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[Waaghals]

Oh, I'm sure Ryse will look great. However, it's much easier to claim that it's resolution is a technical choice than with The Order, where the vision and look would actually be easier to point to it being an artistic choice.

(I think I'm going to remove myself from this discussion soon, I'm derailing)

I sort of agree, with Ryse there is no doubt that the resolution drop is due to performance issues, but with the Order you can make the argument you are making without a problem.

 

[Jawmuncher]

Don't remind me about the Dead Rising performance issues. Really hope Microsoft is helping capcom fully on that. Sad that I have to look forward to a locked 30FPS on a nextgen launch title.

 

[Gestault]

I don't think anybody said technologically "unimpressive". Technologically "disappointing" for a new generation would be accurate for sure, though.

I can see that, fair enough. There does seems to be a lot of focus (35 pages worth) on something that's...fairly mundane. I suppose on a technological level, if this level of fidelity is disappointing for a launch title, I'm pretty happy with it. Seeing some of the real-time scenes in these vid-docs, it's certainly a step up from where we are now, and this is the low-ish end of the new consoles.

 

[beast786]

I mentioned it earlier. I'm glad they did, too.

Did he had a choice?

he first brag about it being 1080p native. Then got corrected by his own people and had to tell the truth otherwise he would be caught with his paints down. There was nothing graceful about. it's not like we wouldn't have found about it.

Its not like he is telling you what DR3 resolution is. because he knows it not native 1080p.

The only reason he initially said was to brag. since of all MS published titles he only mention two that he believe were 1080p native.

 

[Portugeezer]

Oh, I'm sure Ryse will look great. However, it's much easier to claim that it's resolution is a technical choice than with The Order, where the vision and look would actually be easier to point to it being an artistic choice.

SSM wouldn't commit to 1920x800 so early on in development on a next gen console if it wasn't a design decision, and well I believe them.

Ryse being 900p seems like a last minute choice for performance reasons, they rushed and optimised as much as possible up until now and got 900p.

 

[moho-foe]

People will care as much about the PS4 having the superior version of MP titles as they care about the PC having the superior version.

But seriously, I'm waiting on the review scores for this game with bated breath. That's when the real fun begins.

 

[VanWinkle]

I can see that, fair enough. There does seems to be a lot of focus (35 pages worth) on something that's...fairly mundane. I suppose on a technological level, if this level of fidelity is disappointing for a launch title, I'm pretty happy with it. Seeing some of the real-time scenes in these vid-docs, it's certainly a step up from where we are now, and this is the low-ish end of the new consoles.

The game still looks great. This kind of thing with console exclusives provides a lot of drama from people who are extremely passionate about the subject. Kind of par for the course really. This is the game, at least on the XB1 side, that people saw as the technical powerhouse, so when it was revealed that it wasn't running at the resolution we were expecting from next-gen, it's a lot of controversy for people like us who are really passionate.

Did he had a choice?

he first brag about it being 1080p native. Then got corrected by his own people and had to tell the truth otherwise he would be caught with his paints down. There was nothing graceful about. it's not like we wouldn't have found about it.

Its not like he is telling you what DR3 resolution is. because he knows it not native 1080p.

The only reason he initially said was to brag. since of all MS published titles he only mention two that he believe were 1080p native.

It's not that it was necessarily really honorable or anything. It's just a little surprising/refreshing since I would have honestly expected him to just pretend he never said it.

 

[dbztrk]

LOL. The Xbox One keeps looking worse and worse as time goes on. Shouldn't it be the other way around?

 

[Raoh]

Here is what I remember, random stuff mind you.

PS2, PS3 and 360 games launched simultaneously, if there was a low end goal it was the PS2 that at the time had the highest install base.

Microsoft a few years ago lowered their minimum HD demand from minimum 720P to anything lower than 720P. I expect that since this did not hurt them they can keep the HD demand lower than 1080P on the xbox one as well. I think it was a Jefferies something or other from either Microsoft or from a third party developer that said that the 360 is not powerful enough to supply a 720p image with a 4x msaa. (I"m not an expert just what I remember reading)

So with the talk of xbone being weaker than PS4, its not surprising that microsoft lowers the demands and targets "acceptable" resolution. Gaf knows the difference but the millions of people that buy games most likely do not based on sales and feedback.

 

[Lynn616]

Nib95 and BigDug13 seem very upset about this. I don't think they should buy the game.

 

[SenjutsuSage]

Why? There wasn't a good portion of current gen launch games that were below 720p.

