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[Negotiator101]

Its not obvious when valve is positioning linux as an alternative to windows really well. It will take a few years and you wont need windows for gaming anymore because of them.

Good for us not soo good for Microsoft

Yeah that's a very silly take to be honest, Linux will always be a tiny percentage, it's really neither here or there on the bigger scale of things.

 

[Pedro Motta]

 

[Fabieter]

Well, I think your point makes sense but theres a couple of things I disagree with. The main one, MS and Xbox can not guarantee that Sony and Nintendo will allow gamepass on their platform and as its not happened yet, when will it?

Well if cloud takes off and i think it will it doesn't matter anymore. If the cloud service is on every tv why would you bother with having it on competing consoles.

Its not there yet but i truely believe next generation is the last "traditional generation".

 

[DenchDeckard]

Well if cloud takes off and i think it will it doesn't matter anymore. If the cloud service is on every tv why would you bother with having it on competing consoles.

Its not there yet but i truely believe next generation is the last "traditional generation".

I agree, and I can see how every business will be doing everything they can to nurture a strong customer base for the future. Thats how i see it.

 

[Tobimacoss]

That aint gonna work. Exclusive needs to mean exclusive.

So you are OK with them not releasing on Steam?

 

[SupremeJ]

To enable 3rd party players to crossover from PC to console.. hence a different Playstation.


Suicidal move in the short/medium term with no sure-fire positive long-term benefits to be gained.

This is a non-starter if I've ever seen any.

If you want to play TES6 and it's only available on the XBOX Store, you go there. Tens of millions want to play it. That's it.

 

[Fabieter]

I agree, and I can see how every business will be doing everything they can to nurture a strong customer base for the future. Thats how i see it.

Yeah Microsoft can also license their games to sonys services in the future. Just like alot of film studios do their shit while having on edge on pricing on their own service because they own all hyperscalers themselves.

 

[Astray]

Starfield had legit flaws though. The reception was pretty mid. There was tons to criticize in that game. I say this as someone who mostly liked it.

Skyrim was pretty beloved and if ES6 ends up being legit good, then it will still sale pretty well with a delayed release.

Even if ES6 is good the videos will have to shit on it regardless. It's just the nature of the economy of this kind of video maker.

No one watches a 3hr critique video to hear about how good the game is, the ones that do the best are the ones that shit on ambitious games that fall short.

If you want to play TES6 and it's only available on the XBOX Store, you go there. Tens of millions want to play it. That's it.

I mean we saw how that went with Starfield. And that had a Steam day 1 release too.

Microsoft likely lost millions of lifetime unit sales in that action by itself. One of the single biggest erosions of value I've seen in the gaming industry.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Yeah Microsoft can also license their games to sonys services in the future. Just like alot of film studios do their shit while having on edge on pricing on their own service because they own all hyperscalers themselves.

But, evidence in the market shows that all those TV and Films studios locked their IP to their own streaming service after the initial allowing Netflix or Amazon Prime to have them, and now they off them for sale or rent the films to other platforms.

So, you are saying Sony, Nintendo and Microsoft should follow that business plan or just MS?

 

[Tobimacoss]

But, evidence in the market shows that all those TV and Films studios locked their IP to their own streaming service and then sell or rent the films to other platforms.

So, you are saying Sony, Nintendo and Microsoft should follow that business plan or just MS?

It's like with Disney+, release movies in theaters, sell on video platforms everywhere, then become longterm exclusive to Disney+ streaming service. Universal studios though puts their movies in theaters, sells everywhere, then 90 days on Peacock, then leases out to Prime video for next 8 months, then back to Peacock permanently.

ABK is mandated by UK CMA and EU to lease content to other streaming services. But MS has allowed Bethesda to do the same. XGS content is exclusive to Gamepass though, relative to other subscription/streaming services inclusion into the game catalog. Other services can still deploy the Buy and Stream model.

 

[Lucifers Beard]

Even though I don't own an Xbox anymore, I think platform exclusives make sense if you want people to buy into the platform. As good as it is being able to play their games on most platforms, they are kind of shooting themselves in the foot and making their own hardware redundant (since you're not playing Sony or Nintendo games there).

I'd like to see them release some big hitters over the next couple of years and then perhaps move back to console exclusives. Gaming is better when platforms are competing with each other.

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

I so hate to kind of back up bean man Jez but there are discussions

To what extent or if it will even happen has not been decided as far as I know

I know sneakers recently said it's never happening but I am leaning way more towards they will pull back from launching on PS at some point

If they want to salvage their brand... it's the right thing to do. More specifically, its one of the three right things to do.

All you have to do with Microsoft is follow money. There's nothing else to it really.

