Agent Unknown
Member
Easier said than done on any platform considering the code and assets for Panzer Dragoon Saga were lost years ago.
-
Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!
WSJ: Nintendo Begins Distributing Software Kit for NX (Console + Handheld units)
- Thread starter killercow
- Start date
- Status
Easier said than done on any platform considering the code and assets for Panzer Dragoon Saga were lost years ago.
Horii already said that the thought process was, they wanted to appeal to both the hardcore audience and the casual audience for the new DQ, basically getting maximum amount of revenue from both versions.
I think them trying to get western support from that decision was also an obvious conclusion to make.
NX for DQ, like FF15 and KH3 for XB1 is a revenue splitting measure by default.
The screen tech that they have a hand in ATM is quite different...
http://www.sharp-world.com/corporate/news/140618.html
Free form shaped screen could lead to many interesting things on a controller.
jhmtehgamr20xx
Banned
So this means it could be releasing holiday 2016, or very early 2017?
....
.......my heart....it breaks. It breaks so badly.
It's assumption by the author that based on Nintendo with the Wii and Wii U that they will not be doing any kind of significant power so the cost per unit will be lower thus AMD will not make as much per unit as they would with Sony or Microsoft. And its based on console sales they assume a smaller order.
If Nintendo does in fact make something that is actually decently powerful then their costs will certainly be closer to Sony and MS so AMD would not be making significantly less on units. If NX were to somehow be a Wii in sales then it would clearly be a significant unit sales for AMD or it could be a Wii U and yes a small order.
Valkyri von Thanatos
Member
Sort of what I meant, and what I want as well. I realize your idea would also save processing power from being used unnecessarily, I was just trying to call back to some earlier mockups of a similar concept. I wouldn't be opposed to it being like the DS and 3DS again, but personally if the bottom screen wasn't wide screen like the top like the 3DS should have been, it would be pretty weird IMO.
As much as I like the Vita's form and design, personally clamshell still makes the most sense to me, because it naturally protects the screens from scratching (aside from stylus). For the NX handheld to go back to one screen doesn't make much sense to me considering they have taled about "absorbing" the previous gens in the past (including Wii U I think). So if it goes back to one screen, what then?
Of course, most NX games probably wouldn't use the dual screen very extensively, since on the console version it would most likely be a feature only possible when using the handheld as a controller, but it doesn't seem sensible to leave clamshell/dualscreen design at this point.
Main point of my post though was talking about how there is a possibility that we could be getting a huge library of games on both the handheld and home versions. If Nintendo truly is "absorbing" the previous gens, then what if that means not only being able to play DS and 3DS games, but maybe certain Wii U games ported over, and all the Wii U compatible VC titles? I recall it being said or speculated that the reason the Gameboy VC releases stopped was because the VC group within Nintendo wanted to focus on future-proofing VC titled to run on NX and the Wii U VC titles could be ported over.
Basically, the NX handheld being able to run low end versions of NX home's games, and also running most Wii U games as enhanced ports, plus VC maybe including everything Wii down would be incredible (with the NX home operating as a system weaker than but close enough in power to Xbox One, with most multiplats).
Fancy full screen handhelds are a lesser hope of mine, but if done well the idea seems like it could really make the handheld stand out.
ShockingAlberto
Member
Too bad there's that nearly-finished Gametap version we'll never see.
James Scott
Banned
The AMD thing means Nintendo will get a chip for cheaper than normal? Or am I reading that incorrectly. Also sounds like it should launch in late 2016.
And this is why I will never part with my copy of this gem.
Agent Unknown
Member
Makes sense but now they just need to start uh, actually localizing their DQ games already. It's going to be hard for them to benefit from hardcore/Western/casual when all of a sudden they act like they think it's 1989 again and western fans don't know what RPGs are and DQ is supposed to be Japan exclusive again. I'm just itching to play DQ 7&8 on my N3DS, really hope Horii's slip at the show in France about wanting DQ 7&8 localized actually pans out.