PS4 and XB1 are a big step up so I don't think it's unreasonable to expect the vast majority to be 1080p.

http://beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1113344&postcount=3

Perfect Dark Zero = 1152x640 (no AA)
Project Gotham Racing 3 = 1024x600 (2xAA)

These were two major releases also. Forget just launch, even Halo 3, Halo 3: ODST and Halo Reach weren't 720p. Halo 4 was the first 720p Halo fps title of the gen.

Halo: Anniversary = 1152x720 (FXAA remake, no AA classic)
Halo 3 = 1152x640 (no AA)
Halo 3: ODST = 1152x640 (no AA)
Halo: Reach = 1152x720 (2xAA temporal)
Halo 4 = 1280x720 (post-AA)

Alan Wake = 960x544 (4xAA) <-- I still think Alan Wake is one of the more amazing looking Xbox 360 titles. Incredible lighting and solid visuals imo. A lot of people had no idea this game wasn't 720p either till it was revealed through pixel counting. Even Halo 3 had to be found out through pixel counting, although Halo 3 had some really bad IQ in places, I thought, so it was prob a matter of time.

I also think none of the COD releases were 720p either. Maybe COD2 at launch was, but I don't think the rest were. It would certainly be nice for the vast majority to be 1080p, but as long as the games look good and perform great, I don't think there'll be many complaints if they happen to be running at a lower resolution.

But seriously, I'm waiting on the review scores for this game with bated breath. That's when the real fun begins.

Ryse will probably be annihilated in reviews. Of that there's probably very little doubt, but for me reviews are largely flawed for the simple reason that it's someone else trying to tell me what I'll think about a game. If I have interest in any game at all, I'm cautious by nature regarding the reviews. I get the game, see for myself, form an opinion, and then look at reviews in retrospect of playing the game myself to try and ascertain which reviewers best share my view, and then I try to pay attention to their reviews in the future, but it isn't a perfect science. There's reviewers who I agree with 100% when it concerns jrpgs, but then I disagree with completely where it concerns first person shooters or other types of games.

 

[oVerde]

We're not the ones who actually spent the time creating a paint file to accompany a really salty comment.

because funny reactions?
totally worth lol

 

[JaggedSac]

Do some people on here not watch movies or something? I feel like 2:40:1 is a new concept to some, when its actually one of the most historically used aspect ratios in cinema, ever....And lol at the notion that black bars will leave image retention on plasmas. This discussion has many completely abandoning logic.

Movies are filmed in that ratio because that is what the standard theater screen size is. TV shows are recorded/filmed in the aspect ratios of tv screens. Video games should be output in the standard ratio of televisions.

 

[velociraptor]

I'm looking at the 1080p Ryse vidoc and if its indeed running at 900p there, then all this drama has been for nothing. Ryse looks stunning. The video is suspiciously free of aliasing though. Image quality is remarkable. It looks really, really sharp. In fact, it looks like 1080p. The feel of 1080p.

 

[Parapraxis]

Not sure how relevant this is still but anyways:

So, that helped very little.

 

[Portugeezer]

I'm looking at the 1080p Ryse vidoc and if its indeed running at 900p there, then all this drama has been for nothing. Ryse looks stunning. The video is suspiciously free of aliasing though. Image quality is remarkable. It looks really, really sharp. In fact, it looks like 1080p. The feel of 1080p.

We've heard the same song for years and did that ever stop resolution discussions?

Not sure how relevant this is still but anyways:

So, that helped very little.

Strange answer. I wonder if they listened to the people moaning about the aspect ratio? 1080p confirmed!

 

[Crisium]

Well, if 1080 is the new 720, and many PS360 games ran at below 720, then 1600x900 is expected for the sneaky developer who relies on bullshots that are low resolution anyway. Slightly toned down lighting and shadows but 1920x1080 is preferable from the perspective of actually playing the game, though.

 

[Durante]

I'll admit that I'm not sure how consoles determine their resolution, as you can't select it manually. As a PC gamer, I choose my resolution. The resolutions I have at my disposal are based entirely upon the aspect ratio of my display (unless I force a resolution that uses a different aspect ratio, but that will give me letterboxing\pillarboxing)

And I think you mean 1280x1024, which is a 5:4 ratio. We havent' seen any 5:4 screenshots or footage, so one would assume they aren't going to force that resolution on 16:9 displays with pillarboxing.