Sure, most businesses are like that but MS is famous for chasing the money. If the money doesn't come the product dies and they attempt to swipe it under the rug like nothings happened.

I keep getting lol emojis because it's not the point people want to read

But

Microsoft sees the value in Xbox, clearly.

That is all the answer you need to know if Xbox is ticking boxes at Microsoft.

It must be pulling in enough revenue and profit for pappa Satya to not want to lose it and it's clearly taken a couple of years after the ABK situation to show the higher ups that losing hardware sales, subscriptions, games to other platforms has caused enough of a dint that it's gone straight to the top and pappa is opening his wallet to help fix it again.

I think this will be their last attempt but I am hoping if Satya has signed things off that we are going to get a fully commited Xbox push.

They have to go all out after that cultish speech or it's just fluff and pointless. I'll take the wait and see approach but it would be amazing if we had all three companies fully going for it next gen.

But what does fully going at it mean? Are we just going to keep pretending that their supporting PC gaming hasn't done more harm to them than anything they have done on the PlayStation front? Their hardware sales started to truly crash the second they made their games available on PC.

So if they are going all in, are they also going to reaccess PC support? Or will they close off their OS so that you can play PC games, but only if you buy them from the Xbox Store? Like, what does going all in mean?

Because if they are multiplat for Xbox and PC, that is not going to make a difference. Cause you ultimately will still NOT need an Xbox to play games, in that case, what's the point?

I think its pointless for Microsoft to so that because in the long run as much as people including me dislike it cloud will win. So why would they go all in on hardware again if it has limited time of possible success.

If cloud gaming were to win eventually... it would already have.

It's like people do not realize or recall how long cloud gaming has been a thing. Cloud gaming has been making the rounds since the year 2000, and got its first proper push in 2005. and the first mainstream push in 2010. Since then, there have been at least 6 or so different cloud gaming services. We are looking at a spread of over 20 years there. All the ingredients are there for it to succeed if it were actually ever to succeed... well, except the latency thing because that's something that will never be overcome... it's just physics. And yet here we are.

 

[DenchDeckard]

They need to ensure they have the best launch line up theyve had in the history of the brand imo. And, those games need to be exclusive for some time.

If they want to salvage their brand... it's the right thing to do. More specifically, its one of the three right things to do.

But what does fully going at it mean? Are we just going to keep pretending that their supporting PC gaming hasn't done more harm to them than anything they have done on the PlayStation front? Their hardware sales started to truly crash the second they made their games available on PC.

So if they are going all in, are they also going to reaccess PC support? Or will they close off their OS so that you can play PC games, but only if you buy them from the Xbox Store? Like, what does going all in mean?

Because if they are multiplat for Xbox and PC, that is not going to make a difference. Cause you ultimately will still NOT need an Xbox to play games, in that case, what's the point?

If cloud gaming were to win eventually... it would already have.

It's like people do not realize or recall how long cloud gaming has been a thing. Cloud gaming has been making the rounds since the year 2000, and got its first proper push in 2005. and the first mainstream push in 2010. Since then, there have been at least 6 or so different cloud gaming services. We are looking at a spread of over 20 years there. All the ingredients are there for it to succeed if it were actually ever to succeed... well, except the latency thing because that's something that will never be overcome... it's just physics. And yet here we are.

By all in, I mean what I put in another thread recently.

Excellent hardware - Subsidised to some level - Should be easy for Xbox to do
The best launch line up/ launch window / year in Xbox history - The hardest task for Xbox, imo
Excellent services - Remove pay to play online - improve gamepass
Make the xbox store the best it can be - More play anywhere, better refund policies and customer support.
Exclusive games window - Minimum one year exclusivity for other stores including Steam - All Xbox games must be purchased from an Xbox store within the exclusivity window.
Other launchers - Let the box boot Steam and play your steam library.

I think that more or less covers going all in. Its a big task, can Asha do it? who knows.

 

[M1987]

They don't sell enough on Xbox to be able to go back to exclusives

 

[Tobimacoss]

If they want to salvage their brand... it's the right thing to do. More specifically, its one of the three right things to do.

But what does fully going at it mean? Are we just going to keep pretending that their supporting PC gaming hasn't done more harm to them than anything they have done on the PlayStation front? Their hardware sales started to truly crash the second they made their games available on PC.

So if they are going all in, are they also going to reaccess PC support? Or will they close off their OS so that you can play PC games, but only if you buy them from the Xbox Store? Like, what does going all in mean?

Because if they are multiplat for Xbox and PC, that is not going to make a difference. Cause you ultimately will still NOT need an Xbox to play games, in that case, what's the point?

If cloud gaming were to win eventually... it would already have.

