We all are!!! 14 years!!!!
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Yu Suzuki: Shenmue 3 Funding and Budget Statement
- Thread starter MouldyK
- Start date
We all are!!! 14 years!!!!
Dead End Irony
Member
The only thing that kind of sucks is that the size of the game's world isn't clear (unless I've missed something). I wish it was clear like:
$2 million for Shenmue 1 size
$5 million for Shenmue 2 size
$10 million for a world bigger than the other two games.
I think this game should at least be the size of Shenmue 1. I don't think Yu would be trying to implement a brand new gameplay feature at 5 mil if the world would be smaller than the first two games.
Stoked the game is being made though! Donated as soon as the Kickstarter got posted. Hoping he introduces more tiers.
$2 million for Shenmue 1 size
$5 million for Shenmue 2 size
$10 million for a world bigger than the other two games.
I think this game should at least be the size of Shenmue 1. I don't think Yu would be trying to implement a brand new gameplay feature at 5 mil if the world would be smaller than the first two games.
Stoked the game is being made though! Donated as soon as the Kickstarter got posted. Hoping he introduces more tiers.
AstroNut325
Member
I think it would be extremely beneficial if there was a GAF poll for people who haven't backed the KS.
Some values for the poll:
- Lack of Xbox One version
- Lack of previous gen version
- Lack of physical PS4 version
- Lack of HD ports/remasters of 1 & 2
- Insufficient info regarding differences between $2 million game and $5 million game
- Insufficient info regarding differences between $5 million game and $10 million game
- Insufficient or uninteresting stretch goals
- I don't like Shenmue
- What is Shenmue?
- I don't like Sony
- I don't like Yu Suzuki
This info can be used to help Yu, Ys, and Sony address concerns and grievances.
Edit:
Some values for the poll:
- Lack of Xbox One version
- Lack of previous gen version
- Lack of physical PS4 version
- Lack of HD ports/remasters of 1 & 2
- Insufficient info regarding differences between $2 million game and $5 million game
- Insufficient info regarding differences between $5 million game and $10 million game
- Insufficient or uninteresting stretch goals
- I don't like Shenmue
- What is Shenmue?
- I don't like Sony
- I don't like Yu Suzuki
This info can be used to help Yu, Ys, and Sony address concerns and grievances.
Edit:
I was only providing a starting ground for poll options. But yes that is another valid option.
Where's the 'Lack of HD remakes' option? I've never played Shenmue, so I've got no reason to back.
Elfforkusu
Member
Would be a good option, BUT unfortunately that's out of their control.
Sega will (probably) independently cash in on 3's hype train by announcing PC ports.
Right after the campaign is over, just to salt the wound
Cave Johnson
Member
You do realize, the opening of Skyrim is a lot bigger than Shenmue I, right? 2 mil for something like that would be very concerning especially with the tools this gem. The
Ragnarsson
Member
The outrage and "concern" surrounding this project sadden me. Yes, there are valid questions to be asked. These mostly concern the nature and scale of the game - for instance, what Yu Suzuki calls an "open world" is not what some gamers are probably thinking of or used to, and though that has been addressed, the messaging could have been better.
However, these questions seem to be buried underneath a pile of irrelevant issues and outright non-questions. I genuinely can't understand why Sony's involvement is such a big deal. Why exactly does it matter? Why is it a bad thing? How is it shady? Don't people know how business deals work, or are they being willfully ignorant just for the sake of stirring up controversy?
Asking for more transparency is a good principle, but some of this call for transparency is completely misaimed and counterproductive.
However, these questions seem to be buried underneath a pile of irrelevant issues and outright non-questions. I genuinely can't understand why Sony's involvement is such a big deal. Why exactly does it matter? Why is it a bad thing? How is it shady? Don't people know how business deals work, or are they being willfully ignorant just for the sake of stirring up controversy?