You are confusing aspect ratio with resolution, they are not necessarily tightly coupled. On PC, very few games allow you to set them separately, but when you're scaling already you can easily decouple them. E.g. you can render a 1280x1080 image at 16:9 -- it will only look correct once scaled to 16:9. It's called anamorphic rendering.

There are some PC games which allow you to do this. I used to play Dreamfall at 16:9 rendered at 1600x1200 and stretched to 1920x1200, because when I got my Dell 2405 ages ago my GPU wasn't up to running the game at the full resolution,

 

[velociraptor]

http://beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1113344&postcount=3

Perfect Dark Zero = 1152x640 (no AA)
Project Gotham Racing 3 = 1024x600 (2xAA)

These were two major releases also. Forget just launch, even Halo 3, Halo 3: ODST and Halo Reach weren't 720p. Halo 4 was the first 720p Halo fps title of the gen.

Halo: Anniversary = 1152x720 (FXAA remake, no AA classic)
Halo 3 = 1152x640 (no AA)
Halo 3: ODST = 1152x640 (no AA)
Halo: Reach = 1152x720 (2xAA temporal)
Halo 4 = 1280x720 (post-AA)

Alan Wake = 960x544 (4xAA) <-- I still think Alan Wake is one of the more amazing looking Xbox 360 titles. Incredible lighting and solid visuals imo. A lot of people had no idea this game wasn't 720p either till it was revealed through pixel counting. Even Halo 3 had to be found out through pixel counting, although Halo 3 had some really bad IQ in places, I thought, so it was prob a matter of time.

I also think none of the COD releases were 720p either. Maybe COD2 at launch was, but I don't think the rest were. It would certainly be nice for the vast majority to be 1080p, but as long as the games look good and perform great, I don't think there'll be many complaints if they happen to be running at a lower resolution.

I had Alan Wake on the 360 and honestly it looked bad. While the post processing and effects looked good, image quality was poor (thanks to it's extremely low resolution) and textures were muddy. The best looking game on the 360 is Gears of War 3. The fact it's 720p helps this.

 

[RoboPlato]

Not sure how relevant this is still but anyways:

So, that helped very little.

SSM isn't actually working on The Order, they're just producing/overseeing, so I doubt they have much say in anything.

 

[shwimpy]

Not sure how relevant this is still but anyways:

So, that helped very little.

Later in the year? So VGAs I'm guessing.

 

[velociraptor]

We've heard the same song for years and did that ever stop resolution discussions?

?

PS3/360 games mostly look awful because of their low resolutions.

 

[Zombie James]

Digital Foundry to the rescue:

While we'd clearly prefer 1080p as a target resolution, it's safe to say that the reduction in quality isn't quite as impactful as you might expect in these shots - surprising bearing in mind that we're looking at a one-third drop in overall resolution. In motion, larger, upscaled pixels may be more noticeable but persistent on-screen elements - like the HUD - are likely to be rendered at native 1080p.

The takeaway from our testing with the detail-rich Crysis 3 was that the situation isn't as much of an issue as it is on current-gen console, where sub-720p imagery can look really grim, particularly in concert with post-process anti-aliasing. Clearly though, final judgement on multi-platform next-gen titles that employ different resolutions will be reserved for our hands-on comparisons with final retail code.

Upscaling has come a long way since the current-gen consoles launched in 2005/2006, and we can imagine that developers of both Xbox One and to a lesser extent PS4 titles will employ sub-native framebuffers to hit their performance targets, especially in first-gen games. Given the choice between a consistent gameplay experience at 900p or 1080p with a frame-rate hit, we'd take the smoother performance every time.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-ryse-runs-at-900p

 

[Parapraxis]

SSM isn't actually working on The Order so I doubt they have much say in anything.

They are, along with Ready at Dawn.

Later in the year? So VGAs I'm guessing.

Lets hope so, out of all the PS4 line-up this game and Second Son have most of my attention.

 

[CassidyIzABeast]

Not sure how relevant this is still but anyways:

So, that helped very little.

720p confirmed. Make the thread.

 

[Raistlin]

Pretty sure that's a (dumb) artistic decision than anything performance saving related. It's not like the game is going to be upscaled or anything. They just want you to have black cars for some reason similar to a movie. Which again, is idiotic and I hope they change course. There's still a possibility the black bars may even be rendered and switch up throughout the game, so it's too early to say at this point anyway.

It's not just an artistic reason, it also alters the FOV. For what appears to be a game with little in the way of vertical elements, that can make sense.