It's like people do not realize or recall how long cloud gaming has been a thing. Cloud gaming has been making the rounds since the year 2000, and got its first proper push in 2005. and the first mainstream push in 2010. Since then, there have been at least 6 or so different cloud gaming services. We are looking at a spread of over 20 years there. All the ingredients are there for it to succeed if it were actually ever to succeed... well, except the latency thing because that's something that will never be overcome... it's just physics. And yet here we are.

Xbox is an extension of Windows PC Gaming, even more so with Helix and full convergence with the unified GDK. So no, they won't be getting rid of PC form factors. You already don't need an Xbox Console to Play Xbox games. You would be able to play them via any of these form factors you may own: Desktops, Laptops, Tablets, Handhelds, Consoles, or Cloud. That's already true with Play Anywhere, Cloud Enabled, Handheld Optimized games. The universal Helix SKU will simply make sure that's doable for 99% of games.

Console is just one part of the ecosystem of devices able to play the games. So what does it matter if they add another couple of consoles into the mix? It's good for controller based multiplayer games like Halo, Gears.

Xbox should simply announce 6-12 months timed exclusivity on single player games, can be extended to 18-24 months case by case after seeing how well the game performs at the awards. And then stick with it, let the chips fall where they may.

Keep publishing more third party content, setup a $5 billion fund for Xbox Global Publishing and keep acquiring permanent content for Gamepass. That's the best they can do.

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

They need to ensure they have the best launch line up theyve had in the history of the brand imo. And, those games need to be exclusive for some time.



By all in, I mean what I put in another thread recently.

Excellent hardware - Subsidised to some level - Should be easy for Xbox to do
The best launch line up/ launch window / year in Xbox history - The hardest task for Xbox, imo
Excellent services - Remove pay to play online - improve gamepass
Make the xbox store the best it can be - More play anywhere, better refund policies and customer support.
Exclusive games window - Minimum one year exclusivity for other stores including Steam - All games must be purchased from an Xbox store.
Other launchers - Let the box boot Steam and play your steam library.

I think that more or less covers going all in. Its a big task, can Asha do it? who knows.

Well... that's a start I guess.

I feel the key thing is that they should make it such that you cn play all PC games on Xbox, but can only play all Xbox games on Xbox. By this, I mean they need to treat the PC as a separate platform and not have their games be on it at all. That way, they can actually be the one console that allows you to play PC games, while still being a console whose games aren't on PC. And this would mean you should not have Steam or other launchers on it. The timed exclusivity thing can work, but even that has to be done the way PlayStation did it.... release your games 2-3 years later on other platforms for a price... and usually only when the same game has finally made its way "free" as part of your sub service.

And I am not sure how this works, because if all PC games will work on Helix, then it means it's a PC, and devs wouldn't need to make a Helix and PC version of their game; they just make a PC version and have a Helix configuration file in there.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Well... that's a start I guess.

I feel the key thing is that they should make it such that you cn play all PC games on Xbox, but can only play all Xbox games on Xbox. By this, I mean they need to treat the PC as a separate platform and not have their games be on it at all. That way, they can actually be the one console that allows you to play PC games, while still being a console whose games aren't on PC. And this would mean you should not have Steam or other launchers on it. The timed exclusivity thing can work, but even that has to be done the way PlayStation did it.... release your games 2-3 years later on other platforms for a price... and usually only when the same game has finally made its way "free" as part of your sub service.

And I am not sure how this works, because if all PC games will work on Helix, then it means it's a PC, and devs wouldn't need to make a Helix and PC version of their game; they just make a PC version and have a Helix configuration file in there.

PC is too big to be ignored. It makes 0 sense to not have Xbox games on the Xbox app on PC. Where Xbox would receive 100% of profits. Microsoft want people on windows and or Xbox Helix, I imagine they would love everyone to have both, haha.

The Xbox would require to have PC drivers to run steam games. I have no idea how they make that work, its someone else's problem to think about haha. Maybe the steam Xbox app boots and has the drivers etc into it to allow steam to see it as the Xbox Helix which has generic profiles. I have no idea what is possible and what is economically / business viable.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

So you are OK with them not releasing on Steam?

Microsoft can do whatever the hell they want. Im not buying their $1000+ box.

Their exclusives don't mean THAT much to me.

To me their best move is a no brainer: Full embrace being 3rd party. Day and Date on all systems. Offer some unique perks for buying from the MS Store. I'm not really sure what they can offer since I can almost guarantee that Playstation and Steam likely have price parity clauses.

Going full exclusive IMO be their dumbest move.

