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[peedi]

right, but MS is doing everything they can to minimize the gap between Xenon and the PS3, so they're leaving it up in the air until the last possible moment.

The fear is palpable.

 

[peedi]

good to know Microsoft is going to bring us fairly new technology, unlike the PS2 when it released. PS2 was already getting old before it came out.

:lol ..... If you're being serious, tell me what processor on the market, when the ps2 was released, compared to the emotion engine.

 

[Blimblim]

:lol ..... If you're being serious, tell me what GPU on the market, when the ps2 was released, compared to the Graphics Synthesizer feature-wise.

Fixed, and my reply would be: All of them.
Can't you please go to PS2 topics, seeing you on Xbox centric topics is getting tiring.

 

[The End]

PS2/PC comparisons are a bit disingenuous, as they $300 PC didn't really exist in 2000.

That said, i think the point that both peedi and I are trying to make is that MS is much more aware of Sony's strenths this time around (and vice versa), and won't be trying to sell Xenon on the strength of the "Power of X".

 

[pj]

Would this be the picture in question?

It loads fine for me on the second page.

You all missed the most important thing in that picture.. THE WHITE BUTTON IS STILL THERE.. Putting colored buttons on a part of the controller that you can't see (assuming they're being moved to the shoulder), is kind of weird.

 

[peedi]

Fixed, and my reply would be: All of them.
Can't you please go to PS2 topics, seeing you on Xbox centric topics is getting tiring.

Fixed? It isn't analogous. He said the PS2 was dated out the box. I challenged him to prove that absurdity.

 

[GashPrex]

how are you still posting here?

 

[Blimblim]

Fixed? It isn't analogous. He said the PS2 was dated out the box. I challenged him to prove that absurdity.

And I proved you that the PS2 GPU was awfully outdated piece of hardware. What's your point?

 

[Ghost of Bill Gates]

it looks like 512 Mbytes of RAM + cache is more and more likely.

If true, this is the best news yet!

 

[Blimblim]

If true, this is the best news yet!

I should have a confirmation before the end of the week.

 

[android]

how are you still posting here?

I think the mods see him as a joke that is being tolerated now. I bet Futami won't survive till E3.

 

[gofreak]

The first Xbox was not finalized for its first E3.

I'm pretty sure the spec was locked by the E3 before its launch (and that final hardware was on the show floor?). This year's E3 should be to Xenon what E3 2001 was to Xbox.

There's an upper limit on how long they can wait. I'll be amazed if final specs are not announced at E3.

 

[Ghost of Bill Gates]

I should have a confirmation before the end of the week.

really?! cool!

 

[rastex]

Ignore button people. Use it!

 

[peedi]

And I proved you that the PS2 GPU was awfully outdated piece of hardware. What's your point?

It wasn't. That programmers encountered difficulty wrangling the arcane development environment of the PS2 does not mean it was "awfully outdated."

 

[Blimblim]

Ignore button people. Use it!

I've found that putting someone on my ignore list (axsider) would actually make me want to see what he was saying. And I had to make a special effort to do so!
So I won't use it anymore I guess

 

[rastex]

That's what happens initially when you want to satisfy your curiosity, but if you're strong then you eventually come to the understand that they really do have nothing important or useful to say, so there's no point in reading it. Plus you get the added benefit of not having to endure their ridiculous statements that go against all logic and good reason.

edit: I have 16 people on my ignore list, so I guess you could say I'm used to it

 

[Doom_Bringer]

Psyborgs aren't too annoying, I think Xbots take the cake here. People like Reanimated, thorns, Ryudo, cockles, Error Macro, open_mouth, bitewise just to name a few. Now these guys are masters at relentless trolling.

 

[android]

That's what happens initially when you want to satisfy your curiosity, but if you're strong then you eventually come to the understand that they really do have nothing important or useful to say, so there's no point in reading it. Plus you get the added benefit of not having to endure their ridiculous statements that go against all logic and good reason.

edit: I have 16 people on my ignore list, so I guess you could say I'm used to it

:lol I forgot about that. And..... done.

 

[ThirdEye]

Voluntarily lock or not, they have no choice to change the specs much at this phase because they can't switch a partner like they did with Intel and AMD. Also, it's the strategy of MS to sell as many Xbox 2 as possible in the launch window, so their initial shipment must not be hurt by production problems, therefore they can't take a risk.

 

[thorns]

Psyborgs aren't too annoying, I think Xbots take the cake here. People like Reanimated, thorns, Ryudo, cockles, Error Macro, open_mouth, bitewise just to name a few. Now these guys are masters at relentless trolling.

:lol
i like how your list keeps growing bigger as you edit.

 

[Blimblim]

That's what happens initially when you want to satisfy your curiosity, but if you're strong then you eventually come to the understand that they really do have nothing important or useful to say, so there's no point in reading it. Plus you get the added benefit of not having to endure their ridiculous statements that go against all logic and good reason.

edit: I have 16 people on my ignore list, so I guess you could say I'm used to it

I guess I'm too weak.