Whether it's used effectively remains to be seen. But there certainly can be a gameplay case for greater than 16:9 aspect ratios.

 

[VanWinkle]

Not sure how relevant this is still but anyways:

So, that helped very little.

That's a weird answer. :-/ I wonder if they decided against the cinematic widescreen ratio due to customer feedback. I kinda hope not.

 

[Perkel]

Any other insider information you want to share?

Sure, rendering 1920x800 cost less than 1920x1080. They could just go for 1920x1080 and no one would give a shit about letterbox which "filmic" is essentially.

But i agree with you. We should go back to 4:3 with vertical bars instead. Or we should have both horizontal and vertical black bars. Or instead of black bars nice frame. Games that way can be both "filmic" and "picturic" at same time.

edit:

And as we already trying to get best of movies. Superb 50 FOV.

 

[JaggedSac]

You are confusing aspect ratio with resolution, they are not necessarily tightly coupled. On PC, very few games allow you to set them separately, but when you're scaling already you can easily decouple them. E.g. you can render a 1280x1080 image at 16:9 -- it will only look correct once scaled to 16:9. It's called anamorphic rendering.

Same concept is used in films.

 

[Parapraxis]

Sure, rendering 1920x800 cost less than 1920x1080. They could just go for 1920x1080 and no one would give a shit about letterbox which "filmic" is essentially.

But i agree with you. We should go back to 4:3 with vertical bars instead. Or we should have both horizontal and vertical black bars. Or instead of black bars nice frame. Games that way can be both "filmic" and "picturic" at same time.

LOL, going 4:3 aspect ratio would truly be a ballzy move!
Maybe we can get some indies to do it, River City Ransom 2 maybe? Volgarr the Viking? haha

 

[Crisium]

Digital Foundry to the rescue:

Given the choice between a consistent gameplay experience at 900p or 1080p with a frame-rate hit, we'd take the smoother performance every time.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-ryse-runs-at-900p

But what about this:

Given the choice between a consistent gameplay experience at 900p or 1080p with a consistent gameplay experience but toned down lighting and shadows, I'd take 1080p every time.

 

[L4nnist3r]

I prefer for them to lower the resolution for the sake of better effects, better anti-aliasing and steady frame rate, than having a 1080p aliasing mess slideshow.

 

[Durante]

Sure, rendering 1920x800 cost less than 1920x1080. They could just go for 1920x1080 and no one would give a shit about letterbox which "filmic" is essentially.

But i agree with you. We should go back to 4:3 with vertical bars instead. Or we should have both horizontal and vertical black bars. Or instead of black bars nice frame. Games that way can be both "filmic" and "picturic" at same time.

You could let gamers select different frames to put their game in, or even let artists decide the frame on a per-scene basis!

 

[SenjutsuSage]

I had Alan Wake on the 360 and honestly it looked bad. While the post processing and effects looked good, image quality was poor (thanks to it's extremely low resolution) and textures were muddy. The best looking game on the 360 is Gears of War 3. The fact it's 720p helps this.

Alan Wake was an awesome looking game to me. It only ever looked bad in still captures of the game that were horribly representative of what the game actually looked like.

Different opinions, so it's to be expected.

Don't remind me about the Dead Rising performance issues. Really hope Microsoft is helping capcom fully on that. Sad that I have to look forward to a locked 30FPS on a nextgen launch title.

They fixed those performance issues. Check out the PAX gameplay. Launching with performance like this will be the best performance I've ever seen in a Dead Rising title.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=z579CJwFjYI

 

[commedieu]

Oh, I'm all for creativity, and I really don't mind that much that it isn't native 1080p.
I just find it incredibly naive to think that the game runs at a lower resolution simply due to artistic vision.

Are you trying to tell me that out of all the interesting innovations happening in indie gaming - and sometimes even in AAA gaming - that black bars rock your world?

And to the guy above that asked "do I mind that blu rays technically aren't 1080p":
No, I don't mind that either, but then again real footage is spared all the imperfections that appear in computer generated footage.

thank you.

All of a sudden, resolution doesn't matter. Console folks make 900page threads because 1 version of a game is 1 pixel less. Hahaha. surreee folks.

Sure.

I prefer for them to lower the resolution for the sake of better effects, better anti-aliasing and steady frame rate, than having a 1080p aliasing mess slideshow.

I prefer developers to create high resolution games, with stable framerates, and effects.

No one wants a slide show, at any resolution.