Let's take a real look at what Xbox has going against them
1. When you consiver that around half of their Xbox audience is on XSS and likely paid no more than $300 for that system. Are those people REALLY going to invest in a $1000 system?
2. They have to overcome the massive amounts of brand damage. It will take an enormous amount of money and marketting.
3. They have largely conditioned their audience to not buy games. How do we know this? Sales for games on Xbox are often dismal every time.
4. Gamepass has had no serious growth. This is now well known. Call of Duty did not move the needle in the slightest. This latest move proves that. Short of making GTA6 a Gamepass exclusive (some fanboys legit believe this is a possibility) that is game set match.
5. PC Gamers hate the MS Store. Games on their are very tightly restricted, not moddable, and often use inferior versions (Control is an example of this). Epic GAVE away. Literally GAVE away games and they took absolutely nothing away from Steam. Skyrim is the PERFECT example of the MS Store version being shit. You cannot do any real modding. Its locked to 60 fps, when it could likely push 240 fps on like a 3060. If the MS Store embraced modding fully, I'd take a look.

Their next dumbest move is timed exclusivity.
1. Starfield is the perfect example. MS estimated that they cost themselves 10 million in sales by not putting it on Playstation Day and Date. Now that it's out on PS5, lets be generous and say it sold 1 million copies. That is a fuck ton of revenue they lost and probably barely covered the porting cost. Now, I do recognize that Starfield had a rather mid reception. A truly exceptional game, would most certainly sell more.
2. And Steam. This is the classic damned if you do, damned if you dont. Xbots hate playstation. But they have this HUGE blindspot for steam and Valve. I have said it many times, Valve threatens Microsoft on multiple fronts, not just gaming. Linux gaming is becoming a VERY viable alternative to Windows. That is largely due to Valve and their development of Proton and SteamOS. In fact you'd be foolish to not try Linux if you own an all AMD build. Nvidia still has some work to do, but it is getting better. If Microsoft starts hemoraging gamers to go to Linux, that hurts their entire identity.

I won't say it can't be done, but I don't see it unless MS makes some really ballsy and VERY expensive moves.
1. The first move they need to make is to drop the price of XSS and XSX and offer a free 6 months of Gamepass. $350 for XSX and $200. Get the remaining inventory into the hands of gamers. Market the fuck out of it. Get people talking about Project Helix. Right now, nobody cares outside of internet fanboys influencers. I dont think even that will work, but it will send the message loud and clear that MS and Asha are serious about. Waiting until Helix launches at the end of 2027...not a great plan.

MS has no good options to make Xbox viable.

 

[jm89]

So you are OK with them not releasing on Steam?

Steam will gobble up what's left of the Xbox userbase. Ms will lose the full revenue they get from purchases on there own store, would be a huge hit to margins.

They economics of this make no sense, gamepass has also stagnated well before the price increase.

Not looking good tobi.

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

Xbox is an extension of Windows PC Gaming, even more so with Helix and full convergence with the unified GDK. So no, they won't be getting rid of PC form factors. You already don't need an Xbox Console to Play Xbox games. You would be able to play them via any of these form factors you may own: Desktops, Laptops, Tablets, Handhelds, Consoles, or Cloud. That's already true with Play Anywhere, Cloud Enabled, Handheld Optimized games. The universal Helix SKU will simply make sure that's doable for 99% of games.

Console is just one part of the ecosystem of devices able to play the games. So what does it matter if they add another couple of consoles into the mix? It's good for controller based multiplayer games like Halo, Gears.

Xbox should simply announce 6-12 months timed exclusivity on single player games, can be extended to 18-24 months case by case after seeing how well the game performs at the awards. And then stick with it, let the chips fall where they may.

Keep publishing more third party content, setup a $5 billion fund for Xbox Global Publishing and keep acquiring permanent content for Gamepass. That's the best they can do.

But you see, this right here is the problem.

So basically, is Xbox Windows PC gaming? Meaning their audience is everyone who plays games on a Windows device? And even non windows device with their Play Anywhere initiative?

If that is your strategy, then why the hell do you need anything to be exclusive? To anyone? Cause that strategy says you were only interested in selling your product to as many people as possible. It says you do not care if they are playing one series, Helix, Steam Deck, laptop, Samsung TV...mobile phone...whatever. If that's what you are doing, can you not see how counterintuitive making "exclusives" is? Someone buying your game on PlayStation or Switch... at that point is absolutely no different from them buying it on Steam or whatever.

The only reason you invest in exclusive content and services.... is if you are presenting yourself as the only way and means to access those services and content. That's what being an exclusive means.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

Even if ES6 is good the videos will have to shit on it regardless. It's just the nature of the economy of this kind of video maker.

No one watches a 3hr critique video to hear about how good the game is, the ones that do the best are the ones that shit on ambitious games that fall short.