Asking for more transparency is a good principle, but some of this call for transparency is completely misaimed and counterproductive.
Dead End Irony
Member
It's strange because as a Shenmue fan, I was HOPING that Sony would be involved in financially assisting the game, even before they came out and said anything. I don't get it.
Elfforkusu
Member
Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by greed.
(well, greed and the other thing...)
Galactic Barret
Member
Are journos going to report on this, or are they still too concerned to call this a positive thing?
It'll be a sad day to see this game not reach its potential because of consumer fear and mistrust.
It'll be a sad day to see this game not reach its potential because of consumer fear and mistrust.
The issue is from a lot of people I spoke with is many think it is unethical/shady for Sony to announce the game at E3 on Kickstarter without funding it and assume Sony is hence why Yu released this statement. I mean if Microsoft announced a game on Kickstarter, they would have got slaughtered just like this game is. It is not the norm for a major corporation to ask for crowdfunding.
How else are they going to get all those clicks if they don't use those sort of tactics?
It's been pretty obvious from the get-go the type of partnership they had. I'm glad it's completely laid out for the public now and we can get on with making Shenmue 3 happen as best as possible.
DidntKnowJack
Member
I can only guess that was one of the stipulations Sega made when giving Suzuki permission to use their Ip and make this game. That he could get assistance for marketing, but the main funding would have to be done through kickstarter. I don't know why that would be, and I've certainly no proof of that, I just can't think of any other reason. Other than Sony saying "Hell no!" But I honestly doubt that's the case. Unless game publishers really REALLY don't want to risk any money on this game. That's too sad for me to consider.
otaku-asia
Member
Ultimately there will be a PS4 disc release, so I see no reason to back the game and get a crappy boxed PC game. They are getting a decent amount of money through KS but it could have been so much more if they ran a better campaign.
MaulerX
Member
Conflict NZ
Member
From what he said in interviews the style of game seemed like:
$2 Million: Telltale Style Game
$5 Million: Yakuza Ishin Style with Shenmue Features
$10 Million: Shenmue 1/2 Style with new Gameplay systems
DidntKnowJack
Member
All I want to do is play the game. If there's no disc version, so be it. I understand people that want a physical copy for their collection, but honestly what's more important - having a round trophy or being able to play the game?
Edit: I mean people who don't have PC as an option.
Galactic Barret
Member
They couldn't have Yu on stage asking for it because he doesn't speak english (well?). Sony announced it on stage to give it even more exposure, which they did successfully.
Now its about bringing the truth to the forefront to stop the toxic speculation that followed it so fans can get the game they have wanted all these years.
No Linux and Mac for some reason.
No Xbox One version.
Poor Stretch goals and poor explanation of why they need that much money.
Not partnering with youtube partners like Bloodstained did with Mega64 and a bunch of others, and just general lack of social media interaction. They took a week to respond to criticism that popped out the day after the kickstarter was revealed.
No Xbox One version.
Poor Stretch goals and poor explanation of why they need that much money.
Not partnering with youtube partners like Bloodstained did with Mega64 and a bunch of others, and just general lack of social media interaction. They took a week to respond to criticism that popped out the day after the kickstarter was revealed.
Galactic Barret
Member
Adam Boyes responded the next day, though?
Ys Net should have had some sort of press release ready to go as soon as the Kickstarter went live to provide clarity to everyone. Now can be too late for some.
Hopefully $30 on the 3rd is effective.
DidntKnowJack
Member
Don't forget the whiny entitled babies.
This makes me sad. Is it possible they'll release a retail version for the PS4 at all, just not as part of this whole funding thing? Will the physical PC version be sold when the game comes out or is it strictly a backer-only thing?
Yea more and more a lot of people are starting to show why they have an issue with this.
Well I didn't hear about it ¯\_(ツ
_/¯Why do you think they put this announcement in the kickstarter page? Because people kept asking the same question question. Why not answer clearly the first day?