 

[Crisium]

I prefer for them to lower the resolution for the sake of better effects, better anti-aliasing and steady frame rate, than having a 1080p aliasing mess slideshow.

Anti-aliasing is really just simulating the appearance of a higher resolution anyway. 1600x900 with 2x or even 4xAA looks worse than 1920x1080 without it.

 

[Perkel]

LOL, going 4:3 aspect ratio would truly be a ballzy move!
Maybe we can get some indies to do it, River City Ransom 2 maybe? Volgarr the Viking? haha

Wasn't Hotline Miami in non standar resolution ? Like 4:3 or something ?

 

[Majanew]

how does the ps4 version look?

Are 343i targeting 1920x1080 for Xbox One Halo?

 

[Always-honest]

Edit: never mind..

 

[panda-zebra]

Movies are filmed in that ratio because that is what the standard theater screen size is. TV shows are recorded/filmed in the aspect ratios of tv screens. Video games should be output in the standard ratio of televisions.

So we shouldn't watch movies on TVs and we shouldn't play old consoles on anything other than 4:3 CRTs?

 

[evolution]

Its a launch game, it will probably look bad in a year or two

 

[jim2point0]

You are confusing aspect ratio with resolution, they are not necessarily tightly coupled. On PC, very few games allow you to set them separately, but when you're scaling already you can easily decouple them. E.g. you can render a 1280x1080 image at 16:9 -- it will only look correct once scaled to 16:9. It's called anamorphic rendering.

There are some PC games which allow you to do this. I used to play Dreamfall at 16:9 rendered at 1600x1200 and stretched to 1920x1200, because when I got my Dell 2405 ages ago my GPU wasn't up to running the game at the full resolution,

Were they to do that.... say, render @ 1280x900, stretch to 1600x900, and upscale to 1920x1080.... that would look real close to 720p upscaled to 1080p. Yick. Just can't imagine them doing that. Though I suppose anything is possible.....

 

[VanWinkle]

Wasn't Hotline Miami in non standar resolution ? Like 4:3 or something ?

Yeah. A performance issue rather than artistic choice, of course.

 

[Durante]

Were they to do that.... say, render @ 1280x900, stretch to 1600x900, and upscale to 1920x1080.... that would look real close to 720p upscaled to 1080p. Yick. Just can't imagine them doing that. Though I suppose anything is possible.....

I'm sure it's not done in this case, but I do wonder if e.g. 1320*1080 would look better than 1600x900 on a 1080p display (it's almost the same amount of pixels to render).

 

[traidenk]

is Killzone 1080p native? who cares

 

[Majanew]

is Killzone 1080p native? who cares

Yes. And I care.

 

[JaggedSac]

So we shouldn't watch movies on TVs and we shouldn't play old consoles on anything other than 4:3 CRTs?

Nope, im saying the ratio should be what the primary display medium standard ratio will be. I don't think many people will be playing the game on a theater screen or a tv with that aspect ratio.

 

[Parapraxis]

Movies are filmed in that ratio because that is what the standard theater screen size is. TV shows are recorded/filmed in the aspect ratios of tv screens. Video games should be output in the standard ratio of televisions.

TV aspect ratio was 4:3 for ages, and film aspect ratio for the most part has been 2.35:1
16:9 is basically an average of both, so the general amount of black borders you would get between films and standard TV ratio (at that time) was about the same.
This is the reason we have a 16:9 aspect ratio now with most HDTVs (excluding super-widescreen and ultra-widescreen HDTVs)

 

[Trago]

Doubt this will detract from the experience much.

 

[SenjutsuSage]

Crytek just shot themselves in the foot.

I don't know how much the rest of you know about awesome next gen graphics (I'm an expert), but high pixel counts and smooth frame rates are huge parts of them. It's not like this gen where you can become successful by putting out crappy, low resolution slideshows. If you screw customers over in 2013, you bring shame to yourself, and the only way to get rid of that shame is repentance.

What this means is the hardcore gamers, after hearing about this, are not going to want to purchase Ryse, nor will they purchase any of Crytek's games. This is HUGE. You can laugh all you want, but Crytek has alienated an entire demographic with this move.

Crytek, publicly apologize and cancel Ryse or you can kiss your business goodbye.

Hmm, I'm getting flashbacks... Who was the originator of this legendary post. I think it was about FF13 lol.

Doubt this will detract from the experience much.

I agree. What's most surprising is that a lot of people really couldn't care about how good or bad this game turns out, but now there's a lot of concerned citizens about what the resolution does to the game.