 

[Doom_Bringer]

:lol
i like how your list keeps growing bigger as you edit.

yeah just remembered a few more names that's all

 

[thorns]

yeah just remembered a few more names that's all

i don't really mind being called an xbot anyway , could give less shit about it..
not to derail the thread but I got thief : deadly shadows (xbox) version today and wtf is up with the framerate? total shit don't have a pc good enough to run it either.. and I'm a big fan of thief series.

 

[Lord Error]

And I proved you that the PS2 GPU was awfully outdated piece of hardware. What's your point?

Even if what you say is true (and it's only very partially true and completely the opposite in other part), I don't see how that invalidates his point. Xexex has said that PS2 didn't bring any new worthy technology. I think that EE was certainly pretty new and pretty advanced for it's time. Considering that it was the major part of the PS2, I'd say it did in fact bring some quite new technology to the table. Btw, Xexex was the one to bring PS2 into this thread and in a way that just begged for counter-trolling.

 

[Pug]

With regard to the guys I know developing on XB2, the summer date is when they expect final development kits, so I assume thats when everything will be locked down. Although they are close friends, from my time at Uni they will not tell me much, I'm actually taken aback about how little they divulge, even when I got them pissed after the Wales England Rugby match this year. As for E3 I have no idea if they will have final hardware on show but I wouldn't be suprised if they didn't. Oh sorry about the T kaching.

 

[Blimblim]

Even if what you say is true (and it's only very partially true and completely the opposite in other part), I don't see how that invalidates his point. Xexex has said that PS2 didn't bring any new worthy technology. I think that EE was certainly pretty new and pretty advanced for it's time. Considering that it was the major part of the PS2, I'd say it did in fact bring some quite new technology to the table. Btw, Xexex was the one to bring PS2 into this thread and in a way that just begged for counter-trolling.

I understand (and agree with) your point, but seeing that peevy moron is really getting on my nerves.
PS2 had much raw power for its time, but also lots of stuff very wrong in its design too. Seeing NVidia working on the very thing that was bad on PS2 totally convinces me that PS3 will be a monster.

 

[gofreak]

I should say one thing: having the spec locked, and having final hardware are probably two different things. Certainly, having the spec locked, and having 100s of final dev kits shipped to developers, are certainly very different things.

 

[Pug]

Gofreak it was a bit of guess on my but based on some of the information I got from the guys. Specs have been changing all along and they for sure do not know the final spec with regards to many issues. If this includes the CPU i don't know, what they did say 3 weeks ago that it did seem like 256 MB main ram, although Blim thinks this may have changed, if so it just reaffirms what the guys have been telling me. By the way they are also working on PS3 titles!

 

[Doom_Bringer]

By the way they are also working on PS3 titles!

who?

 

[Pug]

Doom, I'm not going to say that, they often pop along here for a look and its certaintly not fair on them. They are based in the UK and have studio's in more than one part of the country. The guys I know are based on south coast.

 

[Blimblim]

Gofreak it was a bit of guess on my but based on some of the information I got from the guys. Specs have been changing all along and they for sure do not know the final spec with regards to many issues. If this includes the CPU i don't know, what they did say 3 weeks ago that it did seem like 256 MB main ram, although Blim thinks this may have changed, if so it just reaffirms what the guys have been telling me. By the way they are also working on PS3 titles!

The 512 MB change, if true, would be from last week.

 

[Pug]

Blim I haven't spoken to them since Wales Beat England rugby and I don't they are speaking to me anyway after I wound them up for the whole evening. I'm pretty sure they wouldn't tell me anyway, as I said they really don't give much info away at all, which I'm still really suprised at. As if I would post it on a gaming message board!

 

[TekunoRobby]

i don't really mind being called an xbot anyway , could give less shit about it..
not to derail the thread but I got thief : deadly shadows (xbox) version today and wtf is up with the framerate? total shit don't have a pc good enough to run it either.. and I'm a big fan of thief series.

Yeah the PC version lets you heavily modify it and change all sorts of stuff around, not to mention the badly needed texture upgrades.

The Editor just got released and I'm already toying around with it, sorry to hear about your situation but when you finally do get a decent PC I'm sure there will be tons of excellent fan made missions and the game will probably be dirt cheap.

 

[Ghost of Bill Gates]

The 512 MB change, if true, would be from last week.

I pray this is true!

I think this will guarantee us rich texture PC ports and high texture xbox2 original titles well into the year 2010.

 

[Agent Icebeezy]

They ran Halo audio off of the GPU in E3 of 2001. It was not finalized

 

[Kobold]

Kobold, theres plenty of High Def TV's for sale in the UK, however there is no media available as yet (well tv broadcasts) that utilise HD. Hence not much is being made of the fact that the TV is HD compatible. The slaes of plasma's and LCD's over the Xmas period in the UK was massive.