But there's still 22 days left to the kickstarter. I just don't think they will react in time to get people excited about it again.
bmcphail2008
Member
I think these are valid concerns. While there are some ambitious games that have delivered as a result of Kickstarter campaigns, I think Shemue III might be the most complicated one ever attempted. Quite honestly, I don't think you can really deliver a modern version of a game like Shenmue or Shenmue II that is so dependent on complex and detailed 3D environments for less than what a mid-budget AAA game like Witcher 3 was done for.
Yu Suzuki and his team spent something like $25 million less than a decade ago developing the never complete Shenmue Online and that was only after less than two years of development. I've put my $300 where my mouth is, but I would not be surprised if this is one of those projects that goes well over time and budget and still never delivers what all of us who have been Shemue fans for so many years really want.
Galactic Barret
Member
Who would have guessed there would have been such a negative sentiment about a dream game being developed? I wouldn't have. Even after Boyes tried to clarify the arrangement (and Shu, and now Yu) it didn't prevent the backlash and gnashing of teeth. I'll say it again: game journalists may have done some irrevoccable damage jumping the gun to demonize the collaboration.
Everyone assumed Sony was getting money. Why? They are a multi-billion dollar corp. It was obviously for the YSnet team to make the game a reality.
I believe the statement was made within 24 hours of the announcement; the game reached funding in 8 hours. The day after, all hell broke loose. I honestly believe people just refused to believe it wasn't a scam, backed up by video comments by well-known internet personalities.Well I didn't hear about it ¯_(ツ
Why do you think they put this announcement in the kickstarter page? Because people kept asking the same question question. Why not answer clearly the first day?
But there's still 22 days left to the kickstarter. I just don't think they will react in time to get people excited about it again.
And, yes, even more clarity was needed for those not really paying attention, especially by the YSnet team.
Some people felt Sony was being shady as in "they have money yet want us to pay for the game?! This is a bad precedent for the industry!! DOOM IS COMING!!"
Anyways the damage is done and if you are a fan spewing FUD, shame on you. If you really wanted Shenmue 3, any system it came to, you'd get it just like you did when the game was released on Xbox back in the day.
Galactic Barret
Member
I don't understand what this means.
If Sony were paying for this game, they would want exclusivity, of course. That would be even more drama. Its not Sony's IP, why are they funding the entirety of the game? That doesn't line up.
I still think people are crazy with their expectations for the finished product.
I mean, look at other video game Kickstarters that have received millions of dollars - Broken Age, Wasteland 2, Pillars of Eternity.
What do they all have in common? They're effectively 2D (not sure whether they use 3D models).
Making a open-world 3D adventure game with voice-acting, individually modeled objects like the previous games, densely detailed environments? On potentially less than 5 million dollars? That's a big stretch.
Part of the problem, I think, is that the reason many people admire Shenmue is because of its extreme attention to detail. But why did Shenmue have that level of detail? Mm, maybe it has something to do with it being the most expensive video game ever made up to that point.
I think Yu Suzuki's a smart dude, but there's no way he can possibly meet the expectations people will have for this project. Not on the money he's getting. That's the biggest problem, IMO.
I mean, look at other video game Kickstarters that have received millions of dollars - Broken Age, Wasteland 2, Pillars of Eternity.
What do they all have in common? They're effectively 2D (not sure whether they use 3D models).
Making a open-world 3D adventure game with voice-acting, individually modeled objects like the previous games, densely detailed environments? On potentially less than 5 million dollars? That's a big stretch.
Part of the problem, I think, is that the reason many people admire Shenmue is because of its extreme attention to detail. But why did Shenmue have that level of detail? Mm, maybe it has something to do with it being the most expensive video game ever made up to that point.
I think Yu Suzuki's a smart dude, but there's no way he can possibly meet the expectations people will have for this project. Not on the money he's getting. That's the biggest problem, IMO.
