The DLC is built into the western release.
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Xenoblade X Localization Changes for Character Models
- Thread starter Jarmel
- Start date
The DLC is built into the western release.
Suzushiiro
Banned
To be fair, I'm guessing the changes to Until Dawn in Japan were due to platform/government restrictions and thus had to be done in order for them to be able to sell the game at all, as opposed to the XCX changes which are clearly more due to fear of people not wanting to buy the game due to the elements in question and/or fear of a vocal minority kicking up a shitstorm over it. Not quite the same thing, though I personally am not a fan of either.
I think Saint's Row had a genitalia slider that changed bulge size for men.
PreyingShark
Member
I believe it had a universal "Sex Appeal" slider that applied to the bulge when used with a male character.
I also believe the result was exaggerated for humorous effect.
That was basically everything in the game
I probably wouldn't have played it otherwise.
This is so stupid...
Not a problem for me, my main character will be a male like in every other game that lets you create it, but i really don't see what the problem with that slider was.
Sometimes i think they should just stick to Mario & co if they have to be such a bunch of ridicolous prudes with games that aim to an older target.
Not a problem for me, my main character will be a male like in every other game that lets you create it, but i really don't see what the problem with that slider was.
Sometimes i think they should just stick to Mario & co if they have to be such a bunch of ridicolous prudes with games that aim to an older target.
Suzushiiro
Banned
Well, we are talking about the body here. If you want a female equivalent to facial hair, I'm sure female-only make-up, hairstyles and stuff can possibly even that out. Even if a lot of make-up is unisex in XBX (like facepaint).
But still, it would be fine IF there were more body options. There could be options for the butt, waist, bust etc. For the male that same boob slider could change muscle mass in the chest. It will all lead to a different silhouette.
But seriously, you can only change height and boobs... While the male only has height. It's just awkward and has 'fanservice' written all over it.
What else could they realistically have in that category that wouldn't drastically increase the amount of effort required to do it properly, though? Height and breast size are relatively cheap as you can easily make animations that work regardless of how short/tall/flat/big-busted you are. Being able to vary the amount of muscle/fat on the body gets into "how do we make this work without everything clipping all over the place" territory, which drastically increases the workload on the people doing animations.
It was most likely less of a "we're only going to make sliders for height and boobs because that's all our horny otaku target audience cares about" thing and more of a "we're only going to make sliders for height and boobs because we don't have the budget to do anything more complicated" thing.
They published and funded Bayonetta 2.
Palculator
Unconfirmed Member
Then they censored Fatal Frame.
Bayonetta 2's existence kinda kills the entire concept of Nintendo being prudish to the western audience regardless of changes to any other game.
Palculator
Unconfirmed Member
Seems like Bayonetta 2's existence is meaningless in the broader image of Nintendo, though. It doesn't uncensor these current games, it doesn't cancel out their long history of censorship in the West, and you can't use it as a basis to predict future decisions regarding censorship. However great it may be, it's an outlier.
Suzushiiro
Banned
To be completely fair, there's a difference between a series like Bayonetta where the sexuality is core to the entire franchise's identity and a series like Xenoblade where the sexuality is a minor/optional aspect of the games. Anyone who is remotely interested in the former is obviously okay with that content, but there are plenty of people interested in the latter who may be turned off by it.
I'd say that applies more to the Lin thing than the boob slider, though.
Mr Fahrenheit
Member
Bayonetta 2 is kind of becoming Nintendo's "black friend" for this sort of thing.
Also, this isn't an instance of the original creator modifying their own work. This is a case of a completely different group of people (NOA) censoring someone else's work (Monolith Soft), which has already been released as a finished product.
Or do you think One Piece wasn't censored when it was brought over by 4kids?
Or do you think One Piece wasn't censored when it was brought over by 4kids?
To me, it seems more about how NoA are trying to retain an image (and not wanting to get in trouble with any potential public) wherever they can while NoJ seems like they're more lenient about these types of things. In Bayonetta's case, it can't be edited out without changing much of the game itself, so it forces NoA to either embrace it for what it is or simply not release the game. In Xenoblade's case (and any similar case), the edits can be made without too much trouble since it's just slight editing to armor and removing a character creation option.
It's also why I've said before, I'm looking forward to how Fire Emblem: Fates works since it would require much more editing it seems. Maybe for #FE as well.