And I've said it before and I'll say it again, it would be pathetic if the home version of DQ 11 was localized for PS4 but not NX. Sony will surely pull out the stops to get a NA version of the game, hope Nintendo is ready to go to bat on that. It's also about time they leaned on SE a bit regarding KH 3.
Agent Unknown
Member
They are making an educated guess based off prior Nintendo hardware that it wont be a very profitable chip for AMD. Yet at the same time this chip is supposed to be worth 500 million to AMD so it cant be all bad
Tatsumi Oga
Banned
It just sucks that Nintendo has said it won't talk about it until next year, yet we keep getting these stories without any confirmation. I really do want to believe Nintendo has finally seen the light and is going to compete with the current consoles on a hardware level, but with no confirmation it's all rumours and hearsay if you ask me. I want to get hyped, but I'm not going to.
Trevelyan9999
Banned
Don't forget that Nintendo hired a Western Graphics Engineer late last year. They might have told him to get a GPU made that is on par or better than PS4, then he came back with what he found out AMD was working on set to release the following year and helped convince Nintendo to use it in the NX. Makes sense.
In regards to Nintendo not going to graphics parity in their consoles, NES, SNES, N64 & Gamecube all set high marks in graphics for their respective generations. With the Wii and Wii U, Nintendo was thinking controls, interface and interaction and really downplayed the importance of graphics. They got a little of it back with the Wii U, but it seemed like it was a "because we had to" type of attitude.
Now with developers sighting a direct relation to console power as to why they won't port games to Nintendo's consoles, Nintendo may have woke up and re-evaluated the importance of technology parity and ease of development. Before Wii and Wii U, the graphics performance was treated nearly equally important as the controller interface and that was something that made people stick with Nintendo, because they basically had the best consoles out there.
The Wii U failure was a good lesson learned. You can't just put one foot in to a console launch with minimal effort in advertising, confusing naming and no clear vision for the machine's innovative features besides playing Nintendo games in HD....HD that was only a little more advanced than consoles 6 years older.
Everything points to an old fashioned rebound, when a team has a bad game and gets blown out, they seem like they could never play well again, then the next game they come back strong and blow the other team out. I'm thinking with the NX, Nintendo is putting a lot more effort into the components of the device(s), making sure of what direction they are going to take the innovative features. It's going to be fun to watch the effort from them next year.
In regards to Nintendo not going to graphics parity in their consoles, NES, SNES, N64 & Gamecube all set high marks in graphics for their respective generations. With the Wii and Wii U, Nintendo was thinking controls, interface and interaction and really downplayed the importance of graphics. They got a little of it back with the Wii U, but it seemed like it was a "because we had to" type of attitude.
Now with developers sighting a direct relation to console power as to why they won't port games to Nintendo's consoles, Nintendo may have woke up and re-evaluated the importance of technology parity and ease of development. Before Wii and Wii U, the graphics performance was treated nearly equally important as the controller interface and that was something that made people stick with Nintendo, because they basically had the best consoles out there.
The Wii U failure was a good lesson learned. You can't just put one foot in to a console launch with minimal effort in advertising, confusing naming and no clear vision for the machine's innovative features besides playing Nintendo games in HD....HD that was only a little more advanced than consoles 6 years older.
Everything points to an old fashioned rebound, when a team has a bad game and gets blown out, they seem like they could never play well again, then the next game they come back strong and blow the other team out. I'm thinking with the NX, Nintendo is putting a lot more effort into the components of the device(s), making sure of what direction they are going to take the innovative features. It's going to be fun to watch the effort from them next year.
Think yourself lucky. We're hearing this now, 8 months before E3 2016....With Wii U we started doing this 18 months before!
Remember though that Nintendo's consoles are typically $250 with the Wii U being an outlier. It wouldn't surprise me (Unless they're going "core") that they want to hit that low price again. If so, something's got to give and it will be specs.
One thing that does concern me is this whole idea of a cartridge based system. I see some benefits of course like being able to put the same cart into multiple devices and robustness of the form factor however the costs must be insane and typically platform holders pass those onto the publisher correct? I don't see how third party publishers would swallow this which would make me start thinking that third parties are yet again not going to be courted with any seriousness.
