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Zombies. Steam key kerfuffle; dev waffles on Steam keys for past purchasers, drama

C

Cabal

Member
Wow, I thought he might reverse his position, but damn that was fast...

I love how he is mad in that tweet, he is the one that promised the keys. He should only be mad at himself.
 
santeesioux

santeesioux

Member
Pikawil said:
LtP1Lcy.png


One less scamming scum off the face of the industry. Excellent.
Click to expand...

74343-Tombstone-well-bye-gif-hji0.gif
 
H

Htown

STOP SHITTING ON MY MOTHER'S HEADSTONE
they're not free copies, dumbass. they're going out to people who already paid for your game

holy shit
 
T

ThatsMytrunks

Member
I'm tempted to contact all those bundles and give them keys for Love to replace the keys their customers aren't getting for his game.

It may not be much, but that's still a shitty move. :|
 
I

IcyRhythms

Member
He's going to call it quits because he's allowed gamers to destroy his mind fucked mind into oblivion. It's his own damn fault. Leave...this industry doesn't need dogshit like this guy.
 
K

Karu

Member
This is a ploy to have another chance to diss NeoGaf for "bullying" developers, right?

Nevermind, if it is true, that he never did say this and it's indeed a thing, bundle sites do, because that's why. Well, can't really blame him for his reaction. Sure, he may be advised to give away keys for his "fans", but it should not be mandatory.

Now it would be nice to know, if his statements are true.
 
Sanic

Sanic

Member
So to be clear, would his contracts really have said nothing about giving out steam keys?

I'm assuming if this were true we would have heard of it previously.
 
T

ThatsMytrunks

Member
Wazzy said:
That's pretty cool and very nice of you. Is that your game?
Click to expand...

Yep. That's my game. I got greenlit a couple months ago, launched a couple of weeks ago, and gave keys to everyone that bought the game, whether it be a bundle or on a competing service. Like I said I would.
 
M

Mavromatis

Member
Stumpokapow said:
Setting aside the lying about being willing to provide a key, this seems awfully too-big-for-your-britches

A fairly standard practice today is that you're an indie, you release your game, and it doesn't sell enough for you to quit your day job. I have literally never heard of a developer who made a non-trivial amount of cash off Desura. The market just isn't there on alternative sales portals. You can view this as a negative or a positive, but essentially it's a truth.

As a result, if you're an indie and don't have independent capital to invest to make your game, you aggressively bundle and discount your game in order to get the recognition necessary to get you onto Steam (or look for other non-PC outlets) and to pay your rent or whatever in the mean time. Most of these developers are making a thousand or a few thousand per indie bundle. That's money that buys them time as they work through the Greenlight process, which can often take 4-6 months or more.

Many customers out there buy these bundles or discounted copies. Some do it explicitly to find out what your game is about and if they like what they see, they promote it. Which benefits you. Streamers have made an awful lot of indie games into at least moderate hits, and some into smash successes. You want to feel like a friend to these people, not an enemy. They are taking care of a lot of the sort of evangelizing of your product that a publisher traditionally would have done, and they don't ask for any of your money in exchange.

Others buy the bundles and have absolutely no intention of playing your game. Maybe they don't care about your game at all--in that case, you owe a feeling of community to the other developers you were bundled with for sharing what would be their revenue with you. Maybe they do care about your game, but they're just doing it to secure future Steam keys for the game. So for those people, they're basically giving you a cash advance on future earnings in exchange for a discount on a copy of the game. To them, they're pre-ordering, not buying on Desura or wherever.

So you can read all this and come to the conclusion that people are a bit weird about Steam and shouldn't they enjoy the game wherever they get it, but also these are all groups of people who are doing you a solid by helping you through the lean times. Setting aside any legal promise or obligation, you have an ethical obligation not just to "thank" your supporters, but also to appreciate that the nature of this process goes beyond a typical commercial transaction. You want these people to be happy and satisfied, because they're not just your customers, they're patrons during a period where you needed them.
Click to expand...