- better graphics
- mods
- VR
- pre-release demo
- a higher quality Shenmue III because you helped fund its development
I don't understand why anyone would choose the PS4 version over PC if they have both options.
PeregrinSe7en
Member
well said
The only reason I haven't back it, is lack of funds.
The negative tone of much press covering the KS has me bummed out. People implying that the KS was some shady cash grab are forgetting just how niche Shenmue is (which, ironically, is the same thing many of the fans clamoring for Shenmue 3 have been told for years). No, I am sure the money raised by KS will play a significant role in determining the scope of the game.
The negative tone of much press covering the KS has me bummed out. People implying that the KS was some shady cash grab are forgetting just how niche Shenmue is (which, ironically, is the same thing many of the fans clamoring for Shenmue 3 have been told for years). No, I am sure the money raised by KS will play a significant role in determining the scope of the game.
Galactic Barret
Member
Unless this gets traction from news outlets, maybe even if it does, we'll always wonder what could have been.
That makes me feel the worst.
That makes me feel the worst.
If that was just it, I don't think most fans would be as upset as they are.
Some people have a preferred gaming platform and get the games there. That's ok.
At a least people are agreeing that this campaign is badly run rather than blaming console warz for the "failure".
Should say "I don't like Sonys outside involvement with a KS project"
I don't agree at all with these folks. But I would say that is more fair of an option than "I don't like Sony"...although for some that might be the case lol
Littlefang
Member
This doesn't really change any information that wasn't disclosed when Yu said that the majority of the funds would be raised from kickstarter. So I've already made my peace on the subject. Here I've summarized my own feelings on Sony's involvement in the kickstarter. And to my understanding, Sony's involvement in the kickstarter is limited to marketing and now some minor publishing (which I'm assuming, key word here assuming, this means they've gotten an exclusivity deal). which entails that Sony is still benefiting from the success of this kickstarter. And yes I still have qualms with this, but that's not specific to either Shenmue or Sony.
AstroNut325
Member
This post isn't necessarily directed towards you specifically, and it is also entirely my opinion. You can completely ignore if you like.
I really think the people who are clamoring for a physical PS4 release need to realize Shenmue is a special case. This is a game that costs quite a lot to make and it has a very niche market. There are very good and perfectly reasonable justifications for publishers to completely shy away from pouring money into this franchise. And they did just that for 14 years. Think about that. Someone who was born when the previous game was released is now entering high school in the USA. The point I'm trying to make is that THIS opportunity shouldn't even exist. But it does. And how it turns out is in the hands of the community that values the franchise. It makes no sense to me to demand things from an opportunity that would not exist if it weren't for very specific conditions and establishments making it possible. I feel it is much more constructive to critique the contents and structure than it is to outright ignore it due to one demand not being met.
All YS needs to do is open donations post-kickstarter. I think its doing fine, I think the medias spin halting this is being blown out though its had some impact. I doubt either way it was going to continue crazy crazy numbers.
Shenmues fanbase is passionate as hell, just that its for the 3rd game of a series 2 generations ago.
This was always going to be a difficult one, but I think its done admirably so far. I also think our passion pulled in a lot of the videogame community early on after e3. I think that buzz and evidence of funding carried a lot of momentum, and the negative spin squashed some of it, but this slowdown was bound to happen regardless. The campaign has to start doing its job and its slouched on that front. Still expecting some noise before this things over with, a second burst from Shenmue fans (30 for 3rd)
Shenmues fanbase is passionate as hell, just that its for the 3rd game of a series 2 generations ago.