D
Deleted member 465307
Unconfirmed Member
Nintendo's sales could simply sink further, but I'm excited to see them fight against that. They know that their next home console has to be a comeback and that their next portable has to prove a lot of naysayers wrong, so I'm excited to see them be aggressive. The reveal and E3 should be very fun to watch.
I would hope Nintendo realizes the global schism in form factors. Portables don't sell in the west, western developers don't support them. Consoles don't sell in Japan, Japanese developers don't support them. It would be awesome if NX can bridge some of that but realistically they should start with the expectation that a console needs to be targeted specifically western (power, power, power, who cares if it needs a gas generator and sounds like jet engine), their portables are already very Japan-centric so they can just continue that.
And given the move away from portables, they would be sensible to court the West more. We are the people who want grunty, dedicated gaming machines and will pay for them.
I think that's what NX will try to do if we go by Iwata's outlining strategy. Anihawk had a great post about this much earlier in the thread on how Nintendo could provide some form factors that are better suited for specific regions. http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=181975469&postcount=2158
And yeah, the west loves its raw horse power and they likely will have to address this.
I wonder how hard it's going to be to put a Console game on the Handheld if it's the same architecture. I also wonder how if those Console-only games going forward can be played on future Handhelds, assuming the architecture remains the same.
They'll likely port/progressively enhance up rather than down. Console games for the most part can't be shrunk like that, that's why literally everyone besides Nintendo failed, that's why mobile actually does well. It's also why pure hardware consolidation is not a viable strategy.
Yeah... No. Even in the west Nintendo handhelds were always more popular than their homesystems and this won't chance with the NX portable.
NX portable will probably be the only dedicated handheld next gen while the console will still have to deal with cheaper getting MS and Sony systems.
I expect the Handheld to be the main unit and the console more or less being able to play the games in 1080p in addition to some exclusive features.
Based on comments Iwata made a few months back I would expect Nintendo to move away from region locking.
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
That was it. Thanks.
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Costs for a "cartridge" wouldn't be much if they were SD card-type "cartridges." The cost differential is nowhere near what it was during N64/PSX days.
I think we might be looking at this the wrong way. In term of shared library, I think it possible that it will go only one way, as in, 100% of handheld games can be played on the console but not vice versa. There are several advantages to doing it this way:
1. Boost the console library
2. Won't hold back the graphical power of the console like most have feared
3. Cross-buy: You could either go physical or digital and still be able to play it on both devices. I think this coincide with the Nintendo's patent about the cartridge slot being included on the console that someone found last month.
4. Allow smaller studios to create low budget, handheld games but still able to be played on console, expanding their user base. I think this would draws in the Japanese developers.
For developers that want to release a game on both devices, like Smash Bros, Mario Kart, etc., but still want to take advantage of the console graphic capabilities, the rumored, shared cpu/gpu architecture would make it easy to port the game to handheld and vice versa.
Tatsumi Oga
Banned
Good point. before we know it it'll be E3 time again.
It does sound fairly believeable to me though. A third party that remains anonymous spilled the beans on what kind of hardware we can expect, i can definitely see that's not too farfetched. If they are going for a low price again and the hardware is going to take a hit, they won't get the real gamers back. If it's not going to even compete with what we have now, i see little reason why these third party developers would even bother. Nobody in their right mind is going to be a much inferior version of say...Mass Effect Andromeda and BF5 when they get a much better console version.
They should come with something that easily does 1080p/60fps for starters, cause i sure as hell won't buy those games for my Xbox One anymore then.
This would be great.
Its a development portal, and all versions of it have to have a respective market certification (which caries over to software made) for the ratings.
It tells you nothing about region locking or not.
I wasn't commenting on the portal lol.
plank
Member
Funny it's the other way around for me when I go visit anime forums. On topic I really hope Nintendo delivers in the games department when it come to this console.