Weltall Zero
Member
I was undecided on this until someone posted that the only sliders in the Japanese version are height and breast size. If the original didn't even allow for different body builds, it's pretty obvious to me that the boob slider wasn't about inclusion and celebration of differences. I mean, as if the stripperiffic costumes weren't a hint already.
That statement says a lot more about your gaze than about breasts.
That statement says a lot more about your gaze than about breasts.
Yes, and I primarily mean for the MP aspects. If they remove customization options for player-created characters, then the least they should do is to add some randomization.
Also, this isn't an instance of the original creator modifying their own work. This is a case of a completely different group of people (NOA) censoring someone else's work (Monolith Soft), which has already been released as a finished product.
Or do you think One Piece wasn't censored when it was brought over by 4kids?
I'm pretty sure that Monolith Soft are the ones still having to do the programming for any and all changes, including the incorporation of Treehouse's localization, so I don't think your comparison holds up.
Devil's Third is the other black friend?
Hours Left
Member
Anyone thinking the bust slider was to promote different body types and not to increase fanservice is deluding themselves. It's literally the only variable you can change besides height, of course it's primary function was to sexualize the characters.
Don't get upset about the lack of breast enhancement if you can't come to terms with the idea that the same treatment should be applied to male characters too.
The highly sexualized outfits should already be a good indicator.
Hours Left
Member
For real. Just a cursory look at the equipment available makes it incredibly obvious.
As I said originally, I think removing it was silly and overprotective, but the idea that it's some feature to promote body diversity is ridiculous. And on the same note, people getting up in arms about a proposed bulge slider are being obtuse. I don't have a problem with fanservice in games, but it's certainly preferable to have a more balanced offering of said features. Saints Row did it exactly right.
I really, really doubt they have a choice.
1) It's one of the most noticeable options for female body types
2) It's one of the easier body type options to implement
3) Your speculation on the cause of its inclusion is completely irrelevant; we are discussing NoA's decision to remove it, and a direct result of that decision is reduced representation of different body types.
Who said I can't come to terms with it? I said a dong slider wasn't equivalent, and it isn't. The equivalent of a dong slider would be a vulva slider for females. In terms of how "adult" it is, that's a significant step above breast sliders.
I'd be perfectly happy with a dong slider, but I really doubt we'd ever get one. That's not an excuse for removing options we DID get.
You have an alternative? Another female-exclusive feature that affects the shape of the body with such prominence and variability?
I wonder how people would react to a pregnancy slider.
I'm not really thinking about it in terms of "promotion" but in terms of options available to the player to change the way their character looks and how they can distinguish their character from any other. Weight is the obvious exclusion here, but that's not gender exclusive. "Bulge Size" comes in below "Neck Width" and "Ear Size" on a sorted list of characteristics that distinguish clothed characters from each other.
Outfits which are, strangely enough, are still there as far as I can tell. Which strongly suggests these things are not being done out of some sort of high-minded reasons regarding depictions of women.
Well, we are talking about the body here. If you want a female equivalent to facial hair, I'm sure female-only make-up, hairstyles and stuff can possibly even that out. Even if a lot of make-up is unisex in XBX (like facepaint).
But still, it would be fine IF there were more body options. There could be options for the butt, waist, bust etc. For the male that same boob slider could change muscle mass in the chest. It will all lead to a different silhouette.
But seriously, you can only change height and boobs... While the male only has height. It's just awkward and has 'fanservice' written all over it.
Boobs don't look like that. I don't mind so much now.
Hours Left
Member
If you think the relative location of a part of anatomy on a person's body, or it's core biological function, is the key factor in equivalence when it comes to sexualization, I don't know what to say, because I disagree.
As for breasts being the most noticeable aspect of a woman's body, and therefore the easiest one to modify, I'd say that's a representation of your personal bias. (Which everyone has, obviously.) The effect it has on body type representation is what's irrelevant, because it was never the primary function of the feature to begin with. This isn't some blow to a more varied inclusion of different female physiques, it was a choice Nintendo made to minimize the overt sexualization of the female characters models.
I've already said, twice now, that I think removing it was overreacting, so please do not hoist your predispositions on me, like I'm trying to be the fun police.
The bust slider was included to sexualize the female characters. If Monolith Soft really wanted to make the characters have body definining features to further differentiate the player made characters from each other, they would have. This was simply something they threw in to up the fan service, and hence, a bulge slider would be the most equivalent in this case.
I don't like the censorship, but I also think those bikini options are pretty gross. It wouldnt have effected me either way as I wouldn't ever use them.