I mean we saw how that went with Starfield. And that had a Steam day 1 release too.

Microsoft likely lost millions of lifetime unit sales in that action by itself. One of the single biggest erosions of value I've seen in the gaming industry.

They did, they predicted they lost 10M sales by not releasing Starfield on PS5...I cannot find the quote. Now its released, they will likely be lucky to get 2 million.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

But you see, this right here is the problem.

So basically, is Xbox Windows PC gaming? Meaning their audience is everyone who plays games on a Windows device? And even non windows device with their Play Anywhere initiative?

If that is your strategy, then why the hell do you need anything to be exclusive? To anyone? Cause that strategy says you were only interested in selling your product to as many people as possible. It says you do not care if they are playing one series, Helix, Steam Deck, laptop, Samsung TV...mobile phone...whatever. If that's what you are doing, can you not see how counterintuitive making "exclusives" is? Someone buying your game on PlayStation or Switch... at that point is absolutely no different from them buying it on Steam or whatever.

The only reason you invest in exclusive content and services.... is if you are presenting yourself as the only way and means to access those services and content. That's what being an exclusive means.

You hit the point right on the head. I cannot in anyway see a world where it makes any sense to be anything other than full 3rd party.

 

[DenchDeckard]

They did, they predicted they lost 10M sales by not releasing Starfield on PS5...I cannot find the quote. Now its released, they will likely be lucky to get 2 million.

You can do this for any game. Imagine how many copies the last of us 2 would have sold on Xbox and PC if it launched day and date.

What makes any of this different, just because its Xbox. It would apply to anyone, Nintendo or Sony.

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

PC is too big to be ignored. It makes 0 sense to not have Xbox games on the Xbox app on PC. Where Xbox would receive 100% of profits. Microsoft want people on windows and or Xbox Helix, I imagine they would love everyone to have both, haha.

The Xbox would require to have PC drivers to run steam games. I have no idea how they make that work, its someone else's problem to think about haha. Maybe the steam Xbox app boots and has the drivers etc into it to allow steam to see it as the Xbox Helix which has generic profiles. I have no idea what is possible and what is economically / business viable.

Xbox games, on the Xbox app on PC... means you do not need an Xbox to play EVERYTHING that is released for Xbox. At that point, your games might as well also be on PlayStation.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

If they want to salvage their brand... it's the right thing to do. More specifically, its one of the three right things to do.

The big shakeup in leadership would not have been needed for status quo

 

[DenchDeckard]

Xbox games, on the Xbox app on PC... means you do not need an Xbox to play EVERYTHING that is released for Xbox. At that point, your games might as well also be on PlayStation.

Ok, but MS is Windows and Xbox, its not about retaining customers to just one platform. Its letting them choose from two of the platforms you basically own.

So, you have the consoles for those who want it, and then you have the PC for those who want the flexibility. As long as the sale is going through an Xbox store, they are still making the money without the loss of revenue from selling a subsidised piece of hardware. I am struggling to see the negatives outside of Xbox being able to say they sold more units of the console. Is that relevant in todays market?

I mean, if a customer is somehow turned on or attaches some weight to how many units a manufacturer sells, then I can't relate to that or understand it as it doesnt make sense to me. I was a day one Wii U purchaser, so that might tell a lot. I love and loved that console but to the industry it was a commercial failure. Had amazing games though.

 

[rkofan87]

The new Xbox head Asha Sharma has confirmed the division will "reevaluate" its approach to video game exclusivity in a comprehensive letter to the Xbox audience.

Xbox Will 'Reevaluate' Its Game Exclusivity, Throwing Potential Doubt Over PS5 Ports

Microsoft confirms internal debates

www.pushsquare.com

not a fan of this

 

[Astray]

They did, they predicted they lost 10M sales by not releasing Starfield on PS5...I cannot find the quote. Now its released, they will likely be lucky to get 2 million.

Yeah it was Tim Stuart who pointed that out iirc.

 

[RoboFu]

Xbox's biggest issue isn't that their games are on other platforms as much as their games haven't been great in the last 5+ years and they killed their ace in the hole halo series.

 

[StereoVsn]

Yes, yes, let's go! Locking large titles as exclusives to a $1200-1300+ box is a way to go clearly and even Copilot agrees.

They may get thousands of sales!

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

The big shakeup in leadership would not have been needed for status quo

And this is the only reason I am even entertaining these discussions now. That shakeup should be as clear an indicator, if any... that changes are coming. And day one game pass and their current multiplatform drive are the two big white elephants in the room.