Yeah, they sell plasma TV's and the such here too. However, they don't even bother mention that they are capable of HDTV signals, and as you say, broadcasting stations don't send out signals, and I doubt they will for some time. In five years we could MAYBE be where Amerika is now on HDTV, now how does that fit into the whole HD era plan? What's in it for Europe???

 

[Kobold]

You all missed the most important thing in that picture.. THE WHITE BUTTON IS STILL THERE.. Putting colored buttons on a part of the controller that you can't see (assuming they're being moved to the shoulder), is kind of weird.

I really hope they don't remove the triggers. They are basically the fundament of the controller that makes racing and firing better then on any other controller because you can apply pressure.

 

[Duckhuntdog]

All signs still point to 3 cores, but Xenon stats will change up until about E3 is what I am hearing.

 

[Lord Error]

I understand (and agree with) your point, but seeing that peevy moron is really getting on my nerves.

Well, if you're patient enough, you can expect that annoying people, no matter what camp they belong to, get weeded off quickly here.

Seeing NVidia working on the very thing that was bad on PS2 totally convinces me that PS3 will be a monster.

I agree, that was a smart thing to do, not only becaue of hardware but also documentation, code samples, GPU dev tools, etc...

Oh, and 512MB in Xenon would be great if true. Not just for Xenon itself but also because it would effectively force Sony (and maybe even Nintendo) to at least follow - to everyone's benefit.

 

[Lord Error]

I understand (and agree with) your point, but seeing that peevy moron is really getting on my nerves.

Heh, it seems like if everyone would just like things they like and go about their business, GAF would implode

Seeing NVidia working on the very thing that was bad on PS2 totally convinces me that PS3 will be a monster.

I agree, that was a smart thing to do, not only becaue of hardware but also documentation, code samples, GPU dev tools, etc...

Oh, and 512MB in Xenon would be great if true. Not just for Xenon itself but also because it would effectively force Sony (and maybe even Nintendo) to at least follow - to everyone's benefit.

 

[PC Gaijin]

The only interesting thing (even if it's already quite old) is that the executables are now using the .exe extension instead of .xbe. This could be mean that MS is aiming for both windows and xenon compatibility with a single executable. Disclaimer: This is speculation on my part, I never heard anything about such an idea from my contacts.

This is simply not possible, since you can't run the same machine code in two different architectures.

Could be a fat binary with both x86 and PPC code combined into a single image. This was pretty common in the Mac world during the transition from 68k to PPC.

 

[Ghost of Bill Gates]

Oh, and 512MB in Xenon would be great if true. Not just for Xenon itself but also because it would effectively force Sony (and maybe even Nintendo) to at least follow - to everyone's benefit.

Ram is MS trump card next gen..lets see if they'll use it. PS3 is pretty much stuck at 256mb.

512mb of ram will allow Xbox2 to have straight ports from new high end PC games and allow rich textures..among other things.

 

[soundwave05]

Why is the PS3 stuck at 256MB again?

Somehow I doubt PS3 comes out after the XBox 2 with less RAM. The developers would at least raise a stink about it, just like they did when the PSP was planned to only have 8MB of RAM.

 

[Ghost of Bill Gates]

Why is the PS3 stuck at 256MB again?

The maximum RAM a single Cell processor can access in the PS3 is 256MB. It's a hardware limitation, and the only way around that would be to include a second processor using a seperate bank of RAM.

 

[xexex]

keep in mind, that 512 MB of RAM is not gobsmackingly awesome. it is just decent, and just saving Xenon from being completely crippled as far as memory.

512 MB is only 8 times as much memory as Xbox, obviously. still a smaller leap than from PS1 to PS2

 

[Ghost of Bill Gates]

keep in mind, that 512 MB of RAM is not gobsmackingly awesome. it is just decent, and just saving Xenon from being completely crippled as far as memory.

512 MB is only 8 times as much memory as Xbox, obviously. still a smaller leap than from PS1 to PS2

That what scares me, If MS stays at 256mb.. at least 521mb is decent.

 

[soundwave05]

The maximum RAM a single Cell processor can access in the PS3 is 256MB. It's a hardware limitation, and the only way around that would be to include a second processor using a seperate bank of RAM.

I still doubt PS3 will only have 256MB of RAM. Maybe the CELL processor will have 256MB all to itself and the Nvidia GPU will get an additional 256MB.

 

[Scottlarock]

hey you know if MS didn't say it you know sony whould have said something about the hd era!

 

[Ghost of Bill Gates]

I still doubt PS3 will only have 256MB of RAM. Maybe the CELL processor will have 256MB all to itself and the Nvidia GPU will get an additional 256MB.

Sony uses XDR Rambus RAM. 512mb is just too expensive.. we're talking about high performance RAM, not chuck-it-somewhere-on-the-motherboard RAM..we're talking about doubling the RAM price for millions of units.