

1) This is a horrible justification for piracy. The net gain is still negative, and if I have to lose 1000 sales to make 5 ones I wouldn't have made otherwise, it's still a shitty situation.

I in no way think this justifies piracy,

I find it hard to take you seriously with that first line of yours. Not only do you fail to read the post you are responding to (the first few words at that!), you assume that all or most piracy results in a lost sale (at least, this is what I gather from your "I have to lose X sales to get Y sales" sentence).


By the way, what the fuck is with people assuming I pirate games? Let me post you my thoughts on piracy:

I absolutely love the impatience and sense of entitlement people display here.

Some people seem to forget that they don't need games right away, and that they can save money for the purchase.

If you can't save money for the purchase? YOU SHOULDN'T BE FUCKING GAMING*.

*Don't have a job? Get one. Or offer a service through craigslist or something along these lines.

Also: Piracy is not stealing, but piracy is still wrong. Should it carry stiff fines (for those not profiting off of it)? Probably not. Is it the worse thing you could do? Of course not. Doesn't change the fact that it is wrong.

Go buy World of Goo.

In case you can't fucking read, I am against piracy. I'm just not a simpleton who makes irrational arguments against piracy. I actually believe that some of the anti-piracy drivel you people post might help a pirate think something like "ha! But it isn't stealing! no one loses any physical item" or "but no one is losing anything if I wouldn't buy it anyways" and forget or never realize that "what I am doing is wrong".