I just don't see them actually changing it as they should ( I mean, they just did a small Game Pass reshuffle but still announced a PC gamepass tier, which means they are still all in with PC support), because if they are pushing to go exclusives, I am simply saying that only works if it applies to PCs too. Or not, they are doing the exact same thing they started doing way back in 2016 or whatever that got them into this very mess to begin with.

Ok, but MS is Windows and Xbox, its not about retaining customers to just one platform. Its letting them choose from two of the platforms you basically own.

So, you have the consoles for those who want it, and then you have the PC for those who want the flexibility. As long as the sale is going through an Xbox store, they are still making the money without the loss of revenue from selling a subsidised piece of hardware. I am struggling to see the negatives outside of Xbox being able to say they sold more units of the console. Is that relevant in todays market?

I mean, if a customer is somehow turned on or attaches some weight to how many units a manufacturer sells, then I can't relate to that or understand it as it doesnt make sense to me. I was a day one Wii U purchaser, so that might tell a lot. I love and loved that console but to the industry it was a commercial failure. Had amazing games though.

The issue with that is... "windows".... is bigger, and will always be bigger than Xbox. This Windows and Xbox thing we are trying to push... does not exist. Its the reason why the second MS truly embraced that approach, the xbox brand instantly got diluted. And this is because if Xbox and Windows coexist... then I am sorry, but Windows will ALWAYS be the better way to consume Xbox content.

And I totally agree with you that it shouldn't matter to MS, as long as they are making their money. But this brings me back to the same argument, if that is the case, then what harm does releasing your games on PlayStation do? If you do not need exclusivity to prop your own hardware, and your real fight is on the game sales on the PC... then you have nothing to lose by releasing your games on consoles like PlayStation and Nintendo.... because you are not offering a traditional console anyway.

 

[CentralScrutinizer]

Yes, yes, let's go! Locking large titles as exclusives to a $1200-1300+ box is a way to go clearly and even Copilot agrees.

They may get thousands of sales!

A did a quick google search to challenge this idea. I picked a high end pc game, cyberpunk, and I saw that roughly 50% of its 35m sales were on PC.

Thats 17.5m mid to high end pc gamers that bought that game. That's quite a big market. A $1200 PC is a mid tier pc.

 

[Fabieter]

But, evidence in the market shows that all those TV and Films studios locked their IP to their own streaming service after the initial allowing Netflix or Amazon Prime to have them, and now they off them for sale or rent the films to other platforms.

So, you are saying Sony, Nintendo and Microsoft should follow that business plan or just MS?

Paramount already said they are continue to licence some of the wb stuff to other services just for example.

I think the industry is heading this way in a few years so i dokt know what you mean if aony and Nintendo should do this too.

If cloud gaming were to win eventually... it would already have.

It's like people do not realize or recall how long cloud gaming has been a thing. Cloud gaming has been making the rounds since the year 2000, and got its first proper push in 2005. and the first mainstream push in 2010. Since then, there have been at least 6 or so different cloud gaming services. We are looking at a spread of over 20 years there. All the ingredients are there for it to succeed if it were actually ever to succeed... well, except the latency thing because that's something that will never be overcome... it's just physics. And yet here we are.

The hardware market isnt the same as it was 10 or 20 years ago and it will be even more different in a decade.

Imo we are headinf this way even though iam not a big fan of cloud gaming.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

A did a quick google search to challenge this idea. I picked a high end pc game, cyberpunk, and I saw that roughly 50% of its 35m sales were on PC.

Thats 17.5m high end pc gamers that bought that game. That's quite a big market.

Literally anyone looking for a prebuilt gaming PC is the target if priced right compared to comparable equipped PCs

Throw in being able to play console only games

It may not work for Xbox but at least they are trying something different

 

[CentralScrutinizer]

Literally anyone looking for a prebuilt gaming PC is the target if priced right compared to comparable equipped PCs

Throw in being able to play console only games

It may not work for Xbox but at least they are trying something different

I personally think a reliable prebuilt pc is a good idea. You're not guessing at component lottery, the manufacturer cheating out on ram or MB that particular month, or other random bottlenecks like cooling they chose to cheap out on to save $50.

A prebuilt uniformly built for its specific task of playing Xbox games comes with a better sense of reliability. I already have a 4070S prebuilt that I will be looking to upgrade around 2028 anyway; so if Helix has a good price to performance, I'll get it.

 

[RoboFu]

You guys still think this is going to run full blown windows are going to be disappointed. Though maybe that's the angle you are going for ? So you can say " oooff ... no full blown windows !"

 

[Topher]

You guys still think this is going to run full blown windows are going to be disappointed. Though maybe that's the angle you are going for ? So you can say " oooff ... no full blown windows !"

Microsoft is the one pushing the idea that this will play PC games. Hard to imagine what that would be other than full blown windows. So what's your "angle" here?