I don't know about third parties, but wouldn't there be a few ways for Nintendo to make the cost not that big of an issue? Like, if they're making the same carts for every form factor, then that means they aren't making discs at all. Wouldn't halting the production of all discs help them produce more carts? Wouldn't it cost less to make a console with no disc drive? They should even be able to save on plastic by having smaller cases, right?
Is it at all possible that those factors, along with carts not being as expensive as they used to be (according to what people have been saying), could help make using carts only not that big of a burden. Is there any possibility that such savings could be passed on to 3rd parties? Or would it be possible for Nintendo to take the hit and absorb some of the cost in order to court 3rd parties?
Yeah but disks must be cents. I would be surprised if physical cartridge hardware wasn't an order of magnitude higher.
3DS has done a bit over 50 million units hasn't it? That's definitely within reach of a healthy console. Mobile has "Decimated" handheld gaming.
Bitmap Frogs
Mr. Community
I just hope they score a hit.
The 3DS one better get localized too. It looks better to me.
I mean, I'll just play it in Japanese if it doesn't but still.
The costs per game are higher for sure, but there are other benefits. Inventory management becomes a lot easier when you just have one set of games to manufacture and distribute, and their retail presence and relationships with retailers would likely seriously benefit too.
How much would 32, 64 and 128GB SD-card style variants cost Nintendo? If it means a quieter cooler system and no load times or game install delays, I'm all for them using such cards in the NX. I wonder what the read speeds and access times would have to be to eliminate loading and the need for installs.
For consumers it'd also mean less 5+gb Day 1 content patches that should've been on the disc.
100% the reverse direction probably doesn't work either. It seems reasonable that things like Streetpass, GPS, AR, the patented linear image sensors and what-not (depending on what they include) just wouldn't work on a console. Total convergence such that one is a subset of the other is simple unlikely because there are strength and weaknesses of various form-factors, there is no one that rules them all. That said at least some can be shared, whether identical applications through progressive enhancement (like web), specific ports (Smash bros Wii U/3DS), streaming and whatever else.
Possible but risky. This would greatly increase costs which they'd either eat or pass along and long-term this will be a non-factor just like it is with PS4 now. If it's a priority then it makes more sense to put that money into emulation.
I'm wondering the same thing. If they go for an ARM CPU will the Wii U's PowerPC CPU work well with it on the same mobo?
It's certainly possible. It would be an added expense per system but maybe they could justify it by giving it coprocessor duties during regular operation.
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
I can't possibly imagine Nintendo implementing extra hardware for backward compatibility. If there were ever a time to start fresh, post-Wii U is definitely that time. The increased cost and complexity would add next to nothing.
OG_Original Gamer
Member
I expect a GPU with high speed embedded memory, accompanied by high speed main memory. Nintendo can keep their graphics engine centered around storing shaders on that embedded memory. Third party developers can easily port from PS4.
Especially if they are going for that $300 cost of entry for consumers. Any games could just be ported digitally to the e shop.
Still curious by what Iwata meant by absorbing the Wii U. If BC is possible on the NX, I can see emulation as a way of absorbing it. Wii U VC titles could be a thing as well as playing from disc if you have it.
Iwata's quote is what has me wondering. Assuming a goal of keeping a Virtual Console going, some sort of BC is needed*.
I'm not aware of a robust POWER to ARM converter.
*Note: I'm saying BC strictly in the context of VC style sales, I am aware that in general BC is a nice feature, but not really a system seller, but VC may be making a decent chunk of change for Nintendo.
Agent Unknown
Member
Have said it before in many other threads but this is one time where I'm content NOT to have BC in a Nintendo home console. I have no problem leaving my Wii U sitting on my entertainment shelf after the NX launches in order to play my Wii U library next gen if that's what it takes for Nintendo to finally leave behind GC and Wii era hardware components and take a big, and more progressive step into truly modern, more open minded 21st century game hardware development. The Wii U's first party library is more than enough to make it worth leaving set up in my living room with both my older and newer consoles, plus I have a lot of legacy VC & Wiiware content from the old shop which probably won't carry over.
- Status