The boob slider thing seems like something that should be present in most games that have a character creator. Especially for women who want to create fantasy versions of themselves.
The boob slider thing seems like something that should be present in most games that have a character creator. Especially for women who want to create fantasy versions of themselves.
Yeah, the implementation is a bit flawed, but I would have preferred a narrower scale range to a complete removal of the feature.
Astral Dog
Member
Boobarella cant approve this
KratosEnergyDrink
Member
Speaking about one scene with an underage girl in string tanga? And a change to a model of another underage girl in Xenoblade. And a hilarious boobs slider that was clearly fanservice.
This whole "Nintendo censors" discussion because auf this localization changes (seems someone in the localization department has good taste) is pathetic and hilarious. And it will watering down the effort of people who goes against real censorship in media.
Same. Not having options to have the smaller bust sizes than the new default sucks.
PixyJunket
Member
I can't believe it's 2015 and there are people that are so terrified of sexuality that this has to be done.
Palculator
Unconfirmed Member
Wasn't underage.
I don't really care what their intentions were for adding or removing the feature. Whatever their reasons, the fact remains that bulge size doesn't even come close to bust size with regard to the effect it has on the character's overall appearance. Thus, it makes sense for there to be a bust slider and not a bulge slider, just as it makes sense to have a height slider but not a slider to change arm width.
That probably would have taken more work as well as being seen as sexist for only allowing medium-large boobs.
I'm fairly certain changing the minimum and maximum values on the slider would actually be fairly easy. I don't have the code to look at, but the position of the marker on the slider generally just marks a position between two variables. For example, just set the bottom of the slider to 0 and the top to 1, and then multiply the sliders position between them to the difference between the biggest chest size and the smallest to find the desired value.
Besides, they could just retract the range around the middle, so you end up with values that are neither as small, or as large as the extremes of the original version.
Hours Left
Member
I obviously disagree, it doesn't make sense. The fact that it was the only option for body modification other than height says it all. And the fact that the notion of applying similar treatment to male characters is constantly decried as being completely off base just shows how the sexualization of the female body has been so normalized in popular culture.
You don't think it makes sense to have more impactful options be present in the absence of less noticeable options? Do you also think it's problematic that The Sims 3 has a bust slider but no bulge slider?
Hours Left
Member
I'm all for diversifying the options being given in character creation, but you're not looking at the situation for what it is. When the most "impactful" option is changing a woman's breast size, then that's sexualization. Thinking it's anything else is being naive. If this game had multiple toggles for various body parts then it would be more plausible that it was included to promote individuality and body diversity, but it wasn't.
I'm not familiar with The Sims so I can't comment directly on that, but any game that includes a bust slider (or any sort of customization) for the primary purpose of sexualizing the female characters and does not offer the same treatment for the male characters is problematic, yes.
In the past, Monolith Soft has worked with 8-4 on Baten Kaitos Origins, and one of the things 8-4 said about the experience was how open Monolith Soft were to their suggestions and wound up giving them a lot of freedom on how to pursue the localization for that game. They don't strike me as the kind of studio that would be up in arms at all about such a minor alteration like this.
The situation is this: When I play the game, I will have fewer options available to me to create a character than someone who owns the Japanese versions. The most impactful option regarding body shape is height, not breast size. I don't want a character creator because it promotes individuality and body diversity, I want a character creator so I can make my character look the way I want it to look.
If you think it's problematic to have a breast slider, than that's fine. You can be offended by whatever you want.
I'm just saying that not having a breast slider is a bigger problem than not having a bulge slider because the size of your breasts has a bigger impact on your appearance than the size of your penis, and since the entire purpose of a character creator is letting me change my character's appearance, than yes, I would rather have a breast slider than a bulge slider if I were to pick between them. I'd also rather have a weight and muscle slider than a bulge slider.
If being able to adjust my character's secondary sex characteristics is sexualization, then so be it.
Hours Left
Member
I never once said I was offended by the bust slider. The "problematic" part is the lack of effort on the developer's part to offer a balanced amount of features between the different genders. We shouldn't have to choose.
If changing a female character's bust size is paramount in importance to you being able to create the character you want, then go for it. I have zero issue with that. (As I've repeatedly said.) But acting as if the option to change a woman's bust size is something inherent to proper female character customization but not seeing any issue with a lack of the same attention being given to the male characters is endemic of the normalization of female sexualization in the industry.
Owlowiscious
Member
Facial hair. Look up hot Ryu.