 

[DenchDeckard]

And this is the only reason I am even entertaining these discussions now. That shakeup should be as clear an indicator, if any... that changes are coming. And day one game pass and their current multiplatform drive are the two big white elephants in the room.

I just don't see them actually changing it as they should ( I mean, they just did a small Game Pass reshuffle but still announced a PC gamepass tier, which means they are still all in with PC support), because if they are pushing to go exclusives, I am simply saying that only works if it applies to PCs too. Or not, they are doing the exact same thing they started doing way back in 2016 or whatever that got them into this very mess to begin with.


The issue with that is... "windows".... is bigger, and will always be bigger than Xbox. This Windows and Xbox thing we are trying to push... does not exist. Its the reason why the second MS truly embraced that approach, the xbox brand instantly got diluted. And this is because if Xbox and Windows coexist... then I am sorry, but Windows will ALWAYS be the better way to consume Xbox content.

And I totally agree with you that it shouldn't matter to MS, as long as they are making their money. But this brings me back to the same argument, if that is the case, then what harm does releasing your games on PlayStation do? If you do not need exclusivity to prop your own hardware, and your real fight is on the game sales on the PC... then you have nothing to lose by releasing your games on consoles like PlayStation and Nintendo.... because you are not offering a traditional console anyway.

I am sure you have seen all the posts, leaks and comments that MS and XBox are in the process of unifying Windows and XBox, to make WIndows better for gaming and to allow games to be made for one store and it runs on all their devices. That store is the Xbox store.

Im a bit confused by the comment "This windows and XBox thing we are trying to push......does not exist" - Is that not what they are literally working on right now? unless I am misunderstanding you?

I think we are maybe on the same page, apart from it seems you do not perhaps understand that the Xbox store would be the platform and that is where the games are exclusive.....so exclusives do matter to their ecosystem, like many have said for years.

I apologise if I am not understanding your point properly.

 

[Fabieter]

You guys still think this is going to run full blown windows are going to be disappointed. Though maybe that's the angle you are going for ? So you can say " oooff ... no full blown windows !"

It might be some kind of dual boot.

 

[RoboFu]

Microsoft is the one pushing the idea that this will play PC games. Hard to imagine what that would be other than full blown windows. So what's your "angle" here?

im almost 90% sure it will just be a big picture mode type of deal .. you will see xbox pc and BC xbox console games mixed together just like the new xbox app mixes in steam games. We may get some windows "APPS". but I seriously doubt you are going to get a windows desktop.

 

[MisterXDTV]

And I totally agree with you that it shouldn't matter to MS, as long as they are making their money. But this brings me back to the same argument, if that is the case, then what harm does releasing your games on PlayStation do? If you do not need exclusivity to prop your own hardware, and your real fight is on the game sales on the PC... then you have nothing to lose by releasing your games on consoles like PlayStation and Nintendo.... because you are not offering a traditional console anyway.

They are making much less money though, because 30% of that revenue is basically gifted to Valve....

Nobody buys PC games from the Xbox Store, and nobody ever will

For third-parties that 30% they used to get becomes 0%

 

[Braag]

I've never been a huge fan of exclusives as I like a game having as big of a pool of players as possible. It brings more people together to talk about a game they all enjoyed. But as we saw with Sony, GAF loves exclusives, so this should be a good thing for most people here.

 

[DenchDeckard]

They are making much less money though, because 30% of the revenue is basically gifted to Valve....

Nobody buys PC games from the Xbox Store, and nobody ever will

For third-parties that 30% they used to get becomes 0%

They don't need to sell on the Xbox store on PC, they need people to use it for gamepass, which many PC players already do.

 

[JerryinSoCal]

I so hate to kind of back up bean man Jez but there are discussions

To what extent or if it will even happen has not been decided as far as I know

I know sneakers recently said it's never happening but I am leaning way more towards they will pull back from launching on PS at some point

The funny thing is the lack of exclusivity isn't causing them problems it's a result of their problems. If they had been able to sell hardware and get more of their customers to actually buy their games instead of the majority of them using a rental service that doesn't cover their costs they'd be in a much better place.

I know they seem to be in a mode of telling people what they want to hear so it sounds like they are listening but I don't think it was Phil's idea to put those games on PS5 that had to have come from higher up and it would seem kind of funny for them to reverse that now. They could, I'm not saying they won't it's just that they are in the position they are in because of how they've been run and making games exclusive again and then releasing a console/PC hybrid that costs over $1000 isn't going to do them any favors when it comes to profit.