This was always going to be a difficult one, but I think its done admirably so far. I also think our passion pulled in a lot of the videogame community early on after e3. I think that buzz and evidence of funding carried a lot of momentum, and the negative spin squashed some of it, but this slowdown was bound to happen regardless. The campaign has to start doing its job and its slouched on that front. Still expecting some noise before this things over with, a second burst from Shenmue fans (30 for 3rd)
the way i see it, xbone had a chance to get the game if there's enough people backing and asking for it, but with the way things are going now i don't see it happening anymore
and personally i don't see what's wrong with yu rewarding sony for being proactive, if a friend is helping me in a business deal, why wouldn't i want to help him out as well?
and personally i don't see what's wrong with yu rewarding sony for being proactive, if a friend is helping me in a business deal, why wouldn't i want to help him out as well?
Kindred Dread
Neo Member
Anyone who had a problem with this from the start is an idiot... instead of Sony taking forever to make games now they can just gauge demand. We could actually get some fucking games like Medievil on PS4, or who knows what else.
I think the biggest problem with the campaign so far is..
-There is no real explanation for this 'true' open world at 10mi. Does this mean the game won't be open world? It will be smaller? Is the 'true' open world something revolutionary that hasn't been done before, or at least not on the scale of Shenmue 3?
-No physical PS4 release. This a game I'd be proud to place upon a shelf, and I don't want to bet my money on a digital download then realize I'd have to pay again just to own it in some form.
It makes sense that the funding slowed down when the whole spiel broke out. Anyone who didn't already donate was a skeptic. On the other hand- the sad possible reality- is that's about the demand for Shenmue 3. But it's still a league above the original asking price so it's not necessarily a failure.
I really hope to see it get to 5, or 10 million. But I can't donate more myself without knowing the game gets a physical or not, even if just for the KS.
I also think they could have just been more forward opening up their KS. You know. For the idiots.
I think the biggest problem with the campaign so far is..
-There is no real explanation for this 'true' open world at 10mi. Does this mean the game won't be open world? It will be smaller? Is the 'true' open world something revolutionary that hasn't been done before, or at least not on the scale of Shenmue 3?
-No physical PS4 release. This a game I'd be proud to place upon a shelf, and I don't want to bet my money on a digital download then realize I'd have to pay again just to own it in some form.
It makes sense that the funding slowed down when the whole spiel broke out. Anyone who didn't already donate was a skeptic. On the other hand- the sad possible reality- is that's about the demand for Shenmue 3. But it's still a league above the original asking price so it's not necessarily a failure.
I really hope to see it get to 5, or 10 million. But I can't donate more myself without knowing the game gets a physical or not, even if just for the KS.
I also think they could have just been more forward opening up their KS. You know. For the idiots.
The game will include three towns regardless of what stretch goals are achieved. The stretch goals simply dictate how fleshed out these towns are. (source)
I think the "true open world" line just means he needs $10 million to flesh out these towns in a way that makes them feel like a living world.
Hope this helps some people.
That is beautifully put.
Upsidedown Fuji
Member
Pie and Beans explanation is in line with what I assumed since the AMA last week. I think many are over thinking all this and its really not the most important issue IMO. It's the fact this game is even getting a chance to be made after 14 years of nothing.
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
If these are realistic budget amounts for the game's goals, then a whole lot of people are going to be seriously disappointed by the end result. Even $10 million (minus KS fees, reward fulfillment, and taxes) is a small sum to do even a relatively short & linear 3D Action/Adventure/Sim game.
D
Deleted member 80556
Unconfirmed Member
Can Yu release a statement about why the KS seems so badly managed? Seriously, they only recently sent surveys on some stuff, but they didn't seem prepared for the campaign and seem to be doing things on the fly, or not doing them at all.
Kindred Dread
Neo Member
I think your first sentence is correct, but the rest- that's the problem- it's so vague. He doesn't need to spoil anything, but some communication could go a long way.
Hell, I'd put down $60 for a physical copy. Just to help the project and get it muh physical pride for PS4. I haven't even played 1 and 2. I just know this sequel is wanted so badly, it's a legend about how this series has ended on a cliffhanger- the rest of us that aren't diehard Shenmue fans really need something a bit extra like what I mentioned to want to help.