In short, the process is an alternative Kickstarter. Where you start with bundles which forms the lowest tier donation getting early access. You get on the greenlight, promote via more bundles and get on Steam where you appear on New Releases, which can grant some serious amount of sale if you have a proper description, a good trailer and a good release price/discount. This will be the mid tier of kickstarter donations, and everybody who buys after that are the big donators.
But the problem I assume this guy met, was over usage of bundles. He gave too much at bundles and he feared that he already fed the whole market with his game. And now he thinks that the Steam market being totally different than bundle market of earlier will buy this game anew, as if it is a different one.
I think he even changed the name like Orion did to isolate the game.
 
C

chubigans

y'all should be ashamed
By the way, I can factually prove he's lying in regards to not promising keys with bundles.

Here's his IndieGameStand bundle: https://indiegamestand.com/deal/?saleId=21

Hover the mouse over the Steam Greenlight button- it asks to vote for the game, and you get a key with this purchase if greenlit.

I've been on IGS and there's an OPTIONAL text entry that lets you link to Greenlight.
 
T

Team Filler

Member
I can't imagine Valve being happy about him putting his game through the greenlight process only to change the name post-greenlight and claim it's a different enough game, nevermind screwing over his early adopters like he has (they are still gamers at Valve, after all).
 
D

Doctor_Thomas

Member
Karu said:
This is a ploy to have another chance to diss NeoGaf for "bullying" developers, right?

Nevermind, if it is true, that he never did say this and it's indeed a thing, bundle sites do, because that's why. Well, can't really blame him for his reaction. Sure, he may be advised to give away keys for his "fans", but it should not be mandatory.

Now it would be nice to know, if his statements are true.
Click to expand...

One of the bundle pages has this on it

w4wG6.png


Another one, in the same bundle doesn't promise a Steam key if Greenlit.

UnMEo.png


He had a choice, he misled people and now people are questioning it.
 
W

Wazzy

Banned
ThatsMytrunks said:
Yep. That's my game. I got greenlit a couple months ago, launched a couple of weeks ago, and gave keys to everyone that bought the game, whether it be a bundle or on a competing service. Like I said I would.
Click to expand...

Good for you. It's nice to see that you stick to your word and support the people supporting you. Kudos to you for being a nice and respectful dev. :)
 
A

Almighty

Member
Jesus this guy sounds like a giant assclown now. He gets on Steam and acts like his previous customers don't exist and then calls them scumbags.
 
T

ThatsMytrunks

Member
chubigans said:
Hover the mouse over the Steam Greenlight button- it asks to vote for the game, and you get a key with this purchase if greenlit.

I've been on IGS and there's an OPTIONAL text entry that lets you link to Greenlight.
Click to expand...

Yep, and you have to enable it. And it asks if you'll give keys out if you're ever greenlit.

He just needs to come out, apologize, give the keys, and try to stop the media before they stick the nails in his wrists.
 
M

Mavromatis

Member
Buzzman said:
"I was part of a bundle and now I have to give out keys in return?"

Did he think it was a charity or something?
Click to expand...

I didn't check hid twitter account for the tweets during the giveaways but I assume even he didn't accept "giving keys" via his contract; he never denounced these bundles promising keys from him.

Edit: I guess this kinda answers my question.

Doctor_Thomas said:
One of the bundle pages has this on it

w4wG6.png


Another one, in the same bundle doesn't promise a Steam key if Greenlit.

UnMEo.png


He had a choice, he misled people and now people are questioning it.
Click to expand...
 
T

Tempy

don't ask me for codes
So many indie games promise free keys when it gets on Steam. You'd think he'd be familiar with the approach. (Although I remember one previous occasion of a game not handing out keys like promised)
 
G

Guess Who

Banned
I think a lot of people are misunderstanding the problem.

The bundles that the game was part of were selling his game were selling the non-Steam version. The game was not on Steam at the time and because he planned the Steam version to be a bigger, extended version of the game, he was not planning to give out Steam keys for that version to people who bought the original (this is not uncommon - lots of games get extended or deluxe releases that are separate purchases from the original). He did not make any promise on the Greenlight page that owners of the original game would get Steam keys. Some of the bundles he was featured in, however, did make that promise, unbeknownst to him when he agreed to put the game in them.

It's absolutely a good move for a game like this to give out Steam keys to people who bought the original, but contrary to the thread title he himself never promised such a thing.
 
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