If anything I would probably stop putting the AA titles out on PS5 or going and porting 2 year old games, I know they are probably cheaper to do but they also don't have much of an audience. I don't think anyone was asking for Avowed or South of Midnight and the Starfield hype died down a month after launch. I know some would say it should be the other way around but I think if you are going to spend money to put games on competing hardware you go with the ones that have the best chance of being big sellers.

 

[kevboard]

Microsoft is the one pushing the idea that this will play PC games. Hard to imagine what that would be other than full blown windows. So what's your "angle" here?

the Xbox One can run PC games if Microsoft opened up the system.

Xbox consoles already run a version of Windows that can run PC software. currently the only limitation is that you have to wrap it in a UWP container to work, which is in the end still just a wrapper.

Xenia, Dolphin, Retroarch, AM2R, Duckstation, PCSX2, all of them were "ported over" by simply wrapping them as a UWP app (and adding a controller compatible UI in some cases). they were not meaningfully changed to run on Xbox One or Series X.

the consoles even have a compatibility mode for older OpenGL versions. which helped some of the emulator cores in Retroarch.


a gaming focused windows only needs the necessary libraries to run games, and a UI that allows you to install from the Microsoft Store... done. you got a gaming ready Windows for PC games.

 

[//DEVIL//]

This is so wrong in 2026. Maybe one or two games in a generation could influence some buyers (like GTA6), but exclusivity is low on the list of reasons to buy a new console if you're in the market for one. Off the top of my head, services, accessories, software like UI/UX, game libraries, and where your friends play all come before exclusivity. If I have my library and my friends on PlayStation or Xbox, I wouldn't trade them for one or two exclusive games. The era when exclusivity really mattered ended over a decade ago. Sure, there are a few people who might rage on Twitter claiming exclusivity is the best reason to buy a console, but they're maybe only 1% or less of the reason customers make that choice.

I see .. I don't agree with anything you said. Reason to buy a console is accessories and UI.... Not the exclusives games that you want and can't play anywhere else ..


What kind of shitty crack you smoking ?

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

This is so wrong in 2026. Maybe one or two games in a generation could influence some buyers (like GTA6), but exclusivity is low on the list of reasons to buy a new console if you're in the market for one. Off the top of my head, services, accessories, software like UI/UX, game libraries, and where your friends play all come before exclusivity. If I have my library and my friends on PlayStation or Xbox, I wouldn't trade them for one or two exclusive games. The era when exclusivity really mattered ended over a decade ago. Sure, there are a few people who might rage on Twitter claiming exclusivity is the best reason to buy a console, but they're maybe only 1% or less of the reason customers make that choice.

Just my 2 cents but 3rd party has carried this gen and outside of maybe one or two games in this entire gen no exclusive has made me say "oh I must have that lone ecosystem to play this game"

But I am mainly a PC gamer

 

[Fabieter]

This news somehow also confirms the sony news. If Microsoft stops their multiplatform strategy there is no way pc people will see a single single player exclusive game from sony going forward.

 

[Topher]

im almost 90% sure it will just be a big picture mode type of deal .. you will see xbox pc and BC xbox console games mixed together just like the new xbox app mixes in steam games. We may get some windows "APPS". but I seriously doubt you are going to get a windows desktop.

Think that scenario will lose a significant number of PC gamers right off the bat.

the Xbox One can run PC games if Microsoft opened up the system.

Xbox consoles already run a version of Windows that can run PC software. currently the only limitation is that you have to wrap it in a UWP container to work, which is in the end still just a wrapper.

Xenia, Dolphin, Retroarch, AM2R, Duckstation, PCSX2, all of them were "ported over" by simply wrapping them as a UWP app (and adding a controller compatible UI in some cases). they were not meaningfully changed to run on Xbox One or Series X.

the consoles even have a compatibility mode for older OpenGL versions. which helped some of the emulator cores in Retroarch.


a gaming focused windows only needs the necessary libraries to run games, and a UI that allows you to install from the Microsoft Store... done. you got a gaming ready Windows for PC games.

Or it could just be a full bore Windows PC with a Xbox BC mode. I'm not suggesting it has to be, just that is the most obvious approach and it shouldn't be surprising that folks are suggesting that is what Microsoft is doing.

Edit: Having said that, I get your point and my saying it was "hard to imagine" anything other than full bore Windows was a bit too strong.

 

[RickMasters]

Project Helix, The Elder Scrolls VI launch title, only on Xbox.

Bada bing bada boom.

I think they should just start sooner and cancel the ports of halo:CE, fable and GOW: E-day. FH6 should be the last. nothing wrong with grabbing another 5 million sales on that platform on the way out the door. next one should be excluisve.


Matter of fact just let the ABK and the MMO stuff stay multiformat. everything else xbox exclusive.